Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
Stop this madness and let players play the game.
Last'One
✭✭✭✭✭
Until when will ZeniMax allow this [snip]???
Gatekeeping other players just to wipe on the first vLC boss?
There were no HA players in the group. But maybe if we had them… maybe the group could kill him? No? Well, two-bar players can’t. So…
What a [snip] game ESO is turning into, and ZOS does nothing to stop it…
[edited for profanity bypass]
Edited by ZOS_Icy on February 9, 2026 7:09PM Gatekeeping other players just to wipe on the first vLC boss?
There were no HA players in the group. But maybe if we had them… maybe the group could kill him? No? Well, two-bar players can’t. So…
What a [snip] game ESO is turning into, and ZOS does nothing to stop it…
[edited for profanity bypass]
1
-
valenwood_vegan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Thought you'd quit already?
Anyway, that's a player-created group with a player-imposed requirement - other people cannot be forced to play with you, your way.Edited by valenwood_vegan on February 9, 2026 5:40PM22 -
Last'One✭✭✭✭✭valenwood_vegan wrote: »Thought you'd quit already?
Anyway, that's a player-created group with a player-imposed requirement - other people cannot be forced to play with you, your way.
Of course I quit the group. I was there to play, not to carry 2bar players who can’t even kill a damn boss.
The problem isn’t about me, or that player, or any single player. It’s about the group, where we all want to play, right?
And yet you all (not me, for sure) keep gatekeeping other players just because some play 1bar builds, while keep 2bar players. For what? To wipe? To disband? lol!
Look at me, two bars, 140k parse… still can’t kill one boss. Group wipes. But hey, I’M ELITE!!!
Edited by Last'One on February 9, 2026 5:49PM3 -
Gabriel_H✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭valenwood_vegan wrote: »Thought you'd quit already?
Anyway, that's a player-created group with a player-imposed requirement - other people cannot be forced to play with you, your way.
Not for nothing, but flawed requirements - Like having the achievement proves anything.PC EU
Never get involved in a land war in Asia - it's one of the classic blunders!1 -
valenwood_vegan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭valenwood_vegan wrote: »Thought you'd quit already?
Anyway, that's a player-created group with a player-imposed requirement - other people cannot be forced to play with you, your way.
Not for nothing, but flawed requirements - Like having the achievement proves anything.
Well I didn't create the group in question, but people are free to create whatever group they want with whatever requirements they want [as long as they comply with the ToS], flawed or not.Edited by valenwood_vegan on February 9, 2026 6:04PM10 -
imPDA✭✭✭✭Until when will ZeniMax allow this [snip]???
I also interested when they will already fix HA nonsense, so this gameplay could die already and rest in peace and be forgotten as a nightmare.
It originated from players who told you can do huge damage doing relatively nothing, holding left mouse button 90% of the time, and then it somehow seeded into the game and combat designers decided it is legit way to play their game and added more stuff to further push this gameplay...
They should make you hire more companions, so they could fight completely for you, and make auto battler. It is the next step if the same battle design continues to evolve.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on February 9, 2026 7:10PMYour Friendly Neighborhood PvP Enjoyer (prior to U48)6 -
Last'One✭✭✭✭✭
My God… two-bar players: 0/36 deaths.
Seven players dead, first boss still at 82% health. Kkkkkk.
Let’s go, elite players!!!Until when will ZeniMax allow this b*shis???
I also interested when they will already fix HA nonsense, so this gameplay could die already and rest in peace and be forgotten as a nightmare.
It originated from players who told you can do huge damage doing relatively nothing, holding left mouse button 90% of the time, and then it somehow seeded into the game and combat designers decided it is legit way to play their game and added more stuff to further push this gameplay...
They should make you hire more companions, so they could fight completely for you, and make auto battler. It is the next step if the same battle design continues to evolve.
My Bastion will fight longer than those 2bar players, for sure. lol
But anyway… you call HA players a nightmare?
Then what do you call this—a learning process? xD
Edited by Last'One on February 9, 2026 6:24PM0 -
Gabriel_H✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It originated from players who told you can do huge damage doing relatively nothing, holding left mouse button 90% of the time, and then it somehow seeded into the game and combat designers decided it is legit way to play their game and added more stuff to further push this gameplay...
It originated in the original design and existed for 34 updates. Players were pushed more into HA builds following U35 when Empower was re-worked, making it useful only for HA builds, and taking away a damage buff from classes that could provide access it, as well the group buff version from armour sets.
