What am I not understanding?

DVBURNSII · March 9

The community seems very dry and silent. I really enjoy The Elder Scrolls series not least of which Online. With that said I do get this sort of dead or dying impression from the internet regarding it. I see in-game guilds where players rarely speak to each other. What am I missing? Please assuage my doubts. I have played MMORPG most of my life, I am soon to be 37. It isn't a question of how to play but a question of where is everyone or all the socialization?

Orbital78 · March 9

Communication is divided up to different platforms, so you are likely missing a good portion of the communication unless you're using voice chat and discord. There are also more popular city hubs than others, if you're hanging out in Murkmire it might be a little dead. If you go to Vivec City, Alinor, etc. there are people all over the place during prime time hours. If you are playing off peak hours that might be part of it. Personally I don't use in game chat much at all. There are plenty that seem to though, I think. Most of my communication with guild mates is in our discord channels or in actual voice chat. 90% of the time when we are doing harder content we are in voice chat, where you don't have to worry about false flagged ai moderation and such.

irstarkey57 · March 9

DVBURNSII wrote: »

The community seems very dry and silent. I really enjoy The Elder Scrolls series not least of which Online. With that said I do get this sort of dead or dying impression from the internet regarding it. I see in-game guilds where players rarely speak to each other. What am I missing? Please assuage my doubts. I have played MMORPG most of my life, I am soon to be 37. It isn't a question of how to play but a question of where is everyone or all the socialization?

There was a big "changing of the guard" so to speak after update 35. Many of the long time and "since launch" players tired of the game and many of the changes around that time. Many of those players were also guild GM's of that era who put together some pretty great groups of people. Many were helpful, and willing to actually spend time helping new players.
While there are still some out there that are helpful, the difference is noticable, like you have, well, noticed. That being said, there are still great people out there that you can meet if you put in the effort to reach out to people. In my opinion, i think it's just a generational thing. Younger players etc. Good luck to you, cheers.

AScarlato · March 9

Some large, easy to join guilds I think are sometimes just too big for their own good. I've noticed this in other MMos too, where guilds are big just to be big and without any real community, so no one talks. Joining a small to mid-sized guild may help get to know specific people.

I know in game people can be busy fighting/questing so there may not be as much chat unless your guild has some sort of event planned.

Many may also be taking breaks until patches come since there isn't much new to do at the moment, so it's a good time to break before a patch. Since that was today may pick up more when people are home from work.

Elvenheart · March 10

This is just a guess, but the name Elder Scrolls Exchange suggests it might be primarily a trading guild. Sometimes trading guilds aren’t very lively because the members are primarily focused on trading and do their socializing in other guilds that are primarily social guilds. This isn’t the case for all trading guilds of course, some guilds mix trading and socializing.

blktauna · March 10

DVBURNSII wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The maintenance is in the banner. Try doing some group activities or joining a guild if you'd like to see more people in game.

Thanks for your response. I was mistaken about the maintenance page because I didn't see the default filters. Still, the game is very quiet. All I really read in public channels are guild invites for some astranged group. Guild chats are all dead silent. It's a very peculiar atmosphere that is so different than any other game I've played before. I have plenty to do in the game as far as activities and that makes me so happy! There is simply something missing in the way of community for myself. Perhaps it is only me who sees this?

Most guilds are in Comms on discord. Zone chat can be filled with idiotd so many people take it elsewhere.

BradTheNord · March 10

Because ZoS has done its best to make this mmo as single player as possible “play your way” and with doing that lots of guild chats are silent zone chats are quite etc …

Aliniel · March 11

You're not missing anything. I've been playing ESO for a long time and the community has always been pretty much like this. All you see in zone chats is guild adverts or some poor guy asking for help. Some guilds have more activity; some are purely trade oriented with pretty much dead silence for hours.

A pretty depressive example of how dead the community is: during an event where 20+ people camp a boss and literally have nothing else to do, I often write something to those people - and most times get zero replies. They just keep jumping around doing nothing.

