Yeah, most of what you wrote here is actually pretty accurate.

Ball groups are just utilizing the same mechanics as everybody else, but in their environment those mechanics drastically overperform. HOT stacking, shield spam via barrier/gibbering/chakrams, max health, and buff sets are all being abused to a level that I imagine was never intended for, resulting in players with unimaginable stats running around with 40k HP + 15k+ in damage shields and 20k+ healing per second in hots at any given moment. Something has to be done about this, it's gone on for years and we've reached a stage where they're the vast majority of the population at any given moment, and are unstoppable by anything other than another group doing the same thing (and often times, they simply cannot kill each other because the defense drastically outweighs the offense in this setting).

Hybridization definitely has hurt PVP. It has it's pros, but overall I think the impact has been mostly negative. It's allowed people to have the best of everything, which ultimately results in just generally overperforming builds with no sacrifices across the majority of classes. It also effectively halved the number of specs you can play, as before each stamina/magicka variant of every class had its own distinct feeling and set of class skills.

Even worse, hybridization isn't even "complete" years later. They've yet to hybridized potions, class passives, and several other things - resulting in many specs having needlessly inconvenient restrictions applied to them. Additionally, they never did a pass across the lesser utilized/underperforming skills post-hybridization to bring them into line, which has resulted in numerous skills becoming "dead content", as well as forcing people to slot the exact same meta skills on every build in PVP (looking at you, resolving vigor and elemental susceptibility).

It's hard to believe that none of this has been addressed in the past few years despite the extreme amount of feedback given regarding them here on the forums, especially since next patch we'll be getting arguably the most impactful combat changes in the history of the game via spellcrafting (scribing).

React wrote: »

Yeah, most of what you wrote here is actually pretty accurate.

Ball groups are just utilizing the same mechanics as everybody else, but in their environment those mechanics drastically overperform. HOT stacking, shield spam via barrier/gibbering/chakrams, max health, and buff sets are all being abused to a level that I imagine was never intended for, resulting in players with unimaginable stats running around with 40k HP + 15k+ in damage shields and 20k+ healing per second in hots at any given moment. Something has to be done about this, it's gone on for years and we've reached a stage where they're the vast majority of the population at any given moment, and are unstoppable by anything other than another group doing the same thing (and often times, they simply cannot kill each other because the defense drastically outweighs the offense in this setting).

Hybridization definitely has hurt PVP. It has it's pros, but overall I think the impact has been mostly negative. It's allowed people to have the best of everything, which ultimately results in just generally overperforming builds with no sacrifices across the majority of classes. It also effectively halved the number of specs you can play, as before each stamina/magicka variant of every class had its own distinct feeling and set of class skills.

Even worse, hybridization isn't even "complete" years later. They've yet to hybridized potions, class passives, and several other things - resulting in many specs having needlessly inconvenient restrictions applied to them. Additionally, they never did a pass across the lesser utilized/underperforming skills post-hybridization to bring them into line, which has resulted in numerous skills becoming "dead content", as well as forcing people to slot the exact same meta skills on every build in PVP (looking at you, resolving vigor and elemental susceptibility).

It's hard to believe that none of this has been addressed in the past few years despite the extreme amount of feedback given regarding them here on the forums, especially since next patch we'll be getting arguably the most impactful combat changes in the history of the game via spellcrafting (scribing).

I honestly don’t pvp too often but I just want to say the comments in this thread are very informative and sadly describe the reality pretty well.

I hope if the devs are reading this, they have a plan for properly redesigning the combat system in a broad sense in order to address all these issues, especially as they also impact pve as well as pvp.

Well done for noting all this down, it should keep being spoken about if there is ever a chance to salvage the MMO and keep it as fun as it can potentially be with the correct combat systems in place

Shadowbinder7 wrote: »

React wrote: »

Yeah, most of what you wrote here is actually pretty accurate.

Ball groups are just utilizing the same mechanics as everybody else, but in their environment those mechanics drastically overperform. HOT stacking, shield spam via barrier/gibbering/chakrams, max health, and buff sets are all being abused to a level that I imagine was never intended for, resulting in players with unimaginable stats running around with 40k HP + 15k+ in damage shields and 20k+ healing per second in hots at any given moment. Something has to be done about this, it's gone on for years and we've reached a stage where they're the vast majority of the population at any given moment, and are unstoppable by anything other than another group doing the same thing (and often times, they simply cannot kill each other because the defense drastically outweighs the offense in this setting).

