Share Your Thoughts on ESO's Classes with Us

Gabriel_H · October 4

DarkStrifeYT wrote: »

Templar - has legitimately everything needed and is nearly perfect. A few complaints on animations from the community and the nova ult needs a bit of a damage buff, maybe one of the morphs can have a self synergy?

Technically Nova is the tanking ulti, and sweep is the DPS ulti, though as with all base classes there is some cross-over in roles between the lines (which is why sub-classing hits differently on base classes. There is no "dps line" or "tank line" to take out. Luminous Shards has a self-take synergy, procs the minor prot/berserk passive on cast too.

tomofhyrule · October 4

A big thing that this makes me consider is what ZOS's idea of a timeline is.

I am happy seeing that Kevin's latest post here is talking about balance changes and buffs for pure classes. The way that that post reads (and the questions of the survey) make it seem like there's a desire to shift things back to pure classes having their niche with strengths and weaknesses of their own, while Subclass builds are designed around trading your own power to cover your weaknesses, which is how I would have wanted this from the start.

However... how long is this going to take? And what is the team going to be doing in the interim?

We already see that, since U46, the Combat team has spent nearly 100% of their time on Vengeance because there are few, if any, balance changes. It really does feel like the only major balance shift they considered due to subclassing was 1) neuter DK sustain, 2) force Sorcs back into pet builds (partially reverted), 3) disallow ultimate passives from stacking, 4) change the giga buff from Grim Focus to a different very strong buff, 5) throw one bone to Necros in U48.

Are we expecting the team to do nothing but balance next year, considering how much needs to be done? Does this mean that we won't have the chance of seeing new Grimoires/Skill Lines/Classes until that's all done? And, after the fact that Solstice was a bit of a let down overall mostly due to the lack of new additions, does this bode well for the game if the Combat team doesn't add any of these?

Furthermore, the power level pre-U46 and post-U46 is off the charts. Nobody wants a bunch of hard-hitting nerfs (see U35), but is the Combat team okay with the current level of power possible, considering most standard trials have a strategy of "burn it hard enough that we don't need to see the mechanics." Are they going to consider taking power away? Or buffing PvE enemies? Or are they intending that the Encounter team's mechanic design is only for lower DPS groups and it's fine to burn through them?

I feel like the rebalance from this is a monumental task, but I do think that the team should have seen at least some of these issues coming when they planned Subclassing - after all, withing 24h of it leaking, the large raider Discords were already pointing all of these issues out without even having seen it. Is the Combat team really so detached from the players that they couldn't see that? (Don't answer that). Is that raising no alarm bells?

I want this balanced, I really do. At least I can still do my dungeon tris as a pureclass since I'm good enough at my role and have friends who don't mind me taking a harder route, but I can't just "lol I want to eat self nerfs!" in trial tri progs. But... I also want new things - 2025 was a pretty boring year since we didn't get anything really new to play with, just throwing a bunch of old stuff in a blender. I want to play with some new Grimoires (Werewolves desperately need something, and I also think a channelled beam that steals Overload's Heavy Attack animation to make a Fatecarver-esque elemental beam would be awesome). And I desperately want a new Class to be able to play with three all-new Skill Lines (bonus points for an Artificer with automata summons, grenades and traps, and tonal magic).
...but is this asking for having my cake and eating it too? Will we only get one or the other?

Tariq9898 · October 5

Gabriel_H wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

That implies that it is intended that the parent classes each have their own strengths and weaknesses and that the point of Subclassing is to give players a way to make up for the inherent weaknesses of their Class.

It's a little more complex than that. ZOS have even said as much themselves.

“We know the Subclassing system will infuse power into the player community. For example, players can drop their tank and support skill lines for more damage-dealing abilities and passives,” notes Day. “However, there is a trade-off—by taking all damage skill lines, you are more reliant on your team for support healing, shielding, and protection. Also, there is no desire to reduce the effectiveness of pure classes and their ability to complete content, and overall, the system should make the content more accessible to all players.”

In other words, DDs got to address their weaknesses, while tanks and healers are pushed into buff machines.

I’m gonna be honest, and maybe y’all can help me clarify…

But I never understand when people say there is a trade-off when switching to subclassing. I get that you’re sacrificing tank and healing skill lines.