Vulkunne · March 11

DVBURNSII wrote: »

The community seems very dry and silent. I really enjoy The Elder Scrolls series not least of which Online. With that said I do get this sort of dead or dying impression from the internet regarding it. I see in-game guilds where players rarely speak to each other. What am I missing? Please assuage my doubts. I have played MMORPG most of my life, I am soon to be 37. It isn't a question of how to play but a question of where is everyone or all the socialization?

Bots monitoring in-game chat is one reason.

Hatefulness from some people has at least for me, become so prevalent that I have secured all public chat. All of it is turned off (PvE/PvP) except for Group and Private Message. If I got into PvP, its Offline mode or gankers WILL show up. Especially now cause it's easier to find people in there. But it didn't use to be this way.

People getting mass-reported by opportunists looking for a reason to take action against them is another. Yeah, no jokes allowed. No jokes, no teasers, no silly, no tomfoolery, no genuine and fun shenanigans, no disagreement with certain opinions, no nothing but rigid and rock-hard compliance but not even with ZOS, with other people who think they can claim servers as their own. Not even ZOS is this rigid lol. Its these one or two folks who hate their lives, so they want to make everyone else miserable too. The report tool exists for a justifiable reason and is not there to be abused by bad people; Same goes with Customer Service/Support rep's time spent on dealing with foolishness and a couple evil people.

MincMincMinc · March 11

Sadly this is common for alot of gaming not just eso. Cancel culture and liabilities kinda forced everyone out of in game chats and only further pushed people towards third party apps for voice and text. The whole hoopla fiasco and rumors of banning players for T-bagging and the roleplayers getting banned for private messages doesn't help people trust in game forms of communication. It is just not worth risking a 12 year old account that players have spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on.

Gameplay wise zos has pumped more and more daily tasks which take up most people's time. So instead of actually doing gameplay whether dungeons or pvp guilds hanging out, people spend far more time now adays doing login chores. I mean you can take an hour doing writs on 20 characters. Alot of dlcs have daily farm and fetch tasks that players might get wrapped up in. Then you have farms like psijic guild which are aweful solo grinds following third party guides to even have a chance of completing. QoL decisions with subclassing implementation only push people to need multiple characters now for the same build.....only further forcing the population to redo monotonous farms again. Then once your setup is together for the night you que into cyrodil for 40 mins. Ride 20 mins to the only fight on the map. Just to find out its two ballgroups dueling with each other lagging out the server for everyone so you log out for the night.

IMO mmos as a whole are in a rough spot because they have been designed for years like this to fluff up "content". However younger fortnite generation kids are never going to deal with the terrible QoL for hours each day before you can even play real gameplay. More and more now people want to get home from work and be doing GAMEPLAY within 10 mins of turning on their computer. Its no surprise short form games like most shooters and even mobas are so popular. Its not easy to make complex systems for mmos while getting it easy to drop in drop out of gameplay.

shadyjane62 · March 20

I don't say anything because the game is infested with toxic kiddies ready to report you for saying anything at all.

I don't say anything because I don't know how much of the game is infested with game provided watchers AI ready to report anything you say.

Safer just to be paranoid.

CalamityCat · March 21

My guilds are mostly active via Discord, both in chat and voice. It definitely helps if your guild holds regular events or activities, or they're willing to let you run some. I've sat chatting till 2am with my PvE guild and almost as late with the PvPers, we had our actual event nearly 5 hours earlier!

You could always try using one guild slot to try several different guilds and see if you find one that is more active. But definitely don't feel wary of trying Discord, as it's a lot more relaxed in moderation and you don't have to be online at the same time to see what's going on.

With the new content that's coming, it's probably a good time to ask if anyone fancies grouping up. Sometimes guilds get a bit quiet because they only have a few members willing to run an event. When they stop players can just go back to playing alone. If you don't mind making the effort to arrange things, that might be a way to start.