Hybridization definitely has hurt PVP. It has it's pros, but overall I think the impact has been mostly negative. It's allowed people to have the best of everything, which ultimately results in just generally overperforming builds with no sacrifices across the majority of classes. It also effectively halved the number of specs you can play, as before each stamina/magicka variant of every class had its own distinct feeling and set of class skills.

Even worse, hybridization isn't even "complete" years later. They've yet to hybridized potions, class passives, and several other things - resulting in many specs having needlessly inconvenient restrictions applied to them. Additionally, they never did a pass across the lesser utilized/underperforming skills post-hybridization to bring them into line, which has resulted in numerous skills becoming "dead content", as well as forcing people to slot the exact same meta skills on every build in PVP (looking at you, resolving vigor and elemental susceptibility).

It's hard to believe that none of this has been addressed in the past few years despite the extreme amount of feedback given regarding them here on the forums, especially since next patch we'll be getting arguably the most impactful combat changes in the history of the game via spellcrafting (scribing).

I honestly don’t pvp too often but I just want to say the comments in this thread are very informative and sadly describe the reality pretty well.

I hope if the devs are reading this, they have a plan for properly redesigning the combat system in a broad sense in order to address all these issues, especially as they also impact pve as well as pvp.

Well done for noting all this down, it should keep being spoken about if there is ever a chance to salvage the MMO and keep it as fun as it can potentially be with the correct combat systems in place

They don’t , they don’t care about this game's PvP anymore and they won’t balance anything around it. Doesn’t matter how vocal the community is and how much feedback we give every change they make is for the worse, nerfs to proxy and harmony that were completely unwarranted made ball groups and zergs even worse a problem than they already are even tho no one asked for them. None of the devs ever PvP and all the changes they make are based around PvE

Sadly you cant say too much because you get your comments edited, but what happened to customer service? If you buy a car with a faulty battery you get a replacement or its repaired. Why does this basic customer rights policy that is part of law seem to not apply to game software? We have bought a product that is full of faults and they are still present after 10 years.

I go in pvp sometimes and its terrible, stuck in combat bugs, skills not working, ball groups that cant be defeated because of a trash game design, who cause lag, skills not to work etc.

Why are paying customers not being listened to?

Yesterday I had 4 crashes in Cyrodiil and so did a load of others.

I also have put in a customer support ticket because I believe a stack of my Grand coast experience scrolls have vanished since update 41.

Why do they allow ball groups? They are trolls and bullies. No justification for them, even when people defend them about being "organised" groups we all know what they are about. They dont take the scrolls and disappear like most pvpers, they harrass players. When I saw DC and AD ball groups working together in a keep both sieging in Arrius it just summed up how awful it is, which is a completely unfair game design that makes "heroes" and "champions" from cowards and bullies

Giljabrar wrote: »

I came back for the update, and just as quickly, I'm leaving. What an abysmal state MMO PvP is right now across the board.

Here's hoping somebody can release a decent title before this genre implodes entirely.

Yeah I was more pve past 4 years but more pvp lately.

Looks like PVP needs a rehaul and flavour enhancement ZOS devs! At this rate I really will only be coming back to ESO for dlc stories… this imbalance everywhere is getting too crazy

If you can see my comments, ZOS developers, please for the sake of the Aurbis, READ THESE THREADS! PVP AND PVE!

Please stop wasting money, time and potentially beautiful gameplay with a housing update for example… like… what??? And I forgive me but it feels like the time and effort put into updates/patches has steadily reduced over past 5 years. So please, for respect of the community and their dedication and time, do something about it, whatever is happening behind the scenes 👀👀👀👀

Peace out

TheAwesomeChimpanzee wrote: »

Shadowbinder7 wrote: »

React wrote: »

Yeah, most of what you wrote here is actually pretty accurate.

