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Magicka Sorcerer Shields Are So Weak
Overamera
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I have 50k+ magicka and it takes just one spammable for it to go down. It feels impossible to play outnumbered or solo when the shields go down so easily. Specially in No Cp all it takes in one crushing shock from and enemy and my shield is down.
Shields definitely need a buff!
Shields definitely need a buff!
7
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acastanza_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭You have to run three shields, each with a 6 duration to even start to have a decent amount of shielding, and even then one of those shields will randomly appear on someone else if they happen to have less health than you - and of course, this is the only shield that will actually heal you.
I'd propose that Hardened Ward and Empowered Ward both need to be (more than) tripled in strength and have their duration doubled (and Empowered Ward needs healing added to it) and have the 60% of your Max Health cap removed, but at the cost of only being able to benefit from one self-cast damage shield at a time.Edited by acastanza_ESO on September 26, 2022 5:44PM7 -
Quethrosar✭✭✭✭i HATE shields, how are you supposed to dps if you need to keep a shield up ?
Mana and time go to the shield instead of combat.1 -
YandereGirlfriend✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I have never really grasped the supposed power of the shield-stacking style.
It always seems like you are chucking SO many GCDs into the fire maintaining them - WAY more than if you're simply stacking HoTs as is done on basically any other class.3 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭First off you need to stack two shields at least, hardened ward and the big morph of the light armor shield (harness?).
For efficiency, keep one shield up at all times, and cast both when under pressure. Keep at least one HOT running as well on top of that.
Next up, Sorc class shield is terrible. It does need a buff. There’s no buff associated with the hardened morph (unlike empowered ward) and hardened ward does NOT give you all of the extra shielding because of the battle spirit health cap on shields. Solution: add minor protection to this morph please.
Edited by Minalan on September 26, 2022 6:31PM3 -
YandereGirlfriend✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Come to think of it, both shield morphs also only give you the Daedric Protection passive while the shield is actually active, so when you lose your shield you also lose a chunk of your Max HP. That seems unnecessarily punitive. In addition to a buff to the actual morphs, this should probably also be addressed.0 -
acastanza_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭First off you need to stack two shields at least, hardened ward and the big morph of the light armor shield (harness?).
For efficiency, keep one shield up at all times, and cast both when under pressure. Keep at least one HOT running as well on top of that.
Next up, Sorc class shield is terrible. It does need a buff. There’s no buff associated with the hardened morph (unlike empowered ward) and hardened ward does NOT give you all of the extra shielding because of the battle spirit health cap on shields. Solution: add minor protection to this morph please.
Minor Protection is already on Bound Ageis (along with Minor Resolve). What Sorc really needs access to is self healing that isn't tied to a liability pet or to crit RNG.6 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭acastanza_ESO wrote: »First off you need to stack two shields at least, hardened ward and the big morph of the light armor shield (harness?).
For efficiency, keep one shield up at all times, and cast both when under pressure. Keep at least one HOT running as well on top of that.
Next up, Sorc class shield is terrible. It does need a buff. There’s no buff associated with the hardened morph (unlike empowered ward) and hardened ward does NOT give you all of the extra shielding because of the battle spirit health cap on shields. Solution: add minor protection to this morph please.
Minor Protection is already on Bound Ageis (along with Minor Resolve). What Sorc really needs access to is self healing that isn't tied to a liability pet or to crit RNG.
They could add major protection (10%) while the shield is up, and it wouldn’t be overpowered.
Ideally they need to raise the health cap for shields to cope with the reality of 28K spectral bow procs. Then no buff would be required, we would actually get the hardened ward shield increase that we need to survive in light armor.
It should be at least 80% max health with scaling, then we could afford to put more spell damage and less magicka stat in our builds.
But we don’t get what we’re due, and the class is bad.Edited by Minalan on September 26, 2022 7:52PM2 -
Overamera✭✭✭✭First off you need to stack two shields at least, hardened ward and the big morph of the light armor shield (harness?).
