ok so i get what you are saying you don't like the buff management but what you described still requires buff management to perform at a high level you are just recasting bones every 3 seconds vs every 20 im not a necro player but im still waiting on someone to actually do a in-depth parse testing on this new morph before i fully condemn it yet but i do wish they made the blighted morph cost scale of max stat at least

RAYVORN wrote: »

I HATE everything about this change. I planned to come back for the expansion, a few weeks prior, but the fact that blastbones is being changed to what it is just gutted me.

I am so tired of the devs turning each class into a manage buff uptime juggle class. I HATE having to watch my timers and hit things at the perfect time to maintain a buff. I loved blastbones because I could fire and forget while worrying about position, being in position of corpses, graveyard placement, etc. But now I have to watch another timer. I also HATE having to sync things together, now am I suppose to hold all my abilities to just right after I hit blastbones.

These devs came into the year stating they weren't going to do much to the classes and leave them a lone and 1 month into 2024 you make pages of changes. This is why no one takes any of your post serious because you never actually follow through.

I made a forums account just so I could say I hate everything about this change. Please ZoS, don't do this to blastbones, just give us major sorcery/brutality instead on the skeletal mage base skill

I just want my BB to hit. That's all I ask.

IncultaWolf wrote: »

DanteTheDeviant wrote: »

RAYVORN wrote: »

I HATE everything about this change. I planned to come back for the expansion, a few weeks prior, but the fact that blastbones is being changed to what it is just gutted me.

I am so tired of the devs turning each class into a manage buff uptime juggle class. I HATE having to watch my timers and hit things at the perfect time to maintain a buff. I loved blastbones because I could fire and forget while worrying about position, being in position of corpses, graveyard placement, etc. But now I have to watch another timer. I also HATE having to sync things together, now am I suppose to hold all my abilities to just right after I hit blastbones.

These devs came into the year stating they weren't going to do much to the classes and leave them a lone and 1 month into 2024 you make pages of changes. This is why no one takes any of your post serious because you never actually follow through.

I made a forums account just so I could say I hate everything about this change. Please ZoS, don't do this to blastbones, just give us major sorcery/brutality instead on the skeletal mage base skill

Pretty much all of us necromancer mains HATE the blastbones change, and just want the skeletal minion to get buffed/have this sacrifice mechanic applied to it. Sadly, I don't think anything will change and they will go through with it regardless. My only regret with this game is choosing this PAID class that lacks so much other classes already get. I am impressed with how many necro players have joined the forums and started commenting on this pts cycle, I guess there's only so much you can take before you have to really complain about how terrible it is.

A few of us have been making suggestions for buffs for while now. ZOS literally did the opposite of any idea we suggested.

Lalothen wrote: »

They're not going to reverse the Stalking change, so just join the chorus of people requesting that Blighted Blastbones be changed to have a dynamic resource cost and also include the Stalking Blastbones "length of time running to target" damage buff. Job done; people get something new to work into different Necro builds, and current Necro mains get a good Blastbones that works for both mag & stam builds.

Most likely.... it would be nice if they did...good...though. but yeah that's the most likely compromise we can hope for

Lalothen wrote: »

They're not going to reverse the Stalking change, so just join the chorus of people requesting that Blighted Blastbones be changed to have a dynamic resource cost and also include the Stalking Blastbones "length of time running to target" damage buff. Job done; people get something new to work into different Necro builds, and current Necro mains get a good Blastbones that works for both mag & stam builds.

The problem is two-fold though.

Like yes, they need to add the Stalking Modifier to whatever morph of blastbones is leftover.

But the implementation of the Sacrifice buff shows a complete disregard for how corpse gameplay works. The fact that you can't create corpses at range with the new skill is a massive oversight and needs to be fixed - whatever they turn Blastbones into, it still needs to have a targeted aspect to it or ranged Necros get tossed in the trash because they can no longer position corpses where they need to.

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

But the implementation of the Sacrifice buff shows a complete disregard for how corpse gameplay works. The fact that you can't create corpses at range with the new skill is a massive oversight and needs to be fixed - whatever they turn Blastbones into, it still needs to have a targeted aspect to it or ranged Necros get tossed in the trash because they can no longer position corpses where they need to.

Yeah I get that, and an "easy solve" would be to have the Sacrifice skeleton still leap to the target and do damage, with the buff being applied to the Necro on-cast. I'd likely use Sorc's Daedric Tomb damage, or Scalding's up-front damage as a benchmark for it, so it would do less than Blighted but a bit more than a typical ranged spammable.

Personally I'd rather see the necro corpse mechanic reworked to be something more reliable, like a stacking counter on enemies or something like that - but that's major rework territory so I'm not even going to bother thinking about and detailing specifics.

Darkstorne wrote: »

RAYVORN wrote: »

I am so tired of the devs turning each class into a manage buff uptime juggle class.

