Zenimax! Forget about Craglorn!!!

Froggmann5 · May 2014

PLEASE READ THIS!

Listen. I'll be quite frank. There are hundreds of bugs that need to be dealt with immediately. These bugs need full attention, and they need it now. Please put the Craglorn Project to the side for however long it takes, you have no reason to be putting out an update that could potentially bring more harm than good to a game that is already in the, "more harm" category. Please fix what you have instead of trying to release Craglorn as a save-face!

Things such as -

Combat: The sluggishness and delays before the attack actually fires makes it grueling to even try to PvP/PvE. This, and combat animations completely failing to show at most points, taking damage for an attack I cannot see is not fun.
Quests: The main quest is still giving people issues. I will also include bot farming as a key element here. People have found a way to create free accounts. Find this issue and fix it. If you are, please let us know.
WereWolves/Vampires: You know the issues with this. Werewolves hinder the player and give almost no bonuses, while vampires are severely over powered when mixed with emperor status.
Veteran Level Content: This needs to be redone. The lore is off, no explanation as to why people refer to you as 'Soulless' after you redeemed your soul. The XP is not enough to justify spending hours grinding mobs. This is understandable, the grinding that is, however the particle-like XP we get from grinding them is horrendous and seems never-ending.

An MMO is not made like any other Generic Game out on the market. You need to mold and shape it overtime. Nothing will get perfect in a day, or week, or month, we understand this. However, do not put time and effort in a place that it is not needed when players are already struggling to get by with the bugs that exist now.

This is what I've seen from ZeniMax Online over the past few weeks.

Zeni: "HEY LOOK ITS CRAGLORN"
Players: "Fix the bugs please!"
Zeni: "LOOK AT THIS COOL NEW TRAILER OF CRAGLORN!"
Players: "The bugs please!? Do you even know they exist? Please tell us something!"
Zeni: "Fixed a couple of bugs... NEW DOCUMENTARY ON CRAGLORN!"
Players: "Those weren't the game breaking bugs we've been reporting! Can you-"
Zeni: "CRAGLORN TOMORROW! ... JUST KIDDING, STILL PRETTY COOL RIGHT?"
Players: "GAH!!!!!!!"

Dita · May 2014

Awesome !

BrassRazoo · May 2014

I would think they would have been working on Craglorn for a long time.
I also believe that there would be multiple teams in Zenimax, with one dedicated to testing and patching.

pxtc_ESO · May 2014

Agree with you OP.

Froggmann5 · May 2014

BrassRazoo wrote: »

I would think they would have been working on Craglorn for a long time.
I also believe that there would be multiple teams in Zenimax, with one dedicated to testing and patching.

Yes. However even with multiple teams, for any studio their response time is extremely slow when dealing with actual bugs. They do not keep in touch with the community as well as they should, and all we know is that they're focusing on Craglorn.

Laura · May 2014

I agree on all points except for the veteran content. I actually enjoy it (though that isn't my point)

they DO explain it (though it is shallow they do there best to explain why) something about meridias blessing allowing you to become more powerful by seeing events unfold had you been a part of the other alliances... yeah its incredibly weak but I don't know how they could have done it better. I wouldn't have minded the other alliances just sort of being there for you to explore and you would be attacked by guards and such for venturing into areas you don't belong unless you proved your worth to them through a grind - something you wouldn't HAVE to do but could do if you were so inclined. The issue I have with veteran content is that you MUST do it for gear upgrades and etc while it should have just been more skill points, cosmetic, mounts, pets, minor gear upgrades, disguises, titles, achievements, and etc.

again while I agree with you almost completely i'm just being subjective

I actually wish they would pull a FFXIV a realm reborn and do a relaunch later with a complete game that has more ES tennants like more open world (how veteran content COULD have been) crime system (yes I know its coming but its elder scrolls and should have been on release. Its going to be strange when npcs suddenly start caring if you rob them)

I love this game but it needs help and craglorn won't be enough.

Froggmann5 · May 2014

Laura wrote: »

I agree on all points except for the veteran content. I actually enjoy it (though that isn't my point)

Completely understandable, any constructive criticism is welcome!

While, I love veteran levels, I see the first V1-V10 as the starting VR levels. I expect them to add more VR levels (up to level VR50 hopefully) and I can see the grind with the XP we get now get more extremely tedious than anything. Maybe the XP you get from mobs can scale with the level? If it does, maybe even more so?

BeerWolf · May 2014

100% Agree --- especially the dialogue at the bottom

AryaWythers · May 2014

I do agree with OP and just want to add that PvP leveling is pretty bad. Every MMO I have ever played was able to play through as much PvE I could on my Main...then level any alts in PvP only. Also the Campaigns limit you also with time limits and locking alts from Campaigns are in. I could understand that this may be to try to limit cheating and spying, but Guilds are cross faction and negates keeping people of a faction from this sort of behavior.