I run both hardened and dampen and they still get fried so easily. 50k+ mag with pretty much useless shields and the low damage you put out. Magsorc is useless for pvp. Hats off for the sorcs that still manage to put up a fight.Edited by Overamera on September 26, 2022 7:56PM5 -
Soarora✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The shield definitely needs help in my opinion. It’s nigh useless on my pve tank, I only use it if I need a magicka cost shield and even then it covers little of my health compared to the sword and board shield. I use it fine on my pvp stamsorc but that’s just in place of dark conversion when I need a “heal” faster than the dark conversion cast time.PC/NA Dungeoneer (Tank/DPS/Heal), Trialist (DPS/Tank/Heal), and amateur Battlegrounder (DPS) with a passion for The Elder Scrolls lore- CP 2000+
- Warden Healer - Warden Brittleden - Sorc Tank
- Trials: 9/12 HMs - 3/8 Tris
- Dungeons: 30/30 HMs - 30/30 Tris
- All Veterans completed!
View my builds!
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Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Here's some real numbers:
Hardened ward has a 60% health cap on shields. This is what you're getting:- With 28K health and 49K max magicka, outside of Cyrodiil I am getting 16,754 shields
- Inside Cydodiil with the same: 12,113 shields
- Battle spirit reduces shield strength and damage taken by 50%.
I am not sure whether they should increase the health cap, or alter the battle spirit cap for damage shields (raise to 60%), but a 12K shield isn't good for that much max stat investment. I can't push max magicka any higher without losing some of the 4-4.5K+ spell damage that I managed to squeeze in.
TLDR; Sorc should be at 12K shields with 35K max magicka so that we can push spell damage to 6K+. That would be more competitive in this meta. But you cannot do that. Proc set effects scale with spell damage, not max stats. Max stat damage scaling is not increased by 20% with major sorcery/brutality.
It's all because of one defensive mechanic: Damage shields that scale on max stat. It would be nice if we could heal like everyone else in PVP, but we can’t do that. We get damage shields.
Edited by Minalan on September 26, 2022 8:31PM2 -
Adernath✭✭✭✭✭They nerfed sorcs into the ground over the years, likey that they can enjoy playing their favorite stamina toons and feel OP in PvP.
With all that lag on top of it, it is hardly possible to re-apply the buffs effectively in cyro. Sorc playstile requires literally zero lag to be effective, in particular with all the nerfs they have done.5 -
OBJnoob✭✭✭✭✭
✭Don't get me wrong I want PvP sorc to get buffs as well, I'm just not sure this is the way to go. Shields have been out of style long before u35. You'd be better off taking your own advice, stacking damage instead of max stat, include a couple pieces of other armor weights, and maybe wearing a defensive set.
Crit surge, matriarch, and vigor isn't a bad start for healing.
Anyway... Who knows maybe I'm wrong. But the original post talking about making the shield 3x as big as last 2x as long... Nah. That's madness. Keep in mind nobody else would benefit from this change at all. Does it really need to be threefold?0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Don't get me wrong I want PvP sorc to get buffs as well, I'm just not sure this is the way to go. Shields have been out of style long before u35. You'd be better off taking your own advice, stacking damage instead of max stat, include a couple pieces of other armor weights, and maybe wearing a defensive set.
Crit surge, matriarch, and vigor isn't a bad start for healing.
Anyway... Who knows maybe I'm wrong. But the original post talking about making the shield 3x as big as last 2x as long... Nah. That's madness. Keep in mind nobody else would benefit from this change at all. Does it really need to be threefold?
Without five light, we don’t have any armor pen, and no class access to armor pen debuffs other than maybe 1K on crystal weapon.
Matriarch is a terrible heal in PVP. That stupid bird is literally a 20K+ PB/OO bomb waiting to explode and kill anyone near it. Find me another class where their heal isn’t one global away from exploding and killing them?
