Should ZOS prioritize Class rework over Vampire/Werewolf/Other

Overamera · March 9

In my opinion ZOS should have prioritized reworking all the classes before reworking vampire and werewolf as classes are much more important. Sine the full rework is gonna take such a long time it would be best to prioritize the classes instead of other. They should still take their time with the rework itself but try and shortening the full rework time by prioritizing the classes.

I think pure class is reviving the game, as a lot of old main DK players and players that stopped playing the game are now back and exicted to be able to play their favorite class or just pure class in general while still able to somewhat compete vs subclass.

What are your thoughts? Should they focus on the classes before anything else like vamp and ww?

LunaFlora · March 9

they are already working on the Werewolf refresh and i think it is awesome they are doing it.

i am also looking forward to the Warden refresh and other classes, but they are all good.

Erickson9610 · March 9

No, I'd say Werewolf has needed a rework for a very long time. We've been getting Class balance updates for years — almost every single update has them. Werewolf, despite being an isolated playstyle akin to a Class, hasn't had a meaningful update since Update 42, where any feedback regarding it was ignored due to Scribing taking priority. Classes are not the only way to play this game, in both PvE and PvP.

This refresh effort is also tackling the visual aspects, too. The Werewolf model in particular was downgraded when ESO was released on consoles, and hasn't been updated since. While the human form kept getting new motifs, adornments, costumes... Werewolf got nothing. It's in dire need of a visual refresh. After all, why would people play it if it's so outdated?

Emeratis · March 9

I am a little bit grumpy that werewolf is delaying some of the class reworks too, I won't deny that, but werewolf and vampire desperately need help too. I just hope that for fairness sake vampire is not delayed until the end of the classes if werewolf gets work done beforehand. There have been major visual bugs with vampirism since launch of the game (elves with human eyes as a vampire, whitewashing dark skinned/furred/scaled characters, etc). A lot of people who enjoyed vampire before pre-Greymoor would probably like some of the old vampire back or a more rewarding/nice/cool new/fused version of the two.

I kinda wish werewolf and warden were coming together but I think if vampire gets addressed sooner rather than lately it might be easier to ship alongside a class rework, though that could maybe just be being hopeful. It'd also be nice if we're getting weapon lines alongside class reworks if some would get a bit more adjustment/love than twohander got. I know that class balance is the most important part of combat right now but I miss weapon skills and lines feeling good too. Kinda feels like the past few years have just had way too much emphasis on class for combat stuff in general and it'd be nice if all skill lines felt a bit more equal in power.

tomofhyrule · March 9

The idea of waiting a patch between the DK and other Class reworks is to gauge how DK feedback is received, considering it's the template for how the rest will go.

Let's not pretend though that Werewolf is in anything close to a good state though. Werewolf, as something that replaces your entire skill bar and has its own passives, really should be balanced with Classes and not as just a single skill line. It's been memetically bad for far longer than the other Classes have been at this point. It needs the rework just as much as everything else.

laniakea_0 · March 9

the rework is going to take years regardless of how much they prioritize it. it would certainly hurt the game if we would have to wait with all the other changes until this is done.

YandereGirlfriend · March 9

Seems like they could have squeezed another micro-class like vampire or a skill line like Destro Staff in along with Werewolf.

Werewolf is like... five abilities, much closer to a weapon line than an actual class. There just isn't that much to work with or to do when compared to a full class.

It obviously needs a boost but taking an entire patch cycle for just Werewolf seems like taking their foot off of the gas pedal, so to speak.

coop500 · March 9

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Seems like they could have squeezed another micro-class like vampire or a skill line like Destro Staff in along with Werewolf.

Werewolf is like... five abilities, much closer to a weapon line than an actual class. There just isn't that much to work with or to do when compared to a full class.

It obviously needs a boost but taking an entire patch cycle for just Werewolf seems like taking their foot off of the gas pedal, so to speak.

Well it's possible that they're expanding upon it more than we realize. We won't know until later, but I wouldn't directly assume it will be as small as it is now. That may very well be a part of the rework is to expand it more.

And no, I'm actually very happy they're doing werewolf now. Subclassing has made werewolf a joke, while at least all the classes are still playable.

wolfie1.0. · March 9

Emeratis wrote: »

I am a little bit grumpy that werewolf is delaying some of the class reworks too, I won't deny that, but werewolf and vampire desperately need help too. I just hope that for fairness sake vampire is not delayed until the end of the classes if werewolf gets work done beforehand. There have been major visual bugs with vampirism since launch of the game (elves with human eyes as a vampire, whitewashing dark skinned/furred/scaled characters, etc). A lot of people who enjoyed vampire before pre-Greymoor would probably like some of the old vampire back or a more rewarding/nice/cool new/fused version of the two.

I kinda wish werewolf and warden were coming together but I think if vampire gets addressed sooner rather than lately it might be easier to ship alongside a class rework, though that could maybe just be being hopeful. It'd also be nice if we're getting weapon lines alongside class reworks if some would get a bit more adjustment/love than twohander got. I know that class balance is the most important part of combat right now but I miss weapon skills and lines feeling good too. Kinda feels like the past few years have just had way too much emphasis on class for combat stuff in general and it'd be nice if all skill lines felt a bit more equal in power.

I dont think that if they stopped working on vamp or werewolf that we would see another class to replace it.

ZOS_Kevin · March 9

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Seems like they could have squeezed another micro-class like vampire or a skill line like Destro Staff in along with Werewolf.

Werewolf is like... five abilities, much closer to a weapon line than an actual class. There just isn't that much to work with or to do when compared to a full class.