And nor for nothing, but "relatively nothing"? You know you still have to weave with other skills right? And how far into the HA animation you can then fire a skill? You can't just spam skills or you'll fire two in a row and miss the HA.PC EU
Never get involved in a land war in Asia - it's one of the classic blunders!0 -
DenverRalphy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭valenwood_vegan wrote: »Thought you'd quit already?
Anyway, that's a player-created group with a player-imposed requirement - other people cannot be forced to play with you, your way.
Not for nothing, but flawed requirements - Like having the achievement proves anything.
Oh I dunno. Seems reasonable enough to me. It's not often I pug it anymore. But when I do, it is nice to be in a group where you know we don't have to spend half the trial explaining mechs because everone in the group has already seen and understand them.
Edited by DenverRalphy on February 9, 2026 6:32PM4 -
Soarora✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
My God… two-bar players: 0/36 deaths.
Seven players dead, first boss still at 82% health. Kkkkkk.
Let’s go, elite players!!!
That is:
1 — The second boss and
2 — A boss known for having a mechanic where if one person screws up, most of the group dies. I would reckon someone stood in group with bomb, exploding everyone. That’s the bomber’s fault.[PC/NA] Dungeoneer (Tank/DPS), Retired Trialist, and amateur Battlegrounder (DPS) with a passion for The Elder Scrolls lore.- Current GM of Hard Dungeoneers
- Tanks: Sorcerer - Necromancer - Templar
- DPS: Frost Warden - Stamarc
- Ex-healer
- Dungeons: 32/32 HMs - 26/26 Tris
View my builds!
9 -
Last'One✭✭✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »valenwood_vegan wrote: »Thought you'd quit already?
Anyway, that's a player-created group with a player-imposed requirement - other people cannot be forced to play with you, your way.
Not for nothing, but flawed requirements - Like having the achievement proves anything.
Oh I dunno. Seems reasonable enough to me. It's not often I pug it anymore. But when I do, it is nice to be in a group where you know we don't have to spend half the trial explaining mechs because everone in the group has already seen and understand them.
Mechanics aren’t learned from how many bars someone uses, they’re learned by doing the fight. If players are gatekept out before they even fight, when exactly are they supposed to "already understand" the mechanics?
You don’t teach mechanics by excluding people. You teach them by letting players actually play, wipe, adjust, and improve, regardless of whether they’re on one bar or two.1 -
DenverRalphy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »valenwood_vegan wrote: »Thought you'd quit already?
Anyway, that's a player-created group with a player-imposed requirement - other people cannot be forced to play with you, your way.
Not for nothing, but flawed requirements - Like having the achievement proves anything.
Oh I dunno. Seems reasonable enough to me. It's not often I pug it anymore. But when I do, it is nice to be in a group where you know we don't have to spend half the trial explaining mechs because everone in the group has already seen and understand them.
Mechanics aren’t learned from how many bars someone uses, they’re learned by doing the fight. If players are gatekept out before they even fight, when exactly are they supposed to "already understand" the mechanics?
You don’t teach mechanics by excluding people. You teach them by letting players actually play, wipe, adjust, and improve, regardless of whether they’re on one bar or two.
The flaw in your argument is the insinuation every group is obligated to be open to teaching new/inexperienced players. Experienced players do like to play with experienced groups from time to time too. Are they required to accept, carry, and teach any player that comes along?
Experienced players do also like to pre-determine the group dynamics and makeup. Are they required to tailor their group dynamic to include One Bar builds?
[edit] typosEdited by DenverRalphy on February 9, 2026 6:43PM15 -
Last'One✭✭✭✭✭
That is:
1 — The second boss and
2 — A boss known for having a mechanic where if one person screws up, most of the group dies. I would reckon someone stood in group with bomb, exploding everyone. That’s the bomber’s fault.
And so what?!
Does 2bars make you auto-roll for shards?
Does 2bars make players auto-block and move out of AoE damage?
And no, this wasn’t about bombers. It was about a damn tank you can’t even taunt, no matter how many bars they have.
Edited by Last'One on February 9, 2026 6:40PM0 -
Last'One✭✭✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »The flaw in your argument is the insinuation every group is obligated to be open to teaching ew/inexperienced players. Experienced players do like to play with experienced groups from time to time too. Are they required to accept, carry, and teach any player that comes along?