We would benefit the most by raising the PVP battle spirit cap for damage shields or making damage shields scale off of spell damage to 12K at the high end. The former is REALLY easy to do though, and the latter is a difficult rework.3 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Don't get me wrong I want PvP sorc to get buffs as well, I'm just not sure this is the way to go. Shields have been out of style long before u35. You'd be better off taking your own advice, stacking damage instead of max stat, include a couple pieces of other armor weights, and maybe wearing a defensive set.
Crit surge, matriarch, and vigor isn't a bad start for healing.
Anyway... Who knows maybe I'm wrong. But the original post talking about making the shield 3x as big as last 2x as long... Nah. That's madness. Keep in mind nobody else would benefit from this change at all. Does it really need to be threefold?
Without five light, we don’t have any armor pen, and no class access to armor pen debuffs other than maybe 1K on crystal weapon.
Matriarch is a terrible heal in PVP. That stupid bird is literally a 20K+ PB/OO bomb waiting to explode and kill anyone near it. Find me another class where their heal isn’t one global away from exploding and killing them?
We would benefit the most by raising the PVP battle spirit cap for damage shields or making damage shields scale off of spell damage to 12K at the high end. The former is REALLY easy to do though, and the latter is a difficult rework.
Plus matriarch takes two bar slots away, which is huge for the already problematic bar space situation for sorcs.
Another good idea for shields would be to just allow them to crit. If they can take crit damage they should also be able to crit, using both crit chance and crit damage modifiers to account for the chance to crit and the size of the shield increase after a crit.1 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭Don't get me wrong I want PvP sorc to get buffs as well, I'm just not sure this is the way to go. Shields have been out of style long before u35. You'd be better off taking your own advice, stacking damage instead of max stat, include a couple pieces of other armor weights, and maybe wearing a defensive set.
Crit surge, matriarch, and vigor isn't a bad start for healing.
Anyway... Who knows maybe I'm wrong. But the original post talking about making the shield 3x as big as last 2x as long... Nah. That's madness. Keep in mind nobody else would benefit from this change at all. Does it really need to be threefold?
Any mag sorc using crit surge, matriarch and vigor for heals is a typical one shot farmable dummy
You can safely delete crit surge and matriarch from sorc toolkit with zero effect to mag sorc itself. I believe surge might be useful to stamsorcs but not mag sorc. Matriarch will die before you get the heal off. Vigor on mag sorc is weak as mag sorc typically does not stack spell damage
Run 3 shields and I still one shot you. Run 3 heals and it's still the same.Edited by PhoenixGrey on September 26, 2022 10:31PM1 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭Here's some real numbers:
Hardened ward has a 60% health cap on shields. This is what you're getting:- With 28K health and 49K max magicka, outside of Cyrodiil I am getting 16,754 shields
- Inside Cydodiil with the same: 12,113 shields
- Battle spirit reduces shield strength and damage taken by 50%.
I am not sure whether they should increase the health cap, or alter the battle spirit cap for damage shields (raise to 60%), but a 12K shield isn't good for that much max stat investment. I can't push max magicka any higher without losing some of the 4-4.5K+ spell damage that I managed to squeeze in.
TLDR; Sorc should be at 12K shields with 35K max magicka so that we can push spell damage to 6K+. That would be more competitive in this meta. But you cannot do that. Proc set effects scale with spell damage, not max stats. Max stat damage scaling is not increased by 20% with major sorcery/brutality.
It's all because of one defensive mechanic: Damage shields that scale on max stat. It would be nice if we could heal like everyone else in PVP, but we can’t do that. We get damage shields.
Battle spirit not affecting shield sizes will be a good start.
There are already heals with battlespirit exceptions for a fan favorite class1 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭acastanza_ESO wrote: »First off you need to stack two shields at least, hardened ward and the big morph of the light armor shield (harness?).
For efficiency, keep one shield up at all times, and cast both when under pressure. Keep at least one HOT running as well on top of that.
