Please do not force me to play in Vengance, I do not want to

thedude33 · July 1

marius_buys wrote: »

After 20K+ hours in ESO I am now forced into a test campaign with an alternate playstyle, alternate skills, alternate rule set and alternate gear.
Thanks but no thanks, I simply do not want to.

With respect there are factors ZOS is simply not quantifying in forcing all pvp players into a cookie cutter campaign where all stats are standard. Regardless of the literally thousands of hours spent farming gear and fine tuning playstyle there are many Meta factors getting ignored for instance the affect of ping. I play with a standards ping of 250ms out of South Africa. There is no way around it. This is why I for instance play with Oakensoul as I am at a distinct disadvantage with bar swapping and animation cancelling in combat when I fight against a player with lets say 50 ping.

I understand your need for testing BUT not at the cost of players who dislike the changes.
Please ZOS, give the players who do not want to test a normal CP & Non CP campaign during your testing in Vengance.

I agree with you. I would be very curious what Cyrodils population would have been last night with Vengance also running

demonology89 · July 1

They're forcing you because they want to stress the server. It's only a week. Do pvp players want Cyrodill fixed or not?

fizzybeef · July 1

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

scrappy1342 wrote: »

if pvp is their main thing that they do when they play, then yes, they are being forced into it

No, they are not. They have various flavors of BG's to play, and the more freeform Imperial City, and to a lesser extent dueling.

If you want large-scale battles, and player logistics being of importance, that's still in there in vengeance.

While in-depth character/gear customization was lost with this campaign, that can still be leveraged in the aforementioned game modes.

This also isn't permanent.

BG‘s and IC is almost NON EXISTANT ON SOME SERVERS because of low POPULATION….

Not everyone is playing on pc master race or NA server

allochthons · July 1

ZoS and members of this forum have explained this many times, last test and this test.

ZoS cannot do the tests they need internally, because they cannot recreate the conditions with code (bots) that are causing the problems in Cyrodiil.

ZoS cannot do the tests they need on the PTS, because the PTS does not have the population to recreate the conditions that are causing the problems in Cyrodiil.

They need the live servers, the hardware, the simultaneous network connections, but most importantly, the population. They won't get that if there are other campaigns.

And this time consoles can participate.

Van_Winkle · July 1

demonology89 wrote: »

They're forcing you because they want to stress the server. It's only a week. Do pvp players want Cyrodill fixed or not?

Do someone pay me for being a tester? No? It was i who paid for this game, not vice versa.

Jaavaa · July 1

Sluggy wrote: »

Jaavaa wrote: »

HatchetHaro wrote: »

If you don't want to play it then don't. No one is "forcing" you to do anything.

Bad Argument. On Xbox EU i have to play this if i wanna play pvp, cause the Population is low and there is nobody at ic or bg atm.

Here's an idea... everyone that wants to pvp the old way... go to IC?

I've been hearing that console Cyrodii is dead for months now and all of a sudden people are claiming it's the test and not the years of neglect that have done it. They are finally doing something to help that. It's a test. Engage with it. Help make it better. Or don't. PvP is already dead. What have you really go t to loose? Otherwise just go play something else like the rest of us have been doing for months or years now. Yeash.

PvP is on a lower pop than on pc, but not dead. Idk what things you heard.
And your absolutely brilliant idea with ic and bgs. I didn't think of that.…
Sometimes it’s better to play first on a System before talking about it.

preevious · July 1

Maitsukas wrote: »

preevious wrote: »

Also, as far as I understand, in vengeance, you only get to keep the AP, right? What about cyrod-sourced items, like the ruby stuff ot whatnot? They are fully innacessibles, now?

Or is there something I don't know about? (i admit, I don't play PvP, but I'm curious)

The AP, Rewards for the Worthy and XP get delivered once you leave the Vengeance Campaign. Any items you have for use in the Vengeance Campaign (basic gear, unlimited potions & siege) do not get carried over to PvE and vice versa.

Got it, thanks !

Four_Fingers · July 1

I am going to double check today, but rewarding AP after leaving the campaign acted more like getting AP for daily log in, in other words it didn't advance my alliance rank.

