Dodge Dodge Dodge

DrSlaughtr · April 2021

It's time we talk about the constant auto-dodging that occurs nightly. We've all seen it. Some of us have unknowingly benefited from it. One player fires their ranged attacks against another. Maybe the target is walking or running, or maybe just standing still, but somehow most if not all the attacks miss without a single roll dodge due to server side issues. I don't know if this can be fixed as it has long plagued Cyrodiil. But if it can't be fixed, maybe we can at least make it less sucky.

If I line up to attack a target with a bow skill and 5 attacks miss a non-dodging or line of sighting target, I'm charged the stamina cost of each one despite the fact I did nothing incorrect. If this happens enough time, I run out of stamina just as my attacks start landing.

I think that attacks which are actually roll dodged should cost resources because part of the defense is trying to get the opponent to burst through their mag/stam. But in this situation, no one is roll dodging but the attacker is still charged due to server hijinks. Is it possible to only charge mag/stam for attacks that are roll dodged only?

[Edited to remove Spamming]

Fawn4287 · April 2021

To be fair I currently get hit through dodge roll and walls with single target abilities all the time.

ResidentContrarian · April 2021

Disagree.

There are attacks that drop because of movement speed and other targeting issues, especially when targeting sorcs and NBs. Should they also be charged additional resources because the game is buggy?

Also, what you see or perceive another person doing on your end may not be what happens on their end or server side. The game is not 1:1 or functioning anywhere near real-time, which is why reactive-based gameplay in this game is extremely buggy and terrible to balance around.

Vizirith · May 2021

I'm pretty sure roll lasts 1 second so anything "landing" within that time frame will be dodged, but I feel like with some channeled abilities it lasts longer. I've had all my Bound Armaments miss from 1 dodge roll. As each armament fires every .3 sec, 4 should land within 1.2 secs, but then they shouldn't all miss. I've also felt like I've dodged more bow ult projectiles than I should've but don't use the skill myself so it's possible I'm mistaken. But I just chalk it up to server issues like pretty much everything else I can't explain.

master_vanargand · May 2021

Use AoE.

DrSlaughtr · May 2021

I'm specifically talking about people not roll dodging.

ResidentContrarian wrote: »

Disagree.

There are attacks that drop because of movement speed and other targeting issues, especially when targeting sorcs and NBs. Should they also be charged additional resources because the game is buggy?

Also, what you see or perceive another person doing on your end may not be what happens on their end or server side. The game is not 1:1 or functioning anywhere near real-time, which is why reactive-based gameplay in this game is extremely buggy and terrible to balance around.

Not really sure what the point is here. I never said the target should be charged resources. It's nothing that player is doing but they're getting free dodges without actually rolling. This happens quite often during lag spikes. I don't think my 5 silver shards should eat up all that Stam because the server doesn't properly communicate positioning.

Sedare38 · May 2021

Dodge is busted AND people have figured out how to abuse it. I have an example. My friend and I were at a resource defending against 2 people. I killed one, then got killed. The 2nd enemy, an NB, went to resurrect his teammate, and my teammate point blank fired at him or did an incap (can't remember exactly his attack). The enemy dodged while standing there resurrecting. He didn't dodge roll first then start res. He simply walked up to commence rezzing and DURING the resurrection just dodged automatically several attacks.

Noctus · May 2021

Sedare38 wrote: »

Dodge is busted AND people have figured out how to abuse it. I have an example. My friend and I were at a resource defending against 2 people. I killed one, then got killed. The 2nd enemy, an NB, went to resurrect his teammate, and my teammate point blank fired at him or did an incap (can't remember exactly his attack). The enemy dodged while standing there resurrecting. He didn't dodge roll first then start res. He simply walked up to commence rezzing and DURING the resurrection just dodged automatically several attacks.

https://www.elderscrollsbote.de/set=213

there are ppl using it and i hate it i have this set myself even with gold rings and everything but its not OP or anything

DrSlaughtr · May 2021

Noctus wrote: »

Sedare38 wrote: »