Next up, Sorc class shield is terrible. It does need a buff. There’s no buff associated with the hardened morph (unlike empowered ward) and hardened ward does NOT give you all of the extra shielding because of the battle spirit health cap on shields. Solution: add minor protection to this morph please.
Minor Protection is already on Bound Ageis (along with Minor Resolve). What Sorc really needs access to is self healing that isn't tied to a liability pet or to crit RNG.
Bound aegis is an expensive skill
If casting it gave major protection it makes sense to keep that buff up.
0 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭Don't get me wrong I want PvP sorc to get buffs as well, I'm just not sure this is the way to go. Shields have been out of style long before u35. You'd be better off taking your own advice, stacking damage instead of max stat, include a couple pieces of other armor weights, and maybe wearing a defensive set.
Crit surge, matriarch, and vigor isn't a bad start for healing.
Anyway... Who knows maybe I'm wrong. But the original post talking about making the shield 3x as big as last 2x as long... Nah. That's madness. Keep in mind nobody else would benefit from this change at all. Does it really need to be threefold?
Without five light, we don’t have any armor pen, and no class access to armor pen debuffs other than maybe 1K on crystal weapon.
Matriarch is a terrible heal in PVP. That stupid bird is literally a 20K+ PB/OO bomb waiting to explode and kill anyone near it. Find me another class where their heal isn’t one global away from exploding and killing them?
We would benefit the most by raising the PVP battle spirit cap for damage shields or making damage shields scale off of spell damage to 12K at the high end. The former is REALLY easy to do though, and the latter is a difficult rework.
Plus matriarch takes two bar slots away, which is huge for the already problematic bar space situation for sorcs.
Another good idea for shields would be to just allow them to crit. If they can take crit damage they should also be able to crit, using both crit chance and crit damage modifiers to account for the chance to crit and the size of the shield increase after a crit.
The class does have some crit passives so it does synergies well0 -
Xarc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I remember when sorc ruled the world, some years ago.@xarcs FR-EU-PC -"La mort, c'est surfait.", Xarc
Xãrc -- breton necro - DC - AvA rank50
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kàli - redguard templar - DC - AvA rank32
- since april.20142 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I remember when sorc ruled the world, some years ago.
We don't want to rule the world, but we do want to play and be competitive.
Fixing shields would be a great start. Anything would help, even if it's 40% lower on battle spirit instead of 50%. Or add more shields to the base so that the 50% battle spirit cut is less punitive.
One 12K hardened ward at 50K max magicka is absolutely ridiculous, it should be 20% higher at least.
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Artim_X✭✭✭✭✭
✭Damage shields are fine if you build for it (high resistance, decent health, decent magicka, bastion CP, etc.).
A slight buff to them wouldn't be game breaking, but they definitely aren't useless.(AD) Artim X/Xirtām/Måtrix |PC/NA| Casual staff wielding vampire sorcerer/templar/arcanistElectric-Burn/Stunhttps://media.giphy.com/media/Av0zcKH3i2BkaY1GXW/giphy.gif/https://c.tenor.com/jQHdFftrgwMAAAAC/tenor.gifElectric-Heal- Damage Dealing Build.
- Gear: 5 Infallible Aether (All apparel light and Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 Slimecraw Guise for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Perfected Inferno/Lightning Staff (infused/shock enchant), and Rage of the Ursauk jewelry (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused/flame/weapon damage enchant). 1 Mora's Whispers.
- Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Boundless Storm, Mages' Wrath, Lightning Flood, Twilight Tormentor (Twilight Matriarch for solo roleplay variant of build), and Power Overload.
- Ability-Bar 2: Crushing Shock/Storm Pulsar, Streak, Flame/Shock Reach, Unstable Wall of Fire/Storms, Twilight Tormentor (Twilight Matriarch for solo roleplay variant of build) and Fiery/Thunderous Rage.
https://media.giphy.com/media/5ibGIHneWS6ek/giphy.gifElectric-Ward- My Healer Build.