Getsugatenso · July 1

This revenge is undeniable crap, I won't be playing this week, and if they decide to make something like this permanent as the only option, I'm out.

allochthons · July 1

Four_Fingers wrote: »

I am going to double check today, but rewarding AP after leaving the campaign acted more like getting AP for daily log in, in other words it didn't advance my alliance rank.

It did for me. I (not a big PvPer) went up an entire level when I left Vengeance (from low 13 to mid-14, so not a ton, but definitely a lot for me) yesterday on Playstation. I also got 5-6 Reward for the Worthy e-mail. I'd played for a couple of hours.

I imagine for people of much higher rank, that might not move the bar a lot, given how much AP is needed to level when you're a General or Overlord.

Joy_Division · July 1

fizzybeef wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

scrappy1342 wrote: »

if pvp is their main thing that they do when they play, then yes, they are being forced into it

No, they are not. They have various flavors of BG's to play, and the more freeform Imperial City, and to a lesser extent dueling.

If you want large-scale battles, and player logistics being of importance, that's still in there in vengeance.

While in-depth character/gear customization was lost with this campaign, that can still be leveraged in the aforementioned game modes.

This also isn't permanent.

BG‘s and IC is almost NON EXISTANT ON SOME SERVERS because of low POPULATION….

Not everyone is playing on pc master race or NA server

Yes, they are non-existent because ZOS's current iteration of PvP is unappealing to the majority of its customers. If Vengeance was so bad, then people would not sit in ques of 180+ to play it when they could just hop into a BG or go to IC for some "real" PvP or so it's called.

Frayton · July 1

Four_Fingers wrote: »

Maybe it is time for "Vengeance" PVE mode as well at trials and HM dungeons, everybody balanced the same, no more meta complaints.
What is good for the goose is good for the gander.

I actually wouldn't mind that as long as our skills and the content are adjusted for that as well.

marius_buys · July 1

Getsugatenso wrote: »

This revenge is undeniable crap, I won't be playing this week, and if they decide to make something like this permanent as the only option, I'm out.

I'm afraid that's me as well, If you forego the creativity of putting together a build into an arcade build setup I will stop playing ESO.

My guild, is a PvP Campaign only focused guild that tries not to zerg, Vengance does not give us any options. BGs sure but were a guild. IC sure but we do that already, these are of course a valid options but unfortunately there is no Campaign element to either Vengance or IC. No bonus for being emp, no reason to capture scrolls, no quests to complete and to be honest the Golden Rewards are poor at best and offers no incentive to do the test. Its great for the group that can get a zerg together but really sucks for the players on then receiving end. Also not zerg counter play is even a remote option.

reazea · July 1

marius_buys wrote: »

After 20K+ hours in ESO I am now forced into a test campaign with an alternate playstyle, alternate skills, alternate rule set and alternate gear.
Thanks but no thanks, I simply do not want to.

With respect there are factors ZOS is simply not quantifying in forcing all pvp players into a cookie cutter campaign where all stats are standard. Regardless of the literally thousands of hours spent farming gear and fine tuning playstyle there are many Meta factors getting ignored for instance the affect of ping. I play with a standards ping of 250ms out of South Africa. There is no way around it. This is why I for instance play with Oakensoul as I am at a distinct disadvantage with bar swapping and animation cancelling in combat when I fight against a player with lets say 50 ping.

I understand your need for testing BUT not at the cost of players who dislike the changes.
Please ZOS, give the players who do not want to test a normal CP & Non CP campaign during your testing in Vengance.

Agreed. I'm not a guinea pig or a lab rat. Vengeance should be optional with some sort of reward/payment for doing the testing for ZOS.

fufu_from_ps4 · July 1

Four_Fingers wrote: »

Maybe it is time for "Vengeance" PVE mode as well at trials and HM dungeons, everybody balanced the same, no more meta complaints.
What is good for the goose is good for the gander.

why stop there? we should apply this to questing and housing as well.

actually... lets just give everyone 3 skills. one for buffs. one for healing. one for attacking. then everything is fair and balanced. then we will sell color skins in the crown store.

my mind is boggled at how far we have fallen.

Adaarye · July 1

Abelon wrote: »

They are still not "forced" into it. The game literally never forces you into pvp at all. If somebody makes a choice to only play pvp, that's a choice. And during this one test week, yes, the other campaigns are removed. Battlegrounds and Imperial City are technically still there, how many people play them especially during this week I have no idea, but they can make the choice to queue for them instead. They can also make the choice to play pve this one week. They can also make the choice to not play the game this one week.