Ball groups are just utilizing the same mechanics as everybody else, but in their environment those mechanics drastically overperform. HOT stacking, shield spam via barrier/gibbering/chakrams, max health, and buff sets are all being abused to a level that I imagine was never intended for, resulting in players with unimaginable stats running around with 40k HP + 15k+ in damage shields and 20k+ healing per second in hots at any given moment. Something has to be done about this, it's gone on for years and we've reached a stage where they're the vast majority of the population at any given moment, and are unstoppable by anything other than another group doing the same thing (and often times, they simply cannot kill each other because the defense drastically outweighs the offense in this setting).

Hybridization definitely has hurt PVP. It has it's pros, but overall I think the impact has been mostly negative. It's allowed people to have the best of everything, which ultimately results in just generally overperforming builds with no sacrifices across the majority of classes. It also effectively halved the number of specs you can play, as before each stamina/magicka variant of every class had its own distinct feeling and set of class skills.

Even worse, hybridization isn't even "complete" years later. They've yet to hybridized potions, class passives, and several other things - resulting in many specs having needlessly inconvenient restrictions applied to them. Additionally, they never did a pass across the lesser utilized/underperforming skills post-hybridization to bring them into line, which has resulted in numerous skills becoming "dead content", as well as forcing people to slot the exact same meta skills on every build in PVP (looking at you, resolving vigor and elemental susceptibility).

It's hard to believe that none of this has been addressed in the past few years despite the extreme amount of feedback given regarding them here on the forums, especially since next patch we'll be getting arguably the most impactful combat changes in the history of the game via spellcrafting (scribing).

I honestly don’t pvp too often but I just want to say the comments in this thread are very informative and sadly describe the reality pretty well.

I hope if the devs are reading this, they have a plan for properly redesigning the combat system in a broad sense in order to address all these issues, especially as they also impact pve as well as pvp.

Well done for noting all this down, it should keep being spoken about if there is ever a chance to salvage the MMO and keep it as fun as it can potentially be with the correct combat systems in place

They don’t , they don’t care about this game's PvP anymore and they won’t balance anything around it. Doesn’t matter how vocal the community is and how much feedback we give every change they make is for the worse, nerfs to proxy and harmony that were completely unwarranted made ball groups and zergs even worse a problem than they already are even tho no one asked for them. None of the devs ever PvP and all the changes they make are based around PvE

Dude I’m not sure these current developers are actually playing Elder Scrolls Online combat!!

Sigh… I hope ES6 is beautiful and fun. Yes I have high expectations, justifiably so

Shadowbinder7 wrote: »

Always said it. My magsorc and transport should have diff strengths, same with mag and stam arc, magdk, stamdk, not one be identical to other/make the other obsolete

Hybridization has indeed made many specs play the same. Doesn't matter whether you run blue magic or green magic, only Sorc has any sort of meaningful difference in its mag vs stam playstyles.

jerj6925 wrote: »

I think the biggest problem is a majority of the remaining players in pvp (console) primary focus is breaking the game\server for kills. It's amazing how many people ignore the fact that programmable devices can be set up burst out multiple abilities in a split second in the game, pair that speed builds and then multiple players all doing the same thing... it breaks the game.

Last night watching a group of sorcs playing (not picking on the class) 4 out of the group were spamming abilities so fast that it looked like multiple abilities were firing out of the all at once insta dropping there targets will others (same team) there rate of fire was normal. This went on for a good 15 minutes with this group.

Don't try and tell me it's not happening because after the last ps5 patch a number of devices were unusable for a few weeks and I was kind of shocked how many good players were actually trash and even acknowledged they forgot how to play with out them until a work around was figured out. Also I have research the sites selling this stuff and there are ALOT of scrips out there.

I think the combat system would have to be overhauled to negate the benefits of automating combat. That I think would only happen in a new ESO II release.

I showed up to vlast and there was a sorc that I saw put on his shield and even before I could get my ruin down he hit me, out of range for the second skill, crystal frag, Dawnbreaker, crystal frag x3. The crystal frag were all the instant ones. He went to a different flag, someone got me up and as soon as i popped my potion same player nowhere near me killed me the same way. He eventually came over to my body 20 seconds later. Sorc and pvp working as intended.