With the new animation reworks, would you like ZOS to remove animation cancelling?

Renato90085 · February 3

No, keep animation cancelling/weaving

Rungar wrote: »

BananaBender wrote: »

Weaving has become this boogey monster for some players because it's really easy to blame.

Just to demonstrate, here is a 136k parse I did without a single light attack.

Whether you like weaving or not is just personal opinion and everyone is free to have theirs, but weaving is not responsible for anyone dealing low damage, unless you are at the 1% of players.
Weaving isn't required, weaving isn't the majority of your damage and it's not holding you from doing any content. It's simply a feature for people who like it and for me it's the reason why ESO combat feels much better than any other MMO. If you don't care about min maxing your damage, you don't have to worry about weaving.

thats only possible because of the velothi amulet relic ( easy 25%+ damage boost). How long did you play the game before you found that, same for the other relics. Zos , to their credit, brought in a solution, just too late and far too hidden through the backdoor to be useful or effective for newer players who struggle and will never know about it.

like i said, the game is known for a bad combat system. Adding a few items will only fix that for long time players, not anyone new or players that quit because they didnt like the combat system. But we all know one thing for sure. The game is alot more fun with that amulet.

your logic just tell us you feel weaving really negligible too...
if velothi really give you25% over power,it mean weaving negligible,because this mythic weak point is lost 99% lightatack dmg,if light attack weaving really important in game(like la is your 30% dps)like you say,this mythic never anyone using
Because it's not worth it,who will lost 30% dps and have 15% dps buff?but it mystic is meta
just because beam build dont need weaving, your 40-55%dps frome a beam skill, so it like you not affected mythic weakpoint
but your logic is 15% buff-99%weaving dmg lost =25%buff

Rungar · February 3

Yes, get rid of Animation cancelling/weaving

Renato90085 wrote: »

Rungar wrote: »

BananaBender wrote: »

Weaving has become this boogey monster for some players because it's really easy to blame.

Just to demonstrate, here is a 136k parse I did without a single light attack.

Whether you like weaving or not is just personal opinion and everyone is free to have theirs, but weaving is not responsible for anyone dealing low damage, unless you are at the 1% of players.
Weaving isn't required, weaving isn't the majority of your damage and it's not holding you from doing any content. It's simply a feature for people who like it and for me it's the reason why ESO combat feels much better than any other MMO. If you don't care about min maxing your damage, you don't have to worry about weaving.

thats only possible because of the velothi amulet relic ( easy 25%+ damage boost). How long did you play the game before you found that, same for the other relics. Zos , to their credit, brought in a solution, just too late and far too hidden through the backdoor to be useful or effective for newer players who struggle and will never know about it.

like i said, the game is known for a bad combat system. Adding a few items will only fix that for long time players, not anyone new or players that quit because they didnt like the combat system. But we all know one thing for sure. The game is alot more fun with that amulet.

your logic just tell us you feel weaving really negligible too...
if velothi really give you25% over power,it mean weaving negligible,because this mythic weak point is lost 99% lightatack dmg,if light attack weaving really important in game(like la is your 30% dps)like you say,this mythic never anyone using
Because it's not worth it,who will lost 30% dps and have 15% dps buff?but it mystic is meta
just because beam build dont need weaving, your 40-55%dps frome a beam skill, so it like you not affected mythic weakpoint
but your logic is 15% buff-99%weaving dmg lost =25%buff

what i said was they will have to do something big, more than adding an item to the game, before they will change peoples perceptions of the combat system. Weaving and barswap are weaknesses of the system. busywork/lack of impact is another one. This is why that amulet and the oakensoul artifact that gives you a single bar are so popular.

no suprise your focused on the damage number when the damage is irrelevent. People dont want to do it. Thats why they consider the combat system bad among other things like.

Pixiepumpkin · February 3

Yes, get rid of Animation cancelling/weaving

Yes because animation cancelling and even weaving are heavily influced by latency. "Skill" is one thing, not being able to perform on par with peers is another.

Secondly, allowing animation cancelling to exist opens up macro usage, which is against the EULA and yet widely used (not easily caught) especially in PVP.

For these reasons alone, weaving/animation cancelling should be removed.

Rungar · February 3

Yes, get rid of Animation cancelling/weaving

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

Yes because animation cancelling and even weaving are heavily influced by latency. "Skill" is one thing, not being able to perform on par with peers is another.

Secondly, allowing animation cancelling to exist opens up macro usage, which is against the EULA and yet widely used (not easily caught) especially in PVP.

For these reasons alone, weaving/animation cancelling should be removed.

