Prevent Boss Skipping

boi_anachronism_ · September 2022

I had one the other day for nsr. Came in and the tank charged ahead and pulled us into one of the secret boss fights, didn't ask if we wanted to do secret bosses and when someone was like no, I got something else to do right after this dungeon. the tank got aggressive and it turned into a pissing match until we kicked the tank and finished ourselves. If he had asked and not antagonized it might have been a different story but he just tried to force his decision on 3 other people. That's what happens. Lesson here is just communicate with your team. Don't be that guy.

SteamKitten01 · September 2022

If someone speaks up and says they're doing the quest for a dungeon, I've never had a group not wait for them. Similarly, if someone is looking for a specific drop, speak up at the beginning so I know to check my inventory when we're done as I have no problem sharing loot. Otherwise, I'll likely drop group as soon as the final boss is dead. Same goes for if someone speaks up about wanting to do side bosses/secret bosses. More often than not, everyone in the PUG will be game though occasionally someone won't have the time to do all the extras.

Having to kill all adds in a dungeon however just seems like an awful idea. There's already both required trash packs and bosses in a lot of newer dungeons where you can't progress until they're dead. And there's many dungeons where it's easy to miss a couple of adds even when you're trying to kill them all for a speed/no-death achievement (looking at you March of Sacrifices).

Dr_Con · September 2022

no, i do not want to fight that optional boss that is way off in the corner on fungal grotto that gets more defense as their hp gets lower with a group of people under 30 as tank. i'd rather bake a cake in the time it would take the kill her.

Hapexamendios · September 2022

There should not be a mechanism that prevents bosses from being skipped. That's for the group to decide. If someone is not playing like you would prefer, kick, leave or adjust.

Onomog · September 2022

Hämähäkki wrote: »

Besides skipping bosses, one problem here is the movement speed of some players.
If you have a new toon you are simply not capable in keeping up. They run so fast and have so much dps that they kill the boss before you get there. Happend to me two days ago with a CP 2600+ player.

I've lost track of the number of times I've typed in /group "I'm sorry I just can't keep up" and then dropped group. As a result I've pretty much stopped running randoms.

It's only been recently, when I can start to solo base game dungeons with a companion that I've been able to experience the dungeons at a pace where I can actually appreciate the content. It'll probably be a good while before I can do that with the DLC dungeons.

kargen27 · September 2022

Hapexamendios wrote: »

There should not be a mechanism that prevents bosses from being skipped. That's for the group to decide. If someone is not playing like you would prefer, kick, leave or adjust.

I have the opinion that the dungeon isn't done until everything is dead. You want the daily reward you complete the entire dungeon not just run to the end and kill a boss.
It was pointed out in another thread sometimes a member of a mob can get stuck in a wall. So instead of killing everything I would be okay with killing all bosses and at least 85% of mobs to get credit for finishing the dungeon. You can still skip the bosses if you are farming weapons on the final boss but if you want the daily rewards you have to kill them all.

barney2525 · September 2022

MJ202 wrote: »

Create two queues. One for "fast and furious" play style, the other for "lore and explore" play style. Select the one you prefer to hopefully be on a team with other like-minded individuals.

Of course this will open the door to a new complaint, that there aren't enough players queing for the style they prefer and they have to wait to long.

And there will be the " Fake lore and Explore " complaints when someone goes running off.

FeedbackOnly · September 2022

Dr_Con wrote: »

no, i do not want to fight that optional boss that is way off in the corner on fungal grotto that gets more defense as their hp gets lower with a group of people under 30 as tank. i'd rather bake a cake in the time it would take the kill her.

Actually that boss gets more defense only if you kill the adds.

FeedbackOnly · September 2022

kargen27 wrote: »

Hapexamendios wrote: »

There should not be a mechanism that prevents bosses from being skipped. That's for the group to decide. If someone is not playing like you would prefer, kick, leave or adjust.

I have the opinion that the dungeon isn't done until everything is dead. You want the daily reward you complete the entire dungeon not just run to the end and kill a boss.
It was pointed out in another thread sometimes a member of a mob can get stuck in a wall. So instead of killing everything I would be okay with killing all bosses and at least 85% of mobs to get credit for finishing the dungeon. You can still skip the bosses if you are farming weapons on the final boss but if you want the daily rewards you have to kill them all.

It's common for games to reward shortcuts t people for exploring the map. It adds to engagement level to people who been there years.

HerrKeinTipp_MrNoTip · September 2022

Terrible idea. Instead, encourage good dungeon etiquette for both the experienced players (be willing to suck it up and do the whole D) and the newbies (ask us if you wanna do quest/all bosses).

