Do the Major Changes/3 Mo Inhibit Your Ability to Learn Different Roles and Classes?

guarstompemoji · July 2022

Title

francesinhalover · July 2022

I mean if all dots last 20 sec you can slot dot skills in any order.

The issue is endless hail lasts 30 secs so all my rotations will be messed up, so i gotta farm poison injection ds arena weapon now.

That being said, id preffer if all dots were 14 to 16 seconds.

Mr_Stach · July 2022

I think constantly changing the CORE COMBAT or CLASS IDENTITY every 3 months makes the game stagnant and unable to evolve. Of they could stop reinventing the wheel for a minute they could maybe work on the rest of the wagon

Norith_Gilheart_Flail · July 2022

No, it's not hard to learn new variations to combat.

What the issue is if you gravitate to a a playstyle or a feature you like about a class, that may have even been a long standing thing, only to have that rug pulled out from under you - that's what give me the s***s.

For example, Master Crafter Magblade. Deeply regretted investing so much into it that even AWA wouldn't address the fact it's not truly account flexible to change mains.

Decided to change to Templar, ahead of Oakensoul release. Got it as soon as it came out and thought 'perfect, so much easier than nightblade'

And now, I have a change light attack for weave, changed jabs duration and new fugly graphic, as well as the quality of life oakensoul also bait and switched a month after release.

EF321 · July 2022

Tweaking numbers to get over/underperforming things in line is fine, completely and drastically changing functionality of skills/sets is absolutely not. This is not a game where you just pick your loadout from list of available classes/weapons and hop into the match, you have to invest a lot of time, effort and suffer through layers of RNG to get it all, properly trait and gold out, and they are like 'lol no you can't use that anymore'.

I have waited months to buy golden pvp jewelry from MYM vendor to complete build I had in mind, only to have another set in that build drastically change functionality (not number tweaks!) just three months later, so it is no longer usable in my existing configuration at all, and three months later, they make another set in that build, one I bought jewelry for, irrelevant too.

In another patch earlier this same year, they made another change that completely killed the build on another character, making core set of that build useless, I've spent a lot of time trying to come up with something different that will be good enough, once again rebuild the character... to learn that they are drastically changing functionality of core skill of that build, so it won't event do what I was slotting it for originally. I had to trash entire build twice just this year for this character.

I really just want to play my already finished characters, not keep rebuilding them every few weeks and doing all the farming associated with that. They say play how you want, they won't even let me play.

divnyi · July 2022

From PvP perspective: 3 classes got their main damage skill nerfed, like, in half. All dots are unusable, except proc set dots.
Learning class after patch might as well mean "slot several class utilities and pack a full set of neutral skills".

prof_doom · July 2022

Harder to learn? Probably not.
Harder to care enough to bother? Totally.

JustAGoodPlayer · July 2022

We need 1 hour dots. Than you can put it with you and all your ALTs and pass everything solo

)) If it can be named solo ... .

(It is a joke -DO NOT DO IT ! )

Darkstorne · July 2022

prof_doom wrote: »

Harder to learn? Probably not.
Harder to care enough to bother? Totally.

Yep, this.

It doesn't inhibit my ability to learn, it inhibits my desire to learn, when it changes so damn drastically, so damn frequently.

I have four characters I love, most for solo content, all getting their playstyles massively harmed:

A Sorc healer, my only group-content focused character, heavily reliant on HOTs...
A StamSorc LA build, heavily reliant on LA damage scaling from weapon damage stats, bound armaments, and the damage of crystal weapon...
A Nightblade LA build, heavily reliant, again, on LA damage scaling from weapon damage stats, grim focus stacks, and from empower's 40% boost on top of all that for 10k+ LAs.
A high-health Warden (weird for solo content I know...) focused on dot damage from gripping shards, arctic blast, iceheart set, and frozen watcher set. Purely for the fun and the thematic build. Everything dies from dots while I block, now with dots ticking half as often for less damage..? No thanks.

But hey, Throne and Liberty is looking pretty great I guess for a new 2022 MMO! And ZOS is just making me even more excited for it. NCSoft should send them a cheque in the mail...

Agenericname · July 2022

Maybe my desire, not my ability.

Im pretty casual in the times that I play. Im not as casual in the content. Id prefer to spend my time in the content doing what I want, not making frequent adjustments. Im not saying that there shouldnt be change, thats inevitable, but too much is tiresome.

Even more than the damage nerfs, which to me arent as big of a deal as they seem in most cases, this isnt the end of the changes. They've said that this would lead to fewer drastic changes, but they've made content less accessible, not more. To get to their stated goal, more changes are coming.

So no matter how well I do or dont adjust to this patch, the next one is coming, my guess is sooner rather than later, Ill have to do it all over again.

FantasticFreddie · July 2022

AWA killed my desire to expand onto new roles. Learning content on a tank is hard , and while the satisfaction of knowing which content your individual toons have done may seem trivial to some..... it was there, and it was taken away. No way to see exactly what I've tanked vrs healed or dpsed.