You cant get rid of animation cancelling because you wouldnt be able to block or dodge without it which would make the combat system 10 times worse but you could clean it up a bit by getting rid of weaving and making skills more impactful and less busywork but we might be long past that bridge now and it is what it is.

CameraBeardThePirate · February 3

No, keep animation cancelling/weaving

Rungar wrote: »

kevkj wrote: »

Rungar wrote: »

thats only possible because of the velothi amulet relic ( easy 25%+ damage boost). How long did you play the game before you found that, same for the other relics. Zos , to their credit, brought in a solution, just too late and far too hidden through the backdoor to be useful or effective for newer players who struggle and will never know about it.

like i said, the game is known for a bad combat system. Adding a few items will only fix that for long time players, not anyone new or players that quit because they didnt like the combat system. But we all know one thing for sure. The game is alot more fun with that amulet.

"I reject the evidence because it does not fit my delusional worldview." on full display. 25% number sourced from a cavity that sees no sun, to ensure the reduced damage output without Velothi is below 100k in this alternate reality. A 20% reduced output on a single target would already be generous.

What's next? It doesn't count because a trial set was used? It doesn't count because of Highland Sentinel? It doesn't count because of gold gear? It doesn't count because good traits and enchants were used? It doesn't count because an active skill was cast every second? It doesn't count because they didn't refresh skills early like a worse player would? It doesn't count because the test was carried out by someone with good knowledge and execution of the optimal skill rotation?

your splitting hairs we both know this build is cherry picked to max damage on a dummy. This is not reflective of the average player and neither are you. Your out of touch and that has always been the problem with this game and why the game is known for a poor combat system. I understand youll defend it to the death and i dont think youll have to wait long.

That's literally the point of a build. Dismissing their argument because they're in a good build is absurd.

The entire point is if you don't like light attack weaving, make a build where you don't need to light attack weave.

It's not like any of the gear they were using is hard to get. Highland Sentinel is crafted. Velothi can be farmed entirely in normal difficulty content, and you don't really even need to use it, as even without Velothi that parse would still be over 100k - more than enough to clear any content in the game aside from score pushing leaderboards.

Renato90085 · February 3

No, keep animation cancelling/weaving

Rungar wrote: »

Renato90085 wrote: »

Rungar wrote: »

BananaBender wrote: »

Weaving has become this boogey monster for some players because it's really easy to blame.

Just to demonstrate, here is a 136k parse I did without a single light attack.

Whether you like weaving or not is just personal opinion and everyone is free to have theirs, but weaving is not responsible for anyone dealing low damage, unless you are at the 1% of players.
Weaving isn't required, weaving isn't the majority of your damage and it's not holding you from doing any content. It's simply a feature for people who like it and for me it's the reason why ESO combat feels much better than any other MMO. If you don't care about min maxing your damage, you don't have to worry about weaving.

thats only possible because of the velothi amulet relic ( easy 25%+ damage boost). How long did you play the game before you found that, same for the other relics. Zos , to their credit, brought in a solution, just too late and far too hidden through the backdoor to be useful or effective for newer players who struggle and will never know about it.

like i said, the game is known for a bad combat system. Adding a few items will only fix that for long time players, not anyone new or players that quit because they didnt like the combat system. But we all know one thing for sure. The game is alot more fun with that amulet.

your logic just tell us you feel weaving really negligible too...
if velothi really give you25% over power,it mean weaving negligible,because this mythic weak point is lost 99% lightatack dmg,if light attack weaving really important in game(like la is your 30% dps)like you say,this mythic never anyone using
Because it's not worth it,who will lost 30% dps and have 15% dps buff?but it mystic is meta
just because beam build dont need weaving, your 40-55%dps frome a beam skill, so it like you not affected mythic weakpoint
but your logic is 15% buff-99%weaving dmg lost =25%buff

what i said was they will have to do something big, more than adding an item to the game, before they will change peoples perceptions of the combat system. Weaving and barswap are weaknesses of the system. busywork/lack of impact is another one. This is why that amulet and the oakensoul artifact that gives you a single bar are so popular.

no suprise your focused on the damage number when the damage is irrelevent. People dont want to do it. Thats why they consider the combat system bad among other things like.

Not quite the same, if they were as weak as other mythic , no one would use them like other 95% set too(like rakkhat and a auto dodge set,but i forget name),rakkhat is a easy heavyattack mythic dont need you weaving and swap bar too,but since it delete overload combo,it a trash noboday using too.
they are meta just zos not big hammer nerf them like other set
also,since velothi and beam start,most player not use oaken anymore,you can in every high/low cpm build seen velothi just it best thing in game,like 2021-2023 kilt mythic,not it easy so popular

BardokRedSnow · February 3

No, keep animation cancelling/weaving

I would equate this to if they brought down the heights of the baskets in basketball. People wouldn't watch. Adult men wouldn't play. ESO already has a problem with making everything too accessible and easy. This is great for the casual crowd, but wont keep them around long enough to become end game, which is why aside from midyear mayhem in pvp, we've been losing players.