- Gear: 5 Spell Power Cure (All apparel light and Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 Slimecraw Guise for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Perfected Lightning Staff (Charged/shock enchant), and Infallible Aether jewelry (arcane with spell damage enchant)/restoration staff (Powered with absorb magicka enchant). 1 Mora's Whispers.
- Ability-Bar 1: Power Surge, Boundless Storm, Blessing of Restoration, Energy Orb, Twilight Matriarch, and Replenishing Barrier.
- Ability-Bar 2: Dark Deal, Overflowing Altar, Elemental Drain, Blockade of Storms, Twilight Matriarch, and Aggressive Horn.
https://media.giphy.com/media/Wa0TGmtDvwW3e/giphy.gifElectric-Vamp- My Meme Tank Build that uses high resistance and variety of wards.
- Gear: 5 Brands of Imperium (All body pieces except Head and Shoulders, with Divine trait, and with Prismatic Defense Enchants), full Mother Ciannait's (1 light and 1 medium. Divines and Max Mag Enchant), and Combat Physician jewelry (bloodthirsty with Prismatic Recovery Enchants), CP restoration staff (Infused with hardening enchant), and CP ice staff (Infused with crusher enchant).
- Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Bound Aegis, Deep Thoughts, Boundless Storm, Healing Ward, and Replenishing Barrier.
- Ability-Bar 2: Silver Leash (Elemental Drain if healer isn't running it), Bound Aegis, Frost Clench, Blockade of Frost, Empowered Ward, and Temporal Guard.
https://media.giphy.com/media/ukDQiYZzRAxMZKcK86/giphy.gifDawnfang- Tanky stage 4 vampire utility focused PvP healer that can take down very inexperienced players but is primarily focused on working alongside others in an organized group, PUGs, or zergs.
- Gear: 5 Torug's Pact for regular and NoCP build/Oblivion's Foe for dot build (medium chest and body pieces light. All Impenetrable. Max Mag Enchants). Gaze of Sithis and 1 light Mighty Chudan/Pirate Skeleton (light shoulders, and impenetrable with Max Mag Enchants). Knight Slayer/Pariah jewelry/Plaguebreak for dot build (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused with oblivion enchant for regular and noCP build/absorb magicka enchant and Sharpened for dot build. Sharpened for dot build)/restoration staff (infused with oblivion enchant regular and noCP build/absorb magicka enchant and Sharpened for dot build).
- Ability-Bar 1: Structured Entropy, Boundless Storm, Soul Splitting Trap, Radiating Regeneration, Healing Ward, and Life Giver.
- Ability-Bar 2: Drain Vigor (Elemental Susceptibility), Race Against Time, Rune Cage, Radiant Magelight, Empowered Ward, and Shatter Soul.
https://media.tenor.com/ogWfvDdsqBIAAAAd/anime-black-clover.gifDuskfang- My casual one bar heavy attack Templar build that only utilizes Aedric Spear abilities.
- Gear: 5 Infallible Aether (Head or Shoulder and body pieces except Chest. All body pieces Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 1 Slimecraw Guise for max spell critical (Divines, light, Max Mag Enchant), Lightning Staff of the Sergeant (Infused/shock enchant), and Sergeant's Mail jewelry (One Ring and one Neck. Both bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant). 1 Oakensoul Ring (bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant).
- Ability-Bar 1: Puncturing Sweep, Aurora Javelin, Toppling Charge, Blazing Spear, Radiant Ward, and Crescent Sweep.
https://media.tenor.com/Jo8aG_ouy_oAAAAd/ac-odyssey.gifPvE Starter Gear- Tanky stage 4 vampire utility focused PvP healer that can take down very inexperienced players but is primarily focused on working alongside others in an organized group, PUGs, or zergs.
