Fair Compensation For Loss Of Playtime Due to Game Breaking Bug

WrathOfInnos · December 2022

They gave us Seals of Endeavor once, which is a much better answer than a useless guar pet. It allows players to choose their own reward, and is the closest thing to currency without actually costing ZOS anything.

p00tx · December 2022

mocap wrote: »

compensation for bugs? Man, are you serious?

Didn't expect such an extreme reaction from Western players. I've always thought of you as reserved, peaceful and... you know... "Shao Lin monk style" ) Always chill players. Am I wrong?

Have you been keeping up with US news? I appreciate the vote of confidence, but we're absolutely bonkers out here.

gariondavey · December 2022

Dekrypted wrote: »

You'll have your guar and you'll like it

#fixbacklash #backlashdoesntdoanythinginpvp #whydoesstufflikethishappeneveryotherpatch

Preach brother

ghost_bg_ESO · December 2022

what block bug?

i haven't relied on block since it was moved server side... well, actually i've used it on solo vet dungeons here and there, but U35 happened and now i don't use dungeons

.

MidniteOwl1913 · December 2022

DemonicGoat wrote: »

quote="Dren_Utogi;c-7766047"]think this game is done, Everything microsoft touches for P.C. gaming turns to ash. Archeage 2 is on the horizon though with action combat ! woot !

[quote=It was on this trajectory before MS but Ive seen acquisitions happen before where the employees being bought out knew they could basically milk the situation for all its worth until the new owners show up and clean house.

Also,QA workers unionizing just completed,we also know Quality Assurance has been slipping lately which tend to make one think they were busy unionizing or just slacking.[/quote]

QA engineers aren't treated by most software companies as the valuable resource that are. I think a well-compensated QA engineer is a happy productive QA engineer. I wish them well in their efforts.

ghastley · December 2022

If a bug makes something harder to do, so it takes longer to complete, isn’t that increasing your playing time?

Foxtrot39 · December 2022

ghastley wrote: »

If a bug makes something harder to do, so it takes longer to complete, isn’t that increasing your playing time?

Unless you try to tank a boss which one shot attack being regular attack, after tanking vAS most of our group where wondering how to theorycraft a tank which purpose is to outrun all the boss attacks

Carcamongus · December 2022

The only fair enough compensation is for Rich Lambert's promise to be fulfilled: "We'll have to do better."

robwolf666 · December 2022

DemonicGoat wrote: »

It will likely be 2 full months that block has been broken by the time they figure it out and repatch,.. The only compensation we have got was the pet for a poor u36 launch..

If ZOS isnt going to reimburse people for ESO+ over this amount of time what would be fair compensation?

It isn't even remotely "game breaking", at most it's mildly annoying when you're fighting a harder enemy. It's hardly affected my ability to play... I just approach a fight a bit more carefully, and dodge/roll instead of block. Sure, I've gotten twatted a few times, but it happens sometimes even with block working properly. Just alter tactics a bit until it's fixed properly.

Chiaroscuro · December 2022

Barbara73 wrote: »

This is why I only sub one month at a time, which I let expire when things like this happen. There is never compensation for lost time playing unless you count the occasional free pet that no one would want to purchase anyway. May as well give as expired twinkies or last year's Halloween candy. Many I know are taking a break (aka) looking for another game to play like most of the twitch content creators are.

Aye. I came back grudgingly after the mess of 35, because I love Halloween, and I'm a bit staggered it's still like this. Morale doesn't seem much improved, bugs are everywhere, but at least I guess I figured out how to play some other ways? Even if I don't enjoy them. McFlurry and Jabs are still awful. I'm just here for my friends now, if I'm honest.

I subbed for a month again against my better judgement, just for the event and it leaves a bitter taste now, given this outcome. I'll be blighted if I need the extra housing slots that much.

This block bug is really something special.

DemonicGoat · December 2022

robwolf666 wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

It will likely be 2 full months that block has been broken by the time they figure it out and repatch,.. The only compensation we have got was the pet for a poor u36 launch..

If ZOS isnt going to reimburse people for ESO+ over this amount of time what would be fair compensation?