But they are certainly, 100%, not forced into anything.

There are facts as you perceive them, then there are facts as the OP perceives them. No one has the right or the duty to judge another players' perception, in my humble opinion.

If PvP is why the OP plays ESO and furthermore why the OP pays for plus, then they have every right to be annoyed, upset, and to feel cheated.

The next thing you know "end game" housing and fashion will be declared as not "end game" according to those that do not partake. I play for the housing, trading, fashion, and for socializing. I've been around since beta. I've done the full spectrum of PvE and PvP. Casual PvE and limited socializing are now my thing. All that said, even though I despise playing the PvP part of ESO, it's not on me to tell the OP that they have no right to feel the way they feel.

The OP is obviously upset. A little empathy would go a long way.

Adaarye · July 1

Van_Winkle wrote: »

demonology89 wrote: »

They're forcing you because they want to stress the server. It's only a week. Do pvp players want Cyrodill fixed or not?

Do someone pay me for being a tester? No? It was i who paid for this game, not vice versa.

Agreed.

Also, most people pay, in one way or another, to play the game. Not to test the game. Is that not what PTS is for?

Oh wait!! There aren't enough PvP players logging in to PTS in an effort to make Cyrodil better.

So it's done on live servers making players suffer through the testing? How's that working out?

Abelon · July 1

Adaarye wrote: »

Van_Winkle wrote: »

demonology89 wrote: »

They're forcing you because they want to stress the server. It's only a week. Do pvp players want Cyrodill fixed or not?

Do someone pay me for being a tester? No? It was i who paid for this game, not vice versa.

Agreed. Most people pay, in one way or another, to play the game. Not to test the game. Is that not what PTS is for?

Oh wait!! There aren't enough PvP players logging in to PTS to make Cyrodil better.

So it's done on live servers making players suffer through the testing? How's that working out?

Yeah, that's the point. The devs literally said that's the point. They need more players to test this. Players in general (pve and pvp) don't go to PTS in necessary amounts to test such a large scale thing. So live servers is where it goes, even if only for a week.

How is it working out? Uh, very good as far as I can tell. Vengeance is constantly full. Parties are constantly full. You have large scale fights popping all over the map all the time. Have small ones popping all over the map at the same time too. It's been forever since I've seen pvp that active. The forum is filled with feedback and the official feedback thread is receiving feedback too (though many people seem to have missed the link at some point, should really be pinned somewhere). So either way, it looks like the testing is running successfully, whatever the outcome might be.

Twohothardware · July 1

It's a unique Campaign that's something different than what's always up the other 365 days of the year and it only lasts 1 week. Play it and claim the Golden Pursuit rewards or do something else for 1 week. You'll survive.

YandereGirlfriend · July 1

For comparison, the Vengeance test would be like if all PvE content was limited to Banished Cells I.

You're not "forced" to do it but if you want to play a dungeon then it's literally your only option.

Twohothardware · July 1

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

For comparison, the Vengeance test would be like if all PvE content was limited to Banished Cells I.

You're not "forced" to do it but if you want to play a dungeon then it's literally your only option.

Vengeance is not you're only option for PvP. You can go to Battlegrounds, you can go to Imperial City, you can go spend time dueling in any zone.

MorallyBipolar · July 1

fufu_from_ps4 wrote: »

Four_Fingers wrote: »

Maybe it is time for "Vengeance" PVE mode as well at trials and HM dungeons, everybody balanced the same, no more meta complaints.
What is good for the goose is good for the gander.

why stop there? we should apply this to questing and housing as well.

actually... lets just give everyone 3 skills. one for buffs. one for healing. one for attacking. then everything is fair and balanced. then we will sell color skins in the crown store.

my mind is boggled at how far we have fallen.

Yep. Between subclassing and vengeance my confidence in ZOS is completely gone. Seems like they setting ESO up to run on autopilot going forward.

MorallyBipolar · July 1

Abelon wrote: »

Adaarye wrote: »

Van_Winkle wrote: »

demonology89 wrote: »

They're forcing you because they want to stress the server. It's only a week. Do pvp players want Cyrodill fixed or not?

Do someone pay me for being a tester? No? It was i who paid for this game, not vice versa.