- Gear: 5 Torug's Pact (Heavy Chest with light Head, Waist, Hands, and Feet. All body pieces Impenetrable. Health enchant on head and everything else Magicka Enchants), 1 Medium Mighty Chudan/Pirate Skeleton Shoulder (Impenetrable, Max Health Enchant), Knight Slayer Restoration Staff (Infused/Decrease Health enchant/Stealth-Draining Poison IX), and Knight Slayer jewelry (One Ring and one Neck. Both bloodthirsty with spell damage enchant). 1 Oakensoul Ring (bloodthirsty with Spell Damage Enchant).
- Ability-Bar 1:Radiant Oppression, Race Against Time, Aurora Javelin, Breath of Life, Resolving Vigor, and Life Giver (Shatter Soul).
https://media.giphy.com/media/6CovzgyTig7M4/giphy.gifRace- Gear: 5 Law of Julianos (heavy chest, gloves/belt light, and the rest can be light or 1 medium piece if you're not wearing medium anywhere else on your body. All in training if grinding for XP or divines), Armor of the Seducer or Magnus' Gift head, shoulder, and staves (light with 1 medium piece if you are not already wearing 1 medium Julianos piece. All in training or divines. The staves should be training or infused), and 3 purple Willpower Jewelry with Arcane trait (can be bought from trading guilds for relatively cheap.
- Check tamrieltradecentre.com for the best deals if you're not using a price checking addon).
https://media.giphy.com/media/sdEkeWpiaGz0A/giphy.gifMundus Stones- High elf, since you will not have issues with sustain, but other mag based races are also fine so this is more of a personal choice.
https://media.giphy.com/media/cT3wMhLGQWdKU/giphy.gifCurrent Champion Points- PvP: The Lover for penetration when playing a sorc or temp.
- PvE Healing/Damage: The Thief for decent crit rate.
- PvE Tanking: The Lady to get close to resistance cap.
https://media.giphy.com/media/l4FGDAx6u3hthMhgI/giphy.gifFavorite Foods and Potions- DPS Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Exploiter, Weapons Expert, Biting Aura, Thaumaturge, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
- Healer Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Enlivening Overflow, Hope Infusion, Weapon's Expert, Arcane Supremacy, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
- Tanky Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Ironclad, Enduring Resolve, Reinforced, Duelist's Rebuff, Bastion, Ward Master, Rejuvenation, Fortified.
- PvP Sorc: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Enlivening Overflow, Weapon's Expert, Occult Overload, Arcane Supremacy, Bastion, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
- PvE Temp: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Fighting Finesse, Master-at-Arms, Weapons Expert, Biting Aura, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
- PvP Temp: Shadowstrike/ Master Gatherer, Meticulous Disassembly/Plentiful Harvest, Steed's Blessing, Sustaining Shadows, Enlivening Overflow, Weapon's Expert, From the Brink, Arcane Supremacy, Celerity, Rejuvenation, Fortified, Boundless Vitality.
https://media.giphy.com/media/3otPoTggaYFNd1FdAI/giphy.gif- Parse Food for PvE:(DPS) Ghastly Eye Bowl (increases Max Magicka by 4592 and Magicka Recovery by 459 for 2 hours).
- Gold/Purple Food for Sorc PvP and Meme Tanking:(PvP) Clockwork Citrus Filet (increases Max Health by 3326, Health Recovery by 406 [useful if stage 1 vampire], Max Magicka by 3080, and Magicka Recovery by 338 for 2 hours). Witchmother's Potent Brew (Increase Max Magicka by 2856, Max Health by 3094, and Magicka Recovery by 315 for 2 hours.
- Trash Potions when feeling cheap: Regular CP150 Essence of Magicka pots that I obtain frequently from playing the game or Crown Tri-Restoration Potion obtained from dailies.