Experienced players do also like to pre-determine the group dynamics and makeup. Are they required to tailor their group dynamic to include One Bar builds?
Sure, players aren’t obligated to carry or teach anyone. But the point isn’t about obligation, it’s about consistency. If you gatekeep others or “inexperienced” players while still wiping with two-bar-elite-top players, how does that actually improve the group’s experience?
Mechanics aren’t learned by exclusion, they’re learned by letting players participate, make mistakes, and improve. Otherwise, you’re just making your group smaller, not better.
Got it? Mechanics are learned by letting players participate, not by gatekeeping them! Does anyone need a diagram… or a full project, so you can actually understand this??
Edited by Last'One on February 9, 2026 6:45PM1 -
Faltasë✭✭✭✭Does this actually help anyone?
Your first mistake is thinking that endgame players give a *** about teaching others.
Just look at the monopoly that The Gaming Council has had on endgame content.Edited by Faltasë on February 9, 2026 6:54PM
XBOX 2015-2019
PC-NA 2019-2022, 2025-present
Please keep fixing the combat. It's good to fix the combat.
Auri-El is the one true God.2 -
DenverRalphy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You do realize that you're free to form and create your own group finder listing for any dungeon or trial right? Gates are wide open.
What's stopping you from doing that?
13 -
thorwyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Wild idea... create your own group!!And if the dam breaks open many years too soon
And if there is no room upon the hill
And if your head explodes with dark forebodings too
I'll see you on the dark side of the moon12 -
Last'One✭✭✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »You do realize that you're free to form and create your own group finder listing for any dungeon or trial right? Gates are wide open.
What's stopping you from doing that?
And do you realize this whole topic is about players who create group finder groups just to gatekeep others and then end up wiping more than hell with two-bar players? All just because they “have the power” to gatekeep others???1 -
DenverRalphy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »You do realize that you're free to form and create your own group finder listing for any dungeon or trial right? Gates are wide open.
What's stopping you from doing that?
And do you realize this whole topic is about players who create group finder groups just to gatekeep others and then end up wiping more than hell with two-bar players? All just because they “have the power” to gatekeep others???
That's just it though.. those groups aren't created "just to gatekeep". Those groups are created to play with players of a similar caliber and/or makeup. Nothing more deep than that. Zero gatekeeping going on. Gatekeepiing infers that they're preventinig you from playing any specfic content, and that's not what's happening.
13 -
LootAllTheStuff✭✭✭✭✭I really don't see what ZOS can do to fix this situation, since the root cause is human behaviour. The kind of person who creates a group with a "No HA build, must have achievement' requirement is going to do that regardless of whether or not they can place that specific text into group finder.
Some people are always going to find a way to gate-keep, because that's who they are. Likewise, some are going to be welcoming and encouraging, and help new players find their feet because that's who they are. I'm fortunate to have found a guild on my server populated by the latter type, and I know they aren't the only one.
2 -
Skorro✭✭✭✭✭If you joined in the group then you weren't on an HA build right - so why so salty 🙃
Join a different run or start a group with only HA builds and 2-barrers get kicked, I'm sure you'll be fine ^^5 -
thorwyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭And do you realize this whole topic is about players who create group finder groups just to gatekeep others and then end up wiping more than hell with two-bar players?
And your point is what exactly? If that's what they want to do, there is nothing ZOS can an will do about it, no matter how hard you're complaing. These people are paying the same money as you and unless they are breaking the TOS or COC, they can "gatekeep" 24/7 if they wish to.
This "play how you want" mantra is not a one way street.Edited by thorwyn on February 9, 2026 7:20PMAnd if the dam breaks open many years too soon
And if there is no room upon the hill
And if your head explodes with dark forebodings too
I'll see you on the dark side of the moon6 -
Last'One✭✭✭✭✭LootAllTheStuff wrote: »I really don't see what ZOS can do to fix this situation, since the root cause is human behaviour. The kind of person who creates a group with a "No HA build, must have achievement' requirement is going to do that regardless of whether or not they can place that specific text into group finder.
Some people are always going to find a way to gate-keep, because that's who they are. Likewise, some are going to be welcoming and encouraging, and help new players find their feet because that's who they are. I'm fortunate to have found a guild on my server populated by the latter type, and I know they aren't the only one.