Destai · March 27

DVBURNSII wrote: »

The community seems very dry and silent. I really enjoy The Elder Scrolls series not least of which Online. With that said I do get this sort of dead or dying impression from the internet regarding it. I see in-game guilds where players rarely speak to each other. What am I missing? Please assuage my doubts. I have played MMORPG most of my life, I am soon to be 37. It isn't a question of how to play but a question of where is everyone or all the socialization?

I really don't talk in-game. Part of it is, I want a safe space to joke and let loose, and I simply do not trust that I can do that in this game. Regardless of what assurances we've been given, I still believe there's some problematic technology monitoring chat and resulting in unfair bans/suspensions. I don't care if it's AI, new filters being tripped, or people not doing sufficient reviews of the flagged events, the end result is the same. I'm not taking that risk.

Mainly though, my social needs are fulfilled outside of in-game chat. I've had some great guilds in the past where I really vibed with people. Sadly, they've all moved on and I don't feel like making new connections. I have my main group of people that I run with and we're in PSN parties. My guilds - I'm in two - are just for trading. But, I don't really talk to anyone in the guilds. Things like raffles DOMINATE the chat window so I can't even have a conversation if I wanted to.

Because of these factors, I don't even have the chat window enabled anymore. I just don't see the need for it.

spartaxoxo · March 9

The maintenance is in the banner. Try doing some group activities or joining a guild if you'd like to see more people in game.

DVBURNSII · March 9

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The maintenance is in the banner. Try doing some group activities or joining a guild if you'd like to see more people in game.

Thanks for your response. I was mistaken about the maintenance page because I didn't see the default filters. Still, the game is very quiet. All I really read in public channels are guild invites for some astranged group. Guild chats are all dead silent. It's a very peculiar atmosphere that is so different than any other game I've played before. I have plenty to do in the game as far as activities and that makes me so happy! There is simply something missing in the way of community for myself. Perhaps it is only me who sees this?

Erickson9610 · March 9

You can usually find the same faces in Battlegrounds, Alliance Locked Cyrodiil, and sometimes even CP Imperial City. Most of the guilds I'm in are PvP-oriented, so I usually see a group of guildies doing PvP activities together. I remember Stormhaven was a popular spot for dueling, but I haven't been there in a while.

In addition to that, there are a few places that I know where players spend time socializing and/or roleplaying. There's a tavern in the Rivenspire zone which is popular for roleplaying, and Rimmen in Northern Elsweyr always seems populated.

Naturally, people will do daily quests like crafting writs, Undaunted pledges, guild dailies, and so on in various zones of their choosing, typically in the major city of that zone — Deshaan, Vvardenfell, Stormhaven, and Grahtwood are all popular places for guild traders, too. I see a lot of people in Riften in The Rift next to the Subclassing NPC, or asking for Werewolf/Vampire bites in zone chat, but both of those will be less important in Update 49 with the ability to respec in the UI and those NPCs who let you gain/swap curse skill lines.

twisttop138 · March 9

If your guilds have quiet chats, it's time for new ones bud. There's plenty of active popping guilds out there. One thing I've noticed on PlayStation though, we do a lot of communication on discord. We have to type in game on a controller and it takes forever so we just chat on discord. Still though, I see lots of in game talking on guild chats. Look for a good social guild.

robertlabrie · March 9

There are more than a few of us who treat this like a live-service single player RPG as well and don't talk to anyone

Like twisttop said if you're seeking a lively guild they're out there

Emeratis · March 9

So, it depends on the guild. My guild is pretty quiet in game but way more active on discord. It helps because you don't have to log on to chat/connect and we have people from various time zones so it makes it easier to communicate. My trial guild is similarly way more chatty/active on discord unless a group is forming. All three of my trade guilds have in game idle chatter throughout the day. It really depends on the guild's wants, needs, and culture. They did say they were planning some guild QOL/updates later this year so that might make it better/easier for guilds to communicate more in game but it still can be a bit tricky for guilds that span multiple time zones that are smaller to get reliable in game chatter just on the matter of logistically they might not all be on at the same time outside of events and trials and stuff like that.

