What (else) could be done to fix blastbones?

Remathilis · February 20

So sacrificial bones is going over like a lead balloon. Despite this, blastbones was a very clunky skill to use. It's long startup made it hard to comfortably work into a rotation without learning a difficult timing setup. (I've played all seven classes and Necro is the hardest rotation with the least amount of value for the output).

So what could be done to fix bb's awful rotation timing?

I don't have a good answer, but I think of two other skills that has bad timing issues: shalks and crystal frag. Shalks has a wind up time, but once it fires you don't worry about it again until it runs it's duration. It's effectively a 10 second dot that releases all it's damage in two short bursts. Likewise, frags was terrible to hard cast but when it procs its fast and strong.

This lead new to thinking: what if BB borrowed from one or the other. For example, BB could have it's windup animation as normal, but if there is a corpse already near the target when you cast it, it consumes the corpse instantly to explode on the target? Alternatively, a setup where BB summons two or more skeletons over the duration to target the enemy. Now, I wouldn't want BB to just be a copy of frags or shalks, but I would like them to consider how to get BB to feel better while retaining the "flick skeletons at enemies" style of play.

Estin · February 20

The easiest solution would to make blighted work like sub assault and allow it to be recasted early. The short timer is what trips people up, and extending it will make it more accessible to players.

The better solution would make blighted a strong 12 second dot after its initial hit and allow it to continue to spawning corpses for tethers and boneyard. Since it's a dot and the skeleton has already exploded, it can be recasted early which means no more dead inputs, and you don't have to worry about manually creating corpses. And since it's a dot, it will gain a bonus from the class passive that increases dot damage, something that necros lack.

The devs don't play the class though and it's very obvious. They're making changes that make sense to them because they don't understand how it works in it's current form, and they think this would be solution in their eyes instead of consulting the playerbase that thoroughly knows all of the pain points that have necromancers have. They don't care though because it's casual players making the change for other casual players, so they think they know better.

Tinkerhorn · February 20

I think first thing first is understanding there's 2 camps on the matter.

One camp which is wanting an alternative to current blastbones or 'game changing' mechanics to the skill to create a new playstyle with which I believe sacrificial is attempting, albeit failing to achieve what it wants in my opinion and furthering it's own confusion.

The second which I consider myself to be in is people that like the current skill but view stalking as the superior and most (arguably at current only) viable skills to use. I PvP on necro and enjoy it greatly but losing the flame damage, multiplier, and mag cost is a huge nerf which will translate to even worse class/build performance if forced to switch to using blighted. Ultimately people want to preserve the playstyle they have and which ZoS claimed to intend to preserve.

Unfortunately ZoS has created itself two problems now where it doesn't achieve either of its goals and hence uproar and dissatisfaction from seemingly almost everyone.
The first thing I would like is just purely an acknowledgement of somes sort whether directly (not gonna happen) or indicated in patchnotes that both of these -seperate- disgruntlements exist and I think (biased) they should focus on preserving the playstyle for people currently using the class. That said I don't think it's wrong to expect both to be addressed as they've welcomed these problems.

Uvi_AUT · February 20

Someone suggested a 9 second cast that generates a corpse every 3 seconds automatically, either on the target you had in your reticle when you casted BB or on yourself when there was none or the target is dead.
I liked that suggestion.

CameraBeardThePirate · February 20

Just make it a sticky DoT. Easy fix without changing the corpse gameplay at all.

You cast Blastbones, it leaps to a target, and the target + anyone around them get a DoT that lasts 20 seconds. Fewer globals, no headache.

brandsnipe · February 20

Buff blighted by 25-30% as i think thats the average multiplier stalking got when i used it. Personally BB never made rotation clunky, i got it down fairly well for a timed burst. I would BB, comet, and then flame clench, and it worked often in PvP considering how bad necro is. The targeting on BB is horrendous though. What made necro clunky for me was the inexcusable lack of buffs and debuffs in the class kit, so i was forced to micro-manage almost all of my skills in order to play on the same level of every other class.

Galeriano · February 20

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Just make it a sticky DoT. Easy fix without changing the corpse gameplay at all.

You cast Blastbones, it leaps to a target, and the target + anyone around them get a DoT that lasts 20 seconds. Fewer globals, no headache.

Problem is that this DoT would have to be extremly strong to produce more DPS than just recasting blastbones every 3 seconds.