Agreed. Most people pay, in one way or another, to play the game. Not to test the game. Is that not what PTS is for?

Oh wait!! There aren't enough PvP players logging in to PTS to make Cyrodil better.

So it's done on live servers making players suffer through the testing? How's that working out?

Yeah, that's the point. The devs literally said that's the point. They need more players to test this. Players in general (pve and pvp) don't go to PTS in necessary amounts to test such a large scale thing. So live servers is where it goes, even if only for a week.

How is it working out? Uh, very good as far as I can tell. Vengeance is constantly full. Parties are constantly full. You have large scale fights popping all over the map all the time. Have small ones popping all over the map at the same time too. It's been forever since I've seen pvp that active. The forum is filled with feedback and the official feedback thread is receiving feedback too (though many people seem to have missed the link at some point, should really be pinned somewhere). So either way, it looks like the testing is running successfully, whatever the outcome might be.

A better solution would be to make participation voluntary and give a reward or better a tiered set of rewards for those who do participate. Forcing people to play vengeance is abusive to the PvP community the way it's done now.

Abelon · July 1

MorallyBipolar wrote: »

Abelon wrote: »

Adaarye wrote: »

Van_Winkle wrote: »

demonology89 wrote: »

They're forcing you because they want to stress the server. It's only a week. Do pvp players want Cyrodill fixed or not?

Do someone pay me for being a tester? No? It was i who paid for this game, not vice versa.

Agreed. Most people pay, in one way or another, to play the game. Not to test the game. Is that not what PTS is for?

Oh wait!! There aren't enough PvP players logging in to PTS to make Cyrodil better.

So it's done on live servers making players suffer through the testing? How's that working out?

Yeah, that's the point. The devs literally said that's the point. They need more players to test this. Players in general (pve and pvp) don't go to PTS in necessary amounts to test such a large scale thing. So live servers is where it goes, even if only for a week.

How is it working out? Uh, very good as far as I can tell. Vengeance is constantly full. Parties are constantly full. You have large scale fights popping all over the map all the time. Have small ones popping all over the map at the same time too. It's been forever since I've seen pvp that active. The forum is filled with feedback and the official feedback thread is receiving feedback too (though many people seem to have missed the link at some point, should really be pinned somewhere). So either way, it looks like the testing is running successfully, whatever the outcome might be.

A better solution would be to make participation voluntary and give a reward or better a tiered set of rewards for those who do participate. Forcing people to play vengeance is abusive to the PvP community the way it's done now.

You guys will pick the most sensationalized of words to describe a minor problem in a video game, then get worked up if somebody points out how it's a bit over the top. I'll be a pedantic annoyance yet again and point out that... no... you're not being abused.

If you make it voluntary, you'll still have less participants. There would be many pvp players who don't exactly hate Vengeance (as much as you do), but they'd still play the other campaigns out of habit. And rewards aren't always enough. We got rewards right now, but still some people refuse to play it, right? Not that I'm personally against your solution, I really don't care if there are other campaigns running or not running.

JustLovely · July 1

MorallyBipolar wrote: »

Abelon wrote: »

Adaarye wrote: »

Van_Winkle wrote: »

demonology89 wrote: »

They're forcing you because they want to stress the server. It's only a week. Do pvp players want Cyrodill fixed or not?

Do someone pay me for being a tester? No? It was i who paid for this game, not vice versa.

Agreed. Most people pay, in one way or another, to play the game. Not to test the game. Is that not what PTS is for?

Oh wait!! There aren't enough PvP players logging in to PTS to make Cyrodil better.

So it's done on live servers making players suffer through the testing? How's that working out?

Yeah, that's the point. The devs literally said that's the point. They need more players to test this. Players in general (pve and pvp) don't go to PTS in necessary amounts to test such a large scale thing. So live servers is where it goes, even if only for a week.

How is it working out? Uh, very good as far as I can tell. Vengeance is constantly full. Parties are constantly full. You have large scale fights popping all over the map all the time. Have small ones popping all over the map at the same time too. It's been forever since I've seen pvp that active. The forum is filled with feedback and the official feedback thread is receiving feedback too (though many people seem to have missed the link at some point, should really be pinned somewhere). So either way, it looks like the testing is running successfully, whatever the outcome might be.

