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Why the one bar build hate? It needs to stop - some players do not like weapon swapping.
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HatchetHaro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Ooh, an edit!EDIT:
Oh… I just looked at your vLC run too. You were definitely being carried there. It’s all good, mate, it happens to everyone, and it happens to me a lot as well, whether I’m running one-bar or two-bar setups. Yep…
How does it feel to have all your achievements only because others carried you for free?
Easy answer: I was in War Machine.
If you don't know, War Machine is a set from the Halls of Fabrication, and for its 5-piece bonus, it grants the wearer and 5 group members Major Slayer when the wearer casts an ultimate.
Basically, it's a group buff set, where the wearer sacrifices a 5-piece bonus for extra damage for the whole group! I'm sorry you didn't know that before, but now you do!
Oh yeah, I was also using Zena's Empowering Disc to grant the group more buffs, in place of a DoT I could have used to boost my own damage even more.
I am a buff boi, big and strong!Ok, ok. So you carry all the others? I’m trying to understand what "carry your own weight" really means, since so many players in 2bar setups always use this argument… So what does it really mean? After all, you’re not just the carry player, you carry them all. Is that it?
Edited by HatchetHaro on March 30, 2026 7:31PMBest Argonian NA and I will fight anyone for it
20 Argonians
6x IR, 7x GH, 7x TTT, 5x GS, 6x DB, 1x PB, 4x SBS, 1x MM, 1x US, 2x CB, 1x Unchained7 -
JiubLeRepenti✭✭✭✭✭
✭@twisttop138 I truly understand that. But low DPS comes from “bad” players, no matter what build they use, right? Bad one-bar players do low DPS, but bad two-bar players do even less. I really understand your point about how diabolical it is for tanks in a low-DPS trial, but how does that put him in the "hate against 1bar players"??
Wow. Don’t want to sound mean, but that’s some good old fallacy point right here.
Yes, a two-bar player can play very badly and bring less DPS than a top-tier player playing with a one-bar build.
But what we’re looking for here is potential.
The potential with a meta build with two bars is far better than the potential with a meta build with one bar.
You can do whatever you want, a two-bar meta player will always outperform a one-bar meta player. Always.
You may decide that a full 1L capacity bottle is better than a 2L capacity bottle filled at 30%. Then there are people like me who instead prefer a full 2L capacity bottle rather than a full 1L capacity bottle.BE/FR l PC EU l CP2700
TES III Morrowind biggest fan!
A little snail once told me there were no place for debate anymore.
Now, i'll simply MAKE FUN OF IT!3 -
Athory✭✭✭HatchetHaro wrote: »
Easy answer: I was in War Machine.
If you don't know, War Machine is a set from the Halls of Fabrication, and for its 5-piece bonus, it grants the wearer and 5 group members Major Slayer when the wearer casts an ultimate.
Basically, it's a group buff set, where the wearer sacrifices a 5-piece bonus for extra damage for the whole group! I'm sorry you didn't know that before, but now you do!
I am a buff boi, big and strong!Ok, ok. So you carry all the others? I’m trying to understand what "carry your own weight" really means, since so many players in 2bar setups always use this argument… So what does it really mean? After all, you’re not just the carry player, you carry them all. Is that it?
Of course, you’re in “support sets” like everyone else, right? So no carrying in your runs, only in other players’ runs? Okay, I see… Anyway, the server’s open, so I’m going to level up my new HA character. Kiss and free hugs!
:: [Guild: Tamriel Order] :: Exclusively for players using One‑Bar / HA builds, or items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul RingAbout UsIf you don’t want random players, then don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord — not on Group Finder.
*** This guild is exclusively for players who prefer alternative playstyles such as Onebar builds, Heavy Attack builds (HA), or using items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul Ring. ***- Do you ever feel discouraged when you see “no HA players” or “no Oakensoul players” in Group Finder?
- Do you avoid joining groups because you're worried about being judged or kicked?
Then this is exactly where you belong.
*** We are building a group of players who simply want to enjoy the game, learn mechanics at their own pace, and improve naturally over time.
No pressure, no strict meta requirements, no 120k parses — just steady progress and clear understanding of mechanics.
Our goal is simple:
First we learn → then we become consistent → then we get faster → and when the group truly feels ready, we push into Hard Modes together.
*** Minimum requirement: CP800.
This ensures everyone has the baseline stats needed for HM content and helps us maintain a strong, capable team.
*** We value teamwork, respect, patience, and a positive attitude above all else.
Everyone is here to improve — no ego, no toxicity.
If you're looking for a guild where you can grow, feel comfortable, and still clear some of the hardest content ESO has to offer, this is your place."WE DON'T USE DISCORD!"
Recruitment Headline
*** In this guild, we don’t care if you parse 70k less or 200k more than others.
We don’t care about numbers at all — what matters is handling mechanics:
exploding curses outside the group in vRG, swapping mirrors, doing assignments correctly, and keeping runs clean.
By around CP800, any player can reach ~60–70k DPS baseline, and that’s enough to complete almost any trial HM.
For trifectas, yes, we push DPS because of timers — but for Hard Modes, we take our time without pressure.
If you can handle mechanics, you’re welcome here. ***/!\"I have zero tolerance for toxicity regarding other players’ builds or DPS. If you don’t like someone’s setup for any reason, you’re free to leave the group. But if you choose to stay, then support others in every way you can." - @Zaan’s
Why this?I allways run GF to help others since I already have all trial items. But, I noticed: most groups are full of 2bar players doing lowers DPS then 1bar players, and RD keep gatekeeping 1bar players for no reason at all.
It made me realize I’ve been spending my time helping the wrong players. 2bar players don’t need my help, 1bar players need.0 -
SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭twisttop138 wrote: »The problem isn't really that mythic. I see people do great in content, even dlc hm trial content with it or a 1 bar build. The problem is there has been this attitude that became the stereotype for 1 bar players. You see it in this thread. They get a bad wrap for an unwillingness to learn, an attitude that everyone is against them and if you give suggestions or tell them something then you're a gatekeeping elitist. Who wants to play with that? That's not all 1 bar players but the attitude is there, I've experienced it in content. You want to sign up for a vet run in any of my guilds, come with a willingness to learn or to have fun playing the content. That's it. If your dps isn't high enough, no big deal. We can work on it.
In reply to "They get a bad wrap for an unwillingness to learn", why should any player be expected to learn a playstyle they do not enjoy? One bar builds should have their own strengths and should be comparable to 2 bar builds. Then all players will be able to learn the best way to play and how to carry their own weight in a way they enjoy.PCNA1 -
JiubLeRepenti✭✭✭✭✭
✭HatchetHaro wrote: »
Easy answer: I was in War Machine.
If you don't know, War Machine is a set from the Halls of Fabrication, and for its 5-piece bonus, it grants the wearer and 5 group members Major Slayer when the wearer casts an ultimate.
Basically, it's a group buff set, where the wearer sacrifices a 5-piece bonus for extra damage for the whole group! I'm sorry you didn't know that before, but now you do!
I am a buff boi, big and strong!Ok, ok. So you carry all the others? I’m trying to understand what "carry your own weight" really means, since so many players in 2bar setups always use this argument… So what does it really mean? After all, you’re not just the carry player, you carry them all. Is that it?
Of course, you’re in “support sets” like everyone else, right? So no carrying in your runs, only in other players’ runs? Okay, I see… Anyway, the server’s open, so I’m going to level up my new HA character. Kiss and free hugs!
The question of being carried is 100% irrelevant when we speak about trifecta runs in optimized groups...
The goal when you do trifecta trials in an optimized roster isn’t to have the highest DPS as it can be in PUG runs. It’s about being a valuable part of a whole, consistent and interdependent group, where everybody depends on every other member.Edited by JiubLeRepenti on March 30, 2026 7:38PMBE/FR l PC EU l CP2700
TES III Morrowind biggest fan!
A little snail once told me there were no place for debate anymore.
