Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

You will now be removed from all campaign queues upon using an Alliance change token. All pending ready checks will also be automatically declined.

@ZOS_Kevin

Can the dev team explain why this functionality to allow players to switch factions if they want to stop playing during a campaign cycle has been removed?

You can still swap factions on other campaigns, you just don't get to bypass the alliance locked aspect of Grey Host.

Although a bit surprised as this seems like it would be a marketing trick to pump whales, instead they're showing integrity.

Though given your annotations kinda glad you won't be abusing that anymore lol.

I've never used that mechanic but a lot of players return to the game, pop into cyrodiil to check out pvp and then find a group of players they used to play with have swapped factions. They then can't join them for a month and often quit due to that.

Faction lock as a mechanic is fine (has it's flaws but still its ok as a concept) but players should be able to swap factions with a long cooldown or large cost independent of the campaign cycle. Removing this is just pushing potential new / returning players.

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

You will now be removed from all campaign queues upon using an Alliance change token. All pending ready checks will also be automatically declined.

@ZOS_Kevin

Can the dev team explain why this functionality to allow players to switch factions if they want to stop playing during a campaign cycle has been removed?

You can still swap factions on other campaigns, you just don't get to bypass the alliance locked aspect of Grey Host.

Although a bit surprised as this seems like it would be a marketing trick to pump whales, instead they're showing integrity.

Though given your annotations kinda glad you won't be abusing that anymore lol.

I've never used that mechanic but a lot of players return to the game, pop into cyrodiil to check out pvp and then find a group of players they used to play with have swapped factions. They then can't join them for a month and often quit due to that.

Faction lock as a mechanic is fine (has it's flaws but still its ok as a concept) but players should be able to swap factions with a long cooldown or large cost independent of the campaign cycle. Removing this is just pushing potential new / returning players.

This is niche enough of an interaction that I doubt few people actually used such a mechanic outside of heavily involved players who would have known who was doing what already: Needing to spend money on a faction change token, then purposely queue and change faction to probably enter Cyrodiil with the queued request post faction change, likely causing an internal server tick to change the faction associated with that character on the faction locked server.

Faction lock as a mechanic is fine (has its flaws but still its ok as a concept), and it's cooldown is a month, the campaign cycle.

I don't know exactly if this is what was occurring, but given the cost is an alliance change token, there was no cooldown. Now there is, like you wanted.

Except the cooldown isn't 1 month, the cooldown is the time until the campaign ends, meaning that its arbitrary whether your cooldown is 30days or 5 depending on when you want to change. If it's a niche interaction that poeple didn't use why remove it as an option then?
PVP already has low entry participation, why remove things which took care of some barriers to entry.

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

You will now be removed from all campaign queues upon using an Alliance change token. All pending ready checks will also be automatically declined.

@ZOS_Kevin

Can the dev team explain why this functionality to allow players to switch factions if they want to stop playing during a campaign cycle has been removed?

You can still swap factions on other campaigns, you just don't get to bypass the alliance locked aspect of Grey Host.

Although a bit surprised as this seems like it would be a marketing trick to pump whales, instead they're showing integrity.

Though given your annotations kinda glad you won't be abusing that anymore lol.

I've never used that mechanic but a lot of players return to the game, pop into cyrodiil to check out pvp and then find a group of players they used to play with have swapped factions. They then can't join them for a month and often quit due to that.

Faction lock as a mechanic is fine (has it's flaws but still its ok as a concept) but players should be able to swap factions with a long cooldown or large cost independent of the campaign cycle. Removing this is just pushing potential new / returning players.

This is niche enough of an interaction that I doubt few people actually used such a mechanic outside of heavily involved players who would have known who was doing what already: Needing to spend money on a faction change token, then purposely queue and change faction to probably enter Cyrodiil with the queued request post faction change, likely causing an internal server tick to change the faction associated with that character on the faction locked server.

Faction lock as a mechanic is fine (has its flaws but still its ok as a concept), and it's cooldown is a month, the campaign cycle.

I don't know exactly if this is what was occurring, but given the cost is an alliance change token, there was no cooldown. Now there is, like you wanted.

Except the cooldown isn't 1 month, the cooldown is the time until the campaign ends, meaning that its arbitrary whether your cooldown is 30days or 5 depending on when you want to change. If it's a niche interaction that poeple didn't use why remove it as an option then?
PVP already has low entry participation, why remove things which took care of some barriers to entry.

Since the people likely using such a mechanic are likely brow-beating new entrants to begin with, doubly-so now they're in their preferred ball-group.

So it seems that your main objection is that it's a player who occasionally plays a style of pvp you don't like is raising the point?

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

You will now be removed from all campaign queues upon using an Alliance change token. All pending ready checks will also be automatically declined.

@ZOS_Kevin

Can the dev team explain why this functionality to allow players to switch factions if they want to stop playing during a campaign cycle has been removed?

You can still swap factions on other campaigns, you just don't get to bypass the alliance locked aspect of Grey Host.

