Do Werewolves Even Matter Anymore?

VouxeTheMinotaur · July 15

before I ask my main question, I'd like to say that I have one more character slot to use and I'm thinking about using it to make a werewolf DPS, which seems super fun to run through dungeon and possibly trial content. most of my DPS are 1 bar HA staff users and one dual wield / bow user, and I'm getting quite "meh" about them. I've never made a werewolf character before, nor are any of my characters werewolves or vampires.

my main question though comes from small concerns of mine after reading quite a number of forum posts I see about werewolves, and vampires, being left behind in the dust as they have no reworks, buffs or nerfs, or any attention really for quite a loooong time, even with the scribing chapter release they have yet to see any love, though I'd like to imagine that sometime in the future they will get some scribing skills, maybe? hopefully?

so here's my question, are werewolf builds even worth the time in current ESO? I'm sure I will receive answers like "if it's fun, you should do it" or "with certain sets, yes" etc etc. but I guess the feedback i'm looking for is if it's worthwhile since they seem to be dwindling in numbers and have not gotten any attention for a long time.

my idea is to make a build where I can stay in werewolf form throughout the entire, if not majority, of the time spent in a veteran dungeon and deal quite a decent amount of bleed damage or damage overall really. I've seen other players do it, run through and wipe mobs like a literal beast, and always thought, "that's kinda cool, I wonder how they do that. I should try that one day."

DigiAngel · July 15

No. They are not.

tomofhyrule · July 15

If you're looking for anything beyond "this is a lot of fun to play," well...
...eh...

That said, they are a lot of fun to play.

But yes, werewolves are a half-step above being a meme for a reason. Without a lot of help from your various passives and being mandated to only five skills on one bar, and the fact that you simply can't use an ult, they are nowhere near 'good.' Sure, you can definitely get some things to work - I have one that I've been able to solo tank normal dungeons and trials and even some vet basegames, but the fact remains that if I'm on a vet DLC dungeon, I have to go back to human form. His DPS also feels quite underpowered compared to being in human form, even though I'm not a DPS main at all and am not good at that in the first place.

That said, I do still enjoy it, but I play him 100% as a 'for fun' character. As such, I've also got him in 'for fun' sets that really play with the werewolf theme (Blood Moon and Savage Werewolf), but I know he's... not good and I don't inflict him on anyone except my friends when we're doing a bunch of full-group randoms. I also could build him better if I morphed the transformation, but he's supposed to be greyish-brown and we don't have chooseable werewolf colors yet (hint hint, ZOS!) so I only morph it when I'm trying to get a bit sweatier with him.

I will say that I have zero problems staying permanently in werewolf mode, save those times (like in the IA) that some external force changes my form and makes me have to build it back up. IA also goes have some fun synergy with werewolves if you pull the "Archival Worldliness" verse, since nobody uses World skills normally... but werewolves can't use anything but world skills, which means things absolutely melt if I score that one.

tsaescishoeshiner · July 15

I still think they should let you generate Ult while transformed and give werewolves an Ultimate ability while transformed. The way you'd end your form early would be changed to something else, like holding the Ult button, using Ult while crouched, or right-clicking the effect, or something.

I find werewolves really fun, and not competitive in PvP but viable for a fun time that can throw some players off. They could also use a unique buff like the actual classes have, because Feeding Frenzy doesn't offer enough to groups.

adjutant · July 15

It has it's uses but the whole system is just outdated.
I loved playing vMA as werewolf with Alessian Order and Mighty Chudan. Definitely not top leaderboard build but very durable and fast-paced.

El_Borracho · July 15

Werewolves were once a competitive PVP build, back when you could slap on Alessian Order, Balorgh, and Crimson Twilight and kill others. Now they are the best example of what happens when you repeatedly nerf something because players can't handle dying in Cyrodiil.

Panderbander · July 15

Not worth it in their current state.

Drammanoth · July 15

I fear that sadly not...