Now, i'll simply MAKE FUN OF IT!6 -
HatchetHaro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Nah. Double checking the Orphic Shattered Shard fight, everyone else was in Coral Riptide, other than that one guy in Sul-Xan. This was before subclassing, so metas were a bit different back then.HatchetHaro wrote: »
Easy answer: I was in War Machine.
If you don't know, War Machine is a set from the Halls of Fabrication, and for its 5-piece bonus, it grants the wearer and 5 group members Major Slayer when the wearer casts an ultimate.
Basically, it's a group buff set, where the wearer sacrifices a 5-piece bonus for extra damage for the whole group! I'm sorry you didn't know that before, but now you do!
I am a buff boi, big and strong!Ok, ok. So you carry all the others? I’m trying to understand what "carry your own weight" really means, since so many players in 2bar setups always use this argument… So what does it really mean? After all, you’re not just the carry player, you carry them all. Is that it?
Of course, you’re in “support sets” like everyone else, right? So no carrying in your runs, only in other players’ runs? Okay, I see… Anyway, the server’s open, so I’m going to level up my new HA character. Kiss and free hugs!
But here, you can see more clearly the style for these pieces I've circled is of the Refabricated style (the style that War Machine drops/reconstructs in), compared to others' Syrabanic Marine style (the style that Coral Riptide pieces drop/reconstruct in). The guy below me was using Sul-Xan instead because he's an absolute baller.
I don't know if you see the pattern yet, but I have an answer for every one of your accusations. I walk the talk.
Man, this is a lot of walking and talking.
Edited by HatchetHaro on March 30, 2026 7:45PMBest Argonian NA and I will fight anyone for it
20 Argonians
6x IR, 7x GH, 7x TTT, 5x GS, 6x DB, 1x PB, 4x SBS, 1x MM, 1x US, 2x CB, 1x Unchained1 -
Soarora✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭HatchetHaro wrote: »
Easy answer: I was in War Machine.
If you don't know, War Machine is a set from the Halls of Fabrication, and for its 5-piece bonus, it grants the wearer and 5 group members Major Slayer when the wearer casts an ultimate.
Basically, it's a group buff set, where the wearer sacrifices a 5-piece bonus for extra damage for the whole group! I'm sorry you didn't know that before, but now you do!
I am a buff boi, big and strong!Ok, ok. So you carry all the others? I’m trying to understand what "carry your own weight" really means, since so many players in 2bar setups always use this argument… So what does it really mean? After all, you’re not just the carry player, you carry them all. Is that it?
Of course, you’re in “support sets” like everyone else, right? So no carrying in your runs, only in other players’ runs? Okay, I see… Anyway, the server’s open, so I’m going to level up my new HA character. Kiss and free hugs!
There’s usually 2 or 3 support dds and all the others are wearing pure damage sets.SilverBride wrote: »twisttop138 wrote: »The problem isn't really that mythic. I see people do great in content, even dlc hm trial content with it or a 1 bar build. The problem is there has been this attitude that became the stereotype for 1 bar players. You see it in this thread. They get a bad wrap for an unwillingness to learn, an attitude that everyone is against them and if you give suggestions or tell them something then you're a gatekeeping elitist. Who wants to play with that? That's not all 1 bar players but the attitude is there, I've experienced it in content. You want to sign up for a vet run in any of my guilds, come with a willingness to learn or to have fun playing the content. That's it. If your dps isn't high enough, no big deal. We can work on it.
In reply to "They get a bad wrap for an unwillingness to learn", why should any player be expected to learn a playstyle they do not enjoy? One bar builds should have their own strengths and should be comparable to 2 bar builds. Then all players will be able to learn the best way to play and how to carry their own weight in a way they enjoy.
It’s not that people need to play a playstyle they don’t enjoy, but they do need to be open to criticism on how they perform in-content (i.e. how well they avoid AoEs, handle mechanics, keep up their rotation, standing in front of the healer/being where they should be) and adapting their build (which doesn’t have to mean playing 2-bar, but say, if someone’s currently an oakenHA player and are asked to try Rakkhat for more damage, or taking off a shield to slot another damaging skill, or taking off infalliable aether for some higher performing set).[PC/NA] Dungeoneer (Tank/DPS), Retired Trialist, and amateur Battlegrounder (DPS) with a passion for The Elder Scrolls lore.- Current GM of Hard Dungeoneers
- Tanks: Sorcerer - Necromancer - Templar
- DPS: Frost Warden - Stamarc
- Ex-healer
- Dungeons: 32/32 HMs - 26/26 Tris
View my builds!
4 -
Athory✭✭✭JiubLeRepenti wrote: »
The question of being carried is 100% irrelevant when we speak about trifecta runs in optimized groups...
The goal when you do trifecta trials in an optimized roster isn’t to have the highest DPS as it can be in PUG runs. It’s about being a valuable part of a whole, consistent and interdependent group, where everybody depends on every other member.
Right… so Organized Discord groups, where the Raid Leader hand-picks the team ahead of time and tells everyone what they should use, that’s all fine. But if someone joins a group through the finder and the trial go easy, suddenly they say, "Hey, let’s try Trifecta, the group isn’t bad." 10s seconds later, they reset and try again, where all we know is what sets tanks have, what sets healers have, and who’s going through the portal… then the last DPS is expected to be carried? Or the last three? I see…
So, carry runs only happen in group finder play, with people who know the mechanics, don’t care about parsing, or whether someone has one bar or two bars, and all that matters is: complete the content. Okay, okay! Yeah, I’ve been carried a lot of times. And honestly? It’s way better than any Discord group I’ve ever been part of. By far!
Funny… because I never see any "free/selling HM carry runs" in the group finder, but I usually seem them in Discord groups.
Edited by Athory on March 30, 2026 7:50PM:: [Guild: Tamriel Order] :: Exclusively for players using One‑Bar / HA builds, or items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul RingAbout UsIf you don’t want random players, then don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord — not on Group Finder.
*** This guild is exclusively for players who prefer alternative playstyles such as Onebar builds, Heavy Attack builds (HA), or using items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul Ring. ***- Do you ever feel discouraged when you see “no HA players” or “no Oakensoul players” in Group Finder?
- Do you avoid joining groups because you're worried about being judged or kicked?
Then this is exactly where you belong.
*** We are building a group of players who simply want to enjoy the game, learn mechanics at their own pace, and improve naturally over time.
No pressure, no strict meta requirements, no 120k parses — just steady progress and clear understanding of mechanics.
Our goal is simple:
First we learn → then we become consistent → then we get faster → and when the group truly feels ready, we push into Hard Modes together.
*** Minimum requirement: CP800.
This ensures everyone has the baseline stats needed for HM content and helps us maintain a strong, capable team.
*** We value teamwork, respect, patience, and a positive attitude above all else.
Everyone is here to improve — no ego, no toxicity.
If you're looking for a guild where you can grow, feel comfortable, and still clear some of the hardest content ESO has to offer, this is your place."WE DON'T USE DISCORD!"
Recruitment Headline
*** In this guild, we don’t care if you parse 70k less or 200k more than others.
We don’t care about numbers at all — what matters is handling mechanics:
exploding curses outside the group in vRG, swapping mirrors, doing assignments correctly, and keeping runs clean.
By around CP800, any player can reach ~60–70k DPS baseline, and that’s enough to complete almost any trial HM.
For trifectas, yes, we push DPS because of timers — but for Hard Modes, we take our time without pressure.
If you can handle mechanics, you’re welcome here. ***/!\"I have zero tolerance for toxicity regarding other players’ builds or DPS. If you don’t like someone’s setup for any reason, you’re free to leave the group. But if you choose to stay, then support others in every way you can." - @Zaan’s
Why this?I allways run GF to help others since I already have all trial items. But, I noticed: most groups are full of 2bar players doing lowers DPS then 1bar players, and RD keep gatekeeping 1bar players for no reason at all.