Dodge is busted AND people have figured out how to abuse it. I have an example. My friend and I were at a resource defending against 2 people. I killed one, then got killed. The 2nd enemy, an NB, went to resurrect his teammate, and my teammate point blank fired at him or did an incap (can't remember exactly his attack). The enemy dodged while standing there resurrecting. He didn't dodge roll first then start res. He simply walked up to commence rezzing and DURING the resurrection just dodged automatically several attacks.

https://www.elderscrollsbote.de/set=213

there are ppl using it and i hate it i have this set myself even with gold rings and everything but its not OP or anything

Yeah. My issue is in Cyro though where this doesn't work anyway. I never really notice this issue in BGs and IC.

katorga · May 2021

The game engine can't keep up with where everything is. That simple. What you see and what is really there may or may not match. That is primary cause of random "dodge" messages, and random hits that seem to come out of nowhere.

DrSlaughtr · May 2021

katorga wrote: »

The game engine can't keep up with where everything is. That simple. What you see and what is really there may or may not match. That is primary cause of random "dodge" messages, and random hits that seem to come out of nowhere.

Yup. I know. Hence my statement that it shouldn't drain my resources due to server issues and not player skill.

Pauwer · May 2021

Yes, i also see the "dodge" from targets that are not moving at all or anything in cyro. People standing still, sieging, are able to dodge ranged attacks. May be lag issue, but it is very annoying. I can also sometimes hear someone sniping me when i'm siegeing but no damage is done to me nor any effects are applied on me. I bet the sniper sees "dodge".

DrSlaughtr · May 2021

Not to distract from the topic but my new favorite thing is I'll be standing still with full health and drop dead instantly. Then I see a warden or dk walk off. Check my recap, I was getting lit up without seeing a single attack. I know desync happens but this is a new one for me.

Exeter411 · May 2021

TheEndBringer wrote: »

Not to distract from the topic but my new favorite thing is I'll be standing still with full health and drop dead instantly. Then I see a warden or dk walk off. Check my recap, I was getting lit up without seeing a single attack. I know desync happens but this is a new one for me.

I've seen it several times, but the clincher for me was this:

Small group of DC knocked down inner door of keep. I ran to the top of the stairs inside, saw a lone DC coming towards the base of the stairs. I targeted him with a blastbones when I saw him. He ran up the stairs and killed me just as the blastbones finished forming. It takes a blastbones 2.5 seconds to form before it attacks (and before you ask, yes, I was attacking myself, I wasn't waiting for the skeleton.) So he killed me within the 2.5 second interval... no biggie, but then my Improved Death Recap popped up. IDR recorded over 4.5 seconds of attacks on me, yet this happened within the 2.5 second animation on the blastbones.

This happened last month, all factions were at one bar, so no zerg induced lags, no procs. My interest in ESO PVP has gone down a lot.

DrSlaughtr · May 2021

Sounds about right.

Waffennacht · May 2021

Exeter411 wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

Not to distract from the topic but my new favorite thing is I'll be standing still with full health and drop dead instantly. Then I see a warden or dk walk off. Check my recap, I was getting lit up without seeing a single attack. I know desync happens but this is a new one for me.

I've seen it several times, but the clincher for me was this:

Small group of DC knocked down inner door of keep. I ran to the top of the stairs inside, saw a lone DC coming towards the base of the stairs. I targeted him with a blastbones when I saw him. He ran up the stairs and killed me just as the blastbones finished forming. It takes a blastbones 2.5 seconds to form before it attacks (and before you ask, yes, I was attacking myself, I wasn't waiting for the skeleton.) So he killed me within the 2.5 second interval... no biggie, but then my Improved Death Recap popped up. IDR recorded over 4.5 seconds of attacks on me, yet this happened within the 2.5 second animation on the blastbones.

This happened last month, all factions were at one bar, so no zerg induced lags, no procs. My interest in ESO PVP has gone down a lot.

This is why I run with such high health. The bigger your health pool the more of a chance to survive this exact thing. I absolutely hate when this happens to me.

Exeter411 · May 2021

Waffennacht wrote: »

Exeter411 wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

Not to distract from the topic but my new favorite thing is I'll be standing still with full health and drop dead instantly. Then I see a warden or dk walk off. Check my recap, I was getting lit up without seeing a single attack. I know desync happens but this is a new one for me.