You, too, one day will be sick of doing fungal grotto for the 900th time and want to get your daily XP as quick as possible.

HerrKeinTipp_MrNoTip · September 2022

Oh and yes ZOS should make a solo mode of D's that allow you to explore the lore....don't expect and RNG to support you reading the speech bubbles though!

kargen27 · September 2022

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Hapexamendios wrote: »

There should not be a mechanism that prevents bosses from being skipped. That's for the group to decide. If someone is not playing like you would prefer, kick, leave or adjust.

I have the opinion that the dungeon isn't done until everything is dead. You want the daily reward you complete the entire dungeon not just run to the end and kill a boss.
It was pointed out in another thread sometimes a member of a mob can get stuck in a wall. So instead of killing everything I would be okay with killing all bosses and at least 85% of mobs to get credit for finishing the dungeon. You can still skip the bosses if you are farming weapons on the final boss but if you want the daily rewards you have to kill them all.

It's common for games to reward shortcuts t people for exploring the map. It adds to engagement level to people who been there years.

Not sure how skipping content means more engagement. I don't care that players skip content but they shouldn't be rewarded for doing so. This happens most often with players wanting to get the daily rewards from running the random. To me we have gotten away from the idea of why those random dailies exist. They were put in place to provide a way for players wanting to do specific dungeons a way to fill the group. The emphasis should remain there but instead the emphasis has become getting the reward as quick as possible.
Something needs to happen to focus players back on why the queue was created in the first place. Rewards though an incentive should be secondary to doing the actual content. To that end we should not be allowed to skip the content and still get the reward. If you are farming last boss you can still do that but if you want the reward for the daily random you should have to complete the dungeon meaning defeat all bosses and mobs.

Amottica · September 2022

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Hapexamendios wrote: »

There should not be a mechanism that prevents bosses from being skipped. That's for the group to decide. If someone is not playing like you would prefer, kick, leave or adjust.

I have the opinion that the dungeon isn't done until everything is dead. You want the daily reward you complete the entire dungeon not just run to the end and kill a boss.
It was pointed out in another thread sometimes a member of a mob can get stuck in a wall. So instead of killing everything I would be okay with killing all bosses and at least 85% of mobs to get credit for finishing the dungeon. You can still skip the bosses if you are farming weapons on the final boss but if you want the daily rewards you have to kill them all.

It's common for games to reward shortcuts t people for exploring the map. It adds to engagement level to people who been there years.

[/quote]

Actual shortcuts are one thing. Just running past trash until they reset or dying/resurrecting to reset the trash is very different.

Memory_In_Motion · September 2022

FG1 can be hard to solo for the new player banished cells not so much. Going into banished cells 1 with a level 6 toon using gear that was gained from a walk through is doable IF you recognise that some mobs only run so far and you can limit the number that attack you by hanging out on the fringes just outside as far as they will go. Also you need great self heals. FG1 can be a nogo because of the mudcrab attacks and i don't know how it is now but jabs was the goto for soloing that.

I had a new toon in fg1 that i finished the bosses solo after the speed runnners killed the main boss. it takes some time to do it. If you are experienced in mmos though most wont have the patience for that.

N00BxV1 · September 2022

Make all bosses required for a dungeon completion if in a group formed by the activity finder.

That way if someone queues for a pledge, for the quest, or for achievements, then they get to kill all the bosses and don't have to worry about someone skipping.

[Edited for Editing]

SirLeeMinion · September 2022

No thanks, OP. I definitely have had people speed-run dungeons so that I could not complete the quest, but it's rare. I see no need to force people to do every boss, every time. I prefer it the way it is.

In chat, I'll frequently paste either "Hi all, running the quest" or "Hi all - speed run okay?" (whichever is relevant). There's rarely a response, but it does help with expectations.

ZOS_Suserial · September 2022

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dmnqwk · September 2022

When you choose to play with others, their opinions matter.

I see a lot of people here who frame responses and explanations as 'my opinion is correct, everybody else is wrong'. I think that's very poor form in the long term, especially since people don't always know what you prefer.

I prefer trying to complete dungeons as efficiently as possible. I prefer not to explore every inch of the map. I know there are plenty of people who have a different opinion to me; however I would never try to suggest they are wrong for having it (though I might suggest they are inefficient hehe)

Bosses have been skippable for a few decades, and to suggest it's new behaviour/wrong behaviour suggests it's just your personal preference not to skip them. I do think that the approach taken by ZOS in having only the end boss drop the potential 13 different weapons of bow, shield, (resto/frost/fire/lightning) staff, 1h (dagger/sword/mace/axe), 2h (sword/maul/axe) plus amulet and ring that leads to this kind of mentality.