It made me realize I’ve been spending my time helping the wrong players. 2bar players don’t need my help, 1bar players need.0 -
JiubLeRepenti✭✭✭✭✭
✭JiubLeRepenti wrote: »
The question of being carried is 100% irrelevant when we speak about trifecta runs in optimized groups...
The goal when you do trifecta trials in an optimized roster isn’t to have the highest DPS as it can be in PUG runs. It’s about being a valuable part of a whole, consistent and interdependent group, where everybody depends on every other member.
Right… so Organized Discord groups, where the Raid Leader hand-picks the team ahead of time and tells everyone what they should use, that’s all fine. But if someone joins a group through the finder and the trial go easy, suddenly they say, "Hey, let’s try Trifecta, the group isn’t bad." 10s seconds later, they reset and try again, where all we know is what sets tanks have, what sets healers have, and who’s going through the portal… then the last DPS is expected to be carried? Or the last three? I see…
So, carry runs only happen in group finder play, with people who know the mechanics, don’t care about parsing, or whether someone has one bar or two bars, and all that matters is: complete the content. Okay, okay! Yeah, I’ve been carried a lot of times. And honestly? It’s way better than any Discord group I’ve ever been part of. By far!
Funny… because I never see any "free/selling HM carry runs" in the group finder, but I usually seem them in Discord groups.
I've easily done 200+ vet trial runs in PUGs. I've never, ever seen a single run where the leader (or any other group member) was suddenly suggesting doing a trifecta, except maybe for very easy ones like HLC or AA (and even for HLC or AA, it would be very challenging—if not almost impossible—to get a no-death run with a PUG).
Doing a trial trifecta requires a deep understanding of the game mechanics and an optimized group, mostly using voice chat. So there is almost 0% of chance to pass a trifecta with a PUG. Which means the scenario you're describing is highly unlikely.
I just feel like you're inventing fictitious scenarios just to avoid the fact that your argument doesn't make any sense.Edited by JiubLeRepenti on March 30, 2026 8:21PMBE/FR l PC EU l CP2700
TES III Morrowind biggest fan!
A little snail once told me there were no place for debate anymore.
Now, i'll simply MAKE FUN OF IT!6 -
Athory✭✭✭OK. I already said it twice, but it seems like I’m going for the third time! I’m 100% of the time playing with Pugs in Finder. You may find me there, or just invite @Zaan's PC-EU. Anything else I type in the forum or anywhere else… it’s just words. What else can I do? I type my words, you type your words, and we both end up feeling like someone’s wrong about the whole topic and why people hate 1bar. How do we solve it? In-game.
edit:
But please, don’t ask me to go on voice, because that would be the first step toward me leaving the group.
Edited by Athory on March 30, 2026 8:38PM:: [Guild: Tamriel Order] :: Exclusively for players using One‑Bar / HA builds, or items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul RingAbout UsIf you don’t want random players, then don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord — not on Group Finder.
*** This guild is exclusively for players who prefer alternative playstyles such as Onebar builds, Heavy Attack builds (HA), or using items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul Ring. ***- Do you ever feel discouraged when you see “no HA players” or “no Oakensoul players” in Group Finder?
- Do you avoid joining groups because you're worried about being judged or kicked?
Then this is exactly where you belong.
*** We are building a group of players who simply want to enjoy the game, learn mechanics at their own pace, and improve naturally over time.
No pressure, no strict meta requirements, no 120k parses — just steady progress and clear understanding of mechanics.
Our goal is simple:
First we learn → then we become consistent → then we get faster → and when the group truly feels ready, we push into Hard Modes together.
*** Minimum requirement: CP800.
This ensures everyone has the baseline stats needed for HM content and helps us maintain a strong, capable team.
*** We value teamwork, respect, patience, and a positive attitude above all else.
Everyone is here to improve — no ego, no toxicity.
If you're looking for a guild where you can grow, feel comfortable, and still clear some of the hardest content ESO has to offer, this is your place."WE DON'T USE DISCORD!"
Recruitment Headline
*** In this guild, we don’t care if you parse 70k less or 200k more than others.
We don’t care about numbers at all — what matters is handling mechanics:
exploding curses outside the group in vRG, swapping mirrors, doing assignments correctly, and keeping runs clean.
By around CP800, any player can reach ~60–70k DPS baseline, and that’s enough to complete almost any trial HM.
For trifectas, yes, we push DPS because of timers — but for Hard Modes, we take our time without pressure.
If you can handle mechanics, you’re welcome here. ***/!\"I have zero tolerance for toxicity regarding other players’ builds or DPS. If you don’t like someone’s setup for any reason, you’re free to leave the group. But if you choose to stay, then support others in every way you can." - @Zaan’s
Why this?I allways run GF to help others since I already have all trial items. But, I noticed: most groups are full of 2bar players doing lowers DPS then 1bar players, and RD keep gatekeeping 1bar players for no reason at all.
It made me realize I’ve been spending my time helping the wrong players. 2bar players don’t need my help, 1bar players need.0 -
JiubLeRepenti✭✭✭✭✭
✭OK. I already said it twice, but it seems like I’m going for the third time! I’m 100% of the time playing with Pugs in Finder. You may find me there, or just invite @Zaan's PC-EU. Anything else I type in the forum or anywhere else… it’s just words. What else can I do? I type my words, you type your words, and we both end up feeling like someone’s wrong about the whole topic and why people hate 1bar. How do we solve it? In-game.
edit:
But please, don’t ask me to go on voice, because that would be the first step toward me leaving the group.
Nothing in your reply answers the point I made in my previous post. I don't understand the goal of your post, except to "save face" by giving a response and keep feeding this thread.BE/FR l PC EU l CP2700
TES III Morrowind biggest fan!
A little snail once told me there were no place for debate anymore.
Now, i'll simply MAKE FUN OF IT!3 -
RaikaNA✭✭✭✭✭
✭HatchetHaro wrote: »Good news! I don't see you in any of the raiding Discord servers I'm in, so chances are, we've never met. Let us keep it that way!
If you don't believe me on my skill and achievements, though, that's fine; I walk the talk, and I bring receipts.
Well, like I said: "You may be or may not be the player I’m thinking of."
How much did you pay for all that? The same I paid for my carries? Or did you achieve it all on your own while expecting everyone else to pay? I see…
You won’t find me in Discord groups, and the reason is simple: I’m too tired of all the toxicity about builds in there. I just can’t handle it anymore on Discord.
You pro players go happy in Discord; I go happy with Group Finder. You pros create all this “toxicity” around new players, casual players, and anyone who doesn’t follow your rules, gatekeeping, elitism, and all that. Meanwhile, I play with pugs, just logging in, learning, and trying to improve.
Maybe one day I’ll have all that without paying like you did… I mean… no, I pay, not you.
And I’d definitely love to have all those achievements. But well… I’m too much of a noob to be part of those groups (not enought money), and that’s 100% true.
At the same time, saying that players with 80k DPS can’t do HM trials says a lot about your achievements.
New and casual players shouldn't immediately hop into hard content without putting in the work for it first. Why do new players need to complete a veteran trial? especially a DLC one? They're new to the game and don't have the necessary gear to run vtrials. The toxicity you claim is going on is simply a way you not agreeing to the rules of the raid leads .. There is no gatekeeping.. You're certainly welcome to form your own guild and make your own rules and lead hard content in hopes of getting a clear rather than to spend 3+ hours in a vtrial.4 -
Arunei✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭It feels like maybe an easy solution to this is for ZOS to stop balancing new content around current min-maxing DPS numbers. I remember back when something like 50k-60k was more than enough for Vet everything (maybe not Vet HM or Trifectas, but most everything else). Maybe going forward hard DPS checks and the like should be consistently balanced more around...idk 80k, 90k, and focus more on mechanics rather than just how fast things can be burned down. Of course that could affect people doing Speed Run stuff, but perhaps there could be a special mode for that that maybe removes or shortens certain mechanics so they don't artifically add on to a Speed Run?