Although a bit surprised as this seems like it would be a marketing trick to pump whales, instead they're showing integrity.

Though given your annotations kinda glad you won't be abusing that anymore lol.

I've never used that mechanic but a lot of players return to the game, pop into cyrodiil to check out pvp and then find a group of players they used to play with have swapped factions. They then can't join them for a month and often quit due to that.

Faction lock as a mechanic is fine (has it's flaws but still its ok as a concept) but players should be able to swap factions with a long cooldown or large cost independent of the campaign cycle. Removing this is just pushing potential new / returning players.

This is niche enough of an interaction that I doubt few people actually used such a mechanic outside of heavily involved players who would have known who was doing what already: Needing to spend money on a faction change token, then purposely queue and change faction to probably enter Cyrodiil with the queued request post faction change, likely causing an internal server tick to change the faction associated with that character on the faction locked server.

Faction lock as a mechanic is fine (has its flaws but still its ok as a concept), and it's cooldown is a month, the campaign cycle.

I don't know exactly if this is what was occurring, but given the cost is an alliance change token, there was no cooldown. Now there is, like you wanted.

Except the cooldown isn't 1 month, the cooldown is the time until the campaign ends, meaning that its arbitrary whether your cooldown is 30days or 5 depending on when you want to change. If it's a niche interaction that poeple didn't use why remove it as an option then?
PVP already has low entry participation, why remove things which took care of some barriers to entry.

Since the people likely using such a mechanic are likely brow-beating new entrants to begin with, doubly-so now they're in their preferred ball-group.

So it seems that your main objection is that it's a player who occasionally plays a style of pvp you don't like is raising the point?

My main objection is a player bypassing the faction lock mechanic on a faction lock campaign, there are other campaigns that need players that have such a feature removed.

My secondary objection is that its paywalled.

Third is that it's niche enough of an interaction that it is only used by experienced PvP players, contributing once again to their advantage in PvP.

Fourth is that the kind of player that uses this is doing so to better operate in organized groups. Now I understand this fourth reason is likely the main driver, but not my primary concern.

Objection 1 - it's not bypassing the faction lock, players can still only play for 1 faction at a time, it's allowing them to switch the faction they play for at a cost

Objection 2 - fair enough.

Objection 3 - there's videos on the method available on YouTube. I don't think you can say conclusively who uses the option but I agree pvpers are more likely to engage with PvP mechanics

Objection 4 - as I stated above normally I send the video on how to do this to anyone who returns to the game so they don't need to stress about faction locks and can just dip into PvP, see how things are then decide where to play. Very few of them play in/have gone on to play in organised groups. Having a bias due to what playstyle people engage in always leads to poor motives.

Removing the option discourages players from going back into PvP in case they get locked on 'the wrong' faction.

Additionally a lot can happen during a campaign, I think if players aren't having fun and no longer feel they can play for a certain faction due to that they shouldn't have to stop playing and wait for weeks to switch.

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Objection 1 - it's not bypassing the faction lock, players can still only play for 1 faction at a time, it's allowing them to switch the faction they play for at a cost

Objection 2 - fair enough.

Objection 3 - there's videos on the method available on YouTube. I don't think you can say conclusively who uses the option but I agree pvpers are more likely to engage with PvP mechanics

Objection 4 - as I stated above normally I send the video on how to do this to anyone who returns to the game so they don't need to stress about faction locks and can just dip into PvP, see how things are then decide where to play. Very few of them play in/have gone on to play in organised groups. Having a bias due to what playstyle people engage in always leads to poor motives.

Removing the option discourages players from going back into PvP in case they get locked on 'the wrong' faction.

Additionally a lot can happen during a campaign, I think if players aren't having fun and no longer feel they can play for a certain faction due to that they shouldn't have to stop playing and wait for weeks to switch.

Objection 1: You contradict yourself by later providing a scenario where a player is getting dumpstered and wants to faction hop. So, yes. It is bypassing the lock.

Objection 2: agreed.

Objection 3: People looking to play and invest in PvP, primarily ones that want to be organized with groups are the ones more likely to seek outside sources on such a topic. Not your average zerger.

Objection 4: You do realize that allowing players in a faction locked campaign to faction hop into the stronger faction simply exacerbates the issue don't you? "My team sucks, I want to join the winning team." "This faction doesn't have much coordination, I want to play in the more greatly coordinated faction instead of setting up coordination myself in this faction."

Now I'm not saying that the 5min timer is the best option, doesn't really give you much of a feel for it, and the notification popup can be easily glazed over. But faction hopping after days of play just because you don't vibe with that alliance is antithesis to the reason for the faction lock on that campaign.

The faction lock was designed to stop players from swapping back and forth without cost during an active campaign.
This method of faction swapping has a rather high cost and thus is unlikely to occur regularly. But in the case where someone feels they can no longer play on their currently selected faction taking away all options to swap until the end of the month can be a detriment to the community. I'd rather people play for a high pop faction than stop playing pvp all together, the community is already small enough.