Game Breaking Negate Bug

ForumSavant · November 2023

I understand there are a few bugs with the current patch, but the Negate bug ruins PvP entirely for anyone who encounters it. Currently, if you get negated, and the caster of the negate dies while you are inside of their negate, you will remain negated until you have died. This is very easy to replicate. I did some more digging to try and help find possible fixes for the bug. There was a small details in the latest patch notes that said, "fixed an issue where some player sourced effects that visually disappeared could remain activate after their caster died." Negate is not listed but I believe this change is what caused it. Negate will be removed upon caster death, but the effect will stay.

If you step in a negate and walk out of it before killing the caster, it will function normally.
If you kill the caster while inside the negate, you will be negated permanently.
Being negated again, while under the effect of the "perma negate" will not change the effect, you will still be negated.
Dying fixes the problem.

I am not currently aware of whether or not this is this case with other AOE abilities that are removed upon death.

IZZEFlameLash · November 2023

Lol, I think this had been a thing for a while. Because I've had this happen few times before this patch. Surprised this didn't get a fix.

ForumSavant · November 2023

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

Lol, I think this had been a thing for a while. Because I've had this happen few times before this patch. Surprised this didn't get a fix.

No it's new to this patch for sure.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin can we get an update on whether or not you guys are aware of this?

mielyn · November 2023

No, this is brand new to this patch. I PvP on a regular basis, multiple times per week for hours at a time. And this is the first time I've seen this particular bug. (There are other pre-existing bugs which have similar effects, which have been around forever... but they are way less frequent.)

This new bug is frequent.

I won't say that my testing is full, but I can tell you that at least the morph of negate called Supression Field has become "sticky" and persists even when you leave the Negate. And it remains until you crash, log off/back on, enter a delve, or leave the instance somehow. Once you are affected by this debuff, you can no longer cast any mag based skills, nor ultimates, nor synergies.

This bug is game breaking, for sure. Cyrodiil was practically dead the past two nights, and I believe that's related to this bug directly.

p.s. one person reported saying that they notice this happens when the person who cast the negate dies while the negate is still up. But my experience suggests that this bug can happen even if the person does not die.

ForumSavant · November 2023

I did enough testing, if it happens when the person casting negate DOES NOT DIE, it's very infrequent. I have not had this happen in my testing at all. If the person casting negate does die though, it can be replicated 100% of the time without fail. Cyrodiil zone chat is pretty well aware of the issue, I'm surprised this isn't getting more traction.

ZOS_GinaBruno · November 2023

Thanks for the info on this, everyone. Just confirming we've seen the reports and are working on getting this fixed.

ForumSavant · November 2023

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the info on this, everyone. Just confirming we've seen the reports and are working on getting this fixed.

Thanks for the update, if there's anything we an do to help understand and find a fix for the issue let me know.

Theignson · November 2023

Oh, so this explains why I couldn't cast any spells in Zerodil suddenly the other day.

NPCs frequently cast negate, has anyone seen whether this bug also happens when those courtyard NPCs cast it and are then killed?

I got it inside an enemy keep on the porch.

I had to log out to fix it, reloadui did not work.

IZZEFlameLash · November 2023

Nah, it really ain't. There were abusers of this in the past. I don't really see them in Cyro anymore though. Anyways, they'd drop a perma Negate before bomb. You can survive the bomb but you are left with dysfunctional skill bar until you re-instance or die. Can't remember if the sorc had to die or not though back then. Never really looked. Because I don't exploit, no interest in it and I wanted to survive that bomb dump.

What is new is Cyro guard Negate doing this upon their death. And the fact that this came to surface on the forum post.

biminirwb17_ESO · November 2023

The cyrodiil community adapts quickly - the 19k health sorcs dropping negates on ball groups were out in force today.

ForumSavant · November 2023

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

Nah, it really ain't. There were abusers of this in the past. I don't really see them in Cyro anymore though. Anyways, they'd drop a perma Negate before bomb. You can survive the bomb but you are left with dysfunctional skill bar until you re-instance or die. Can't remember if the sorc had to die or not though back then. Never really looked. Because I don't exploit, no interest in it and I wanted to survive that bomb dump.

What is new is Cyro guard Negate doing this upon their death. And the fact that this came to surface on the forum post.

You are just wrong, this is brand new and it's rampant in cyro and is a huge issue.

Auldwulfe · November 2023

After one person told me about this, I switched out negate on my sorc to my lightning storm with my staff ....and yes, it does exist ..... hoping it gets fixed soon.