If they removed the need to run a potential 39 times and allowed the loot tables of every boss contain these, you might find people are more willing to do every boss, including optional and out of the way ones. Not every time, but it's definitely ZOS not supporting the desire of people who want to do every boss.

kurbbie_s · September 2022

VictorDragonslayer wrote: »

If three people farm the dungeon and one wishes to read and chill, that person slows down the party, so kick is only logical. In a matter of conflicting interests there are no right or wrong people, only winners and losers.

Instead of inventing punishments, accept 2 simple things:
1) Your opinion in a random group is only 1/4 of entire group;
2) When you are in minority, either do what is decided by the majority or seek another group.

this is something ive been saying. but the forum goers seem to only want the people who dont have time to walk around be punished. The issue they have is "what about me?" and never think about "what about them?" thats where we are. Winners and losers, whiners and quiet people. Its not my issue if you need an achievement, or anything else. Im here to complete the random dungeon and move tf on.

kurbbie_s · September 2022

Four_Fingers wrote: »

Put a token or fragment on each and every boss with the final piece on the final boss for the monster set or other main reward. That way you have to do all bosses for your monster helm or what ever.

does nothing, random dungeons is where this problem(or lack of) lies.

kurbbie_s · September 2022

AvalonRanger wrote: »

Rampeal wrote: »

Would it be possible to put up walls in certain areas or make it to where certain bosses do not spawn unless you kill the previous boss? Because skipping bosses have been a toxic thing in this game. I have seen numerous times people doing quest ask others to slow down, stop, or kill side bosses for Achievements only for them to be ignored, yelled at, or voted to be removed from group.

It just makes the whole dungeon experience bad. I know I can not prevent people from being rude and toxic by trying to rush everyones experience for instant gratification. But it would be nice to hinder their ability to ruin the experience for others.

Thank you.

Note this:

Most of DLC dungeon have 3 main boss and can't skip it. And secret boss is separated from main road mostly.
If you want to do secret boss, then ask about it at the start point of dungeon. If tank accept it, you have chance to do it.
But some secret needs 3 member to unlock the entrance ( (ex) pressure switch). You must let the other 2 player accept it,
otherwise you can't do it. But, most of normal running doesn't need to play secret contents. Because, main boss is not
so lethal even without secret buff, if your tank is not fake.

wrong, ran the normal dungeon of earthen root, didnt have a tank 4 damage dealers on pvp specced toons. we complete the dungeon and all the bosses. Not because of "oh we're so good" but because we payed attention. Thats the problem with many players, they dont want to do the mechanics

meekmiko · September 2022

No way in heck should they make you have to kill all the adds and bosses just to finish the dungeon.

If you want the dungeon ran YOUR way start your own group and then queue.
You get what you get when you queue for a RANDOM group. Speedy Runners, Slow AFKers, High Damage Dealers, Low Damage Dealers, Groups of Three to Four DPS, Questers, Achievement Hunters, People Who Want To Stop and Loot Everything, etc....

Make your own group with like-minded people if you want to run it a specific way 100% of the time.

blktauna · September 2022

markulrich1966 wrote: »

you will enjoy doing all bosses exactly once. When you repeat the dungeon, e.g. for the random daily or transmutes, you will be glad if you can skip them.

Speak for yourself. If i'm in a dungeon, I do the bloody dungeon. This stupid running BS deprives me of loot and chests. Solo the thing on your nightblade in stealth if you just want to cheese it all.

orgin_stadia · September 2022

dmnqwk wrote: »

If they removed the need to run a potential 39 times and allowed the loot tables of every boss contain these, you might find people are more willing to do every boss, including optional and out of the way ones. Not every time, but it's definitely ZOS not supporting the desire of people who want to do every boss.

Or just let the number of bosses killed determine how many stickerbook items the last boss drops. To prevent first boss farming.

On the other hand, that would mess things up for people who already have filled their stickerbook and are just there for the xp boost and transmutes. Having to do all bosses every time would be a total pain for them and they will probably just do something else. Which leads to less people in the queue and longer queue times.

There's simply just too many interests to satisfy...

orgin_stadia · September 2022

blktauna wrote: »

Speak for yourself. If i'm in a dungeon, I do the bloody dungeon. This stupid running BS deprives me of loot and chests. Solo the thing on your nightblade in stealth if you just want to cheese it all.

That's what people are doing, speaking for themselves. You included.

There's not one interest of running the dungeon that is more right or more correct than another.

Getting angry about it is totally pointless.

Leogon · September 2022

You wanna force other players to play the way you wanna play but they're the ones being "rude and toxic"? Ok.