I've seen it several times, but the clincher for me was this:

Small group of DC knocked down inner door of keep. I ran to the top of the stairs inside, saw a lone DC coming towards the base of the stairs. I targeted him with a blastbones when I saw him. He ran up the stairs and killed me just as the blastbones finished forming. It takes a blastbones 2.5 seconds to form before it attacks (and before you ask, yes, I was attacking myself, I wasn't waiting for the skeleton.) So he killed me within the 2.5 second interval... no biggie, but then my Improved Death Recap popped up. IDR recorded over 4.5 seconds of attacks on me, yet this happened within the 2.5 second animation on the blastbones.

This happened last month, all factions were at one bar, so no zerg induced lags, no procs. My interest in ESO PVP has gone down a lot.

This is why I run with such high health. The bigger your health pool the more of a chance to survive this exact thing. I absolutely hate when this happens to me.

Yeah, I tried that but even with 45K+ health, it only buys another second of (my) time. Frankly, this happens so consistently that PVP isn't interesting anymore.

Dorkener · May 2021

ITT: People dodging 100% of incoming damage without any visible input vs people dying 100-0 without a chance of any input. Balance?

blktauna · May 2021

I'm also brought down by 5 melee attacks from wardens and other 2h users while I am over 30m away and in stealth. Thats when I log out of cyro and do something else.

Caribou77 · June 2022

auto dodges still plague bgs, especially on ranged spells. I’ve had 8 crystal frags in a row autododged (no roll animation anywhere to be seen).

and for all of the threads discussing this I have yet to see a single comment of clarification from a dev.

when lag is bad, ranged classes are unplayable in pvp.

Master_Kas · June 2022

Vizirith wrote: »

I'm pretty sure roll lasts 1 second so anything "landing" within that time frame will be dodged, but I feel like with some channeled abilities it lasts longer. I've had all my Bound Armaments miss from 1 dodge roll. As each armament fires every .3 sec, 4 should land within 1.2 secs, but then they shouldn't all miss. I've also felt like I've dodged more bow ult projectiles than I should've but don't use the skill myself so it's possible I'm mistaken. But I just chalk it up to server issues like pretty much everything else I can't explain.

Think this is what most people have most issues with. I recall there used to be a window where you dodgeroll stuff a little bit after the actual dodgeroll aswell (which leads to the character dodging while standing up). Happens alot on my stamblade when I'm permarolling away from players attacks.

And I'm not using any third party program or meridias/blessed armorset.

Funniest thing is when it's so laggy you can sometimes see dead people (corpses of players) who stand up, do that dodge animation then fall down dead again. xD

I don't recall how long the 'dodgewindow' was or if they have changed it but..

taugrim · June 2022

Waffennacht wrote: »

Exeter411 wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

Not to distract from the topic but my new favorite thing is I'll be standing still with full health and drop dead instantly. Then I see a warden or dk walk off. Check my recap, I was getting lit up without seeing a single attack. I know desync happens but this is a new one for me.

I've seen it several times, but the clincher for me was this:

Small group of DC knocked down inner door of keep. I ran to the top of the stairs inside, saw a lone DC coming towards the base of the stairs. I targeted him with a blastbones when I saw him. He ran up the stairs and killed me just as the blastbones finished forming. It takes a blastbones 2.5 seconds to form before it attacks (and before you ask, yes, I was attacking myself, I wasn't waiting for the skeleton.) So he killed me within the 2.5 second interval... no biggie, but then my Improved Death Recap popped up. IDR recorded over 4.5 seconds of attacks on me, yet this happened within the 2.5 second animation on the blastbones.

This happened last month, all factions were at one bar, so no zerg induced lags, no procs. My interest in ESO PVP has gone down a lot.

This is why I run with such high health. The bigger your health pool the more of a chance to survive this exact thing. I absolutely hate when this happens to me.

Are you talking only about Cyrodiil or BGs too?

I've never seen this happen in BGs, at least over the past 3 months of intensive build testing.