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Halls of Torment - serious balance issues! - Warning Spoilers
GrimMauKin
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I've taken out bosses above my level (such as the Skald King's brother - I forget the quest name) but I'm finding the Lyris doppelganger in Halls of Torment unplayable (not least because the real Lyris is a complete waste of space who just seems to stand there feeding the doppelganger so its health pretty much stays at maximum). This quest is rated as level 30 (I'm 32) and I've died so many times I've lost count. This quest feels way above a level 30 and I seriously believe that I'd be much better of playing solo without the real Lyris who just seems to be an infinite health potion for the boss!
I am one of The Great Mediocracy, those whose role in life is to provide the baseline by which The Few deem themselves Great.
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GrimMauKin✭✭✭✭I thought it seemed a reasonable question about a potentially unbalanced quest, but perhaps not.I am one of The Great Mediocracy, those whose role in life is to provide the baseline by which The Few deem themselves Great.0
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Boneidle✭✭forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/86555/halls-of-torment-defeat-lyris-doppleganger-issues#latest
You might actually find reading through this helpful to you, or you will find there are others with the same issue.Never retreat, If you turn and run you will only die tired.0 -
GrimMauKin✭✭✭✭Should I be looking to play this quest solo or is it a group deal?I am one of The Great Mediocracy, those whose role in life is to provide the baseline by which The Few deem themselves Great.0
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Boneidle✭✭Its the main story line you can only do it soloNever retreat, If you turn and run you will only die tired.0
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GrimMauKin✭✭✭✭Thanks.I am one of The Great Mediocracy, those whose role in life is to provide the baseline by which The Few deem themselves Great.0
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GossiTheDog✭✭✭✭✭You can only do it solo. It took me two attempts, it's a bit difficult. If you can't do it, review how you're approaching it. Watch some videos on YouTube, have a look at the forums.
I imagine this quest will have to be nerf'ed as people are just getting stuck on it all over the place.1 -
GrimMauKin✭✭✭✭I think that I'd like to work a way through it myself, so hopefully I'll not need to resort to video tuition, but it does sound as if it's not just me that's struggling. I'm a fairly balanced Nightblade and just don't seem to be able to deal enough damage quickly enough to counteract the feeding.I am one of The Great Mediocracy, those whose role in life is to provide the baseline by which The Few deem themselves Great.0
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Rhoric✭✭✭✭✭Have you tried range on her. When I did this quest I had no issues with her, I am a sorc with a bow and my clannfear tanked her. Cause of that I was able to sit back and hit her at range.0 -
Dovahkiin804✭✭i'm having the same problems I posted my own about getting tips or help killing this guy am i'm level 45 almost 460 -
Taleof2Cities✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I had a lot of trouble too with the Lyris doppelganger ... until I did some searches in the forums ...forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/86555/halls-of-torment-defeat-lyris-doppleganger-issues#latest
You might actually find reading through this helpful to you, or you will find there are others with the same issue.
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Taleof2Cities✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GrimMauKin wrote: »Should I be looking to play this quest solo or is it a group deal?
By the way, it is part of the main quest so you're on your own ...0 -
Maotti✭✭✭✭✭
✭I was stuck on this for a very long time.
However i do not belivie a nerf is the key here. But rather allowing grouping would be a much better alternative.PC EU3 -
I gave up, I could not get enough DPS to bring her down, and she kept healing, as a Knight blade I was able to keep myself alive too, but over all, I don't think I want to try this one again anytime soon as a solo quest. when I hear folks who are 10 levels above the quest still having issues, there is some serious issue going on. I don't mind dying a few times to learn the fight, but dying multiple times then being hit with a huge repair bill and have nothing to show for it just sucks.
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Jermu73✭✭✭My god this is what gamers have come to ....
My god this what people have come to... If you really haven't got anything to say so why say anything ? That is just rude.
I think that this quest is indeed wrong level. What they should do is lower down doppeldanger health/mana pool or they should buff real lyris AI. Because i can take 3 mobs at once over 3-4 times my level and this one you have to overlevel?
