CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

At any normal time I'm a great supporter of options, not least in respect of difficulty levels.

This is not a normal time, however, in that we know the ZOS team has been significantly reduced in size and that the amount of new content is therefore impacted. At such a time it is even more important that such new content as is viable is aimed at the widest possible range of players, and that means implementing difficulty level options.

This new content is clearly out of the reach of many players, perhaps even most. The others may argue from their veteran BIS dungeon and trial experience with thousands of CPs that you can just run Group Finder and it's all a doddle, but that isn't what many players are used to doing or want to do, and many are simply low level or casual. Their loss for sure, but also ZOS's loss too as they assuredly want their content creation to be widely used and acclaimed.

No rational player wants the Night Market switched from its present focus to a more casual one, but everyone would benefit if it was given some difficulty options as they'd all be able to play it then, their way. And ZOS would benefit too.

Again, I am a PvPer. I've literally never had a PvE build apart from an oakensoul heavy attack builds and a one bar beam build with crafted gear. I do not do vet trials, I rarely do vet dungeons and typically struggle through them.

How many CPs do you have?

Dude you are missing the forest for the trees. It doesnt really matter how much CP one has if their style of gameplay can vary completely. Acting like someone with high CP is automatically going to have an easy time in NM is just as bad as gatekeeping those with low CP from joining groups. Champ points don't even add that much these days anyways since the CP2.0 rework.

The point is that there is an ingame feature that allows you to join a PUG group. The Night Market is designed to be completed by PUG groups. It has very few coordinated mechanics, and just needs someone holding aggro and someone tossing around some heals. You can be CP 200 in crafted gear, join a PUG, and get carried through. You may die, you may get stuck at times, but if I can do it in a PvP build with horrible rotation skills with a PUG, anyone should be able to do it with a PUG.

And the answer to my question is?

coop500 wrote: »

What do the elites gain from enforcing simple trash enemies to be impossible to beat by casual players?
They have all the bosses, and they have a trial and a dungeon. But they need the ENTIRE place just for themselves instead.

All the people here are asking is to be able to beat the trash enemies. Does having 2-shot trash enemies mean THAT much to the elite community? Does gatekeeping the casuals from the Night Market mean that much to you guys?

I'm not an elitist - I enjoy solo & group content - but your first question actually has an easy answer.

If a game only caters to DPS - then all the mechanics boil down to DPS vs HP. We see this in Battlegrounds, where some players ignore the Objectives & turn every match into Deathmatch. Catering to lower-common denominator DPS spam actually chokes out other forms of gameplay.

Now suddenly the mechanics force us to think a little. I dusted off an old stealth-build and did the intro quests fast. I roamed around the streets solo, untouched, doing the District quests, some Oddities (puzzles) and will do the Race quests next - some even gave me buffs that made my stealth-build better at combat There is solo content that rewards you for playing (not grinding a DPS slog).

The more they introduce these sorts of sideways mechs (especially environmentals; puzzles; things that just bypass the usual DPS vs HP formula), the more it rewards creative solutions & exploration.



So for example, as a solo player, I could use Vampirism & Blade of Woe to kill some mobs - then go invis (potion, NB or vamp) and prep for the next kill. Tactical assassination, not DPS spam, helped me thin packs. I could also use my stealth build for all the side adventures above.

If I want dedicated solo content - that's what the Thieve's Guild & Sheogorath quests will bring.

If I want violence? Well, lorewise, the Night Market does not have "trash" - it's a plane of Oblivion & everyone therein is a competitor worthy of being there. Not everything needs cater to the power-fantasy of mindless beam spam. I did manage to melt many NPC squads - but it took 3 packs for me to realize "oh this isn't the point at all".

The difficult encourages pro-social behavior - people using the Group Finder, carrying newer players & teaching them the ropes, strangers resurrecting other randos & helping other groups. If a game lets me solo, I'll solo - but it seemed obvious the purpose of the difficult is to shake us out of the usual beam spam.

First impression of Night Market, I've just logged out, completely uninspiring and boring content, quests should just be picked up from 1 location, mobs respawn rate is insane when there's no one else around.

Why are the individual wings not separately instanced and filled prior to spinning up a new instance? I saw max 3 other players during 2+ hours of playing.

I think a lot of the confusion has come from the advertising up to the release of the NM. There seemed to be many inaccuracies about what it would be like vs how it actually is.
There is a lot going on and it’s hard to understand. These are things I’ve noticed, which add another layer of difficulty, but don’t deter me from playing.
Dailies are spread out all over the place instead of in one area. This makes it even harder to do solo questing if you can’t find a group because you have to keep killing the same mobs over and over because they respawn so quickly.