It isn't even remotely "game breaking", at most it's mildly annoying when you're fighting a harder enemy. It's hardly affected my ability to play... I just approach a fight a bit more carefully, and dodge/roll instead of block. Sure, I've gotten twatted a few times, but it happens sometimes even with block working properly. Just alter tactics a bit until it's fixed properly.

I understand that is your opinion however I disagree, it is a core combat mechanic that will have been broken minimally for 7 weeks(13.5% of the year) and tanks especially need to block for group content vet and HM. How about anyone new or coming back to the game? Anecdotal evidence suggests yet more people are leaving or putting ESO on the shelf and the lack of urgency on the part of the devs is frankly mind boggling.

Tons of other games go above and beyond when they compensate for downtime or server errors,not just some piddly pet,..
you get some currency,an exp boost,and/or something substantial.

Maybe they dont want the players back? Starting to seem that way.

BahometZ · December 2022

robwolf666 wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

It will likely be 2 full months that block has been broken by the time they figure it out and repatch,.. The only compensation we have got was the pet for a poor u36 launch..

If ZOS isnt going to reimburse people for ESO+ over this amount of time what would be fair compensation?

It isn't even remotely "game breaking", at most it's mildly annoying when you're fighting a harder enemy. It's hardly affected my ability to play... I just approach a fight a bit more carefully, and dodge/roll instead of block. Sure, I've gotten twatted a few times, but it happens sometimes even with block working properly. Just alter tactics a bit until it's fixed properly.

Oh brother...

Kusto · December 2022

rpa wrote: »

Just use Oakensoul ring. Triggering the new bug requires a bar swap so if you don't you are safe.
I wonder if there is a viable one bar tank build?

Not just bar swap. The bug also happens when you bash, use channeled/cast time abilities or rolldodge. So pretty much what a decent tank does most of the time.

BlakMarket · December 2022

Oh stop, please just flipping stop. It's not game breaking. Did vKA just on Saturday with the bug and we did it. It's not game breaking not in the slightest. [snip]

[Minor edit for bait.]

Hey man, come pvp. My playstyle is block cancelling, others roll dodge - sadly for me block is bugged, had to leave instance once & had to wipe to npcs twice to unbug all within an hour. Good times.

I'm happy you completed your trial with no hiccups, good for you tbh - sadly there is other content in the game besides vKA including the content I enjoy but cant because of the bug.

My main game is ESO, Im on holidays for 8 weeks, block will be bugged for 6 of the 8 weeks. Sadly Ive spent more time in this forum having these conversations, expressing this sentiment "It's nice the game is working for you, its not for me - here's why".

cave_troll · December 2022

There are really people defending this mess...

If that's not trolling than I don't know what this even means.

Caribou77 · December 2022

Beautiful art in this game, and I really enjoy the expansiveness of the open sandbox world. The dev bugs and inept combat updates are really a shame. There’s so much potential.

Grizzbeorn · December 2022

mocap wrote: »

I've always thought of you as reserved, peaceful and... you know... "Shao Lin monk style" ) Always chill players. Am I wrong?

Yes.

jecks33 · December 2022

robwolf666 wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

It will likely be 2 full months that block has been broken by the time they figure it out and repatch,.. The only compensation we have got was the pet for a poor u36 launch..

If ZOS isnt going to reimburse people for ESO+ over this amount of time what would be fair compensation?

It isn't even remotely "game breaking", at most it's mildly annoying when you're fighting a harder enemy. It's hardly affected my ability to play... I just approach a fight a bit more carefully, and dodge/roll instead of block. Sure, I've gotten twatted a few times, but it happens sometimes even with block working properly. Just alter tactics a bit until it's fixed properly.

we have another "Xynode Cultist"

xthrshx · December 2022

The block bug is game-breaking if you’re doing endgame content. And no, clearing VKA is not endgame content.

And while perhaps not “game-breaking” for everyone else, it is incredibly annoying and signals a dramatic decrease in game functionality and quality. If ESO at its best is worth $15/mo, what is it worth with this bug? Surely it must be less by some amount. That difference is the baseline for compensation.

(But I know that will not happen.)

Razorruk · December 2022

robwolf666 wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

It will likely be 2 full months that block has been broken by the time they figure it out and repatch,.. The only compensation we have got was the pet for a poor u36 launch..

If ZOS isnt going to reimburse people for ESO+ over this amount of time what would be fair compensation?