A better solution would be to make participation voluntary and give a reward or better a tiered set of rewards for those who do participate. Forcing people to play vengeance is abusive to the PvP community the way it's done now.

Outstanding suggestion! ZOS should hire you for their marketing team.

kargen27 · July 1

The way I look at it is I want better performance in Cyrodiil and if this is what it takes to get there I am more than happy to do it.
I have a question. Is there a chance having other campaigns available could throw a wrench in what they are trying to learn? It isn't like each campaign would have it's own server. I have no idea if that could be the case or not, just wondering.

Either way I plan on participating with several of my characters hoping it will provide them with something to use in making PvP better in Cyrodiil.

Alchimiste1 · July 1

This campaign sucks !

Islyn · July 2

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

I refuse to enter it on my main simply because it "disables" my Vampirism

Does not matter if it is temporary, my main has continuously been a Vampire for the last 10 years which is longer then this game has existed on console, not once has he ever been mortal since the day he was turned, not once have I ever set him to be mortal with the armory station, it means he is one of the oldest active Vampires in the entire game and I take pride in that fact.

FELT! My main is copy of the character I made in beta, and she has been a vampire since DAY ONE early access on PC.

Islyn · July 2

demonology89 wrote: »

They're forcing you because they want to stress the server. It's only a week. Do pvp players want Cyrodill fixed or not?

Is changing the entire thing to very basic playstyle and consumables so ppl can zerg *fixed* though?

If ppl are on the whole happy with it - then ok!

But I would not call that FIXED. I would call it changed the the point of not being the same thing at all anymore.

MorallyBipolar wrote: »

Adaarye wrote: »

Agreed. Most people pay, in one way or another, to play the game. Not to test the game. Is that not what PTS is for?

Oh wait!! There aren't enough PvP players logging in to PTS to make Cyrodil better.

So it's done on live servers making players suffer through the testing? How's that working out?

Forcing people to play vengeance is abusive to the PvP community the way it's done now.

Suffer? Abuse? No.

It is hard to take anyone seriously when they use such loaded words as SUFFER and ABUSE regarding a game.

I care about this issue - and AGREE with your points - but when you start throwing SUFFER and ABUSE around - my brain just goes *No*.

Islyn · July 2

Abelon wrote: »

MorallyBipolar wrote: »

Abelon wrote: »

Adaarye wrote: »

Van_Winkle wrote: »

demonology89 wrote: »

They're forcing you because they want to stress the server. It's only a week. Do pvp players want Cyrodill fixed or not?

Do someone pay me for being a tester? No? It was i who paid for this game, not vice versa.

Agreed. Most people pay, in one way or another, to play the game. Not to test the game. Is that not what PTS is for?

Oh wait!! There aren't enough PvP players logging in to PTS to make Cyrodil better.

So it's done on live servers making players suffer through the testing? How's that working out?

Yeah, that's the point. The devs literally said that's the point. They need more players to test this. Players in general (pve and pvp) don't go to PTS in necessary amounts to test such a large scale thing. So live servers is where it goes, even if only for a week.

How is it working out? Uh, very good as far as I can tell. Vengeance is constantly full. Parties are constantly full. You have large scale fights popping all over the map all the time. Have small ones popping all over the map at the same time too. It's been forever since I've seen pvp that active. The forum is filled with feedback and the official feedback thread is receiving feedback too (though many people seem to have missed the link at some point, should really be pinned somewhere). So either way, it looks like the testing is running successfully, whatever the outcome might be.

A better solution would be to make participation voluntary and give a reward or better a tiered set of rewards for those who do participate. Forcing people to play vengeance is abusive to the PvP community the way it's done now.

You guys will pick the most sensationalized of words to describe a minor problem in a video game, then get worked up if somebody points out how it's a bit over the top. I'll be a pedantic annoyance yet again and point out that... no... you're not being abused.

If you make it voluntary, you'll still have less participants. There would be many pvp players who don't exactly hate Vengeance (as much as you do), but they'd still play the other campaigns out of habit. And rewards aren't always enough. We got rewards right now, but still some people refuse to play it, right? Not that I'm personally against your solution, I really don't care if there are other campaigns running or not running.

Dude this! It makes me go from 'yeah ok yeah I'm pickin up what they're laying down' to *wait what? omg gthoh with that* and I am done.