TmanFoody · February 20

sh4d0wh4z3 wrote: »

The easiest solution would to make blighted work like sub assault and allow it to be recasted early. The short timer is what trips people up, and extending it will make it more accessible to players.

The better solution would make blighted a strong 12 second dot after its initial hit and allow it to continue to spawning corpses for tethers and boneyard. Since it's a dot and the skeleton has already exploded, it can be recasted early which means no more dead inputs, and you don't have to worry about manually creating corpses. And since it's a dot, it will gain a bonus from the class passive that increases dot damage, something that necros lack.

This would be a great change. The only thing I would add is bringing up the timer on boneyard. That way you can reduce the need for corpses in pve fights. That plus your idea would probably accomplish exactly what they’re looking for.

Jammy420 · February 20

It was not clunky, it was fun, the only thing that needed to be done was to have it be CONSISTENT, instead of fixing the broken issue, they just made an even BIGGER issue, and made the class nearly unplayable.

Galeriano · February 20

sh4d0wh4z3 wrote: »

The easiest solution would to make blighted work like sub assault and allow it to be recasted early. The short timer is what trips people up, and extending it will make it more accessible to players.

The better solution would make blighted a strong 12 second dot after its initial hit and allow it to continue to spawning corpses for tethers and boneyard. Since it's a dot and the skeleton has already exploded, it can be recasted early which means no more dead inputs, and you don't have to worry about manually creating corpses. And since it's a dot, it will gain a bonus from the class passive that increases dot damage, something that necros lack.

The devs don't play the class though and it's very obvious. They're making changes that make sense to them because they don't understand how it works in it's current form, and they think this would be solution in their eyes instead of consulting the playerbase that thoroughly knows all of the pain points that have necromancers have. They don't care though because it's casual players making the change for other casual players, so they think they know better.

But how would blastbones find a target to hit if it would work like a sub assault?

Issue with DoT is that it would have to be extremly strong DOT in order to be worth more DPS than just recasting blastbones and that would be causing problem in PvP.

Aldoss · February 20

Galeriano wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Just make it a sticky DoT. Easy fix without changing the corpse gameplay at all.

You cast Blastbones, it leaps to a target, and the target + anyone around them get a DoT that lasts 20 seconds. Fewer globals, no headache.

Problem is that this DoT would have to be extremly strong to produce more DPS than just recasting blastbones every 3 seconds.

That's the point. The dot should not replace casting BB every 3 seconds. This game shouldn't be about hand holding everyone to 130k dps. If you want to do max dps, do the rotation.

The dot is a concession that makes the rotation "more forgiving" for people who are struggling to cast the same skill every 3 seconds. It's exactly what ZOS set out to do, but ended up replacing something (arguably) not clunky, for something that seasoned PvErs are saying is the most clunky and half-baked rotation they've ever experienced.

CameraBeardThePirate · February 20

Aldoss wrote: »

Galeriano wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Just make it a sticky DoT. Easy fix without changing the corpse gameplay at all.

You cast Blastbones, it leaps to a target, and the target + anyone around them get a DoT that lasts 20 seconds. Fewer globals, no headache.

Problem is that this DoT would have to be extremly strong to produce more DPS than just recasting blastbones every 3 seconds.

That's the point. The dot should not replace casting BB every 3 seconds. This game shouldn't be about hand holding everyone to 130k dps. If you want to do max dps, do the rotation.

The dot is a concession that makes the rotation "more forgiving" for people who are struggling to cast the same skill every 3 seconds. It's exactly what ZOS set out to do, but ended up replacing something (arguably) not clunky, for something that seasoned PvErs are saying is the most clunky and half-baked rotation they've ever experienced.

Ding ding ding.

Of course it won't be more damage than casting blastbones every 3 seconds.

It would make the rotation easier, add a unique buff still (no reason it couldn't still have the Sacrifice buff), and continue to allow an on demand targeted corpse. All of the issues ZOS set out to address would be solved.

The latest version of Sacrifice is mind-bogglingly stupid - like something that would be introduced in the Alpha of a game and never even make it to Beta levels of stupid. It's a clunky, delayed buff that's average at best, and does nothing to help the "difficult" rotation Necro had.

Oh - and it doesn't even function as advertised. It still isn't buffing all Necro abilities despite claiming to do so.