It isn't even remotely "game breaking", at most it's mildly annoying when you're fighting a harder enemy. It's hardly affected my ability to play... I just approach a fight a bit more carefully, and dodge/roll instead of block. Sure, I've gotten twatted a few times, but it happens sometimes even with block working properly. Just alter tactics a bit until it's fixed properly.

You’re cute.

Sir_Gentleman777 · December 2022

ghastley wrote: »

If a bug makes something harder to do, so it takes longer to complete, isn’t that increasing your playing time?

No it doesn't. If you have 2 hrs a day you can fill them with a certain amount of actions, may it be quests, trials or dungeons. This bug means that the amount of actions will be lowered, but it does not increase the playtime. So instead of increasing playtime it actually lowers your playtime, as you need to catch up on the missed tasks later on.

Now we can discuss what playtime actually means. ZOS thinks that if you can do something the game isn't broken and if it is only standing around and looking pretty. Players think if they can't run a dungeon in 5 seconds the game is broken. Fact is, if you can't do something as it is intended it is broken. Unfortunately the software licenses allow a very broad exclusion of liability. One is that the manufacturer is not liable for pretty much anything. Software is provided as is, with bugs, warts and all.

robwolf666 · December 2022

cave_troll wrote: »

There are really people defending this mess...

If that's not trolling than I don't know what this even means.

I'm not remotely defending it, I agree that it should have been fixed by now. [snip] Anyone who is actually good at the game can find a temporary combat workaround until it's fixed. As I said, it's had very little impact on my ability to fight, just a little extra frustration at getting hit a bit more frequently... but, it's combat, getting hit is part of it, big whoop.

[edited for baiting]

DMuehlhausen · December 2022

DemonicGoat wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

We don't need compensation. If we were unable to log into the game for two months then yeah give us two months of ESO+ back.

I appreciate you sharing your opinion.

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

It will likely be 2 full months that block has been broken by the time they figure it out and repatch,.. The only compensation we have got was the pet for a poor u36 launch..

If ZOS isnt going to reimburse people for ESO+ over this amount of time what would be fair compensation?

Oh stop, please just flipping stop. It's not game breaking. Did vKA just on Saturday with the bug and we did it. It's not game breaking not in the slightest. So dramatic people have become.

Not game breaking? Its a core mechanic that hasnt worked properly for weeks(on top of other issues). The amount of wasted time and anxiety the playerbase has had to deal with certainly seems like grounds for compensation to me. Its an opportunity after everything has gone wrong to sincerely begin making amends.

Nah, Im not stopping.

No, not game breaking not even close. As others have said there are literallly hundreds if not thousands of other things you can do while they come up with a fix. You just couldn't do dungeons or trials, but even that isn't true cause it doesn't always happen. Just did a vDSR. I was dps, but I got the block bug, but the tanks never did. Even if they did you stop and let them leave and come back..annoying yes gamebreaking far from it.

DMuehlhausen · December 2022

Sir_Gentleman777 wrote: »

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

It will likely be 2 full months that block has been broken by the time they figure it out and repatch,.. The only compensation we have got was the pet for a poor u36 launch..

If ZOS isnt going to reimburse people for ESO+ over this amount of time what would be fair compensation?

Oh stop, please just flipping stop. It's not game breaking. Did vKA just on Saturday with the bug and we did it. It's not game breaking not in the slightest. So dramatic people have become.

A) Sunday is not Monday after the patch. If you can't play the game the way you want and as it is intended, it is game-breaking. The functionality is not given. What would you say to an accounting software that can only calculate 1+1?

The bug CAN occur, it doesn't have to. If you are lucky it doesn't, if not it does occur and you are screwed. I don't want to go into trials where sheer luck decides the outcome. Thus the game is not playable if you need to pray to RNGeezus beforehand.

C) The point is that ZOS has not the faintest idea where the bug lies exactly. They introduce a "Fix" that made things worse than before. Quite evident in the latest patch and also in the "communication" from their side. And instead of actually sourcing the community to test things before it goes life is another fail in my opinion.

