I'm Appalled at the Season Pass / ESO+ Value Proposition

Sturmfaenger · April 14

Season Pass not good as it is for me.

For me, the dungeons of "Fallen Banners" and "Feast of Shadows" are included in ESO+.
I will most likely never go inside. I went barely into the previous ones before. Not missing a thing.
In earlier years it was never a problem - the option is there with eso+ but easily ignored.
This year I'm forced to buy those dungeons to "own" them. = paying twice for the same content that's useless to me, because there will be no access to story content and no community event if I don't. Thats appalling.

I hope there will be more varieties of said season pass next year. For example one with just story content in spring and fall, and the community event.
I don't need dungeons and trials.

lillybit · April 14

ADarklore wrote: »

Well, they did say years ago that ESO+ doesn't keep the lights on... and as a 'for profit' company, they need to find more ways to bring in extra money. I don't fault them for that. I don't think people understand how much it costs to keep a modern MMO running, adding content, upkeep, etc... and all of that requires a LOT of money. With player population dropping as other games come out, players get bored, etc... they need to find ways of replacing the revenue lost when players leave.

So it doesn't surprise me that they are trying to find ways to get ESO+ members to pay more- by not including content or making some content redundant. Again, I don't fault them for this- they are a business and not a charity. If population was high, they could afford to be more generous... but at this point, they are in need of constant cash flow coming in to keep the game going and continue further development.

With respect, it's not the job of us subscribers to "keep the lights on" anyway. If it were, it would be compulsory and the burden would be shared equally, not just dumped on a portion of the player base.

They may be a for-profit company, and there may well be a fall in player population, but they are still a far cry from the pleading poverty. They've recently been bragging about how they've cleared 2 billion in *profit.*

The average yearly content (discounting the chaper which everyone buys separately), two dungeon packs and a small zone, costs 5000 crowns. That's one 5500 crown pack with change, costing £30. That's content that has taken time and money to develop. They want to get their money back for it, and rightfully so.

On the other side, i pay monthly for my subscription at £10pcm. That's £120 a year. This gives me various perks but costs them zero in ongoing costs. I mean there was a little initial work setting up the craft bag and this new furnishings vault, but basically it's just flipping switches, no supervision needed.

My sub costs me 4 times what the yearly content costs to buy. It's costing me 4 times as much to rent it than it is for you to buy it. Yes, I get access to previous years content too but guess what? I paid 4 times as much for it that year too.

Don't get me wrong, the craft bag and double bank space are fantastic. But are they really worth 4 times the yearly content without actually getting any of that content?

So yes. Subscribers are annoyed. The aren't asking for "charity" because they are already paying way above the odds for something that's been taken away.

They could've raised the price of the dlc, raised crown costs, even upped the sub cost. Instead they chose to target subscribers and make them pay twice (or is that 5 times?). It's such staggeringly bad business practice I almost can't believe they actually went there.

celner4_ESO · April 14

ADarklore wrote: »

Well, they did say years ago that ESO+ doesn't keep the lights on... and as a 'for profit' company, they need to find more ways to bring in extra money. I don't fault them for that. I don't think people understand how much it costs to keep a modern MMO running, adding content, upkeep, etc... and all of that requires a LOT of money. With player population dropping as other games come out, players get bored, etc... they need to find ways of replacing the revenue lost when players leave.

So it doesn't surprise me that they are trying to find ways to get ESO+ members to pay more- by not including content or making some content redundant. Again, I don't fault them for this- they are a business and not a charity. If population was high, they could afford to be more generous... but at this point, they are in need of constant cash flow coming in to keep the game going and continue further development.

Get rid of the subscription then, make the game truly free to play, with paid current content additions and activities, with great store additions for cosmetics, like what most other live services are doing, rather than trying to double dip. Boy does it come off as really money grubby when, like you said, it’s not even their main source of revenue. To be fair most all of the content remains relevant and it isn’t like WoW where the past DLCs hold no value to the player (kind of, they do seem to purposely nerf old sets to have new OP sets be selling points). So I understand wanting to sell that because of the value it has. But man, there are better ways to monetize and other studios with live service games have proven this. It always boils down to WHAT is the current leadership willing to invest back into the game to improve and add to it. It really is that simple. And secondly, how does the studio respect its customers investment into the product, via content added and monetization. Keeping on making the excuses of how much a mmo costs to maintain and develop without disclosing to the public where revenue is being placed and why, so we might understand if this is actually true or not, is telling in of itself. If they want to say how expensive it is, show us what you’re making in total, how much is being put back into the game, AND THEN we can actually sympathize. Otherwise it’s empty words and excuses. There’s a reason that will never happen.

agelonestar · April 15

So I guess there isn’t going to be a response @ZOS_Kevin ??