- Crafted Potions: Essence of Spell Critical (Bugloss, Lady's Smock, and Water Hyacinth). Without magelight this is my primary means of obtaining Major Prophecy on my Sorc, which increases my Spell Critical Rating. This also heals and restores magicka. Essence of Immovability (Columbine, Corn Flower, and Wormwood). I use this in PvP, since this gives me stealth detection, knockback immunity, and restores magicka (better to use it when competent allies are nearby, since it might reveal that you are surrounded by multiple players in stealth and you will not have an emergency pot available after use). Essence of Invisibility with only 2 ingredients (Blue Entoloma, Namira's Rot, Nirnroot, or Spider Egg). I use this in PvE content that requires stealth and if I need more speed I'll use Rapid Maneuver before using the potion. Essence of Invisibility with 3 ingredients (Blessed Thistle, Blue Entoloma, and Namira's Rot). Very useful in PvP alongside the vampire Dark Stalker passive, since you'll be invisible, ignore movement speed penalty while in Crouch, and you'll have a 30% movement speed boost from Major Expedition (I always have this slotted when riding from point A to B in PvP land, since gankers are always lurking). My templar will mostly use Essence of Health (Tri-Stat Potion) Ingredients: (Mountain Flower, Columbine, and Bugloss).
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jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
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Not to mention, in order to build for large shields you have almost zero opportunity to also built for high resistance, and barely hit that 30K health mark.0 -
ArgonianAustin✭✭✭I remember the days of barrier like shields in pve with a 60k max magicka, and when shields lasted 26 seconds for hardened and 20 for light armor shield. But the latter only protected against magic attacks. I feel making shields last 10 seconds would be ok but they are still weak. Maybe make them not crittable again and not scale on resistances.Edited by ArgonianAustin on September 27, 2022 5:47PMJust a Lizard Man that plays ESO with my twin brother khajiit_kyle2 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭Damage shields are fine if you build for it (high resistance, decent health, decent magicka, bastion CP, etc.).
A slight buff to them wouldn't be game breaking, but they definitely aren't useless.
Sure, build for it! I can still rip through any sorc shield and insta delete you on any other class of mine1 -
OBJnoob✭✭✭✭✭
✭@PhoenixGrey like I said, I know they need buffs, I just don't think buffing shields is the answer. For one thing it just promotes an already dead play style wherein, as you mentioned in talking about vigor, sorcs are still weak because they have no damage stacked. Also in your responses, to others as well as myself, you complain about a lack of penetration. So give sorcs a skill with major breach. Then they don't have to wear 5 light, and don't have to rely on shields cuz they have no armor, and at the same time can achieve higher damage with a few pieces of medium. Its a much more circumspect answer than "make shields 3 times bigger and last 2 times longer." Or make sorc pets untargetable and also unkillable... Would solve a lot of problems old and new. All of these suggestions are borne of complaints found in this very thread. And all of these suggestions would actually help sorc now, not put a bandaid on a playstyle that's been dead for a long time.
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Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I hate so much where mag sorc is right now. I wont even get into it too much how they are now trash tier for solo/openworld PVP. Shields are the lowest form of defense in ESO. The best Mag sorcs dont run them in PVP anymore. They dodge and heal. Add to that that one dodge roll negates their entire offensive bust combo. That is just the tip of the sorc PVP iceberg.
Random Sorc PVE Tangent:
I just spent the last 2 nights parsing with a mag sorc on the trial dummy. I havent done a dummy parse in about 6 months or so, but I wanted to see how things where going in the new Meta. I hate what the sorc rotation has become.
Want to parse competitively? Well, better go DW and 2H, because of course that makes sense for a magic sorcerer. Why would we want a staff to be competitive. Great job! Not uniquely a sorc problem, I will concede.
Let's also talk weaving in a world where ZOS is trying to lower the ceiling and raise the floor on a class that has historically been one of the most accessible for beginners. Well guess what folks, you have 4 different weave timings you need to deal with:
1. Overload weaving.
2. Hard cast frags weaving.
3. Stampede weaving.
4. Regular skill weaving.
None of these timings are the same. Take that floor! Trying to maintain high pace with few missed LAs is harder on sorc now than any other class ever been since launch by a mile.