It obviously needs a boost but taking an entire patch cycle for just Werewolf seems like taking their foot off of the gas pedal, so to speak.

The team working on Werewolf are also working on systems like PvP Veterancy and Class Mastery (to help with Pure Class builds). So they are working on quite a bit in tandem with Werewolf updates.

Erickson9610 · March 9

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Seems like they could have squeezed another micro-class like vampire or a skill line like Destro Staff in along with Werewolf.

Werewolf is like... five abilities, much closer to a weapon line than an actual class. There just isn't that much to work with or to do when compared to a full class.

It obviously needs a boost but taking an entire patch cycle for just Werewolf seems like taking their foot off of the gas pedal, so to speak.

The team working on Werewolf are also working on systems like PvP Veterancy and Class Mastery (to help with Pure Class builds). So they are working on quite a bit in tandem with Werewolf updates.

Thanks for the clarification! I hope the Werewolf feedback won't be drowned out by all the Class Mastery and PvP Veterancy feedback. All of these are equally important.

I've already voiced my concerns about the Update 50 PTS being similar to the Update 42 PTS, but communication has come a long way since then, so I'm trying to be optimistic.

ZOS_Kevin · March 9

Erickson9610 wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Seems like they could have squeezed another micro-class like vampire or a skill line like Destro Staff in along with Werewolf.

Werewolf is like... five abilities, much closer to a weapon line than an actual class. There just isn't that much to work with or to do when compared to a full class.

It obviously needs a boost but taking an entire patch cycle for just Werewolf seems like taking their foot off of the gas pedal, so to speak.

The team working on Werewolf are also working on systems like PvP Veterancy and Class Mastery (to help with Pure Class builds). So they are working on quite a bit in tandem with Werewolf updates.

Thanks for the clarification! I hope the Werewolf feedback won't be drowned out by all the Class Mastery and PvP Veterancy feedback. All of these are equally important.

I've already voiced my concerns about the Update 50 PTS being similar to the Update 42 PTS, but communication has come a long way since then, so I'm trying to be optimistic.

The goal is to hit feedback from all of these elements. We'll have dedicated threads to make sure they do not get merged and drowned out. We'll also pass the general concern on so that the team is aware of this as they look at PTS feedback for U50 .

coop500 · March 9

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Seems like they could have squeezed another micro-class like vampire or a skill line like Destro Staff in along with Werewolf.

Werewolf is like... five abilities, much closer to a weapon line than an actual class. There just isn't that much to work with or to do when compared to a full class.

It obviously needs a boost but taking an entire patch cycle for just Werewolf seems like taking their foot off of the gas pedal, so to speak.

The team working on Werewolf are also working on systems like PvP Veterancy and Class Mastery (to help with Pure Class builds). So they are working on quite a bit in tandem with Werewolf updates.

Thanks for the clarification! I hope the Werewolf feedback won't be drowned out by all the Class Mastery and PvP Veterancy feedback. All of these are equally important.

I've already voiced my concerns about the Update 50 PTS being similar to the Update 42 PTS, but communication has come a long way since then, so I'm trying to be optimistic.

The goal is to hit feedback from all of these elements. We'll have dedicated threads to make sure they do not get merged and drowned out. We'll also pass the general concern on so that the team is aware of this as they look at PTS feedback for U50 .

That's good. Werewolf is important, it's a unique playstyle that could be made really fun and different from the rest of the classes, and I hope it's not rushed just for the sake of the more popular things. Werewolf could be MADE popular if done well. Then you can print money selling cosmetic recolors of the werewolf form.

nightbringer1993 · March 9

Necromancer needs to be reworked as soon as possible when I se what happened to DK today. When all other classes before necro would have been remastered, then necro will be completely dead.
Am already worried about the use of my necro tank once warden class comes live.

I am tired of being nerfed since four years, and I still do not understand why necro is last in refresh order despite having the biggest amount of complaints about the need for refresh over the last four years.

It is a paid class that cannot be properly used, and feels like a scam.

SedoUmbra · March 9

I vote no. Werewolf and Vampire have floated around between unusable and niche use states. Classes that are in decent states with a strong identity aren't really urgently in need of a fix IMO

YandereGirlfriend · March 9

SedoUmbra wrote: »

I vote no. Werewolf and Vampire have floated around between unusable and niche use states. Classes that are in decent states with a strong identity aren't really urgently in need of a fix IMO

Tell that to a Necromancer main, hehe.

16BitForestCat · March 10

I don't play vampire or werewolf on my main or most of my alts, but I've seen for years how werewolves in particular have repeatedly been...well...thrown to the wolves. It's been faaaaar past time for them to have a bone thrown their way (pun not intended until I was writing it out; no offense meant to the stronk doggos

). So, while there are a lot of skills and classes that need love, I'm very glad to see werewolves getting some attention to their plight.

randconfig · March 10

I disagree. I think it's fine to work on them too. They're both essentially a class with a single skill line. Shouldn't be too difficult to rework them in-between reworking the other classes.

Overamera · March 10

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Seems like they could have squeezed another micro-class like vampire or a skill line like Destro Staff in along with Werewolf.

Werewolf is like... five abilities, much closer to a weapon line than an actual class. There just isn't that much to work with or to do when compared to a full class.

It obviously needs a boost but taking an entire patch cycle for just Werewolf seems like taking their foot off of the gas pedal, so to speak.

The team working on Werewolf are also working on systems like PvP Veterancy and Class Mastery (to help with Pure Class builds). So they are working on quite a bit in tandem with Werewolf updates.

Hello Kevin, I might have missed out on PvP Veterancy. Is there a place I can read up on what it is?