But then why are all of Hyperioxes best solo builds utilizing three 3 DPS skill lines?? Keep in mind, this is the person who solos vet dlc dungeons on hard mode for every boss.

https://hyperioxes.com/eso/solo

Clearly, there isn’t a trade off. Subclassing into 3 DD skill lines is better than staying pure in every way, be it DPS or survivability.

I asked this exact question and even Hyperioxes said on Discord that subclassing will always be better than a pure class.

Maybe someone can change my mind… 🤷🏻‍♂️

siebenstein5b16_ESO · October 5

I appreciate the thought....
I just got disillusioned when the age-question came up

If you don't share your age, the survey ends here.

What does that mean to me?
I'm playing the game since beta, meaning I hang around here since 2013
meaning I know how to play my class, meaning I know how it feels to get castrated for the sake of pvp, screaming injustice and last but not least anything that's got nothing to do with my kind of playing the game and then being confronted with an over-uber-not-ever-getting-nerfed class called the arcanist...

I understand that your primary target is not players my age, but a group of youngsters who rule the market. I completely get your thought about oldies. But let me just tell you one thing: My age doesn't have anything to do with my playstile, desires or wishes in an mmorpg (the kind of which I played for more than 30 years now) - I wouldn't have answered any question in a different way if I was a teen or twen - which I still am (not only inside my head) but by heart.

So allow me to just state a fact: The age commiting restriction was truly *** and will lose you some dedicated players like me. (Not that you mind, I think...but still... spare us a thought, as you throw us aside for profit and commerce)

shadoza · October 5

siebenstein5b16_ESO wrote: »

I appreciate the thought....
I just got disillusioned when the age-question came up

If you don't share your age, the survey ends here.

What does that mean to me?
I'm playing the game since beta, meaning I hang around here since 2013
meaning I know how to play my class, meaning I know how it feels to get castrated for the sake of pvp, screaming injustice and last but not least anything that's got nothing to do with my kind of playing the game and then being confronted with an over-uber-not-ever-getting-nerfed class called the arcanist...

I understand that your primary target is not players my age, but a group of youngsters who rule the market. I completely get your thought about oldies. But let me just tell you one thing: My age doesn't have anything to do with my playstile, desires or wishes in an mmorpg (the kind of which I played for more than 30 years now) - I wouldn't have answered any question in a different way if I was a teen or twen - which I still am (not only inside my head) but by heart.

So allow me to just state a fact: The age commiting restriction was truly *** and will lose you some dedicated players like me. (Not that you mind, I think...but still... spare us a thought, as you throw us aside for profit and commerce)

Didn't the survey offer an option of not providing that data; like a rather not say option?
I do think age makes a difference. Not a bad difference but still a serious one.
Older players tend to have more disposable income.
Older, mature, players are more selective in making purchase choices and are less likely to follow trends. (They stay with a game longer and tend to have more product loyalty.)
Older players are less tolerant. Depending on how old, they might be used to getting a quality product for a fair price and they don't like it when something doesn't work.
Younger players are flightily and will change games and companies based on whatever influencer they are paying attention to.
Younger players settle for less, have lower standards, and tend to be more focused on instant pleasures. They are more forgiving when something doesn't work because they expect things not to work.
Younger players tend to not adapt well to changes. The tend to rely on min/max, skill weaving / rotations . . . so when something changes they do not have a path forward immediately.
Those that are transitioning between younger groups and older groups are likely a little of either or both.

I would say, even though I think age is an important demography, you should do the survey. Pick the age you want to represent if you cannot find a 'rather not say' option and focus on the meat of the survey rather than demographics.

kind_hero · October 5

After playing for 11 years, of course I am tempted by the new abilities, especially the one that everyone uses or is talking about: fatecarver.

I don't want this to be nerfed, I want other classes to have abilities this cool. When I first used it, I was farming XP fighting lots of mobs at once, and I was laughing constantly of how ridiculously fun to use was this ability. Compare the fun factor of this with sap essence from night blade. I keep playing this game because it still makes me laugh. I don't care so much about the stats anymore, I just want it to be fun, but not silly.

In my opionion, you need to ditch the least used ability of each class and come with something else, or add new class abilities which feel fresh and fun. Maybe new morphs in certain cases, I don't know.