Edited by Jermu73 on May 13, 2014 3:55AM7 -
LadyDestiny✭✭✭✭✭If they would get the npc's fixed so they were worth something as a companion would really help in some of these boss fights. Nothing more frustrating when a companion just has to go with you on a quest and for what? So they can just stand there with your head up your backside while I run around like an idiot taking all the damage. Wish there was some way to end their pitiful existence.....lol On a side note, yeah it is kinda tough. Most of these boss fights in the main quests are nasty but can be done. If you have a tank pet it helps, but as for my NB I do not. It's all about stealth, dodge and kite most of the time and then you burn up so much stamina and magic it's a joke. I feel bad for those that don't use any ranged abilities. Oh and in truth, I can relate and agree with the OP. Some bosses and levels are just not balanced, meaning I can go fight a boss that is 2 or 3 levels higher, kill it solo with no problem, then go to another boss that is 2 or 3 levels lower than me and it rips me a new one if you get my meaning. Anyone that says LTP is just blowing smoke lol. Even they had to figure out what to do. Sure it is an issue on LTP which you have to stand back and figure out what is the best way to take that boss down. Eventually something works, but it is all about balance. The scaling in this game does need some work. Not to worry OP. Just smile and know it only gets more difficult as you get higher. Just wait for VR levels
I do think they should allow grouping for these. I mean after all, Isn't everything else group related? Love how you get to a quest only to see some unknown player kills the boss and your quest updates. Public dungeons, group dungeons and solo dungeons are another example. They just need to allow grouping for everything and saves frustration for the players that maybe are not as good a players as some others. At least it will give you a choice to do it solo or not. Lower the repair bill cost also if they want to make these fights unbalanced is another thing. I have had occasions where I have died multiple times before I knew what to do, but the outcome of the reward did not compensate for what I had to pay at the vender to repair my gear. Edited by LadyDestiny on May 13, 2014 8:43AM1 -
KerinKor✭✭✭✭✭
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It is a reasonable question, ignore the trolls, many people have complained this and later main story quests are horribly over-tuned.GrimMauKin wrote: »I thought it seemed a reasonable question about a potentially unbalanced quest, but perhaps not.
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LimeFox✭✭✭@GrimMauKin
I've posted so many rants on this very fight and subject I've lost count. And I've beaten the fight on a few characters, mind you!
My best advice is, leave the quest until level 35 if you want a challenge, level 40+ if you just want to get through it without dying multiple times. I found it annoying on my dragonknight and sorcerer characters, but IMPOSSIBLE on my Nightblade.
The quest would be entirely manageable if the NPC's just worked properly - one time I sailed through the fight because LYRIS ACTUALLY TANKED FOR 10 SECONDS. AND KILLED A BUBBLE. She was useless the rest of the fight, but it was just enough of a reprieve that the fight was suddenly manageable. I don't understand why they won't fix the NPC's - it really doesn't have to be nerfed if they balanced that issue.
My attacks didn't seem to be damaging the bubbles enough or they mistargeted and landed on the Harvester. I would also get 4-6 bubbles at once, freezes, lag, etc. I was using a bow and all the critical chance/bonus damage I could stack, so I went back in with:
Level 40 Nightblade
Level 40 Medium Armor with the highest enchantment I use on every piece for Magicka. You know the Runes that add Magicka points to gear? Every single piece had that buff.
Buy a stack of Magicka potions and put them in your hotbar to use, and every time your magicka is low, use one to refill what you can.
If you can find rings/necklace that offer Magicka regen boosts, even better.
Put Assassination's Teleport Strike -> Lotus Fan (for the AoE damage, so you can occasionally kill more than one orb at once if you manage to cluster them together) on your skill bar.
Attack the Harvester with normal attacks, save Stamina entirely for dodging those ground wave attacks with the hands. Whenever the orbs spawn, run towards them and use Lotus Fan. Lotus Fan is the only thing I've found that will reliably let you kill the orbs in one hit as a bow NB, and it has the bonus of popping you further away from the Harvester. The orbs chase after her, so if you keep drawing her away, it gives you some time to chase the others. Don't even bother with Health potions, just keep your Magicka topped off. Drop an Ultimate if things get desperate for trying to catch a bunch of orbs near her - Veil of Blades is a good one.
Lotus Fan is a godsend. Just make sure you have enough Magicka to constantly spam it whenever the orbs appear - armor enchants should help with that.
Laughably enough, the Main Story quest after this at level 35 is cake. So is the level 40 one with Mannimarco. Really, everything after those stupid, malfunctioning orbs is cake.Edited by LimeFox on May 13, 2014 10:21AM0 -
Seroczynski✭✭✭I died a few times at the battle before, but once I reached Lyris is was easy.