FantasticFreddie · July 2022

The combat changes every 3 months gets really frustrating when I want to dps. I tried really hard to learn mag dk. I liked it. I wasn't great at it, but I had my first ever 90+ parse, was really pleased with it and had a lot of fun in content with it. I cleared vVH for the first time, and decided to go for some of the achievements.

Then Zos had the absolute audacity to say that oh, dk was meant to struggle with sustain.
Suddenly, I was struggling in vVH. I spent 3 hours on the last boss. I adjusted my build, added sustain and penetration, and eventually gave up. Swapped to stamcro, and am trying to learn that. My parse is back in the 80s. It's not as much fun as dk. But neither is wiping on content I previously cleared for 3 hours.

I might be an end game healer, but I am solidly mid-tier as a dps, and the constant changes keep me there.

K9002 · July 2022

I burnt out for good when hybridization patch came out. I could catch up and learn but I just have no desire or energy. In order to retain interest, I have to be gripped thematically. I never liked the class system in this game and hybridization made it even less engaging for me. First I've quit tanking and now I'm not interested in playing at damage dealing either.

Noisivid · July 2022

My ability to learn and optimize a new build is still pretty good.

It should be, I've been doing it in ESO pretty much every few months since the Morrowind chapter was released; with a few breaks.

I'm not wanting to do it anymore though, just no drive to do it again knowing that it will most likely all change again in a few months.

I really don't care how the basic combat systems are set up. I'd just really really like it if everything isn't "overhauled" every three to six months.

GetAgrippa · July 2022

With this patch and the way they gutted classes, I wouldn't invest any time at all learning a new class. How do I know the class won't be unrecognizable in 3 months? (Looks sadly at my wardens.)

Mr_Stach · July 2022

GetAgrippa wrote: »

With this patch and the way they gutted classes, I wouldn't invest any time at all learning a new class. How do I know the class won't be unrecognizable in 3 months? (Looks sadly at my wardens.)

I'm Stubborn, if I can't play my Warden, I probably won't play a ton

shadyjane62 · July 2022

Hinder our ability, no. We simply don't know where to go if everybody is nerfed.

Except NB's somehow got buffed.

katorga · July 2022

My experience is that most casual players don't hit the forums, don't read the patch notes, and do NOT know what changes have occurred every 3 months. For 2-3 weeks after the patch they don't understand what happened or what is going on and why things don't work the way they used to.

PUG random dungeon runs are colorful after ZOS upsets the apple cart. But hey, why worry about tiresome and disappointing people?

For the tiresome and disappointing players who keep up with the minutia, they'll find the next Thing That Works. The forums will fill with cries of "OP", "NERF" and the cycle repeats.

merpins · July 2022

It makes learning healer more annoying, due to the change to how healing works. DPS and Tank remain unchanged, aside from tanks dealing more light attack damage, and DPS' damage getting nerfed by 40%.

Noisivid · July 2022

shadyjane62 wrote: »

Hinder our ability, no. We simply don't know where to go if everybody is nerfed.

Except NB's somehow got buffed.

for this patch, for the next patch, who knows

(sorry for being the Voice of DOOOOOMMMM)

i'm not even motivated to play my NB's & they're leveled, moderately well geared and ready to go. Don't even ask about my DK's, my poor, abused, played from early access DK's. :'(

guarstompemoji · July 2022

EF321 wrote: »

I really just want to play my already finished characters, not keep rebuilding them every few weeks and doing all the farming associated with that. They say play how you want, they won't even let me play.

This is something I wondered at. Thank you. You are not the only one!

guarstompemoji · July 2022

Thank you for all of the replies. I've noticed it's hard to find all roles in trials of late. There also seems little time to actually play, outside of trying to relearn how things work, trying to find gear because the older set doesn't work as well anymore.

One of my concerns is how players used to branch out and dabble in multiple roles (dps, healer, tank). That seems less likely, now.

Much of what I am seeing across the board is fatigue. I'm looking at other games, too. It isn't "just" this update, it's all of them combined, and the "we'll leave things stable for a little while before upending the cart again" sort of phrasing that was in this natch potes.

starkerealm · July 2022

No, it has a different effect for me.

I've got characters who haven't updated their builds in five or six years. (In one case, I have a character who is literally wearing gear from back when Wrothgar dropped. About the only meaningful differences are that a few pieces were swapped out over the years to replace them with better traits (back before retraiting was a thing.)

Now, you might ask, "why is that?" There have been some very good sets released in that time, some abilities have been significantly altered, and those characters stumble along partying like it's 2016. That can't be optimal, right?

It's not.

The constant shifts back and forth have meant I really didn't feel the point in updating them, and still don't (though, U34 did see me update a few I hadn't touched in, years.) I mean, yeah, I could get them up to par, only to watch the next patch drop and completely scramble whatever I was doing with them.)

The constant shifts mean that there is a real sense that... yeah, I could update my builds every patch, but it's not going to matter. If I actually make any real improvement, it'll be wiped away with the next patch.

This is a sense that gradually grew over time, and really kicked in sometime around Greymoor.