At this point, I would consider it an exploit if it is still being used .....

Auldwulfe

Kartalin · November 2023

biminirwb17_ESO wrote: »

The cyrodiil community adapts quickly - the 19k health sorcs dropping negates on ball groups were out in force today.

Also naked, I presume?

Got hit by this bug several times over the early part of the week, to the point that one of my guilds canceled raids until it's fixed.

@mielyn still with LOM? Always enjoy our battles, if so good to see y'all are still at it.

mielyn · November 2023

While I do appreciate a response from the devs... I have to say I'm pretty unimpressed with how long it seems to usually take to fix bugs that only seem to affect PvP. This bug literally has entire guilds refusing to play right now. Cyrodiil is a *** show with 19k health sorcs spamming negates to get this bug to happen. I myself have been paying for this game for years now, and just decided to cancel my sub. No, I'm not saying I'm quitting. But I'm hoping to at least send a small message to express my displeasure. They did a hot fix today to fix some other PvE related bugs, and this Negate bug still exists.

I understand if the bug is small and only impacts gameplay to a slight degree. But this is truly game breaking, just as the title of this thread suggests. You CANNOT participate in PvP with this bug going around. At least not in Cyrodiil.

I would like to see much faster response time from ZOS on issues that are sweeping like this. 24 to 48 hours maximum, once the first report comes in, should be it. For such a huge game that costs a lot of money, and which many millions of people have dedicated countless hours of their life to.

Anyway. I don't really want to argue over this. I just want my voice to be heard that the support speed is below what I consider an acceptable level.

mielyn · November 2023

@Kartalin yep, still with LOM. Just saw your message there. What guild you with?

smee_z · November 2023

ForumSavant wrote: »

If you step in a negate and walk out of it before killing the caster, it will function normally.
If you kill the caster while inside the negate, you will be negated permanently.

Dear ZOS,

Simple fix.
Make negate as it was intended just like how it works when an NPC casts it,
player skills whether mag-based nor stam-based disabled while inside the negate.

StihlReign · November 2023

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the info on this, everyone. Just confirming we've seen the reports and are working on getting this fixed.

Do we have an ETA?

This is not good. The game feels... broken, not bugged - broken.

Kartalin · November 2023

mielyn wrote: »

@Kartalin yep, still with LOM. Just saw your message there. What guild you with?

Lemon party, Tertiary meat, and Meanest girls. MG is still ascending so you guys probably didn't take much notice of that group as you fought us lol

ForumSavant · November 2023

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

ForumSavant wrote: »

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

Nah, it really ain't. There were abusers of this in the past. I don't really see them in Cyro anymore though. Anyways, they'd drop a perma Negate before bomb. You can survive the bomb but you are left with dysfunctional skill bar until you re-instance or die. Can't remember if the sorc had to die or not though back then. Never really looked. Because I don't exploit, no interest in it and I wanted to survive that bomb dump.

What is new is Cyro guard Negate doing this upon their death. And the fact that this came to surface on the forum post.

You are just wrong, this is brand new and it's rampant in cyro and is a huge issue.

[snip]

Are you just not playing the game or something? If you aren't aware of what's going on I don't know why you would comment on it. You said "I don't really see them in Cyro anymore though" This is a bug that is repeatable 100% of the time and is being spammed in cyrodiil, but tell us more about how it isn't happening when there was a dev response and multiple comments about it.

[edited to remove quote]

KKolly · November 2023

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

ForumSavant wrote: »

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

Nah, it really ain't. There were abusers of this in the past. I don't really see them in Cyro anymore though. Anyways, they'd drop a perma Negate before bomb. You can survive the bomb but you are left with dysfunctional skill bar until you re-instance or die. Can't remember if the sorc had to die or not though back then. Never really looked. Because I don't exploit, no interest in it and I wanted to survive that bomb dump.

What is new is Cyro guard Negate doing this upon their death. And the fact that this came to surface on the forum post.

You are just wrong, this is brand new and it's rampant in cyro and is a huge issue.

[snip]

The effect of he bug itself (not being able to do magicka based actions) is not new, yes, but it has never manifested this way before. You absolutely could not suicide negate the way you can now, that is simply false. That is a result of a new exploit.

[edited to remove quote]

mielyn · November 2023

Kartalin wrote: »

mielyn wrote: »

@Kartalin yep, still with LOM. Just saw your message there. What guild you with?

Lemon party, Tertiary meat, and Meanest girls. MG is still ascending so you guys probably didn't take much notice of that group as you fought us lol

Oh yeah, sweet. You guys are fun to GvG. You play well.