I will gladly spend hours on the PTS or whatever test system to help out, but letting a bug-fix go live that causes even more issues is not understandable for me. It is also a massive failure of the QA and the test management. Geeeeezzz ZOS, the players are here right at your fingertips, use them. If you also compensate these players with a few crowns, a house, a mount, everybody would be more than happy. And don't simply assume that players don't know how to test things. Sometimes they are even better at it than professionals, because they do stuff you don't expect. I rather spend daily 2 hours of my time to test things than to suffer a really annoying bug for weeks. But don't expect that i do it for free. Giving away mounts and houses doesn't cost ZOS anything. They are digital items with only an intrinsic value. Worse than even NFTs. The only thing that actually topped that non existent value is a Guar pet with even less value, that can even be seen as an insult to players.

Another issue i have right now is the communication, that deserves an F-. Maybe ZOS wants to look at other studios how they handle it when they mess up and how they communicate with their community. it is not about being liable for anything, but rather the good feeling you have as a player if you are kept in the loop. Criticism seems to be rather badly received by ZOS. Threads are simply closed and wiped as soon as somebody is a bit more passionate. ZOS just wants the honey, but without being stung by bees. Unfortunately this is not how the world works. Yes there are unfair comments, even outright stupid comments. But there wouldn't be any negative comments if everything would just work. So the issue is not with the users who voice their frustration, but in this case with ZOS who feel threatened or stepped on the toes. ZOS doesn't have to every idiotic request by users, it is their game and they can do whatever they like with it. But to be open minded to suggestions is a neccessary part of business life. ZOS is working on a new IP, but what does ZOS think the success will be, if we can't trust them to support the new game or deal with issues the same way as they do now with ESO?Reputation also accounts for a large part to be successful. I know that it is difficult to meet business expectations, revenue expectations and on top keep investors happy, but it can't be with the costs of a quality decrease of this magnitude.

2019 we were promised a much better experience in Cyrodiil, and where are we now? At dead silence. Currently the performance is increased, but not of all the work ZOS did, but rather because there are no players. You enter Cyrodiil at midnight CET and it is dead. A zerg of 10 can roll up the entire map. Take one Keep after the other. I did solo the other day a whole bunch of resources, nobody challenged me. Then i solo'd a keep.
Go to Belkarth past midnight now. it is dead. It is rather a jump scare if you find another player there. 2 years ago you still found pugs to run trials with at 3AM. Last night i was in Rimmen and it was completely empty, not a single soul to see apart from the NPCs. Sometimes i even start to attack the guards for giggles just to have some action. On Monday i pulled up the Steam numbers, only 10000 players online. Steam numbers are global, so it was split between NA and EU. If we assume a 50/50 split that were only 5000 per Mega Server. Do the maths and calculate to how many players this equates per zone. There is probably more traffic and activity in a desert. I have never seen a sharper decline before, even not when all the Cyrodiil crap started.

Empty promises, insulting compensations, declining content, that is how a majority of players see ZOS right now. Guilds are dying and drying out. I am just glad that i found a still active guild. My old guilds are dead and we were very active. Multiple trials a week, proc groups, there was always somebody available to run randoms, pledges. A lot of social events for giggles. Now is nothing left. I wouldn't even get a group together for dungeons most of the time.

No, even if you can't play the game you want it's still not game breaking. The game is still up and running and playable. It's not broken. This is the problem with todays society. Everything is Hyperbole, the game wasn't broken it's running, it's playable, maybe one part is a little more frustrating than it should be right now, but still playable. By definition not broken.

gariondavey · December 2022

BlakMarket wrote: »

Oh stop, please just flipping stop. It's not game breaking. Did vKA just on Saturday with the bug and we did it. It's not game breaking not in the slightest. [snip]

[Minor edit for bait.]

Hey man, come pvp. My playstyle is block cancelling, others roll dodge - sadly for me block is bugged, had to leave instance once & had to wipe to npcs twice to unbug all within an hour. Good times.

I'm happy you completed your trial with no hiccups, good for you tbh - sadly there is other content in the game besides vKA including the content I enjoy but cant because of the bug.

My main game is ESO, Im on holidays for 8 weeks, block will be bugged for 6 of the 8 weeks. Sadly Ive spent more time in this forum having these conversations, expressing this sentiment "It's nice the game is working for you, its not for me - here's why".

Hot dang 8 weeks of holiday?

