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As a Plaguebreak user; please nerf Plaguebreak

  • katanagirl1
    katanagirl1
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    I suppose there is no reason to comment on this anymore. ZOS will not acknowledge it and every post on here refuting the brokenly OP nature of this set is someone who is benefiting from using it, most of them in PvP.

    The only conclusion is that ZOS wants a handful of people who group up and use this set (but ironically aren’t calling themselves a ball group), or even solo players using the set, to be able to press a couple of buttons and clear the field of dozens of other players easily.
    Khajiit Stamblade main
    Dark Elf Magsorc
    Redguard Stamina Dragonknight
    Orc Stamplar PVP
    Breton Magsorc PVP
    Dark Elf Magden
    Khajiit Stamblade
    Khajiit Stamina Arcanist

    PS5 NA
  • Kwoung
    Kwoung
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    furiouslog wrote: »
    I object to two things about the set:

    2. Randos that are not in your group can purge you and get you killed. In Blackreach, I noticed a player who swapped factions to follow a ball group around and keep putting purges on them to increase chances of their opponents successfully killing them. A secret 13th group member. Pretty lame, but also effective if that person can keep up.

    Everything else can be handled with combat awareness.

    Had one of those following us around for like 1.5 hours, the difference was he had a friend popping out, casting PB on us and disappearing as well. Really awesome gameplay there, it never ceases to amaze me the lengths some go to in order to grief others. The funny thing is, the purger probably made more AP than his friend, as it only killed a couple of us and we were taking a ton of keeps and resources that night. We did finally bore of it and decided to afk in a safe spot for a break, which apparently made them sad, because we didn't see them after that.
  • Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo
    Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo
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    On PC EU last night, a whole group of AD (+30) died to this set (group implosion)....and the server went 'bonkers'...we all had a slow bug after and thought we were going to crash.
  • MEBengalsFan2001
    MEBengalsFan2001
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    furiouslog wrote: »
    I object to two things about the set:

    1. It renders the Purify synergy useless to the point where it's actually a nuisance if it's on top of the synergy stack. It can prevent execution of anything synergy dependent.
    2. Randos that are not in your group can purge you and get you killed. In Blackreach, I noticed a player who swapped factions to follow a ball group around and keep putting purges on them to increase chances of their opponents successfully killing them. A secret 13th group member. Pretty lame, but also effective if that person can keep up.

    Everything else can be handled with combat awareness.

    Plaguebreak stacks with other dots. Destructive Reach, Fire damage, weapon poison, poison from skills/gear sets, etc... all of these can be cleared with a cleanse and if not you end taking some serious damage over time that when you add a few burst type damage you are either pushed to cleanse or die. Most will cleanse but it can cost you your life as well make it rather hard going up against a player running multiple type of dot effects. This is especially true when going against a hybrid DK that uses two different type of dots.

    Plaguebreak after it was updated I knew it would become the set of choice for many players and I was already using it when it was only impacted by cleanse and not many were using the set. Now it seems almost everyone is running it.
    Edited by MEBengalsFan2001 on February 17, 2022 3:41PM
  • Oznog666
    Oznog666
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    Oh. Plaguebreak was never on my wish list. Until I saw this thread. Today I gave it a try, very nice in some situations. Thanks a lot for this thread B)B)>:)
    PC EU
    1 Healer, 1 Tank, 3 DD, 5 more Toons just for fun
  • p_tsakirisb16_ESO
    p_tsakirisb16_ESO
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    Youyouz06 wrote: »
    On PC EU last night, a whole group of AD (+30) died to this set (group implosion)....and the server went 'bonkers'...we all had a slow bug after and thought we were going to crash.

    Problem is when Necro using both Dark Convergence and Plaguebreak. We cannot break at all, is insta death to everyone all 10+ players caught on it, the Colossus is usually there for the bonus if someone manages to break free who had 60K hp and max resistances.

    Tonight we lost dozens of people easily per jump of 2 guys. Ofc ZOS instead of balancing out PVP and get it back to what it was in early 2014 where battles lasted for quite some time, we are in a damn fragfest of 1 button press nucking whole alliance group.