I don't know but it seems like perhaps normal and Vet Dungeons/Trials shouldn't just constantly be balanced around what a smaller percent of the playerbase can achieve. That's not to say that people should be able to equip all white random gear, use Mag Skills on a character that has 64 Stam and 0 Mag, only spam executes regardless of what health the Boss is at because they like how the Skill looks, and clear all content. What I AM saying is that people should be able to complete a majority of the content (and again I'll repeat I'm not even talking vet HM or Trifectas, just normal and Vet Dungeons and Trials) regardless of whether they use a 1-bar or 2-bar build and regardless of whether it's HA or not.PC-NA | Been around since closed beta
Avid RPer. Hit me up in-game @Ras_Lei if you're interested in getting together for some arr-pee shenanigans!
RP Characters:
Sarah Lacroix: Breton Vampire who really really REALLY likes likes learning Magick and also her Altmer husbando
Kaalhil Swiftstrike: Tiny shapeshifting monster hunter Bosmeri lady with enough sass to kill a dragon or ten
Gwendolyn Jenelle: Friendly healer with a coffee addiction and her own medical practice
Krisiel: Literally crazy Werewolf, no like legit insane. She nuts
Kiju Veran: Ex-Fighters Guild Suthay who likes to punch things and is also a spy and ALSO a Werewolf
Niralae Elsinal: Young Altmeri woman with way too much Magicka and Vampire husbando
Slondor: TESified Slenderman, except lazier and has more of a thing for deals than Clavicus Vile does
Marius Vastino: Sarah's Imperial apathetic sire who likes to monologue
Lirawyn Calatare: Traveling performer and bard who's 101% vanilla bean
Soliril Larethian: Blind alchemist who uses animals to see and brews plagues in his spare time0 -
HatchetHaro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
For the record, the run in question only had 1 single support DD: me!
There’s usually 2 or 3 support dds and all the others are wearing pure damage sets.HatchetHaro wrote: »
Easy answer: I was in War Machine.
If you don't know, War Machine is a set from the Halls of Fabrication, and for its 5-piece bonus, it grants the wearer and 5 group members Major Slayer when the wearer casts an ultimate.
Basically, it's a group buff set, where the wearer sacrifices a 5-piece bonus for extra damage for the whole group! I'm sorry you didn't know that before, but now you do!
I am a buff boi, big and strong!Ok, ok. So you carry all the others? I’m trying to understand what "carry your own weight" really means, since so many players in 2bar setups always use this argument… So what does it really mean? After all, you’re not just the carry player, you carry them all. Is that it?
Of course, you’re in “support sets” like everyone else, right? So no carrying in your runs, only in other players’ runs? Okay, I see… Anyway, the server’s open, so I’m going to level up my new HA character. Kiss and free hugs!
No one's gonna invite you, man. You can beg all you want, but you've already demonstrated yourself to be 1. unknowledgable of trial mechanics, 2. ignorant of group comps, 3. unable to perform, and 4. unwilling to learn.OK. I already said it twice, but it seems like I’m going for the third time! I’m 100% of the time playing with Pugs in Finder. You may find me there, or just invite @Zaan's PC-EU. Anything else I type in the forum or anywhere else… it’s just words. What else can I do? I type my words, you type your words, and we both end up feeling like someone’s wrong about the whole topic and why people hate 1bar. How do we solve it? In-game.
edit:
But please, don’t ask me to go on voice, because that would be the first step toward me leaving the group.
Best Argonian NA and I will fight anyone for it
20 Argonians
6x IR, 7x GH, 7x TTT, 5x GS, 6x DB, 1x PB, 4x SBS, 1x MM, 1x US, 2x CB, 1x Unchained5 -
coop500✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭It feels like maybe an easy solution to this is for ZOS to stop balancing new content around current min-maxing DPS numbers. I remember back when something like 50k-60k was more than enough for Vet everything (maybe not Vet HM or Trifectas, but most everything else). Maybe going forward hard DPS checks and the like should be consistently balanced more around...idk 80k, 90k, and focus more on mechanics rather than just how fast things can be burned down. Of course that could affect people doing Speed Run stuff, but perhaps there could be a special mode for that that maybe removes or shortens certain mechanics so they don't artifically add on to a Speed Run?
I don't know but it seems like perhaps normal and Vet Dungeons/Trials shouldn't just constantly be balanced around what a smaller percent of the playerbase can achieve. That's not to say that people should be able to equip all white random gear, use Mag Skills on a character that has 64 Stam and 0 Mag, only spam executes regardless of what health the Boss is at because they like how the Skill looks, and clear all content. What I AM saying is that people should be able to complete a majority of the content (and again I'll repeat I'm not even talking vet HM or Trifectas, just normal and Vet Dungeons and Trials) regardless of whether they use a 1-bar or 2-bar build and regardless of whether it's HA or not.
I agree with this, and the upcoming Night Market is a good example of content that was clearly balanced with min-maxing DPS numbers in mind. Even the trash packs are punishing, and it makes me concerned for a timed FOMO zone to be this way.Hoping for more playable races0 -
Athory✭✭✭HatchetHaro wrote: »No one's gonna invite you, man. You can beg all you want, but you've already demonstrated yourself to be 1. unknowledgable of trial mechanics, 2. ignorant of group comps, 3. unable to perform, and 4. unwilling to learn.
Of course no one will invite me, and I know that. The reasons are everything you said, plus:
1) We all know that in any organized top group, HA builds will be completely useless. That’s just a fact.
2) But for any other vet HM content, especially in pugs from Group Finder or even guild runs, any 1bar build can carry a lot of players and show them how “useless” they are with 2bars.
The real issue for you, and others who talk about 1bar builds is this: in pugs, you might end up performing worse than a 1bar player. And that’s why you don’t invite me, because I can prove it. You hate that, and I love it.:: [Guild: Tamriel Order] :: Exclusively for players using One‑Bar / HA builds, or items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul RingAbout UsIf you don’t want random players, then don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord — not on Group Finder.
*** This guild is exclusively for players who prefer alternative playstyles such as Onebar builds, Heavy Attack builds (HA), or using items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul Ring. ***- Do you ever feel discouraged when you see “no HA players” or “no Oakensoul players” in Group Finder?
- Do you avoid joining groups because you're worried about being judged or kicked?
Then this is exactly where you belong.
*** We are building a group of players who simply want to enjoy the game, learn mechanics at their own pace, and improve naturally over time.
No pressure, no strict meta requirements, no 120k parses — just steady progress and clear understanding of mechanics.
Our goal is simple:
First we learn → then we become consistent → then we get faster → and when the group truly feels ready, we push into Hard Modes together.
*** Minimum requirement: CP800.
This ensures everyone has the baseline stats needed for HM content and helps us maintain a strong, capable team.
*** We value teamwork, respect, patience, and a positive attitude above all else.
Everyone is here to improve — no ego, no toxicity.
If you're looking for a guild where you can grow, feel comfortable, and still clear some of the hardest content ESO has to offer, this is your place."WE DON'T USE DISCORD!"
Recruitment Headline
*** In this guild, we don’t care if you parse 70k less or 200k more than others.
We don’t care about numbers at all — what matters is handling mechanics:
exploding curses outside the group in vRG, swapping mirrors, doing assignments correctly, and keeping runs clean.
By around CP800, any player can reach ~60–70k DPS baseline, and that’s enough to complete almost any trial HM.
For trifectas, yes, we push DPS because of timers — but for Hard Modes, we take our time without pressure.
If you can handle mechanics, you’re welcome here. ***/!\"I have zero tolerance for toxicity regarding other players’ builds or DPS. If you don’t like someone’s setup for any reason, you’re free to leave the group. But if you choose to stay, then support others in every way you can." - @Zaan’s
Why this?I allways run GF to help others since I already have all trial items. But, I noticed: most groups are full of 2bar players doing lowers DPS then 1bar players, and RD keep gatekeeping 1bar players for no reason at all.