What I also dislike a lot about the ESO classes, is that all of them play like magic heroes. I can't make a brawler/knight build that is viable and feels like a hero that doesn't have any inclination for magic. Also, there is little difference between magic schools in terms of visuals.

I would like skills like shields to be from the alteration school, and have the visuals we know from earlier games. I get it that some things are too far on the road to be changed now, but at least you are going in some direction with custom visual effects.

I want more colors or themes for visual effects, for example to have a Nocturnal inspired nightblade instead of a vampire-like one, which became so boring to me after so many years. Or a sorc that is pure fire-mage or storm.

Blackbird_V · 8:33AM

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Hi everyone! We've seen some questions about our recent classes survey, and we wanted to clarify a few things around our goals for this one.

As we look to the future, a couple of our primary goals are to improve overall build viability and also address longstanding concerns and feedback related to class identity in ESO. We are in the process of putting together our long-term vision and plan for this work to share with you. Your direct experiences and feedback on ESO's classes and builds are important considerations for us as we work through this planning. It's our goal to share all of these elements together, so you have a better picture of where we are heading.

Part of the process we're going through is this classes survey, which is intended to help us gather additional input for upcoming build viability, combat feel, class identity, and some other things we're interested in learning more about. It is intentionally high level.

We hear you and understand that many of you would like to see adjustments to various abilities, and have questions about balance, build viability, hybridization, and even class relevancy in light of subclassing. Those questions and requests are absolutely a consideration and part of this work as well, but this high level planning must be completed first and this survey is just one step toward that.

While it wasn't reflected in-depth in this survey, we are considering the impact subclassing and scribing have on build viability, class identity, and overall balance. We also do recognize there are longstanding desires for boosts/bonuses for those who wish to play a pure class.

Thank you all for raising questions, and for filling out the survey.

"to improve overall build viability"

This will never be accomplished without a major overhaul to the gear system. So many gear sets are useless, regardless what you may think, and regardless to what your formulae's dictate. 100's of useless sets that are just bloat. Sets like Witchman come to mind. Like... why does it exist? Move away from stupid spreadsheets ffs.

You had a major opportunity with SkinnyCheeks, and his video on his idea for item set overhauls would honestly be the most solid foundation you could ask for to help with build diversity and viability. Just hire the guy already. He has better understanding of what the game needs as he is a human being that has played the game.

"feedback related to class identity in ESO"

You've had years of PTS feedback. Years of constant complaints. You've done nothing other than go on Twitter and say our reactions are "knee-jerk" reactions. Hybridisation butchered class identity, subclassing has annihilated it fully. Class identity will never be a thing, not at the very least as long as subclassing exists.
As for subclassing, you should seriously delete that system. It's broken, overpowered and a balance nightmare. If you buff base classes, you also buff subclassing at the same time. Considering you cannot even separate PvP and PvE balance, there ain't no way you're separating class and subclass balance.

"Part of the process we're going through is this classes survey, which is intended to help us gather additional input for upcoming build viability, combat feel, class identity, and some other things"

Again, you've had PTS cycles for this. You did not listen to any feedback, so why would you here?

ZoS, you need to remember that this is a game and you should start balancing it as such. This is the Elder Scrolls Online, not Microsoft Excel Spreadsheets. Just. STOP. SPREADSHEET. BALANCING.

LISTEN TO YOUR PLAYERS FOR ONCE!

Sarannah · 9:19AM

Filled it in, as I play all classes it took me about an hour or so.

As some other players already mentioned, I was also surprised there wasn't a general class questionaire at the end, after filling this in for all classes. As I would like to have mentioned all classes need that one major ability to make a build around, similar to how fatecarver works for arcanist. This would bring builddiversity back.

Some ideas for major class skills similar to fatecarver functionality/build convenience:
-Templar: Puncturing strikes: Change this skill into a channeled skill and to fire each strike in a very long range cone AOE, also remove the dps damage restriction when hitting multiple enemies.
-Sorcerer: Overload: Change overload from an ultimate into a normal channeled skill with a much longer range.

And these are ideas for only two of the classes. Making these changes would give players a choice on which main attack to use, especially with subclassing active!

PS: Wasn't possible to add this idea in the survey, so I am posting it here!