Jordan_Black · March 9

DVBURNSII wrote: »

The community seems very dry and silent. I really enjoy The Elder Scrolls series not least of which Online. With that said I do get this sort of dead or dying impression from the internet regarding it. I see in-game guilds where players rarely speak to each other. What am I missing? Please assuage my doubts. I have played MMORPG most of my life, I am soon to be 37. It isn't a question of how to play but a question of where is everyone or all the socialization?

Try joining a social guild and joining the discord - often times they're very chatty.

moderatelyfatman · March 9

DVBURNSII wrote: »

The community seems very dry and silent. I really enjoy The Elder Scrolls series not least of which Online. With that said I do get this sort of dead or dying impression from the internet regarding it. I see in-game guilds where players rarely speak to each other. What am I missing? Please assuage my doubts. I have played MMORPG most of my life, I am soon to be 37. It isn't a question of how to play but a question of where is everyone or all the socialization?

In my three guilds most of the senior members are still there but very quiet. Endgame (PvE and PvP) has not been in a great state for some time so we are waiting and watching in the hope that 2026 is the year things change. Most of us currently no longer log in daily but there is still chatter on the discords.

The other issue is some pretty aggressive AI monitoring the in game chat and auto banning users even for private messaging. This has put a chilling effect on the use of in game chat.

SneaK · March 9

Honestly a big issue on Console at least is the in game voice function used to break so much everyone just does party chat now. Back in the day area voice and guild voice were booming, but it consistently broke down so players started using other means to communicate. Honestly not sure if it was ever fixed cause the default is party chat now.

RD065 · March 9

Seems fine to me, and I'm mostly a solo player.

madman65 · March 9

A topic came up some time ago about Bot Guilds, you may have joined one. I would talk to some of the members and see if you might have stumbled into one.

DVBURNSII · March 9

madman65 wrote: »

A topic came up some time ago about Bot Guilds, you may have joined one. I would talk to some of the members and see if you might have stumbled into one.

First, thank you all for taking time to respond to my thread. This has given me a few areas of consideration. Discord wasn't really around back during FFXI or WoW so that presumably may change the landscape a bit.

Currently I am a member of four guilds.
Night Hawks, Order of the Golden Moons, The Gauntlet of Auri-El, and Elder Scrolls Exchange.
The first three do have a bit of communication and I like the members I've engaged with. Elder Scrolls Exchange, which appears to be the most established, I haven't heard a single word from anyone. Is there anywhere that lists suspect bot guilds? I 'Truly Superb'ly despise bots and RMT groups and would prefer to avoid them as much as is reasonably possible.

DVBURNSII · March 10

blktauna wrote: »

Most guilds are in Comms on discord. Zone chat can be filled with idiotd so many people take it elsewhere.

That makes some sense. Again, I am from an era before Discord. Even though that may very well be the reason alongside AI filtering it all still feels unnatural to me. I would think there would exist zones with 'Barrens Chat' but I haven't found one. I am in the early game though so that could be simply because I haven't reached more populated areas yet. In my experience though there will be idiots anywhere I may travel, Discord included.

Elvenheart wrote: »

This is just a guess, but the name Elder Scrolls Exchange suggests it might be primarily a trading guild. Sometimes trading guilds aren’t very lively because the members are primarily focused on trading and do their socializing in other guilds that are primarily social guilds. This isn’t the case for all trading guilds of course, some guilds mix trading and socializing.

You are correct. ESE is a trading guild and so that would explain it, I won't leave because their stock and vendor is plentiful. Although it isn't, at least strictly, a social guild I still figured some communication would exist if nothing else in the form of new player introductions and formalities which is not the case. Other guilds are crafting and trading guilds but also partially advertised as social guilds and still the conversation is very minimal almost to the point of non-existence. What I am getting from all this though is that for ESO it comes down to being filtered out by a computer or hopping on Discord if I desire to be a part of the action. I don't like it but I do accept it.