The main demographic of gamers that stay dedicated to a game, who are competitive and keep it alive don't like the game they're playing to be easy to master.

Easy to start up is good, easy to get into is good, but difficulty of mastery is what keeps competitive spirits around for years, and its why many are no longer here.

BardokRedSnow · February 3

No, keep animation cancelling/weaving

Its interesting looking back and seeing the comments from people wanting it gone lol, I wonder if its a pvp vs pve thing, for me I did hate the idea of it and application when my guild was forcing me to parse and do things I didn't want to as a TES III-V Skyrim Andy lol. I didn't want to use dual wield daggers so I tried dpsing with two handed and that was awkward, and even when I gave in to full dps meta it was boring and annoying. I dont get satisfaction crunching numbers on a dummy and tanking was more entertaining for pve.

Going to pvp though parsing helps with burst, procing your enchantment or poisons alongside your weapon skills, gives ultimate from the light attack and overall just feels good to do in combat when you do it efficiently. And when the lag allows you to do it lol.

For pvers I could understand why they'd want it gone though to be honest that would imo make dpsing even more boring like its already become now with beam meta.

It may be clunky depending on the content you're doing but making things even easier and simpler when Im already falling asleep doing dps unless its very hard content seems like a bad idea for the majority of players. Not perfect in pve land but thats no reason to strip it away.

Improving the weaving is a better idea, which from what I've seen of these new animations for DK and the weapon skills, they're definitely doing that.

HatchetHaro · February 3

No, keep animation cancelling/weaving

I genuinely hate how people keep throwing around this "animation cancelling" buzzword and calling it an exploit of some sort without understanding what "animation cancelling" actually means.

Almost all combat animations in any game have cancel-able components. There's the wind-up (anticipation - usually short), the action (when the damage happens), and the wind-down (the animation that's usually cancelled). If the player has to wait for the wind-down animation to complete before they can cast another combat action (aka no animation cancelling), that combat would then feel slow and clunky. Animation-cancelling is the very core of how combo systems work in many video games - they cancel the wind-down animations from each attack so they flow into the other combo animations.

Same goes for ESO - being able to attack between abilities is just part of its "combo system", and at just 2 combat actions per second, it's not even unrealistic. Besides, since animation canceling is such an easy thing to disable, ZOS would have disabled weaving ages ago if it wasn't intended.

Look, if it's a "weaving is hard to learn" thing, I get it; the whole concept of timing every attack after every ability and vice versa seems daunting; but really, it's not much more than keeping a beat. Imagine your heart is beating about once per second, and instead of the usual buh-bum, it's attack-ability; set a 55bpm metronome and practice it for like 10 minutes on a target dummy, and you'll very quickly get the hang of it.

If it's still an accessibility concern even at just 2 alternating inputs per second, heavy attack builds are still very much a viable option for you.

BardokRedSnow · February 3

No, keep animation cancelling/weaving

Its basically muscle memory after you've been doing it for years, only daunting really if you're trying to get a certain dps and think your lack of cancelling is the issue, which it probably is.

If you're in pvp tho you don't even gotta be perfect at it for animation cancelling to make a big difference in your fights. And for the PvE community I barely understand the problem since beam and subclassing seems to be their way of needing to animation cancel/weave less.

Plus heavy attack builds.

Not good enough for trials but if you're doing hardcore difficulty trials anyway, you're not complaining about needing to AC

majulook · February 3

No, keep animation cancelling/weaving

No This would affect all aspects of animation canceling.

Example: Blade of Woe do you really want to see the animation sequence each time you use it?

kevkj · February 4

No, keep animation cancelling/weaving

Rungar wrote: »

no suprise your focused on the damage number when the damage is irrelevent. People dont want to do it. Thats why they consider the combat system bad among other things like.

I have to apologize, before this I thought you were just someone who is misinformed but now I realize I'm dealing with a troll. It took you barely 3 comments to go from "weaving gives a MASSIVE damage boost" to "you are TOO FOCUSED on the damage". I'm not aware that ZOS bans players who don't light attack weave. If you don't want to do it, just don't press left click. It's as shrimple as that.

People like you who propagate this falsehood that you MUST light attack weave in ESO do infinitely more harm to the game's reputation than your inability to light attack weave does to your ability to complete PVE content. Light attack weaving is just a convenient scapegoat for people who lack the ability to form coherent arguments.