It made me realize I’ve been spending my time helping the wrong players. 2bar players don’t need my help, 1bar players need.0 -
FlameDark✭✭✭✭Personally I don't care what gear you're running, or if you're doing the fight with one or two bars. As long as you're doing enough DPS and not making everyone else in the group carry your damage then use whatever set you feel like.
The tank has to be able to have health and resistance to not die to the boss's attack. The healer has to be able to sustain healing and keep the team alive. The DPS has to do enough damage to kill the boss. We all have jobs to do. Sucking at your job by not doing enough DPS will compromise the group, potentially causing a wipe, or making a 20 minute dungeon into a two hour long punishment. So as long as you, as the DPS, can do your job... I really don't care how you do it.
Of course this isn't accounting for CR with it's bar swap mechanic... Ya don't go in there with one bar, just temporary have a two bar build for that one so you don't wipe the group.PC/NA CP 950 - PvE
◆Arondael - Level 50 Magicka Necromancer ◆ Valyndrae (MAIN) - Level 50 Magicka Sorcerer ◆ Mithaedrun - Level 50 Stamina Arcanist
4 -
JiubLeRepenti✭✭✭✭✭
✭HatchetHaro wrote: »No one's gonna invite you, man. You can beg all you want, but you've already demonstrated yourself to be 1. unknowledgable of trial mechanics, 2. ignorant of group comps, 3. unable to perform, and 4. unwilling to learn.
Of course no one will invite me, and I know that. The reasons are everything you said, plus:
1) We all know that in any organized top group, HA builds will be completely useless. That’s just a fact.
2) But for any other vet HM content, especially in pugs from Group Finder or even guild runs, any 1bar build can carry a lot of players and show them how “useless” they are with 2bars.
The real issue for you, and others who talk about 1bar builds is this: in pugs, you might end up performing worse than a 1bar player. And that’s why you don’t invite me, because I can prove it. You hate that, and I love it.
Once again, that’s not the point.
You might outplay some two-bar players who perform poorly. But the potential of two-bar gameplay will always be higher than that of one-bar gameplay.
Can I beat a Bugatti Veyron in a speed race with my BMW i8 if I drive like a pro and the Bugatti driver is very bad? Yeah, sure. But if both drivers are at the same level, the Bugatti will still crush me. And guess what? In a speed race, any good driver will choose the Bugatti over the BMW, even if the BMW wins 10% of the time.
Your potential as a one-bar player is, and will always be, lower than the potential of a two-bar player. The max you can potentially reach will always be lower. That's it.BE/FR l PC EU l CP2700
TES III Morrowind biggest fan!
A little snail once told me there were no place for debate anymore.
Now, i'll simply MAKE FUN OF IT!2 -
Athory✭✭✭JiubLeRepenti wrote: »HatchetHaro wrote: »No one's gonna invite you, man. You can beg all you want, but you've already demonstrated yourself to be 1. unknowledgable of trial mechanics, 2. ignorant of group comps, 3. unable to perform, and 4. unwilling to learn.
Of course no one will invite me, and I know that. The reasons are everything you said, plus:
1) We all know that in any organized top group, HA builds will be completely useless. That’s just a fact.
2) But for any other vet HM content, especially in pugs from Group Finder or even guild runs, any 1bar build can carry a lot of players and show them how “useless” they are with 2bars.
The real issue for you, and others who talk about 1bar builds is this: in pugs, you might end up performing worse than a 1bar player. And that’s why you don’t invite me, because I can prove it. You hate that, and I love it.
Once again, that’s not the point.
You might outplay some two-bar players who perform poorly. But the potential of two-bar gameplay will always be higher than that of one-bar gameplay.
Can I beat a Bugatti Veyron in a speed race with my BMW i8 if I drive like a pro and the Bugatti driver is very bad? Yeah, sure. But if both drivers are at the same level, the Bugatti will still crush me. And guess what? In a speed race, any good driver will choose the Bugatti over the BMW, even if the BMW wins 10% of the time.
Your potential as a one-bar player is, and will always be, lower than the potential of a two-bar player. The max you can potentially reach will always be lower. That's it.
And where did I disagree with that? If we compare two endgame 2bar players versus one endgame 1bar player, the 2bar players will always win by far, as I said before. And this is how it should be! A 1bar player should never even come close to matching a 2bar player with a perfect rotation. I agree with this, and I never said otherwise.
And if any player can use 2 bars, they should learn weaving as soon as possible, because at some point they will outperform any 1bar build.
But my point still stands:
This whole discussion is not about endgame content. It’s about "Why the hate for one-bar builds? It needs to stop — some players don’t like weapon swapping." And that’s valid! Because in pugs, Group Finder, guild runs, and most veteran or even HM content, a 1bar build is more than enough to complete it.
Top-tier players, like @HatchetHaro for example, perform incredibly well in fully optimized groups. But in unorganized pug runs, where those ideal conditions don’t exist, their advantage shrinks significantly. In those situations, a simple and consistent 1bar build can sometimes outperform them.- And this is why you all hate 1bar players. This is why you gatekeep them and this is why my point is 100% valid.
Edited by Athory on March 31, 2026 8:54AM:: [Guild: Tamriel Order] :: Exclusively for players using One‑Bar / HA builds, or items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul RingAbout UsIf you don’t want random players, then don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord — not on Group Finder.
*** This guild is exclusively for players who prefer alternative playstyles such as Onebar builds, Heavy Attack builds (HA), or using items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul Ring. ***- Do you ever feel discouraged when you see “no HA players” or “no Oakensoul players” in Group Finder?
- Do you avoid joining groups because you're worried about being judged or kicked?
Then this is exactly where you belong.
*** We are building a group of players who simply want to enjoy the game, learn mechanics at their own pace, and improve naturally over time.
No pressure, no strict meta requirements, no 120k parses — just steady progress and clear understanding of mechanics.
Our goal is simple:
First we learn → then we become consistent → then we get faster → and when the group truly feels ready, we push into Hard Modes together.
*** Minimum requirement: CP800.
This ensures everyone has the baseline stats needed for HM content and helps us maintain a strong, capable team.
*** We value teamwork, respect, patience, and a positive attitude above all else.
Everyone is here to improve — no ego, no toxicity.
If you're looking for a guild where you can grow, feel comfortable, and still clear some of the hardest content ESO has to offer, this is your place."WE DON'T USE DISCORD!"
Recruitment Headline
*** In this guild, we don’t care if you parse 70k less or 200k more than others.
We don’t care about numbers at all — what matters is handling mechanics:
exploding curses outside the group in vRG, swapping mirrors, doing assignments correctly, and keeping runs clean.
By around CP800, any player can reach ~60–70k DPS baseline, and that’s enough to complete almost any trial HM.
For trifectas, yes, we push DPS because of timers — but for Hard Modes, we take our time without pressure.
If you can handle mechanics, you’re welcome here. ***/!\"I have zero tolerance for toxicity regarding other players’ builds or DPS. If you don’t like someone’s setup for any reason, you’re free to leave the group. But if you choose to stay, then support others in every way you can." - @Zaan’s
Why this?I allways run GF to help others since I already have all trial items. But, I noticed: most groups are full of 2bar players doing lowers DPS then 1bar players, and RD keep gatekeeping 1bar players for no reason at all.
It made me realize I’ve been spending my time helping the wrong players. 2bar players don’t need my help, 1bar players need.0 -
JiubLeRepenti✭✭✭✭✭
✭JiubLeRepenti wrote: »HatchetHaro wrote: »No one's gonna invite you, man. You can beg all you want, but you've already demonstrated yourself to be 1. unknowledgable of trial mechanics, 2. ignorant of group comps, 3. unable to perform, and 4. unwilling to learn.
Of course no one will invite me, and I know that. The reasons are everything you said, plus:
1) We all know that in any organized top group, HA builds will be completely useless. That’s just a fact.
2) But for any other vet HM content, especially in pugs from Group Finder or even guild runs, any 1bar build can carry a lot of players and show them how “useless” they are with 2bars.