I think this is a really important point about ESO as a whole, because with the Arcanist class release it felt like even ZOS agreed with this statement. Major Brutality/Sorcery skill for that class was now applied passively so long as the skill was slotted, and on either bar. Huge improvement, and they started rolling out similar QoL skill tweaks to other class skills. I really thought that was the the new direction we were headed, for the betterment of the game.

But now Necro's blastbones update is... a managed uptime buff, that can't be used as a pre-buff (Why? Why keep placing barriers to QoL like this?), that also has a delay after casting before the buff is applied.

And that's before getting into the nonsensical aesthetic design of the skill. Necros now conjure a skeleton mid-battle to give them... a hug? Guys, really.



I'm all for the idea of splitting necros into minion masters and non-minion self-buff builds. But make it a buff that passively activates while slotted, where the Necro is drawing upon the spirits of fallen warriors to strengthen their own battle skills instead of summoning minions to attack their foes for them (the alternate blastbones morph), and activating the skill consumes a corpse to boost the effects further or something.

Splitting? Dude, where is the minion master necro to start with? They have done everything they could to remove that fantasy from the class. It's like they don't understand what people want to be necros in games for.

Darkstorne wrote: »

RAYVORN wrote: »

I am so tired of the devs turning each class into a manage buff uptime juggle class.

I think this is a really important point about ESO as a whole, because with the Arcanist class release it felt like even ZOS agreed with this statement. Major Brutality/Sorcery skill for that class was now applied passively so long as the skill was slotted, and on either bar. Huge improvement, and they started rolling out similar QoL skill tweaks to other class skills. I really thought that was the the new direction we were headed, for the betterment of the game.

But now Necro's blastbones update is... a managed uptime buff, that can't be used as a pre-buff (Why? Why keep placing barriers to QoL like this?), that also has a delay after casting before the buff is applied.

And that's before getting into the nonsensical aesthetic design of the skill. Necros now conjure a skeleton mid-battle to give them... a hug? Guys, really.



I'm all for the idea of splitting necros into minion masters and non-minion self-buff builds. But make it a buff that passively activates while slotted, where the Necro is drawing upon the spirits of fallen warriors to strengthen their own battle skills instead of summoning minions to attack their foes for them (the alternate blastbones morph), and activating the skill consumes a corpse to boost the effects further or something.

They could make it passive yes, and activate to spawn corpses AT TARGET LOCATION.

Oh and replace Skeletal Arcanist instead of BB. Heck, this could be a graveyard morph and it would make sense.

There are so many better options, so how do paid devs choose the worst possible thing???

Tessitura wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Lalothen wrote: »

They're not going to reverse the Stalking change, so just join the chorus of people requesting that Blighted Blastbones be changed to have a dynamic resource cost and also include the Stalking Blastbones "length of time running to target" damage buff. Job done; people get something new to work into different Necro builds, and current Necro mains get a good Blastbones that works for both mag & stam builds.

The problem is two-fold though.

Like yes, they need to add the Stalking Modifier to whatever morph of blastbones is leftover.

But the implementation of the Sacrifice buff shows a complete disregard for how corpse gameplay works. The fact that you can't create corpses at range with the new skill is a massive oversight and needs to be fixed - whatever they turn Blastbones into, it still needs to have a targeted aspect to it or ranged Necros get tossed in the trash because they can no longer position corpses where they need to.

I am going to be real with you, I dont think they see necromancer as a caster. They fully view it has a melee and mostly a tank. The play your way moniker has been clown make up for them for years now.

Melee caster is an interesting niche if they were to pursue that for its DPS identity at least. It would help set the class apart from other renditions of necromancers in other MMOs where you are frontline with your minions, like a boss among your own set of adds, rather than a guy having them do all the work. This also fits well enough with necromancers in the Elder Scrolls main games, as a horde of minions isn't normal there for player characters. I really like the idea of Necromancers being tanky brawlers amongst a selection of choice undead given that a horde of minions isn't really doable within the scope of the game as this would set them apart from the other classes even with a focus on DOTs. DKs are melee casters with a DOT focus too, but even then in a different way if ONLY Necromancer actually used summons consistently. However, they aren't committing to that vision either as the Elementalist part of Necro's identity seems to be the strongest as they get pushed closer to the DK playstyle, only with ground-placed short DOTs rather than long, sticky DOTs that makes them much harder to maintain in actual content.

Tessitura wrote: »

Grim_Overlord wrote: »

Tessitura wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Lalothen wrote: »

They're not going to reverse the Stalking change, so just join the chorus of people requesting that Blighted Blastbones be changed to have a dynamic resource cost and also include the Stalking Blastbones "length of time running to target" damage buff. Job done; people get something new to work into different Necro builds, and current Necro mains get a good Blastbones that works for both mag & stam builds.

