These changes look good to me, especially the Searing Strike buff, when someday build PvP sees a balance of burst and pressure in its meta it can start to come back to life.

This is probably not a common opinion, I do not think DK even needs "burst potential" in its kit, especially now that subclassing exists. Nightblade stab, Sorc lightning bolt, these things are represented as burst damage. DK crushes, and burns, and crushes, and burns, and CRUSHES AND BURNS, until there is nothing left of your enemy but ash and dust.

I get the intent behind "This effect is only active if you are a dragonknight"
But I highly suggest it be changed to "This effect is only active if you have 2 dragonknight skill lines active", at least until all classes have something similar added.
Since the former creates a big gap in power between characters that share the same skill lines, but aren't the original same class.

MXVIIDREAM wrote: »

MashmalloMan wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

I don’t see anyone mentioning this but it has been mentioned to me… people are going to prebuff with whip in its current state. They’re going to gain stacks in trash, use it in trash or use it once on boss, and burn with a now free 15% damage boost. If this ends up being more effective than other subclasses with Arcanist, this would make meta more restrictive by enforcing base class DK.

Same with the other morph probably, that’s what, 25% damage for 30 seconds? If there’s trash in the same room that’s definitely prebuffable.

5 stacks is just for Flame Lash. (12%)
3 stacks is Molten Whip. (15%)

I also agree though, very problematic and why I suggested shifting that bonus from Whip to Draconic Power where that line is currently underperforming.

If they're against Engulfing Dragonfire using that bonus:

• Nerf Engulfing Dragonfire by ~12% to account for the new passive.
• Add in the tooltip: "Does not affect Engulfing Dragonfire". (Less intuitive imo).

Honestly, both Whip morphs are crazy strong even without these damage done buffs, so sending the buff elsewhere in the kit that prevents subclassing from being as easy, buffs Draconic Power, and buffs pure classing is a triple win in my book.

Doesn’t it say the stacks are disabled when using the channeled breath or did I read it wrong

I'm speaking from the perspective that I wish the new Damage Done bonus they tacked on to Whip was sent to Draconic Power instead, where Engulfing Flames currently exists. Read my previous comment for more details.

But yes, their current design does not offer the Damage Done if Engulfing Flames is on either of your bars and only for base class DKs.

DK is dead to me. Thanks ESO team.

Developer Comment: We’re intentionally inflating some of the damage of the Dragonknight class in the short term to help the class stand up to snuff with other current meta options, while we find more long-term solutions and continue work on other class refreshes. Expect these values/effects to be adjusted over time!

I think that's great. Arcanist skills being the center of most builds is a problem, and leaves little room for build diversity. I'm happy to see the jump in power. I love it when a class is just silly strong.

xylena wrote: »

These changes look good to me, especially the Searing Strike buff, when someday build PvP sees a balance of burst and pressure in its meta it can start to come back to life.

This is probably not a common opinion, I do not think DK even needs "burst potential" in its kit, especially now that subclassing exists. Nightblade stab, Sorc lightning bolt, these things are represented as burst damage. DK crushes, and burns, and crushes, and burns, and CRUSHES AND BURNS, until there is nothing left of your enemy but ash and dust.

I agree, I’m not looking to burst, I’m looking to outlast and put the pressure on on an undeniable way. All I truly want is for being THE fire class to mean we ramp up burning status in unbelievable ways. I’m looking to play my Fire Mage do in that manner. I show up,and sure I can’t tank, but every second I’m still alive is a problem for monsters/bosses. (I have no pvp opinions)

Another thing I'm not a fan of is relying on percent damage done modifiers over other types as it heavily limits what interacts with each other in unique and synergistic ways. I feel like the original rework that was presented was well thought out but the buffs have felt kind of rushed. I also feel like building specifically targeted anti synergies between 2 skills is an odd choice. The best example of this is that you have actually made Ardent Flame and Draconic Power less synergistic with Minor Brutality from Draconic Power not affecting the bonus from Molten Whip and Engulfing being completely excluded from benefiting from an Iconic skill. This along with the Dragonknight specific buffs leads to a situation where the elementalist type build that was a popular subclass is fundamentally better on Dragonknight leaving Sorc and Warden mains behind and even on Dragonknight it has a weird incentive to keep ardent flame over the other lines when subclassing as it is the only one with those buffs

Molten whip was fine in pvp didn't need to be nerfed

Wait...you can't gain stacks of seething fury if you have engulfing dragonfire on either bar now? Wasn't the purpose of dk rework to buff the dk if they are using more dk skill lines on a pure class dk? But now it seems that it's a penalty? That's a bit backward IMO. "Hey you get to have seething fury stacks as a dk, but not if you're using another dk skill line skill" back to subclassing we go I guess? Seems like I should just use ardent flame alone and use it as we are now on arcs on live. Generate stacks and damage from ardent flame but keep using the arc inspired scholarship/flail, flail/beam meta that's currently best. Makes subclassing from dk but using it as an arc more appealing IMO...