Tommy_The_Gun · July 15

Um... apparently not...

Erickson9610 · July 15

VouxeTheMinotaur wrote: »

my main question though comes from small concerns of mine after reading quite a number of forum posts I see about werewolves, and vampires, being left behind in the dust as they have no reworks, buffs or nerfs, or any attention really for quite a loooong time, even with the scribing chapter release they have yet to see any love, though I'd like to imagine that sometime in the future they will get some scribing skills, maybe? hopefully?

Some people at ZOS are aware that some people want more for the werewolves among us:

Not to mention ZOS is aware that players want QoL updates to Werewolf, such as the ability to sneak:

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Not sure if any conversations around this have happened recently, but we'll pass them teams to review in the new year.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Top quality of life concerns
Can’t res allies

Can’t use synergies

Can’t sneak

Devour synergy requires precise targeting and direct line of sight without other characters in the way, making it clunky and unwieldy to use in fights

Then, Update 42 released a bunch of Werewolf combat balance updates. Some of them were beneficial (such as a status effect chance on light/heavy attack) and others were detrimental (such as the nerf to the uptime and total bonus damage of Howl of Agony, coinciding with the introduction of the Terrified effect). Update 43 is introducing a new Skill Style that can be unlocked for Werewolf's Roar ability, but people have likened it to bad breath or bile:

Overall, some requests (like the ability to sneak) have been there for years with seemingly no recent conversations, while other requests (like Werewolf cosmetics or Werewolf tanking) have been acted on but in ways that some players aren't fond of. There are some bugs with Werewolf that haven't yet been fixed (such as Pack Leader's Dire Wolves mysteriously dying upon entering certain rooms in the Imperial City, or the Infinite Archive Werewolf animation bug after selecting a Verse/Vision) while there are others which were eventually fixed (such as the bug when equipping Salvation while already in Werewolf form).

It's true that for a long while, there were no substantial updates to Werewolf. I believe that the updates that have been given to Werewolf in recent months have been hit or miss with the Werewolf community, though.

Scarefish · July 16

I used to play WW but then someone roasted me so hard I dropped it. "There are guilds where you can furry RP."

moderatelyfatman · July 16

Werewolf tanking used to be a lot of fun but they destroyed it even though it wasn't meta and it wasn't overtaking the game in any way.

RaikaNA · July 16

I do think their should be some serious overhaul for the werebeasts.

1) incorporate Werecrocodiles for argonians only... makes zero sense for a warm blooded to become cold.. argonians should be immune to any warm blooded diseases such as werewolf.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:On_Argonians

2) Allow us to upgrade our werewolf transformation (by doing Hircines quests) to become a Werewolf Behemoth using the same exact skills used in the Stone Garden dungeon.
3) Moonlight Tales is such an awesome mod in skyrim SE... I would recommend adding a werewolf skill tree (Very much like the CP tree, but werewolf).
4) In human form we should have an additional passives from having lycanthropy like extra stam resource, and more stamina regen.
5) Let us customize our werewolf fur color/markings. Why restrict us to white and black only?
6) Stop restricting the time of us being in werewolf. I feel that we should be able to revert back in werewolf form at any time.. this includes vampire lords too.

Weakness! Yes I feel with balance in mind that Fighters guild skills should be more potent against werewolves/vampires... especially Dawnbreaker.

Their should be a whole new joinable faction of vampire/werewolf hunters (Vigilant of Stendarr) that grants us new abilities and passives to deal with the menace. Perhaps this would encourage ZOS to work on a Stendarr DLC.. It would be nice to put some light on the 8th divines rather than to focus on daedra princes all the time.

Anifaas · July 16

Scarefish wrote: »

I used to play WW but then someone roasted me so hard I dropped it. "There are guilds where you can furry RP."

But the thing is you're already playing an RPG. The roast is built in the environment. Roasting someone over playing a WW is like roasting someone for getting wet in a rainstorm.