When playing as a melee, all you have to do (as with every 'Harverster'-like enemy) is to walk around in circles so you don't get hit, target the healing orbs (which heal you) and keep DPS on her. Done in 5 minutes, at the appropiate level.“To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems.” ― Homer J. Simpson0 -
Maestro_Sartori✭✭✭GrimMauKin wrote: »I've taken out bosses above my level (such as the Skald King's brother - I forget the quest name) but I'm finding the Lyris doppelganger in Halls of Torment unplayable (not least because the real Lyris is a complete waste of space who just seems to stand there feeding the doppelganger so its health pretty much stays at maximum). This quest is rated as level 30 (I'm 32) and I've died so many times I've lost count. This quest feels way above a level 30 and I seriously believe that I'd be much better of playing solo without the real Lyris who just seems to be an infinite health potion for the boss!
I already made a thread about this a long time ago....
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/86555/halls-of-torment-defeat-lyris-doppleganger-issues/p1
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Many people do this quest just fine, some people do it when they're below the level, some do it above, and few can't seem to get the grasp of it. All that adds up to a balanced quest, with sub-satisfactory playing of your class/character/skill usage.
I'm not saying you're playing bad, it's just maybe you haven't discovered your strengths and weakness' enough (Most of us in VR levels haven't either). Play with your skills, try different ones, maybe different weapons, and see where that takes you0 -
KerinKor✭✭✭✭✭
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Except the 'some' in the various categories you cite are by no means balanced, if it were 'well balanced' the MAJORITY would defeat it on-level, I argue there's strong evidence that this is not at all the case and that 5+ levels are where many people hare having to go and if that's the case this is a terribly tuned fight that in its current state has no right to exist on the critical path through the game.the.dzeneralb16_ESO wrote: »Many people do this quest just fine, some people do it when they're below the level, some do it above, and few can't seem to get the grasp of it. All that adds up to a balanced quest, with sub-satisfactory playing of your class/character/skill usage.
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KerinKor✭✭✭✭✭
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I've seen other people saying how hard this one is say the next is even harder.Laughably enough, the Main Story quest after this at level 35 is cake. So is the level 40 one with Mannimarco. Really, everything after those stupid, malfunctioning orbs is cake.
Edited by KerinKor on May 13, 2014 1:02PM0 -
AngryNord✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭the.dzeneralb16_ESO wrote: »some people do it when they're below the level
Then they're either liars or hackers - these quests can't be gotten before you're at the posted Level.
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aufischb16_ESO✭✭✭the.dzeneralb16_ESO wrote: »some people do it when they're below the level
Then they're either liars or hackers - these quests can't be gotten before you're at the posted Level.
I don't know about that, but for some reason I keep getting the fighters guild quests (which this one is) as soon as I have finished the last instance of the quest. I am usually not foolish enough to tackle the bright red quests in my journal, but they technically could be taken before you reach the specific level.
The same thing does not apply for the mages-guild quests, I only get them after reaching a specific level.Edited by aufischb16_ESO on May 13, 2014 1:22PM0 -
AngryNord✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yeah, the Fighters' Guild quests are gotten immideately upon completing the previous one. Halls of Torment is a Main Quest tho.0 -
Reykice✭✭✭✭✭GrimMauKin wrote: »I've taken out bosses above my level (such as the Skald King's brother - I forget the quest name) but I'm finding the Lyris doppelganger in Halls of Torment unplayable (not least because the real Lyris is a complete waste of space who just seems to stand there feeding the doppelganger so its health pretty much stays at maximum). This quest is rated as level 30 (I'm 32) and I've died so many times I've lost count. This quest feels way above a level 30 and I seriously believe that I'd be much better of playing solo without the real Lyris who just seems to be an infinite health potion for the boss!
I have killed that one with 2 classes so far, no problem...
Check your build if you have a decent one you should just burn her down so fast you won`t even notice she has like "special" mechanics...
Stop asking ZENIMAX to make the game easier... you can just use a dps build and smack down every quest boss so fast they don`t even get to heal/do their special thing...
Ever considered that the quest is perfectly fine but the people using bad builds are not at all balanced for the content they are trying to complete?
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