The real issue for you, and others who talk about 1bar builds is this: in pugs, you might end up performing worse than a 1bar player. And that’s why you don’t invite me, because I can prove it. You hate that, and I love it.
Once again, that’s not the point.
You might outplay some two-bar players who perform poorly. But the potential of two-bar gameplay will always be higher than that of one-bar gameplay.
Can I beat a Bugatti Veyron in a speed race with my BMW i8 if I drive like a pro and the Bugatti driver is very bad? Yeah, sure. But if both drivers are at the same level, the Bugatti will still crush me. And guess what? In a speed race, any good driver will choose the Bugatti over the BMW, even if the BMW wins 10% of the time.
Your potential as a one-bar player is, and will always be, lower than the potential of a two-bar player. The max you can potentially reach will always be lower. That's it.
And where did I disagree with that? If we compare two endgame 2bar players versus one endgame 1bar player, the 2bar players will always win by far, as I said before. And this is how it should be! A 1bar player should never even come close to matching a 2bar player with a perfect rotation. I agree with this, and I never said otherwise.
And if any player can use 2 bars, they should learn weaving as soon as possible, because at some point they will outperform any 1bar build.
But my point still stands:
This whole discussion is not about endgame content. It’s about "Why the hate for one-bar builds? It needs to stop — some players don’t like weapon swapping." And that’s valid! Because in pugs, Group Finder, guild runs, and most veteran or even HM content, a 1bar build is more than enough to complete it.
Top-tier players, like @HatchetHaro for example, perform incredibly well in fully optimized groups. But in unorganized pug runs, where those ideal conditions don’t exist, their advantage shrinks significantly. In those situations, a simple and consistent 1bar build can sometimes outperform them.- And this is why you all hate 1bar players. This is why you gatekeep them and this is why my point is 100% valid.
It's just a nonsense to compare a build used in an optimized roster for a trifecta and a build used in a PUG. And it's even more a nonsense to compare the damage done by a roster member for a trifecta and a PUG member in a PUG run...
In trifecta: you have to focus on mechs, to support the group with some specific sets. Which means you can't deal as much damage as you'd like.
In a PUG you basically want to get as much dps as possible to get it quickly done and, if possible, to skip some annoying mechs that will take time. So when your goal is to reach the maximum DPS, you'll likely choose two-bars players who have a far bigger DPS potential. Because, once again, your unique goal is having huge DPS to nuke everything.
When you're doing a trifecta, nuking everything isn't even on your top 3 list of tasks. You first want to be:- optimized in your build
- organised (HM)
- efficient (HM)
- alive (Nodeath)
- fast (Speedrun)
- as fast as possible so you can finish it quick and leave the instance asap
- Trifecta: You want to be fully optimized, sometimes making compromises on your damage, since rushing the trial isn’t your only goal.
- PUG: You want the highest group DPS possible to stomp everything and get it done as fast as possible.
BE/FR l PC EU l CP2700
TES III Morrowind biggest fan!
A little snail once told me there were no place for debate anymore.
Now, i'll simply MAKE FUN OF IT!1 -
Athory✭✭✭In pugs, Group Finder, or even many guild runs, the main focus should be completing the content with the group you have. But too many players only care about their damn parse numbers in Hodor.
That’s exactly why no one wants to handle mechanics, like doing orbs in vDSR, reefs, kiting in Bahsei, and so on. People avoid these mechanics because they’re focused on their numbers instead of actually clearing the content.
At the end of the day, it feels like some players are just trying to prove how good they are on Hodor rather than contributing to the success of the group. And because of that mindset, runs often fail or at least become much harder than they need to be. Of course, many factors can affect the outcome, but ignoring mechanics in favor of numbers is a big one.
And in my opinion, you’re 100% wrong:- PUG: The goal is to complete the content.
EDIT:
Some players, like OP, don’t like weaving, and that’s completely fine.
So are we really going to gatekeep these players in Group Finder, guild runs, and everywhere else just because they don’t have a 180k parse?
They can easily reach 100k DPS, and that’s enough for most content. So what’s the issue with nuking? What’s the issue with kiting? What’s the issue with doing vSS portals? There isn’t one there’s no real problem at all.
If we’re gatekeeping players just because they don’t like weaving or can’t hit 180k, then we’re also preventing them from learning and improving. Why would anyone want that?
Edited by Athory on March 31, 2026 9:24AM:: [Guild: Tamriel Order] :: Exclusively for players using One‑Bar / HA builds, or items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul RingAbout UsIf you don’t want random players, then don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord — not on Group Finder.
*** This guild is exclusively for players who prefer alternative playstyles such as Onebar builds, Heavy Attack builds (HA), or using items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul Ring. ***- Do you ever feel discouraged when you see “no HA players” or “no Oakensoul players” in Group Finder?
- Do you avoid joining groups because you're worried about being judged or kicked?
Then this is exactly where you belong.
*** We are building a group of players who simply want to enjoy the game, learn mechanics at their own pace, and improve naturally over time.
No pressure, no strict meta requirements, no 120k parses — just steady progress and clear understanding of mechanics.
Our goal is simple:
First we learn → then we become consistent → then we get faster → and when the group truly feels ready, we push into Hard Modes together.
*** Minimum requirement: CP800.
This ensures everyone has the baseline stats needed for HM content and helps us maintain a strong, capable team.
*** We value teamwork, respect, patience, and a positive attitude above all else.
Everyone is here to improve — no ego, no toxicity.
If you're looking for a guild where you can grow, feel comfortable, and still clear some of the hardest content ESO has to offer, this is your place."WE DON'T USE DISCORD!"
Recruitment Headline
*** In this guild, we don’t care if you parse 70k less or 200k more than others.
We don’t care about numbers at all — what matters is handling mechanics:
exploding curses outside the group in vRG, swapping mirrors, doing assignments correctly, and keeping runs clean.
By around CP800, any player can reach ~60–70k DPS baseline, and that’s enough to complete almost any trial HM.
For trifectas, yes, we push DPS because of timers — but for Hard Modes, we take our time without pressure.
If you can handle mechanics, you’re welcome here. ***/!\"I have zero tolerance for toxicity regarding other players’ builds or DPS. If you don’t like someone’s setup for any reason, you’re free to leave the group. But if you choose to stay, then support others in every way you can." - @Zaan’s
Why this?I allways run GF to help others since I already have all trial items. But, I noticed: most groups are full of 2bar players doing lowers DPS then 1bar players, and RD keep gatekeeping 1bar players for no reason at all.
It made me realize I’ve been spending my time helping the wrong players. 2bar players don’t need my help, 1bar players need.0 -
JiubLeRepenti✭✭✭✭✭
✭In pugs, Group Finder, or even many guild runs, the main focus should be completing the content with the group you have. But too many players only care about their damn parse numbers in Hodor.
Yea... It "should" be (for you).
But the reality is that many people who do PUG runs just want the run to get done as fast as possible, for so many reasons:- because they're farming sets
- because they've already done this trial 30 times before
- because they're doing the daily dungeon on several toons to farm scripts and don't have time to lose
- etc.
I think it has nothing to do with 'proving I have the best DPS in the group,' except for a very small number of people.
It’s actually very simple: people want to finish quickly, so they aim for the highest possible group DPS. That’s it.BE/FR l PC EU l CP2700
TES III Morrowind biggest fan!
A little snail once told me there were no place for debate anymore.
Now, i'll simply MAKE FUN OF IT!2 -
Athory✭✭✭
lol!?JiubLeRepenti wrote: »Yea... It "should" be (for you).
For me, ZOS could and should remove everything related to DPS sharing, like Hodor Reflexes, logs, and similar tools. That would be a first step toward stopping the kind of nonsense the game has turned into.JiubLeRepenti wrote: »But the reality is that many people who do PUG runs just want the run to get done as fast as possible, for so many reasons:- because they're farming sets
- because they've already done this trial 30 times before
- because they're doing the daily dungeon on several toons to farm scripts and don't have time to lose
- etc.