Want to really squeeze out everything? Well, you also need to manage a back bar proc (Pillar) on a class where you cant swap off the main spammable, and nothing in the meta rotation lines up well from a duration standpoint with Pillar. Because most DOTs hit like a noodle and are 20 Seconds long, there is another minigame that needs to be played where you need to decide every 10 seconds what DOT is best to recast early. Its a nightmare.
This class now has a .8 second channel (that you cant bar swap off of). A 6 second skill in curse. A 10 Sec proc for pillar on meta specs, and potentially an 8 second proc if running siroria, a 15 second skill in stampede (also has swapping/weaving issues), and various 20 second skills, 2 of which require double bar slots. None of it lines up well, and you can literally have 3-4 skills in a row that all need to be weaved with different timing. Sure, there are people that hit 135k+ with one on a dummy after parse fishing for a month, but it is the clunkiest and most frustrating rotation I have ever played.
The rotation is also HEAVILY RNG dependent. I have been parsing on pretty much every class since target dummies where introduced, with more time on sorc than most. I have never seen a standard deviation in parses like I am seeing, my pace is as slow as its ever been, and the number of LAs I miss has never been higher than on mag sorc right now. Sure I can pull 120k+ with one, but the next parse might come in at 105k. I am done playing it. Its a disaster.Edited by Oreyn_Bearclaw on September 28, 2022 4:13PM5 -
AdamLAD✭✭✭✭✭I only want a few buffs. Like shields get a direct increase of 20%. A 25% reduction in cost. Harness gives Stamina and magicka. Curse gives minor or major breach. Frags got its stun back. And force pulse and shock is undodgeable. Our execute should be unblockable, undodgeable and unstealthable. What i mean by this is that when you press execute but a nightblade goes into stealth at the same time it shouldn't dodge/suppress or not make our direct hit from execute land. Make pets 1 bar (PvP only) I think this would bump sorcerer up to the power levels of the other classes. Also rework a few passives. Like why get a reduction in cost after blocking ? It should be after dodgerolling. I think all these are fair changes. Considering Max Magicka is way way less powerful than raw spell or physical damage. It would keep the identity of sorcerer. All playstyles would be accommodated and not make it broken.1
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Overamera✭✭✭✭If magsorc were to pick up the non shield style and use vigor it would need a better burst heal for pvp. The pet heal is just too unreliable since it can just be killed of lol. Like almost every other class that uses vigor as a HoT now and their own class burst heal. Tho i would prefer they buffed shields somehow so magsorc sticks with shield style which makes it unique.0
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PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭@PhoenixGrey like I said, I know they need buffs, I just don't think buffing shields is the answer. For one thing it just promotes an already dead play style wherein, as you mentioned in talking about vigor, sorcs are still weak because they have no damage stacked. Also in your responses, to others as well as myself, you complain about a lack of penetration. So give sorcs a skill with major breach. Then they don't have to wear 5 light, and don't have to rely on shields cuz they have no armor, and at the same time can achieve higher damage with a few pieces of medium. Its a much more circumspect answer than "make shields 3 times bigger and last 2 times longer." Or make sorc pets untargetable and also unkillable... Would solve a lot of problems old and new. All of these suggestions are borne of complaints found in this very thread. And all of these suggestions would actually help sorc now, not put a bandaid on a playstyle that's been dead for a long time.
The old playstyle is the sorc identity. It will be like playing stamblade without cloak.
I would rather play ranged magplar which is 10x better ranged class than mag sorc right now.
Or continue playing stamblade which I just started and feel quite invincible and can probably beat any mag sorc main on it
Mag sorc with heals will never work because we don't have any viable class healing abilities neither do we have healing passives. Nor do we have damage mitigation passives to survive without shields.
Defense and sustain are bigger problems than damage right now. I picked to play stamblade a few weeks back because it has the best defense in the game.Edited by PhoenixGrey on September 27, 2022 10:52PM0