The problem is two-fold though.

Like yes, they need to add the Stalking Modifier to whatever morph of blastbones is leftover.

But the implementation of the Sacrifice buff shows a complete disregard for how corpse gameplay works. The fact that you can't create corpses at range with the new skill is a massive oversight and needs to be fixed - whatever they turn Blastbones into, it still needs to have a targeted aspect to it or ranged Necros get tossed in the trash because they can no longer position corpses where they need to.

I am going to be real with you, I dont think they see necromancer as a caster. They fully view it has a melee and mostly a tank. The play your way moniker has been clown make up for them for years now.

Melee caster is an interesting niche if they were to pursue that for its DPS identity at least. It would help set the class apart from other renditions of necromancers in other MMOs where you are frontline with your minions, like a boss among your own set of adds, rather than a guy having them do all the work. This also fits well enough with necromancers in the Elder Scrolls main games, as a horde of minions isn't normal there for player characters. I really like the idea of Necromancers being tanky brawlers amongst a selection of choice undead given that a horde of minions isn't really doable within the scope of the game as this would set them apart from the other classes even with a focus on DOTs. DKs are melee casters with a DOT focus too, but even then in a different way if ONLY Necromancer actually used summons consistently. However, they aren't committing to that vision either as the Elementalist part of Necro's identity seems to be the strongest as they get pushed closer to the DK playstyle, only with ground-placed short DOTs rather than long, sticky DOTs that makes them much harder to maintain in actual content.

I hate to break this to you dude but there are no other renditions in other mmos. There isn't many mmo's left with necros in general, but the ones that are still there have better necros and also have melee options for them that beats the breaks of this game's melee design. Most people see necromancer and want the class fantasy that name leans into. By the way, if you are in melee you are not really a caster then. You are a melee. [Snip]. The brawler shouldn't over take the class fantasy. It doesn't fit TES games by the way, it is far from it it fact. Necromancers in all the games are surrounded by undead and are always casting spells, not brawling in melee. But you know what? Thats okay, I can get behind melee necro because the class should be a tool kit to flavor your fantasy and playstyle. Not hardline you into melee or ranged. But Necro doesn't get that choice.

Also, a horde of minions is doable and within the scope of the game, they have that right now with set procs and class pets. Three or four untargetable minions on the field would be nothing. Its a better use of corpse spenders and more on theme whether you are melee or ranged.

Double also, being a caster would set them apart more since most classes all favor being brawlers. You're argument for their weird design ideas remaining the way they are does not hold up. Majority of players are forced into melee on most classes and I am not even saying they should kill melee necro, just stop forcing it down our throats and let the people who want the necromancer fantasy, have that. I mean it's in the stupid name for *** sake.

(Little Edit here, I probably come off as mad at you, but I ain't. I am pissed at ZoS for being the way they are. I am all for Melee Necro but I don't agree that it's a unique niche. I just want necromancer to be a necromancer [Snip]. I am kind of at the end of my rope with them on so many things, this necro stuff is just the last straw.) )

Fair enough, though when I was thinking about Necromancers in other games I was referring to WoW, Guild Wars 2, and while not the same genre of game, Diablo as I have heard a lot of comparison between it and all of the necromancy the ESO class doesn't do lately. Regarding minions, Guild Wars 2 did have some minion things on their version of Necro, and I am not familiar enough with WoW but I believe Death Knight has a minion at most as Warlock is the super-summons class there.

The Elder Scrolls though has always had melee casters, meaning more battle-mage-esque playstyles available, brawling in with your summons. While the NPC necromancer's don't always do this, the player has always had the option. Skulls and Blastbones are ranged, which keeps that caster-y feel, but they also function well through their tankiness in melee. You can be in melee and be a caster, and having the options to mix doesn't hurt. The part that feels unique to me is that in a lot of media, necromancers merely hide behind their hordes, where here that isn't the case. While I'm sure mechanically that could work, we can't have an army go into trials with us there isn't enough space and the class wouldn't get played because if a Maw of the Infernal is too much for the tank to see through, 30 skeletons will be too. I am all for MORE undead minions and having skills employ them, I am merely recognizing that the army or smaller unit of undead isn't going to happen. Three or four minions as you state sounds great, I am more referring to larger hordes. If we have three or four undead, they need to feel special rather than a horde of generic skeletons as I've seen called for since the class came out.

I can see you are frustrated with the game's direction, and I agree. I am not defending the current state of the class, merely highlighting different paths it could take. As I said in the previous post, I like the necromancer having the draw towards "death knighting" as you mentioned, being in the fray with the minions rather than at the back like Sorcerer's skill lead it to be. I really want them to play up the themes of wielding undead minions and decay and death magic, I just happen to like my Necromancer being able to swap from commanding from the back lines if you will to being in the fray with those summons.

[Edited quote]