MXVIIDREAM wrote: »

Agreed kind of making me want to use that to stack but then subclass in the arcanist beam was a strange change I know why so that it couldn’t be abused with the molten whip change
But it seems like negative change on all of us for various reasons killed the skill for PvP but this oversights kind of shown me how it’s also limited how people play in pve
Molten whip needs to be changed back
And the passive that given crit damage needs to be crit damage and healing
Outside of those skills I’m confident dk could go live as it is

Yeah, exactly. Now I guess I'm going to just be scholarship, flail, flail, beaming on my dk and maintaining seething fury stacks on my dk instead of arc. Pure class got buffed sure, but now damage on subclass sounds like it's gonna be buffed now from dk base over arc base. Not to mention the class mastery buff dk's get in scribing. Gonna get over powered beam builds quick.

Edit: forgot to mention, if keeping earthen heart as well now we are gaining crit damage for doing damage with dk abilities with blessing at the peak on top of avalanche stacks. So it should make for a powerful subclass.

My genuine thoughts and a lot of what I’ve been seeing

Molten whip

needs to be reverted back to how it was weapon damage and spell damage 100 per stack 3 stacks include 3% damage done per stack to monsters keeps roughly the same damage done as before but I genuinely believe the stacking with breath should remain to at least give players the option to use this with breath or else I think people are going to subclass it and use arcanist anyway

avalance

Great great idea, sadly a little ineffective in combat bosses immune phases and just combat in general make this a little redundant I propose 2/3seconds to build stacks 4 seconds of no damage to lose them
Much better uptime for 90% of combat this alone could fix a lot of the underwhelming dk performance in most pve scenarios

blessings of the peak

Adding crit damage to this is a brilliant idea however for the sake of all roles I believe it should be crit damage and crit healing this benefits both support dps and tanks

I wouldn’t mind also seeing 300/600crit resistance rank 1 and 2 added into blessings of the peak, with PvP the way it is and how impen got the treatment it did a while ago I would like to see every class also now have crit resistance worked into them over the refreshes and I think this is the correct skill line to work it into
I think it would go a great way to slowing down some of this insane burst we have reached in PvP
I picked the numbers out of my own experience it’s roughly equal to the champion point tree cp aswel as 600 Crit Resistance ≈ ~9% reduction in incoming crit bonus damage so it seems a fair number to me

Including these changes I’m ecstatic if dk went live exactly as is including the additional pts Notes above

Appreciate you reading

Edit: not sure why the avalanche part went bold as a whole thing sorry about that looking at the code and it’s just avalanche in bold or I’d change it sorry again

ZOS_Amy wrote: »

As we noted in our PTS Week 1 Summary, we know there’s a desire to see the power level for Dragonknight increased. We’ve looked at your feedback surrounding some of the reworked skills and have made adjustments that will be live on Week 3 of PTS.

Below is an early look at the upcoming adjustments for DK:

Ardent Flame

• Lava Whip: This ability and the Flame Lash morph now generate 5 stacks of their empowered forms for 20 seconds, rather than enabling the ability to cast the ability as many times as you can within 7.9s (at most, 7 casts). Increased the damage by 40% to account for less casts. Overall, this should make both versions of the ability much easier to use in a rotation, rather than feeling like you must choose between uptime of other abilities and the super sick flip whip. 
  • Flame Lash: This morph now also grants 12% damage done to monsters for 30s after activating if you are a Dragonknight. 
    • In a future PTS update this will be increased to 15% for 45s but only if all stacks are consumed – to help avoid turning it into a passive buff effect and more of a reward for using the ability to its maximum effect. 
  • Molten Whip: This morph now grants 5% damage done against monsters per stack, rather than 85-100 Weapon and Spell Damage. This effect only activates if you are a Dragonknight. Seething Fury no longer generates stacks if you have Engulfing Dragonfire slotted on either bar.
  • Developer Comment: We’re intentionally inflating some of the damage of the Dragonknight class in the short term to help the class stand up to snuff with other current meta options, while we find more long-term solutions and continue work on other class refreshes. Expect these values/effects to be adjusted over time!
• Searing Strike: Increased the damage of this ability and its morphs’ damage over time effect by 50% per tick. This takes these to the same strength as a normal 20 second DoT, but over half the duration, making their overall DPS twice as strong, rather than 50% stronger. This change was done to account for the loss of GCD activations, as the previous iterations resulted in a very minor damage gain with perfect uptimes, making the change feel more like a horizontal shift than a gain.
  • Searing Claw: Reduced the damage bonus per tick to 10%, down from 24%, to account for the base increase. This damage effect is now built into the base damage calculation, rather than as an additional damage taken modifier, which should make the increase more accurate and performant.
• Core of Flame: Fixed an issue where this ability and its morphs were missing the 15% bonus potency modifier to their damage to account for their delays. 
  • Soul of Flame: Fixed an issue where the Stamina restore of this morph was incorrectly based off your missing Magicka.