React · December 2022

robwolf666 wrote: »

cave_troll wrote: »

There are really people defending this mess...

If that's not trolling than I don't know what this even means.

I'm not remotely defending it, I agree that it should have been fixed by now. [snip] Anyone who is actually good at the game can find a temporary combat workaround until it's fixed. As I said, it's had very little impact on my ability to fight, just a little extra frustration at getting hit a bit more frequently... but, it's combat, getting hit is part of it, big whoop.

[edited for baiting]

This is pretty dismissive of something that certainly qualifies as a major issue. The thing is, they shouldn't be breaking core mechanics like block 8 years into the game. If they somehow do break it, they should be doing one of their "high priority hotfixes" where they do an emergency maintenance within 48 hours to correct it. 6-8 weeks for a feature like this to be repaired, at this point in the game, is unacceptable.

I shouldn't have to "find a combat workaround". If my block gets disabled mid fight in pvp, I am ******. This wastes my time as I now must log out or travel out of pvp, then go back in and ride across the map to get back to where I was while praying the bug doesn't happen again.

I don't know about you, but I value my time and when it is needlessly wasted by a bug which doesn't seem like a high priority fix to the developers, that offends me as a player and a customer.

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

We don't need compensation. If we were unable to log into the game for two months then yeah give us two months of ESO+ back.

I appreciate you sharing your opinion.

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

It will likely be 2 full months that block has been broken by the time they figure it out and repatch,.. The only compensation we have got was the pet for a poor u36 launch..

If ZOS isnt going to reimburse people for ESO+ over this amount of time what would be fair compensation?

Oh stop, please just flipping stop. It's not game breaking. Did vKA just on Saturday with the bug and we did it. It's not game breaking not in the slightest. So dramatic people have become.

Not game breaking? Its a core mechanic that hasnt worked properly for weeks(on top of other issues). The amount of wasted time and anxiety the playerbase has had to deal with certainly seems like grounds for compensation to me. Its an opportunity after everything has gone wrong to sincerely begin making amends.

Nah, Im not stopping.

No, not game breaking not even close. As others have said there are literallly hundreds if not thousands of other things you can do while they come up with a fix. You just couldn't do dungeons or trials, but even that isn't true cause it doesn't always happen. Just did a vDSR. I was dps, but I got the block bug, but the tanks never did. Even if they did you stop and let them leave and come back..annoying yes gamebreaking far from it.

Dude, what? If my block breaks in PVP, I will lose the fight I'm in. That is gamebreaking to me. The same goes for anyone who's playstyle/content involves blocking as a core mechanic.

With the high APM of block weaving and bash cancelling in PVP, I had this bug happen to me 3 times in one hour yesterday while in cyrodiil, without sheathing my weapons. Two times I had to die to fix it, then ride all the way across the map to get back to the fight. The third time it happened I signed out and was booted from the campaign, which forced me to then enter a 30+ queue.

How is this not "gamebreaking"? It is preventing me from playing the content that I enjoy. I'm glad that you enjoy the non-combat parts of eso, but I don't. Therefore, this bug is directly breaking the game for me.

Cadbury · December 2022

So...

I guess now is as good time as any to farm for the Gaze of Sithis...

Major_Soulless · December 2022

Unless I missed it I didn’t notice a single ZOS representative has commented in this thread regarding any of the valid points made

Says it all really

tmbrinks · December 2022

Incredulous that there are those still defending a core game mechanic being broken for nearly 1/7th of the year.

Embarrassing that it's persisted this long.

I anticipate nothing in the form of compensation.

Other MMOs I play... maintenance goes over by a hour, they send you freebies (equivalent to an Oroborous crate). Emergency maintenance happens, core mechanics are broken, and they give time back on paid services (similar to what ESO+ would do in those games).

There is a reason, that if ZoS is working on another MMO, I won't even start it. While I love ESO, its content, the world it's in, I couldn't go through the way we've as customers been treated again.

Major_Soulless · December 2022

How can you compensate for block not working properly though? When an event breaks you can extend the event but what do you give people for having block being dodgy ?

The service isn’t down so there’s no cause to extend ESO + time so I’m not sure how you compensate end game pve players for this.

And no that’s not me defending zos it’s embarrassing they somehow managed to make it worse never mind not fixing it to begin with