Catches_the_Sun · May 2014

Not saying there aren't critical issues that need to be addressed, but as with every MMO ever made...the team that works on bugs is separate from the team that works on new content.

ciannait · May 2014

If that's the case, maybe they need to pull people off the "new content" team to augment the "fixing broken stuff" team.

michaelpatrickjonesnub18_ESO · May 2014

Funny how the game is in such a state of disarray, that people are actually refusing more content.

Smart crowd.

Too bad developers don't think this way.

BeerWolf · May 2014

ciannait wrote: »

If that's the case, maybe they need to pull people off the "new content" team to augment the "fixing broken stuff" team.

Think it's just half a man currently doing the bug fixing.

Mablung · May 2014

Problem with fixing bugs is creating more bugs than what is fixed. Ask any programmer, that is the norm. In no way does this excuse the poor state of this game. I would fire whoever was on the QA team and hire some of the gamers here or on the PTS to help get the game right.

I mean when the top solutions to issues are A)relog and B)reinstall then there are some issues that go beyond poor programming.

Greiger · May 2014

I think the agree button on the OP's post is broken, because it appears I can only agree with it once. That may need looking into.

Been thinking this for awhile. Adding new content onto a broken base just paves the way for that new content to also be broken. Bugfixing may indeed sometimes cause more bugs, but so does entirely new content. Bugfixing at least has a good possibility of fixing major issues.

I would happily put up with a minor issue or two to have Nightblade and Werewolf just...ya know...work as intended.

dragnar12 · May 2014

its to late
game failed hard
by now most have 1 caracter @ least vr 1 found out the sucky vr 1 to vr 10 grind
and quit the game
its over
done
failed pice of ....

Dominulf · May 2014

I keep telling myself that I will not make questionable MMORPG purchases and I keep failing. Maybe it will get better in time.

Froggmann5 wrote: »

Things such as -
Combat: The sluggishness and delays before the attack actually fires makes it grueling to even try to PvP/PvE. This, and combat animations completely failing to show at most points, taking damage for an attack I cannot see is not fun.

Tell me about it. I was able to hit Emperor as a Nightblade and the combat is just so sluggish and horrible feeling. It's one of the countless things that I just tried to ignore and get on with so that I could try to enjoy the game.

Phantax · May 2014

BrassRazoo wrote: »

I would think they would have been working on Craglorn for a long time.
I also believe that there would be multiple teams in Zenimax, with one dedicated to testing and patching.

But it wouldn't hurt to lock the bug fixing team in a room (with no food or water) and refuse to let them out until all the bugs are fixed...lol

Fix it or Die... seems very reasonable to me !

EDIT-
Had to edit this as you just know somebody is going to take me seriously and start flaming. Ok ok they don't have to die, maybe just whip them, or the occasional poke with a cattle prod !

Morbus2 · May 2014

I also agree with the OP. If they can't get the current content to run properly, how in the heck are we supposed to believe that they can get the new content to run properly. FFS fix what you already have, then worry about adding more.

Morbus2 · May 2014

jason.osage_ESO wrote: »

Problem with fixing bugs is creating more bugs than what is fixed. Ask any programmer, that is the norm. In no way does this excuse the poor state of this game. I would fire whoever was on the QA team and hire some of the gamers here or on the PTS to help get the game right.

I mean when the top solutions to issues are A)relog and B)reinstall then there are some issues that go beyond poor programming.

Bingo! It's called poor management.

dragnar12 · May 2014

Morbus2 wrote: »

jason.osage_ESO wrote: »

Problem with fixing bugs is creating more bugs than what is fixed. Ask any programmer, that is the norm. In no way does this excuse the poor state of this game. I would fire whoever was on the QA team and hire some of the gamers here or on the PTS to help get the game right.

I mean when the top solutions to issues are A)relog and B)reinstall then there are some issues that go beyond poor programming.

Bingo! It's called poor management.

this game was rushed top release by the ceo and investors

noting to do whit QA team

they where fearfull of ArcheAge and wildstar

they knew there game was not finished
but released it like this to get as mutch money as posible

u can see that every where

1 eu servers ( save money )
2 subscribe first to unlock free month ( more money )
3 paywall for class + mount ( more money )
4 to play any class / race in any faction your forced to pre order ( forces peeps w8 wanted to w8 and see to buy NOW els they loze a lot of freedome if the game was good )

and so many many many other things
they knew the game was gonne fail
so they went all out to get as mutch money asap out of it

and they prob sucseeded !