Rlacoste · November 2023

shame to the players who knowingly abuse exploits like this. ESO PVP community is full of toxic players abusing exploits

Crown · November 2023

biminirwb17_ESO wrote: »

The cyrodiil community adapts quickly - the 19k health sorcs dropping negates on ball groups were out in force today.

They've been out in force all week, and all weekend.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the info on this, everyone. Just confirming we've seen the reports and are working on getting this fixed.

@ZOS_GinaBruno Please advise if this is formally considered an exploit (against terms and code), and if so we would love to know if there will be any action taken against the people doing this on purpose. At present word in most of the discords are "ZOS don't care, nothing will happen, just go and Eff others over while you can and laugh as they suffer or get mad".

I logged in to play in PvP today, had it happen to me three times in 10 minutes going to the bridge, swore a bit and logged off. I'm going to play Bladur's Gate this evening, where if I get frustrated it's my own fault..

KKolly · November 2023

Any update on this?

Photosniper89 · November 2023

Can a brotha get a GD update?

TechMaybeHic · November 2023

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the info on this, everyone. Just confirming we've seen the reports and are working on getting this fixed.

Any ETA? Seems to happen regularly.

EDIT: I did not feel like this was anyone trying to exploit it. Seemed to happen just in fights where negate is pretty common. Could have even been guards in a couple spots

ForumSavant · November 2023

Probably won't get an update until they find a solution because a, "hey we're still working on it" won't really appease anyone. Though it would be nice to know they aren't just ignoring it, I doubt they can ignore something this game breaking.

IZZEFlameLash · November 2023

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the info on this, everyone. Just confirming we've seen the reports and are working on getting this fixed.

Any ETA? Seems to happen regularly.

EDIT: I did not feel like this was anyone trying to exploit it. Seemed to happen just in fights where negate is pretty common. Could have even been guards in a couple spots

There are always bad actors. I've encountered them. With this iteration, it is as easy as running into the group and drop negate before dying. Some in PCNA have done about 3 perma negates simultaneously before their group's bombs or group oil dump after Negate + Dark Convergence where the caster of Negate jumps off as it goes off to kill their own char to proc this glitch to guarantee no one survives.

Idinuse · November 2023

Rlacoste wrote: »

shame to the players who knowingly abuse exploits like this. ESO PVP community is full of toxic players abusing exploits

It should be very easy to see which players intentionally and enthusiastically exploit this bug, not the least through the consumption of i.e. pots paired with unsustainable low health while using negate, and appropriate actions taken in accordance to ToS.

TechMaybeHic · November 2023

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the info on this, everyone. Just confirming we've seen the reports and are working on getting this fixed.

Any ETA? Seems to happen regularly.

EDIT: I did not feel like this was anyone trying to exploit it. Seemed to happen just in fights where negate is pretty common. Could have even been guards in a couple spots

There are always bad actors. I've encountered them. With this iteration, it is as easy as running into the group and drop negate before dying. Some in PCNA have done about 3 perma negates simultaneously before their group's bombs or group oil dump after Negate + Dark Convergence where the caster of Negate jumps off as it goes off to kill their own char to proc this glitch to guarantee no one survives.

Oh! That makes sense. We had some group run into us and turn and run back away and a second later, we notice one of them rez in place like you would from fall damage and run after their friends as a blue glowy. Several of us then had the bug.

I have video of this as I hit the save right after trying to figure out what just happened. Maybe I should send it to @ZOS_GinaBruno or others to report as an exploit?

IZZEFlameLash · November 2023

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the info on this, everyone. Just confirming we've seen the reports and are working on getting this fixed.

Any ETA? Seems to happen regularly.

EDIT: I did not feel like this was anyone trying to exploit it. Seemed to happen just in fights where negate is pretty common. Could have even been guards in a couple spots

There are always bad actors. I've encountered them. With this iteration, it is as easy as running into the group and drop negate before dying. Some in PCNA have done about 3 perma negates simultaneously before their group's bombs or group oil dump after Negate + Dark Convergence where the caster of Negate jumps off as it goes off to kill their own char to proc this glitch to guarantee no one survives.

Oh! That makes sense. We had some group run into us and turn and run back away and a second later, we notice one of them rez in place like you would from fall damage and run after their friends as a blue glowy. Several of us then had the bug.

I have video of this as I hit the save right after trying to figure out what just happened. Maybe I should send it to @ZOS_GinaBruno or others to report as an exploit?

It is always best to send it directly to ZOS and explain what is going on afaik.