Draconic Power

• Dragonfire Breath: Increased the damage per tick of this ability and the Disintegrating Dragonfire morphs’ damage over time effect by 50% per tick. 
  • Disintegrating Dragonfire: Fixed an issue where the Major Breach from this morph was not extended by Elfbane.
• Dragon Leap: This Ultimate and its morphs now determine what type of CC will play based on the type of enemy they hit. Players are knocked back 4 meters and stunned for 2 seconds, while monsters are knocked into the air and stunned for 3 seconds. This change was done based on the discussions we saw come up - where much of the powerful feeling and benefits of knocking enemies away is lost in the context of PvE.

Earthen Heart

• Magma Armor
  • Corrosive Armor: Reduced the damage limit to 12% of your Max Health, rather than 8%, to better account for the raw offensive power this Ultimate provides. The damage over time effect now only targets monsters, rather than any enemy, to offer healthier PvP balance.
    • Developer Comment: We’re better differentiating some of the buffs made to this ultimate from PTS 1 in efforts to help still reach our goals of making the ability more effective in PvE, while toning down how much impact it brings in PvP by reducing the defensive capabilities further and removing the high damage over time.
  • Molten Weapons
    • Molten Armaments: Reduced the cooldown of the damage of this morph to 1.5s to help it function better with Heavy Attack builds that are quicker than 2s completion times, to have better pairing with the Empower this morph grants.
  • Blessing at the Peak: This passive now triggers off casting OR dealing damage with Earthen Heart abilities, instead of only casting. This passive now grants 5|10% Critical Damage.
  
  We hope you’ll find these adjustments more in line with your expectations. Please keep the feedback coming and let us know what you think when these changes arrive on the PTS on Monday, January 26.

At this point, why even change corrosive at all? Why not just leave it how it was before? Because at this point you are nerfing it into the ground. Obv the way it was on the PTS was overkill. We just stopped testing it in duels, because it was too broken. But corrosive on live is just fine, some people run it, most dont. If you are going to completely remove the dot 12% is too much. Just leave it as it is on live.

Also, again, the inferno/flames of oblivion animation is too much. It needs to be toned down. I didnt see anything about it so far, but its just way too flashy and way to big.

If pure class DK isn't competitive with subclassing meta in PVP after the rework, then you can keep it.

DK needs all the buffs. Whip should keep w/s damage AND there should be added crit damage AND there should be a bonus to penetration for each DK skill lines AND DK should have a self cleanse etc etc

Put out a bold version of the DK. Err on the side of possibly overpowered and if DK is just too much in open world PVP, make an adjustment then. Don't make nerfs because a few people engaged in duels on PTS. It needs to go live to be truly tested.

Putting out a juggernaut version of DK on the live server that melts all of these clones spamming specbow and beetles would be a GOOD THING.

We all know that whatever ends up on the live server can be altered at any time. These class reworks should be disruptive. Pure DK should be as good as any subclass option. The same should be the end goal for Warden next and then Sorc etc.

The goal should be to make pure class totally viable. Not fall short of subclassing but also not render it obsolete.

Keyword here should be BALANCE. And sometimes you have to swing far in the other direction for a period before balance is achieved.

BattleAxe wrote: »

As dks are very lacking in offensive penetration could disintegrating dragon breath instead either give an unarmed armor debuff or after activation boosts dks penetration by an amount say a percentage of the initial damage dealt on first target hit this would I believe increase the effectiveness for single target pure dk builds.

Ooh, that would be interesting if Disintegrating breath gave a unique armor debuff instead of the standard Major Breach that basically everything has nowadays. It would definitely make it more useful.