Dominulf · May 2014

dragnar12 wrote: »

Morbus2 wrote: »

jason.osage_ESO wrote: »

Problem with fixing bugs is creating more bugs than what is fixed. Ask any programmer, that is the norm. In no way does this excuse the poor state of this game. I would fire whoever was on the QA team and hire some of the gamers here or on the PTS to help get the game right.

I mean when the top solutions to issues are A)relog and B)reinstall then there are some issues that go beyond poor programming.

Bingo! It's called poor management.

this game was rushed top release by the ceo and investors

noting to do whit QA team

they where fearfull of ArcheAge and wildstar

they knew there game was not finished
but released it like this to get as mutch money as posible

u can see that every where

1 eu servers ( save money )
2 subscribe first to unlock free month ( more money )
3 paywall for class + mount ( more money )
4 to play any class / race in any faction your forced to pre order ( forces peeps w8 wanted to w8 and see to buy NOW els they loze a lot of freedome if the game was good )

and so many many many other things
they knew the game was gonne fail
so they went all out to get as mutch money asap out of it

and they prob sucseeded !

You type like an idiot, but you have a damn good point.

Hexagar · May 2014

Lag and abilities delay aside can someone please tell me whats all those bugs u all talking about? I am VR3 and seriously I saw only 2 bugged quests that got fixed the other day.. seriously game cant be bugless only for me...

Xexpo · May 2014

Ok guys, point me in the direction of the unsucky MMO, where everyone in the forums is really happy and positive.

shiva7663 · May 2014

I would like to be assured that entirely different teams of developers are working on new content, as opposed to bug and bot suppression.

EliteZ · May 2014

Zeni have already said, as well as several people in this post already, but I'll go ahead and repeat it.

The team that are doing class balance won't be working on craglorn, the pvp team won't be working on craglorn, the animators are not working on craglorn, the people working on fixing bugs, again, will not be working on craglorn. Craglorn will have it's own team of people that are at Zeni for that specific type of content. They've been working on craglorn before launch and therefore even if they was to scrap craglorn, bugs still wouldn't get fixed any faster.

People hate to hear it, but yes this is a new MMO just over 1 month old. Expect bugs, expect broken things, lag and downtime. Point me to one MMO that has ever launched without issues, most have much more issues then ESO does too. Then people say "Just cause X mmo had issues doesn't mean Y mmo should". Well it's the way it is, no game will ever be perfect, no game can ever be tested like launch can.

We are getting weekly updates fixing quest after quest, which is the only real point on OP's list IMO as the other points are not even bugs or issues. Point 1 is lag, people will always have lag no matter what Zeni do, yes they can try to limit it but somebody somewhere will always be lagging, me I get no lag. Point 3 is class balance and is never going to be right and always going to be changing which they are in almost every weekly patch and point 4 is your own opinion many people like and enjoy Vet content even if it is a grind.

And then you have the other side of the coin, there are already a lot of VR10 players that don't enjoy pvp and have no end game content to do but the same Vet dungeons over and over, this is causing players to leave because they are bored with nothing else to do. Craglorn is a much needed updated. which I believe was suppose to be at launch actually but wasn't ready, for end game pve players.

KerinKor · May 2014

kaer426 wrote: »

Ok guys, point me in the direction of the unsucky MMO, where everyone in the forums is really happy and positive.

https://www.lotro.com/en/forums/forums.php

Say anything negative about Turbine, point out someone is posting idiotic comments and you easily get perma-banned, so it's as near to a group-hug forum as I've seen.

Probably 90% of posters here, including myself, would have been banned there long ago.

Chirru · May 2014

http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/25k2ml/zos_i_must_plead_with_you_forget_about_bugged/

Dimillian · May 2014

Hey man, about the vet content, it's perfectly fine. You don't need to grind hour on mobs. Just play the game as it was intended, like you know, enjoying the DIFFERENT story, and doing the actual content, quests, etc.... You don't need to be vet 10 in a day, YOU DONT NEED TO, HEAR ME, if you want to be 80 in 2 days go play GW2. This game have ton of content to offer, if you don't enjoy it, maybe you want to play some other game for mindless/brainless grinding people. I'm sick of hearing that the vet content is a grind.

I'm ok with the rest.

Swampster · May 2014

KerinKor wrote: »

Probably 90% of posters here, including myself, would have been banned there long ago.

I've survived!

SaibotLiu · May 2014

This is pretty standard, par for the course. Developers need to release new high level content a couple of months after launch to keep their most hardcore fans past that initial period. If you dont realize whats going on you must be very new to MMO's.

Im not saying its right. Im only vet rank 1, Craglorn wont be benefiting me personally for some time. But I understand the reasoning behind it, and why it's gotta happen.

But that's because I can actually see past my own nose and past the "me, me, me" mentality and put myself in the position of the company and people who make games. If you can't see the logic behind it, oh well.