In everything you said, where is the reason to hate one-bar players especially those who can parse 100k, handle mechanics, and contribute to the group more than many 2bar players?
Isn’t 100k more than enough to complete all the content you mentioned?
EDIT:
You mention “daily dungeons on multiple toons to farm scripts” what could be more perfect than a simple onebar beam for that?! oO
Edited by Athory on March 31, 2026 9:57AM:: [Guild: Tamriel Order] :: Exclusively for players using One‑Bar / HA builds, or items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul RingAbout UsIf you don’t want random players, then don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord — not on Group Finder.
*** This guild is exclusively for players who prefer alternative playstyles such as Onebar builds, Heavy Attack builds (HA), or using items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul Ring. ***- Do you ever feel discouraged when you see “no HA players” or “no Oakensoul players” in Group Finder?
- Do you avoid joining groups because you're worried about being judged or kicked?
Then this is exactly where you belong.
*** We are building a group of players who simply want to enjoy the game, learn mechanics at their own pace, and improve naturally over time.
No pressure, no strict meta requirements, no 120k parses — just steady progress and clear understanding of mechanics.
Our goal is simple:
First we learn → then we become consistent → then we get faster → and when the group truly feels ready, we push into Hard Modes together.
*** Minimum requirement: CP800.
This ensures everyone has the baseline stats needed for HM content and helps us maintain a strong, capable team.
*** We value teamwork, respect, patience, and a positive attitude above all else.
Everyone is here to improve — no ego, no toxicity.
If you're looking for a guild where you can grow, feel comfortable, and still clear some of the hardest content ESO has to offer, this is your place."WE DON'T USE DISCORD!"
Recruitment Headline
*** In this guild, we don’t care if you parse 70k less or 200k more than others.
We don’t care about numbers at all — what matters is handling mechanics:
exploding curses outside the group in vRG, swapping mirrors, doing assignments correctly, and keeping runs clean.
By around CP800, any player can reach ~60–70k DPS baseline, and that’s enough to complete almost any trial HM.
For trifectas, yes, we push DPS because of timers — but for Hard Modes, we take our time without pressure.
If you can handle mechanics, you’re welcome here. ***/!\"I have zero tolerance for toxicity regarding other players’ builds or DPS. If you don’t like someone’s setup for any reason, you’re free to leave the group. But if you choose to stay, then support others in every way you can." - @Zaan’s
Why this?I allways run GF to help others since I already have all trial items. But, I noticed: most groups are full of 2bar players doing lowers DPS then 1bar players, and RD keep gatekeeping 1bar players for no reason at all.
It made me realize I’ve been spending my time helping the wrong players. 2bar players don’t need my help, 1bar players need.0 -
frogthroat✭✭✭✭✭
✭HatchetHaro wrote: »
Easy answer: I was in War Machine.
If you don't know, War Machine is a set from the Halls of Fabrication, and for its 5-piece bonus, it grants the wearer and 5 group members Major Slayer when the wearer casts an ultimate.
Basically, it's a group buff set, where the wearer sacrifices a 5-piece bonus for extra damage for the whole group! I'm sorry you didn't know that before, but now you do!
I am a buff boi, big and strong!Ok, ok. So you carry all the others? I’m trying to understand what "carry your own weight" really means, since so many players in 2bar setups always use this argument… So what does it really mean? After all, you’re not just the carry player, you carry them all. Is that it?
Of course, you’re in “support sets” like everyone else, right? So no carrying in your runs, only in other players’ runs? Okay, I see… Anyway, the server’s open, so I’m going to level up my new HA character. Kiss and free hugs!
Yes, support DDs are very important in high end content. And depends on your role, no matter how high your dps is, it may still be the lowest in the group because you are assigned to mechanics.
I can see from the video he's using Zena's disk and yellow vigor. No one wants to slot those because your dps drops, but someone has to in order to boost the group's damage and survivability. WM can be a support DD set, or even a healer set. When you start to optimise, you have those "heavy hitters" who do their part by having high dps. Then there are those who are assigned to mechanics. Some have support DD sets/skills. WM, MK, Zenkosh, all those lower the wearer's dps but boost the group damage.
For example our prog group is currently at SS. I was a DD and looking at logs my dps was either highest or second highest up until the message "Tomb 1 open" appears. Then my dps drops to the lowest of all DDs. Guess why.
Our healer had to leave the group and since I play any role and don't really care if I am a mechanics DD, support DD, healer or what, I am now the other healer. And I need to swap between ROJO on trash, MA on Lokke, switch to WM/PA DD build on Yolna (I wish I could swap mundus there...), and finally WM/MK DD on Nahvi. I still need 1-2 heal skills but mostly damage. Since my dps is anyway lower on Yolna and Nahvi, I offered to take also the banner duty, but our group leader thinks it's better that the dedicated banner bearers do that. But basically, on Lokke I am a healer with MA (same as WM but light armour) and on Yolna and Nahvi I play pretty much the same role as HatchetHaro. If two full healers would be required for those two bosses, then one of the DDs would have to be on WM/MK duty. None of us is getting a carry, even (actually, especially) if some have slightly lower dps due to special tasks.
Optimisation is a lot more than just getting high dps numbers.2 -
JiubLeRepenti✭✭✭✭✭
✭For me, ZOS could and should remove everything related to DPS sharing, like Hodor Reflexes, logs, and similar tools. That would be a first step toward stopping the kind of nonsense the game has turned into.
Won't happen. These addons don't go against the game's rules. Your personal opinion =/= the game rules.In everything you said, where is the reason to hate one-bar players especially those who can parse 100k, handle mechanics, and contribute to the group more than many 2bar players?
Because they could potentially do far better with two bars, and then allow the group to finish quickly. And don't worry: people will also critisize you if you have poor results on two bars. Same sht.Isn’t 100k more than enough to complete all the content you mentioned?
Once again: it's not about being able to do it. It's about doing it as fast as possible. You can do it with 100k, but you could do it even faster with 140k on two bars.You mention “daily dungeons on multiple toons to farm scripts” what could be more perfect than a simple onebar beam for that?! oO
A two-bar beam/nb/sorc. And you can do far better in onebar than a beam build btw.BE/FR l PC EU l CP2700
TES III Morrowind biggest fan!
A little snail once told me there were no place for debate anymore.
Now, i'll simply MAKE FUN OF IT!1 -
Athory✭✭✭
Or you could do it even faster with 180k parse and only endgame score-push players, right?JiubLeRepenti wrote: »"... Once again: it's not about being able to do it. It's about doing it as fast as possible. You can do it with 100k, but you could do it even faster with 140k on two bars...."
So how about this: you and your friends who think like that keep playing with score-push players at 180k parse in Discord, and let new players, casuals, and anyone else who’s “inferior” to you play the way they like in guilds, PUGs, and Group Finder, without gatekeeping them. Cuz, they’re just there to play the game, while you’re there to score-push.
I read this somewhere and kept it in my signature. I really believe it fits perfectly here:- "If you don’t want random players, don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord, not in Group Finder."
Does that seem fair?
Edited by Athory on March 31, 2026 10:35AM:: [Guild: Tamriel Order] :: Exclusively for players using One‑Bar / HA builds, or items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul RingAbout UsIf you don’t want random players, then don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord — not on Group Finder.
*** This guild is exclusively for players who prefer alternative playstyles such as Onebar builds, Heavy Attack builds (HA), or using items like Rakkhat's Voidmantle or Oakensoul Ring. ***- Do you ever feel discouraged when you see “no HA players” or “no Oakensoul players” in Group Finder?
- Do you avoid joining groups because you're worried about being judged or kicked?
Then this is exactly where you belong.
*** We are building a group of players who simply want to enjoy the game, learn mechanics at their own pace, and improve naturally over time.
No pressure, no strict meta requirements, no 120k parses — just steady progress and clear understanding of mechanics.