The player cap in each zone seems to low, it’s hard to find people who’re doing what you need to do so that you can work together.

The “extra” favor that pops up randomly after you kill mobs disappears so quickly you’re lucky if you can get to it in time.

How come the rewards we get is overland gear that most veteran players have had stickerbooked for forever already.

And, how come you can’t Wayshrine out of the Nights Den House? If you go to your map, it’s just an endless cycle of night market maps, with no option to go back to the regular Tamriel map.

Edited to add- this seems complain-y but it’s not meant to be. I don’t mind a little extra challenge especially for a new area/event that is new. But it’s a lot of work, even with a group, for some cheap overland gear you’ve already collected before. I like the house, and awesome that it was free, but I feel like the grind isn’t worth the time or the rewards so far

thepandalore wrote: »

I've been in the Skittering Precinct for well over an hour waiting for a ritual skirmish to spawn. How long is this timer?

Press F5 (and then maybe F, there's a couple sub menus) and it shows the timer for the next skirmish. I believe they start every 30 minutes, one at a time (so a specific one is once every 90 minutes)

Tandor wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

At any normal time I'm a great supporter of options, not least in respect of difficulty levels.

This is not a normal time, however, in that we know the ZOS team has been significantly reduced in size and that the amount of new content is therefore impacted. At such a time it is even more important that such new content as is viable is aimed at the widest possible range of players, and that means implementing difficulty level options.

This new content is clearly out of the reach of many players, perhaps even most. The others may argue from their veteran BIS dungeon and trial experience with thousands of CPs that you can just run Group Finder and it's all a doddle, but that isn't what many players are used to doing or want to do, and many are simply low level or casual. Their loss for sure, but also ZOS's loss too as they assuredly want their content creation to be widely used and acclaimed.

No rational player wants the Night Market switched from its present focus to a more casual one, but everyone would benefit if it was given some difficulty options as they'd all be able to play it then, their way. And ZOS would benefit too.

Again, I am a PvPer. I've literally never had a PvE build apart from an oakensoul heavy attack builds and a one bar beam build with crafted gear. I do not do vet trials, I rarely do vet dungeons and typically struggle through them.

How many CPs do you have?

Dude you are missing the forest for the trees. It doesnt really matter how much CP one has if their style of gameplay can vary completely. Acting like someone with high CP is automatically going to have an easy time in NM is just as bad as gatekeeping those with low CP from joining groups. Champ points don't even add that much these days anyways since the CP2.0 rework.

The point is that there is an ingame feature that allows you to join a PUG group. The Night Market is designed to be completed by PUG groups. It has very few coordinated mechanics, and just needs someone holding aggro and someone tossing around some heals. You can be CP 200 in crafted gear, join a PUG, and get carried through. You may die, you may get stuck at times, but if I can do it in a PvP build with horrible rotation skills with a PUG, anyone should be able to do it with a PUG.

And the answer to my question is?

Why should it matter how many CPs someone has? Go grind them, make your character more powerful if you want to be able to do stuff easier... That's the whole point of (MMO)RPGs, isn't it? Character progression etc

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

I have seen a few posts on this and it makes no sense.

Create content that needs a group to complete but then sprinkle additional rng drops for progression on top? So a player can’t move on with their group?

So how do groups get to the trial then?

Yeah, cause it literally kills the whole spirit and desire to play; it's like the game is giving you a personal smack, leaving you behind

If I don't get them in the next couple of days, I'm probably quitting ESO for this season, cause this is way too frustrating; the game threw me off the group's progress, which means a key moment is lost

Are these districts meant to be solo instances? Because so far I've not seen any other players in there.

Suggestion:
Thanks to us having the golden pursuit that gives us the monster style pages it makes no sense to have the style pages be bound as well. Let them be able to be sold to allow players who miss the night market to get them, and give further incentive for players to engage in the night market with the collectibles being worthwhile to grind and hold onto for the sake of making some gold.

Hopefully this retains the correct poster.

Content is supposed to scale to level, not necessarily champion points. That is why a lvl 20 alt who has assigned the account's 2000 CPs is much more effective than a lvl 20 with no or few CPs.

But frankly, I don't assign CPs on my alts first thing out the gate.

So while I understand the basic gist of what you're saying, the point is actually moot.