I’m not angry. I’m just disappointed.

Diminish · April 15

The way I look at it, this is finally a reason to clean up my inventory. With the current state of my inventory, the game is literally unplayable without the craft bag. I don't plan to pay for things twice; I already did that making the jump between 2 different platforms. If one has to go, ESO+ or new content, its going to be ESO+. To me thats crazy though considering it makes more profit than a seasonal pass. Surely someone at ZOS has thought about this.

Pevey · April 16

Early reports from the PTS are that Solstice is a smaller zone, more in line with Gold Coast or Hew's Bane. Personally, those are two of my favorite zones, so no issue with the size. The issue is that they are bending over backwards not to simply call this DLC, when everyone knows it is DLC just like those zones were. Even Wrothgar was just considered DLC. And all were included in ESO+. All of this confusing content pass speak is to try to convince us this is not exactly what it is: DLC. Because then people would ask why the DLC is not being included in ESO+. But we're asking anyway.

Displaced_Salad · April 17

*I could live with a price increase and a change in release style if not for three things:

servers and QOL improvements have been lackluster at best,
bugs have NOT been fixed that are game breaking, some extant since inception, and
content has been decreased (ie, companions no longer releasing with a chapter with no commensurate content to replace them, etc.)

And once again, we have a murky, unorganized release regarding content info, yet a rock solid pricing structure. Poor communications and lack of transparency can be the silent fourth/fifth horsemen of the group, I suppose.

This is no longer a transactional relationship; it's a dysfunctional one that relies on goodwill, nostalgia and customer loyalty to blind players to the fact they are being systematically trained to accept a whole lot less in exchange for the same, or more, currency.

*one person's opinion

Veinblood1965 · April 17

It's just natural. We all know the game has been bleeding players for a while now as least on PS4/5 ever since core skill changes and especially the changes to the vendor system listings from one month to two weeks went live. You don't GAIN players by messing around with core gaming styles. No one said hey ZoS changed this skill so I'm going to start playing, but many left.

The company still needs to pay for expenses which most likely have not gone down yet revenue has. It's just a dart at the wall to see if new revenue can be brought in from existing players. It may even bring in a few new ones.

I've been getting major change fatigue for a while now and I like the game. It usually is the reason I leave a game and move on when my favorite class gets changed so much it no longer resembles the reason I started playing it to begin with.

celner4_ESO · April 17

Veinblood1965 wrote: »

It's just natural. We all know the game has been bleeding players for a while now as least on PS4/5 ever since core skill changes and especially the changes to the vendor system listings from one month to two weeks went live. You don't GAIN players by messing around with core gaming styles. No one said hey ZoS changed this skill so I'm going to start playing, but many left.

The company still needs to pay for expenses which most likely have not gone down yet revenue has. It's just a dart at the wall to see if new revenue can be brought in from existing players. It may even bring in a few new ones.

I've been getting major change fatigue for a while now and I like the game. It usually is the reason I leave a game and move on when my favorite class gets changed so much it no longer resembles the reason I started playing it to begin with.

I’d love to know the current leaderships and board members earnings, compared to the total profit made by ESO in comparison to what is being put back into the game for those.. expenses.

TheValkyn · August 31

daim wrote: »

https://youtu.be/X9YpL_k3jH8?si=hUQZdCOt8XtuNleB

Literally ZOS…

LPapirius · August 31

celner4_ESO wrote: »

Veinblood1965 wrote: »

It's just natural. We all know the game has been bleeding players for a while now as least on PS4/5 ever since core skill changes and especially the changes to the vendor system listings from one month to two weeks went live. You don't GAIN players by messing around with core gaming styles. No one said hey ZoS changed this skill so I'm going to start playing, but many left.

The company still needs to pay for expenses which most likely have not gone down yet revenue has. It's just a dart at the wall to see if new revenue can be brought in from existing players. It may even bring in a few new ones.

I've been getting major change fatigue for a while now and I like the game. It usually is the reason I leave a game and move on when my favorite class gets changed so much it no longer resembles the reason I started playing it to begin with.

I’d love to know the current leaderships and board members earnings, compared to the total profit made by ESO in comparison to what is being put back into the game for those.. expenses.

Pretty sure we're never going to see that data.

I'll buy new content when it goes on sale....if it's a real sale. I'll pay $15 for Solstice and that's my limit.