DVBURNSII · March 20

MincMincMinc wrote: »

Sadly this is common for alot of gaming not just eso. Cancel culture and liabilities kinda forced everyone out of in game chats and only further pushed people towards third party apps for voice and text. The whole hoopla fiasco and rumors of banning players for T-bagging and the roleplayers getting banned for private messages doesn't help people trust in game forms of communication. It is just not worth risking a 12 year old account that players have spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on.

Gameplay wise zos has pumped more and more daily tasks which take up most people's time. So instead of actually doing gameplay whether dungeons or pvp guilds hanging out, people spend far more time now adays doing login chores. I mean you can take an hour doing writs on 20 characters. Alot of dlcs have daily farm and fetch tasks that players might get wrapped up in. Then you have farms like psijic guild which are aweful solo grinds following third party guides to even have a chance of completing. QoL decisions with subclassing implementation only push people to need multiple characters now for the same build.....only further forcing the population to redo monotonous farms again. Then once your setup is together for the night you que into cyrodil for 40 mins. Ride 20 mins to the only fight on the map. Just to find out its two ballgroups dueling with each other lagging out the server for everyone so you log out for the night.

IMO mmos as a whole are in a rough spot because they have been designed for years like this to fluff up "content". However younger fortnite generation kids are never going to deal with the terrible QoL for hours each day before you can even play real gameplay. More and more now people want to get home from work and be doing GAMEPLAY within 10 mins of turning on their computer. Its no surprise short form games like most shooters and even mobas are so popular. Its not easy to make complex systems for mmos while getting it easy to drop in drop out of gameplay.

This is something I think about often. MMORPG is the only style of game for the most part that I am interested in. I have played many and learned firsthand exactly as you describe it, finding the right balance is difficult for developers.

Markytous · March 20

shadyjane62 wrote: »

I don't say anything because the game is infested with toxic kiddies ready to report you for saying anything at all.

I don't say anything because I don't know how much of the game is infested with game provided watchers AI ready to report anything you say.

Safer just to be paranoid.

We have all truly become Glarthir because of the TOS/Code of Conduct

Xarc · March 21

DVBURNSII wrote: »

The community seems very dry and silent. I really enjoy The Elder Scrolls series not least of which Online. With that said I do get this sort of dead or dying impression from the internet regarding it. I see in-game guilds where players rarely speak to each other. What am I missing? Please assuage my doubts. I have played MMORPG most of my life, I am soon to be 37. It isn't a question of how to play but a question of where is everyone or all the socialization?

The Elder Scrolls games are originally single-player games with a dark side (almost all Elder Scrolls games start with the player in prison, theft, crime, assassination, necromancy, demonic schemes, etc. are themes that are very present in games).

I think ESO, as the MMO version of The Elder Scrolls, has the players it deserves.

Of course, not everyone wants to play a thief or assassin, necromancer or dark mage. But it's an aspect that shouldn't be underestimated.

Consequently, I think ESO players are generally rather discreet, solitary, etc.
I think this is reflected in pretty much everything (PvP atmosphere, intense demand for single-player content, guild names and themes, etc.). This doesn't mean they don't want to participate in group activities; otherwise, they wouldn't be playing an MMO. But I think this aspect needs to be taken seriously when trying to analyze the ESO community and compare it to other communities.

Elvenheart · March 21

Xarc wrote: »

DVBURNSII wrote: »

The community seems very dry and silent. I really enjoy The Elder Scrolls series not least of which Online. With that said I do get this sort of dead or dying impression from the internet regarding it. I see in-game guilds where players rarely speak to each other. What am I missing? Please assuage my doubts. I have played MMORPG most of my life, I am soon to be 37. It isn't a question of how to play but a question of where is everyone or all the socialization?

The Elder Scrolls games are originally single-player games with a dark side (almost all Elder Scrolls games start with the player in prison, theft, crime, assassination, necromancy, demonic schemes, etc. are themes that are very present in games).