Erickson9610 · July 16

Scarefish wrote: »

I used to play WW but then someone roasted me so hard I dropped it. "There are guilds where you can furry RP."

I strongly disagree that playing a werewolf in ESO is the equivalent of doing "furry RP". Werewolves in ESO are clearly inspired by the horror movie monsters, so I'd argue that it's more akin to roleplaying a character from a horror film.

ESO's Werewolf utilizes a transformation timer with passives such as Devour, Blood Rage, and Call of the Pack to reinforce the roleplaying fantasy that TES werewolves are bloodthirsty monsters who must constantly hunt. It's very similar to how characters in horror films may not always have control over their transformation and thus act in savage, bloodthirsty ways.

RaikaNA · July 17

Erickson9610 wrote: »

Scarefish wrote: »

I used to play WW but then someone roasted me so hard I dropped it. "There are guilds where you can furry RP."

I strongly disagree that playing a werewolf in ESO is the equivalent of doing "furry RP". Werewolves in ESO are clearly inspired by the horror movie monsters, so I'd argue that it's more akin to roleplaying a character from a horror film.

ESO's Werewolf utilizes a transformation timer with passives such as Devour, Blood Rage, and Call of the Pack to reinforce the roleplaying fantasy that TES werewolves are bloodthirsty monsters who must constantly hunt. It's very similar to how characters in horror films may not always have control over their transformation and thus act in savage, bloodthirsty ways.

At its current state... Werewolves are only vital for RP'ing and have little to no actual use for actual PvP and end gaming PvE (Trials). There is no passives in human form that can better your build.

Erickson9610 · July 17

RaikaNA wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

Scarefish wrote: »

I used to play WW but then someone roasted me so hard I dropped it. "There are guilds where you can furry RP."

I strongly disagree that playing a werewolf in ESO is the equivalent of doing "furry RP". Werewolves in ESO are clearly inspired by the horror movie monsters, so I'd argue that it's more akin to roleplaying a character from a horror film.

ESO's Werewolf utilizes a transformation timer with passives such as Devour, Blood Rage, and Call of the Pack to reinforce the roleplaying fantasy that TES werewolves are bloodthirsty monsters who must constantly hunt. It's very similar to how characters in horror films may not always have control over their transformation and thus act in savage, bloodthirsty ways.

At its current state... Werewolves are only vital for RP'ing and have little to no actual use for actual PvP and end gaming PvE (Trials). There is no passives in human form that can better your build.

That's like saying Necromancers are only vital for RPing because they have little to no actual use in PvP and PvE, due to being vastly power crept. While it's certain that Necromancer was in a poor spot before Update 43, it's disingenuous to relegate all of the Necromancer players to "RPers" just because their toolkit was lacking. Likewise, Werewolf players have no choice but to build around their toolkit, or switch to playing a different build.

I'm also strongly against giving Werewolves their Passive Abilities in their human form, because that would disincentivize players from actually using their transformation ability. Players would use the Werewolf skill line for passives like Savage Strength and Pursuit without interacting with their Active Abilities, and it'd be no different from how many players currently utilize the Vampire skill line. Even if Werewolves could use their Active Abilities without transforming, there are many superior options found in other skill lines.

huskandhunger · July 17

Beyond the dated fur and form factor, werewolf doesn't offer anything unique

it's still fun to play so give it a whirl though ^^

autocookies · July 18

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IncultaWolf · July 18

I still find werewolf to be very fun to play, but you ARE nerfing yourself by playing it, my damage and survivability is a lot lower than playing a "normal" build.

ClowdyAllDay · July 18

when you say anymore, you mean to assert that they mattered b4? Well sure they mattered b4 to someone and will likely still matter to someone. I however have never even looked at WW never willingly got bit and truly never saw the point to it, Doesn't mean they don't matter it's just they never appealed to me. Honestly if it weren't for the inviso running i would never had played vamp for leveling up or running around cyrodil and thats the only part of vamp i really cared for and if they took that away i'd never pay them any mind.