Tandor wrote: »

Because CPs make a difference to the difficulty level of content, someone even at level 20 on an alt but with 2000 CPs will find content a breeze compared with someone at level 20 on their main with no CPs. That's why it's important when someone tells us how easy the NM content is should give a clear picture of where they're coming from compared to those who are struggling with the content. Context is everything. Plus, when someone avoids answering that question it's a bit of a giveaway...

Can anyone tell me how the "propaganda" we need to destroy in one Night Market quest looks like? Is it some poster, or a box, or how does it look like? The quest marker doesn't show up and I have difficulty finding it.

(Not sure why we need to destroy some "propaganda claiming horrible things about our faction ruining our reputation" anyway - aren't those factions supposed to be some criminal underworld baddie stuff?)

majulook wrote: »

Most of the time when I die I have to rez at wayshrine because very few players rez others, and then the wayshine has lots and lots of mobs and mini-bosses between the wayshrine and the group so cannot get to them.

After last falls one-time event fiasco, I thought nothing would be as bad as that. But how wrong I was, I am truly surprised at how bad this experience actuary is.

Contrary to other times when you're a ghost, you can do a lot while in ghost form in the Night Market. You can repair gear, change skills (iirc), you can even resurrect other players (!) while still a ghost.

As soon as you respawn, find out in which direction you need to go, and jump off. With the flying bonus and the long ghost phase, you can often be right back where you want to be just in time to pop back to life.

(Not always. Sometimes the game picks a really weird platform to resurrect at.)

Tandor wrote: »

Decimus wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

At any normal time I'm a great supporter of options, not least in respect of difficulty levels.

This is not a normal time, however, in that we know the ZOS team has been significantly reduced in size and that the amount of new content is therefore impacted. At such a time it is even more important that such new content as is viable is aimed at the widest possible range of players, and that means implementing difficulty level options.

This new content is clearly out of the reach of many players, perhaps even most. The others may argue from their veteran BIS dungeon and trial experience with thousands of CPs that you can just run Group Finder and it's all a doddle, but that isn't what many players are used to doing or want to do, and many are simply low level or casual. Their loss for sure, but also ZOS's loss too as they assuredly want their content creation to be widely used and acclaimed.

No rational player wants the Night Market switched from its present focus to a more casual one, but everyone would benefit if it was given some difficulty options as they'd all be able to play it then, their way. And ZOS would benefit too.

Again, I am a PvPer. I've literally never had a PvE build apart from an oakensoul heavy attack builds and a one bar beam build with crafted gear. I do not do vet trials, I rarely do vet dungeons and typically struggle through them.

How many CPs do you have?

Dude you are missing the forest for the trees. It doesnt really matter how much CP one has if their style of gameplay can vary completely. Acting like someone with high CP is automatically going to have an easy time in NM is just as bad as gatekeeping those with low CP from joining groups. Champ points don't even add that much these days anyways since the CP2.0 rework.

The point is that there is an ingame feature that allows you to join a PUG group. The Night Market is designed to be completed by PUG groups. It has very few coordinated mechanics, and just needs someone holding aggro and someone tossing around some heals. You can be CP 200 in crafted gear, join a PUG, and get carried through. You may die, you may get stuck at times, but if I can do it in a PvP build with horrible rotation skills with a PUG, anyone should be able to do it with a PUG.

And the answer to my question is?

Why should it matter how many CPs someone has? Go grind them, make your character more powerful if you want to be able to do stuff easier... That's the whole point of (MMO)RPGs, isn't it? Character progression etc

Because CPs make a difference to the difficulty level of content, someone even at level 20 on an alt but with 2000 CPs will find content a breeze compared with someone at level 20 on their main with no CPs. That's why it's important when someone tells us how easy the NM content is should give a clear picture of where they're coming from compared to those who are struggling with the content. Context is everything. Plus, when someone avoids answering that question it's a bit of a giveaway...

Except again, it doesnt matter in a group of 12. You could do nothing but avoid red circles on the ground and get carried through a group of 12. Slot some heals or dots and join a group with the group finder.

Syldras wrote: »

Thanks! And what's with those kidnapped/missing people? I just picked up that quest and have been running around one spot and can't see anyone? Are they living people or remains?

They’re dead. One’s in a crack in the wall, one’s on a table in one of those little merchant shack areas, and the other’s on the ground in the middle of the path.

Well I did 8 of the dailies today and got one of the splinters from coffers out of three.

Meanwhile the group finder is starting to have groups demanding relics.

Tell me again why blocking progress with RNG is good?