Of course ZoS should do something about this. [snip] ZoS should BAN anyone who gatekeeps in group finder, because gatekeeping blocks players from playing and participating in content. [snip]
If players want to gatekeep, do it in Discord, in guilds, in voice chats... Not in-game! This is wrong.
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Icy on February 9, 2026 7:50PM0 -
SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If ZOS didn't want players to set criteria for joining their group they wouldn't have made that an option in the group finder.
How many times have players been told that if they don't like to play certain ways they should make their own group with their own criteria? Well that is all they are doing.
Players have the right to create groups of like minded players to reach their shared goals.
Edited by SilverBride on February 9, 2026 7:43PMPCNA6 -
thorwyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭because gatekeeping blocks players from playing and participating in content
Your entitlement is simply mindboggling. Noone is obliged to play with you or invite you to their group. Noone is obliged to play with any group setup or build they don't like for whatever reason. Noone is being blocked from content. The gates to vSS will still work just fine for you if you click on them. (I double-checked.)
If I want to create a group full of Khajit in pink bikinis wielding broom stcks, that's my decision and I can enter that in the group finder.
If you think that your mighty HA build is ready for a trifecty, you're encouraged to start your group and rock the stage. Wasn't this what all the fuss was about when ZOS decided to introduce this extended group finder thing?
Edited by thorwyn on February 9, 2026 7:47PMAnd if the dam breaks open many years too soon
And if there is no room upon the hill
And if your head explodes with dark forebodings too
I'll see you on the dark side of the moon12 -
Last'One✭✭✭✭✭SilverBride wrote: »If ZOS didn't want players to set criteria for joining their group they wouldn't have made that an option in the group finder.
How many times have players been told that if they don't like to play certain ways they should make their own group with their own criteria? Well that is all they are doing.
Players have the right to create groups of like minded players to reach their shared goals.
Yes, players have the right to create groups with whatever rules they want.... in Discord, in guilds, in voice chat. And others have the right to play the game without any harassment or gatekeeping. This works for both sides. No?
But you should NOT be allowed to gatekeep others in-game. Simple as that!0 -
Last'One✭✭✭✭✭because gatekeeping blocks players from playing and participating in content
Your entitlement is simply mindboggling. Noone is obliged to play with you or invite you to their group. Noone is obliged to play with any group setup or build they don't like for whatever reason. Noone is being blocked from content. The gates to vSS will still work just fine for you if you click on them. (I double-checked.)
If I want to create a group full of Khajit in pink bikinis wielding broom stcks, that's my decision and I can enter that in the group finder.
If you think that your mighty HA build is ready for a trifecty, you're encouraged to start your group and rock the stage. Wasn't this what all the fuss was about when ZOS decided to introduce this extended group finder thing?
Two-bar players can’t complete vLC… can’t complete vDSR… can’t complete vRG…
And you want to compare that to a Raid Leader who gatekeeps players just for using 1bar to play and enjoy the game?!
WHAT IN THE HELL…0 -
Oblivion_Protocol✭✭✭✭✭But you should NOT be allowed to gatekeep others in-game. Simple as that!
By your argument, a level 5 character should be able to walk into Cyrodiil immediately. A level 30 character should be able to do veteran dungeons. But they aren’t. The game itself sets restrictions on who can do what content, regardless of the number of bars. Players are going to want to play with others at or near their experience level, and ZoS gave them the ability to filter their groups.
Look at it this way. If group finder had never been implemented, and you joined that guy’s group, he still would’ve been kicking people he didn’t want anyway. Not like ZoS could do anything about that.3 -
SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭SilverBride wrote: »If ZOS didn't want players to set criteria for joining their group they wouldn't have made that an option in the group finder.
How many times have players been told that if they don't like to play certain ways they should make their own group with their own criteria? Well that is all they are doing.
Players have the right to create groups of like minded players to reach their shared goals.
Yes, players have the right to create groups with whatever rules they want.... in Discord, in guilds, in voice chat. And others have the right to play the game without any harassment or gatekeeping. This works for both sides. No?
But you should NOT be allowed to gatekeep others in-game. Simple as that!
Creating a group of players with the same goal and players that meet the group leader's requirements to be able to meet that goal is not gatekeeping. Gatekeeping would be preventing other players from being able to do certain content at all, in any group.
ZOS isn't going to force players to group and play with anyone they don't want to, whatever the reason.PCNA3
This discussion has been closed.