Our goal is simple:
First we learn → then we become consistent → then we get faster → and when the group truly feels ready, we push into Hard Modes together.
*** Minimum requirement: CP800.
This ensures everyone has the baseline stats needed for HM content and helps us maintain a strong, capable team.
*** We value teamwork, respect, patience, and a positive attitude above all else.
Everyone is here to improve — no ego, no toxicity.
If you're looking for a guild where you can grow, feel comfortable, and still clear some of the hardest content ESO has to offer, this is your place."WE DON'T USE DISCORD!"
Recruitment Headline
*** In this guild, we don’t care if you parse 70k less or 200k more than others.
We don’t care about numbers at all — what matters is handling mechanics:
exploding curses outside the group in vRG, swapping mirrors, doing assignments correctly, and keeping runs clean.
By around CP800, any player can reach ~60–70k DPS baseline, and that’s enough to complete almost any trial HM.
For trifectas, yes, we push DPS because of timers — but for Hard Modes, we take our time without pressure.
If you can handle mechanics, you’re welcome here. ***/!\"I have zero tolerance for toxicity regarding other players’ builds or DPS. If you don’t like someone’s setup for any reason, you’re free to leave the group. But if you choose to stay, then support others in every way you can." - @Zaan’s
Why this?I allways run GF to help others since I already have all trial items. But, I noticed: most groups are full of 2bar players doing lowers DPS then 1bar players, and RD keep gatekeeping 1bar players for no reason at all.
It made me realize I’ve been spending my time helping the wrong players. 2bar players don’t need my help, 1bar players need.1 -
Blood_again✭✭✭✭✭
Or you could do it even faster with 180k parse and only endgame score-push players, right?JiubLeRepenti wrote: »"... Once again: it's not about being able to do it. It's about doing it as fast as possible. You can do it with 100k, but you could do it even faster with 140k on two bars...."
So how about this: you and your friends who think like that keep playing with score-push players at 180k parse in Discord, and let new players, casuals, and anyone else who’s “inferior” to you play the way they like in guilds, PUGs, and Group Finder, without gatekeeping them. Cuz, they’re just there to play the game, while you’re there to score-push.
Does that seem fair?[/b]
Did you just try to gatekeep the strong groups and players from pugging and using GroupFinder? While blaming them for gatekeeping? huh?4 -
JiubLeRepenti✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Or you could do it even faster with 180k parse and only endgame score-push players, right?JiubLeRepenti wrote: »"... Once again: it's not about being able to do it. It's about doing it as fast as possible. You can do it with 100k, but you could do it even faster with 140k on two bars...."
So how about this: you and your friends who think like that keep playing with score-push players at 180k parse in Discord, and let new players, casuals, and anyone else who’s “inferior” to you play the way they like in guilds, PUGs, and Group Finder, without gatekeeping them. Cuz, they’re just there to play the game, while you’re there to score-push.
I read this somewhere and kept it in my signature. I really believe it fits perfectly here:- "If you don’t want random players, don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord, not in Group Finder."
Does that seem fair?
It may be your perfect vision of the game. But I'm afraid it'll never happen.- Some people will keep leaving the group after a first wipe on the first boss. Or even on the second or the third.
- Some people will keep leaving the group if they consider the group DPS is too low.
- Some people will keep kicking you from the group if they consider your onebar build doesn't meet their expectations.
- Some people will keep leaving a group if they see that several group members have low CPs.
- Some people will keep asking you to share your stuff to check if it's good enough.
- Some people will keep blaming low CP/onebar builds if they don't pass the boss.
- And some people will keep expecting players who join a PUG to bring the best DPS possible to get the run done fast.
That's how an MMO with endgame/HL content works. There's nothing you can change about it. You can surely think/say people who act like that are jerks. But they'll stay on the game and keep flaming onebar players, noobies, casuals, etc.
That's the way it was. That's the way it is. That's the way it'll be.
Plus, you can always tell those people that you want to play your own way. But you can’t force them to accept you into their group.Edited by JiubLeRepenti on March 31, 2026 10:52AMBE/FR l PC EU l CP2700
TES III Morrowind biggest fan!
A little snail once told me there were no place for debate anymore.
Now, i'll simply MAKE FUN OF IT!2 -
twisttop138✭✭✭✭✭
✭SilverBride wrote: »twisttop138 wrote: »The problem isn't really that mythic. I see people do great in content, even dlc hm trial content with it or a 1 bar build. The problem is there has been this attitude that became the stereotype for 1 bar players. You see it in this thread. They get a bad wrap for an unwillingness to learn, an attitude that everyone is against them and if you give suggestions or tell them something then you're a gatekeeping elitist. Who wants to play with that? That's not all 1 bar players but the attitude is there, I've experienced it in content. You want to sign up for a vet run in any of my guilds, come with a willingness to learn or to have fun playing the content. That's it. If your dps isn't high enough, no big deal. We can work on it.
In reply to "They get a bad wrap for an unwillingness to learn", why should any player be expected to learn a playstyle they do not enjoy? One bar builds should have their own strengths and should be comparable to 2 bar builds. Then all players will be able to learn the best way to play and how to carry their own weight in a way they enjoy.
I didn't just mean an unwillingness to learn a different play style. I mean trial mechanics, positioning, gear choices, there's much to learn to do vet and hm trials. If you think everyone telling you something is just an elitist trying to make you do something you don't wanna do, then I don't wanna play with you. Simple.
Also, yes a willingness to change up your playstyle can be helpful. It's a fact that oakensoul builds do less damage then other 1 bar builds. Because other one bar builds you can stack that back bar with stuff that just buffs that you don't have to swap to press. This can increase your damage and team utility without changing your playstyle at all. Do you kinda see where I'm going with this? Also, when you get into harder content, it's not all about you. Or me. Or him. Or her. It's about the 12 people that are giving their time to come together and work as a team. If you're not willing to work as a team and at least be open to advice, but instead come with attitude, you're gonna have a hard time. I know you're not a group content person, so I thought I'd explain a little for you.1 -
frogthroat✭✭✭✭✭
✭JiubLeRepenti wrote: »
Or you could do it even faster with 180k parse and only endgame score-push players, right?JiubLeRepenti wrote: »"... Once again: it's not about being able to do it. It's about doing it as fast as possible. You can do it with 100k, but you could do it even faster with 140k on two bars...."
So how about this: you and your friends who think like that keep playing with score-push players at 180k parse in Discord, and let new players, casuals, and anyone else who’s “inferior” to you play the way they like in guilds, PUGs, and Group Finder, without gatekeeping them. Cuz, they’re just there to play the game, while you’re there to score-push.
I read this somewhere and kept it in my signature. I really believe it fits perfectly here:- "If you don’t want random players, don’t ask for them. Build your roster on Discord, not in Group Finder."
Does that seem fair?
It may be your perfect vision of the game. But I'm afraid it'll never happen.- Some people will keep leaving the group after a first wipe on the first boss. Or even on the second or the third.
- Some people will keep leaving the group if they consider the group DPS is too low.
- Some people will keep kicking you from the group if they consider your onebar build doesn't meet their expectations.
- Some people will keep leaving a group if they see that several group members have low CPs.
- Some people will keep asking you to share your stuff to check if it's good enough.
- Some people will keep blaming low CP/onebar builds if they don't pass the boss.
- And some people will keep expecting players who join a PUG to bring the best DPS possible to get the run done fast.
That's how an MMO with endgame/HL content works. There's nothing you can change about it. You can surely think/say people who act like that are jerks. But they'll stay on the game and keep flaming onebar players, noobies, casuals, etc.
That's the way it was. That's the way it is. That's the way it'll be.
Plus, you can always tell those people that you want to play your own way. But you can’t force them to accept you into their group.
Funnily enough the most open to one bar builds, that I have come across at least, are guilds where you organise via Discord. Not necessarily for prog groups as there optimisation is key, but in more casual vet runs HA Oakensorcs are fine.1