I think ESO, as the MMO version of The Elder Scrolls, has the players it deserves.

Of course, not everyone wants to play a thief or assassin, necromancer or dark mage. But it's an aspect that shouldn't be underestimated.

Consequently, I think ESO players are generally rather discreet, solitary, etc.
I think this is reflected in pretty much everything (PvP atmosphere, intense demand for single-player content, guild names and themes, etc.). This doesn't mean they don't want to participate in group activities; otherwise, they wouldn't be playing an MMO. But I think this aspect needs to be taken seriously when trying to analyze the ESO community and compare it to other communities.

The analysis was good, but I’m giving you an awesome just for those comparison pictures! 😂

MincMincMinc · March 23

DVBURNSII wrote: »

MincMincMinc wrote: »

Sadly this is common for alot of gaming not just eso. Cancel culture and liabilities kinda forced everyone out of in game chats and only further pushed people towards third party apps for voice and text. The whole hoopla fiasco and rumors of banning players for T-bagging and the roleplayers getting banned for private messages doesn't help people trust in game forms of communication. It is just not worth risking a 12 year old account that players have spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on.

Gameplay wise zos has pumped more and more daily tasks which take up most people's time. So instead of actually doing gameplay whether dungeons or pvp guilds hanging out, people spend far more time now adays doing login chores. I mean you can take an hour doing writs on 20 characters. Alot of dlcs have daily farm and fetch tasks that players might get wrapped up in. Then you have farms like psijic guild which are aweful solo grinds following third party guides to even have a chance of completing. QoL decisions with subclassing implementation only push people to need multiple characters now for the same build.....only further forcing the population to redo monotonous farms again. Then once your setup is together for the night you que into cyrodil for 40 mins. Ride 20 mins to the only fight on the map. Just to find out its two ballgroups dueling with each other lagging out the server for everyone so you log out for the night.

IMO mmos as a whole are in a rough spot because they have been designed for years like this to fluff up "content". However younger fortnite generation kids are never going to deal with the terrible QoL for hours each day before you can even play real gameplay. More and more now people want to get home from work and be doing GAMEPLAY within 10 mins of turning on their computer. Its no surprise short form games like most shooters and even mobas are so popular. Its not easy to make complex systems for mmos while getting it easy to drop in drop out of gameplay.

This is something I think about often. MMORPG is the only style of game for the most part that I am interested in. I have played many and learned firsthand exactly as you describe it, finding the right balance is difficult for developers.

Its where the future next big MMO needs to focus on for sure. AI for instance could help with things like voice acting or map generation for things like generated delves with unique quests. There was a gears of war game that had an interesting concept where every day it would procedurally generate a dungeon with objectives to complete in it. Every day it would be a unique experience where you had to discover the dungeon by yourself. The devs basically just have to come up with new rooms or skins which can then plug and play together like legos.

Funny enough PvP is a great answer to the mmo content problem. The trifaction war let players essentially write their own story and the zos investment was next to nothing. A good chunk of the eso population buys every dlc and plus subscription because they designed a very basic pvp gamemode 14 years ago. Now a days it isn't working as well because of neglect and that ESO is far to complicated for the casual player to just learn on their own without outside help causing a population decline.

Syldras · March 23

MincMincMinc wrote: »

Its where the future next big MMO needs to focus on for sure. AI for instance could help with things like voice acting or map generation for things like generated delves with unique quests. There was a gears of war game that had an interesting concept where every day it would procedurally generate a dungeon with objectives to complete in it. Every day it would be a unique experience where you had to discover the dungeon by yourself. The devs basically just have to come up with new rooms or skins which can then plug and play together like legos.

The future is returning to automated dungeon design and lottery-style quest design (kill "random-enemy-id", fetch "random-item-id") - like it was the case in TES1 Arena (1994) and TES2 Daggerfall (1996)?

The Elder Scrolls Online

What am I not understanding?

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