It is a mix of many things, but I would say that for most people it would be things from this list:
- Lag & performance
- Hammer
- ball groups
- proc sets
- scribing & subclassing creating broken builds
- scoring & "who wins" became meaningless
- player experience & knowledge also became almost meaningless
- lack of fixes for way too many things that should have been fixed long ago (invisible ballista projectiles from arrius mine or tower in DC territory that can keep elder scroll save in unintended way or that one tree that you can jump on & get inside enemy keep).

I mean, I can go on almost forever on stuff that should be adressd. I wish this PvP game mode felt like a PvP game mode where it is actual PvP activity deciding who wins or not, but at this point it kinda feels like some kinda of sandbox - PvP - circus.

For me, personally it was Vengeance modes & testing that were infinitely better that regular Cyro. Double AP is too little. In order to have fun... the experience need to be fun...

Stamicka wrote: »

I don't think Vengeance as we last saw it is the solution, but I think that a Cyrodiil with pure stat based sets only (that are balanced with each other), higher population caps, lowered barriers to entry, and skills more in line with early ESO (like frags stunning or merciless resolve requiring more management) would be far more successful than the mess we have now.

This is the way it should be 100%. Stop making the gap between hardcore pvp'ers and everyone else so huge. My last time I entered IC, my entire group decked out very good PvE gear went up against a single DK. We never even moved his health bar or broke his shield. I was on a toon that was parsing about 80k in PvE.

I know that no one will miss me in Cyro, but I won't be going back as the emphasis on perfect gear just ruins it for me.

Vonnegut2506 wrote: »

Because I can't be tasked to do activities I don't enjoy just for some item in a video game, and I would guess many people feel the same way about PvP.

Exactly, it simply is an unenjoyable event for me, and there is so no sense in doint it.

Frayton wrote: »

MISTFORMBZZZ wrote: »

Its just portraying the overall populations sufferings the game has atm.

This is the core issue. The people who are saying there's nothing wrong either haven't been here when all MYM campaigns used to be packed or it's just copium.

I don't think I've ever seen all of the campaigns packed, and I've been playing in WSM since back when it was called MYM. I thought that is the whole point of having the extra campaigns-- so players have campaigns which aren't pop-locked that they can get into without having to wait in a long queue? I know the extra campaigns weren't full, because I used to have to pick one of them when I was trying to get a quick queue out of IC; I would bounce back and forth between IC and Cyrodiil, taking turns doing a district daily, two town dailies (Chorrol and Weynon Priory), turning in the district daily and doing the next one, turning in the town dailies and doing the next two, etc., until I'd done all 6 districts and all 10 Chorrol/Weynon Priory dailies.

This year I'm doing all 6 district dailies, using an extra campaign for queuing back and forth but not doing any town dailies in between, then heading to Cyrodiil to stay for several hours, doing missions and AvA objectives. I'm staying in Cyrodiil a lot longer than I used to, and I'm trying to earn all if my AP in my home campaign-- not that I ever expect to be Emperor, but I'm more cognizant of my tier of end-of-campaign rewards.

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

I will add that there are just two things that remain in pvp zone that appeal to me. Grand overlord and emperor.

While both are easier to achieve during whitesstrake the time commitment and event lengths vs the grind involved dont make it worth it.

The grind for GO is a lot less than it used to be though.

Not sure what the situation in other platforms is but in PC/EU the bottom fell out of the WGWT market which means they have never been more accessible.

That is a huge boost Vs the players who had to grind their way relying on CWT instead.

Rewards are obsolete. All players are fed up with the same old Style Pages that are endlessly created for each event: enough! Give more useful, interesting rewards, less self-serving collecting, and more character growth.

I dunno on prime time weekends the queue for PC/NA Greyhost reaches over 120 by 6pm et

Rkindaleft wrote: »

The rewards from the event aren't anything special (ESO really needs a better event reward system, it hasn't changed for years and it's becoming boring, they should be more useful and interesting) and I suspect most casual players have no interest in going into Cyrodiil and getting farmed by people with proper subclassed builds.

They have recently introduced a better rewards system. One could say they came up with a real golden idea in pursuit of that goal. Unfortunately it resulted in a rather vocal playerbase bemoaning the idea that they'd actually have to participate to earn the the rewards.

As for better rewards, that will never happen. Because if anything of any recognizable value were to be given away, those who didn't manage to get them for whatever reason will scream "foul".

I've pvped quite abit so far and I honestly think subclassing is the problem.


It puts such high requirements on having a decent time; because just using your main class is too weak.

Also the 30-45 min que on Grey Host + combination of lag.

I do not think we're ''short on players'' cause the turnout on peak times isn't that bad

I think they need to return vengeance campaign and do it without subclassing.

Back to the basics

Regarding the rewards, it’s come to a point where I can barely give away the Alliance terrier bones because everyone and their mother has so many of them. Would be nice if we got something new to replace those.

dcrush wrote: »

Regarding the rewards, it’s come to a point where I can barely give away the Alliance terrier bones because everyone and their mother has so many of them. Would be nice if we got something new to replace those.

I think it's nice that those are still available for new players to get, but they ought to be moved into the bag of veteran's glory and retired from the loot table for the event coffers.

PvP is the first mode that got killed with subclassing in my opinion.

Subclasses brought an improvement of around 60% in dps/healing/tanking and changed group mechanics quite drastically in PvE. Needles to say, in PvP you have the same increase in general power, meaning that even the lowest organised group (not necessarily a ball group, just people who know how to make builds work together) can decimate hundreds of casual PvPers.
Bear in mind, this power increase came at basically the SAME skill, rotations are very similar to pure class ones, what changed is just the build knowledge. The skill gap hasn't changed and yet nukers nuke much more.

Casual PvP has always been difficult but now it's straight away impossible, you just explode. And it's cool, I like that PvP requires organization, except that's what brought everybody away from the PvP scene. You can PvP ONLY in an organized way now.
In PvE you still have a huge disparity, but if you're a casual you just sit there in a party waiting for the arcanist to blow the entire dungeon in front of you, or worst case you'll be helped by those "aliens" and go through.
PvP doesn't have time for that, if you have casuals in your group and you attempt to write them how to get through it you've lost.

Think about this, before subclassing dps in PvP was a good 20% lower, meaning that even with huge skill gap, you still could survive a hit or two, and you needed to be completely unprepared to just die that quickly. Now you don't even have time to blink, and if you can and reply, you'll find out that the new subclass combination brought another layer of immortality on that player.
They have created the ultimate player builds, which is the coolest thing ever for PvE but a nightmare in PvP.

Guess what?
They did the pathetic Vengeance campaign, which actually worked.
And why did it work?
Because it ignored everything they have done until now...that's irony.

Arrow312 wrote: »

unfortunately i can't use the terriers in cyrodiil, otherwise i would destroy the map with my army of terriers. seriously the bones of the dogs are just annoying now and should be replaced or abolished urgently.

I would like the terrier bones to become thrown projectiles you can equip in your weapon slot as a stack and lob at enemies which explode on contact in PVP zones.

Veinblood1965 wrote: »

It's funny, I came here to post about this exact same thing. I'm in the top guild on Gray Host and usually there are tons of people online and having fun. This last weekend I logged in on Saturday and FOUR, I repeat FOUR people from my guild were in Cyrodill. There was also only a five minute wait to access GH. Usually there is an hour wait on weekend during the same timeframe.

I participated a little but I have not subclassed my NB and I noticed two things. My resource drain was noticeably worse and I was unable to do much damage to most people while at the same time I was taking significant damage more than normal. I have not subclassed yet due to what I am sure are going to be continual nerfs/changes.

I am thinking that is why my guild was absent.. I am wondering if others are absent due to subclassing also. I am thinking ZoS is seeing huge numbers of population decline in PVE and PVP. I know my vendor sales have been almost non-existant since subclassings release.

Actually the nerfs have all happened on pure classes.
With subclass you actually have the chance to switch to more useful skill trees...DK is a paperweight now, has lost all the sustain :'D

Subclassing I can't level up no skill points.
12 or so toons, played 10yrs.
Have all sub class levelled but in order to actually use on most of my toons I don't have enough skill points to subclass.
The double point cost is stopping me from adjusting them.
If you don't adjust you can't compete.
I have 2 that I can use and have been a bit but really pisses me off I can't use the other ten until I replay them for many hours to get skill points. That is really bad desicion.