    I wonder some times what they are thinking when they make such sets. Nothing is not an answer.
    Sets like these are what has kept me from away from Cyro at the level 50+ campaigns and why if I want PVP i choose different games.
  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
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    First off, I believe this set is just the latest symptom in a long line of misguided attempts to fix game mechanics by releasing new sets - but that's how ZOS likes to do things for now, so I won't get into it.
    • (2 items) Adds 1487 Offensive Penetration
    • (3 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage and Spell Damage
    • (4 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage and Spell Damage
    • (5 items) Dealing direct damage to an enemy, who is not a Plague Carrier, turns them into a Plague Carrier for 10 seconds, dealing 1715 Disease Damage over the duration. If the plague is removed early, it explodes, infecting enemies within 8 meters of the carrier and dealing 712 Disease Damage. The explosion deals an additional 50% damage per enemy hit. This effect can occur once per attack and scales off the higher of your Weapon or Spell Damage.

    It was designed to "punish larger groups for casting Purge with reckless abandon" - And it did that in a way; such that you're either part of a "Ball Group" which has the defenses/healing to power through it any way, or you're a part of disorganized rabble which will get absolutely obliterated if someone decides to use a Cleanse Synergy.
    Anyhow, I digress. The set does make it punishing to spam Purges - but it does so much more than that. I use it in Cyrodiil, sure. But I also use it in Battlegrounds, or in PVE (yes, the dot/explosion also applies to PVE monsters) - things don't even have to be Purged, if a target dies they explode just the same (the tooltip fails to mention that, but it's there. Case in point; it works in AOE farming PVE)
    At this point it's simply better than most other damage sets for Stamina (potentially).

    Compare it to a set like Syvarra's Scales
    • (2 items) Adds 1206 Maximum Health
    • (3 items) Adds 1096 Maximum Stamina
    • (4 items) Adds 1096 Maximum Magicka, Reduces your damage taken from Guards by 20%.
    • (5 items) When you deal damage, you cause a burst of lamia poison that deals 900 Poison Damage in a 5 meter radius and an additional 10272 Poison Damage over 6 seconds to all enemies hit. This effect can occur once every 7 seconds and scales off the higher of your Weapon or Spell Damage.

    Viper's Sting
    • (2 items) Adds 657 Critical Chance
    • (3 items) Adds 1096 Maximum Stamina
    • (4 items) Adds 657 Critical Chance
    • (5 items) When you deal damage with a Martial melee attack, you deal an additional 6400 Poison Damage over 4 seconds. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds and scales off the higher of your Weapon or Spell Damage.

    or Sheer Venom, which can only be applied with Execute abilities.
    • (2 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    • (3 items) Adds 129 Weapon and Spell Damage
    • (4 items) Adds 129 Weapon and Spell Damage
    • (5 items) When you deal damage with an Execute ability you infect the enemy, dealing 6576 Poison Damage over 6 seconds and dealing up to 100% more damage to enemies under 100% Health. This effect can occur every 6 seconds per target.
    These sets do 1712, 1600, or 1096-2192 (at best!) DPS with their procs. Plague only does 1177 - lower, but somehow still comparable no?
    Disregarding for the moment how Plaguebreak has an almost ideal offensive stat line of Penetration, Weapon Damage, Weapon Damage, you might prefer one of above sets in a 1v1 scenario - assuming your opponent doesn't use any sort of Purges - but in virtually any other scenario, Plaguebreak far outshines these sets (and most other proc sets at the moment)

    Say you're a Warden - who, like most Wardens, likes to use Betty Netch summon, which purges a negative effect once every 5 seconds. If you're fighting, say, a stamDK with Plaguebreak, you'll probably be hit with Noxious Breath (Dot+Major Breach), Venomous Claw (DoT) and the Plaguebreak. Leaving you with a nice 25% chance to nuke yourself (and anyone around) if the Netch happens to purge the wrong effect.
    Or say you're a Templar, and you like to use Cleansing Ritual (either morph) because it's a nice aura for dueling in (healing/damage) - better hope no one has Plaguebreak on you, because that's gonna hurt - incidentally, any rando who uses your Synergy might also nuke you.

    Now, you might be thinking; well, Vicious Death can also be used to nuke groups like that. But I would argue that Plaguebreak is simply stronger than VD in every way.

    Now, for a reference Weapon Damage of 5500 (not at all optimal, but just a reference point), Vicious Death does 18500 death-explosion damage.
    Plaguebreak "only" does 4000, but it scales with 50% per target. Meaning that Plaguebreak would out-damage VD once there are 4+ enemies hit. Considering that Plaguebreak also has greater radius (8m vs. the 5m of VD) this is a fairly easy condition to meet, even in Battlegrounds.
    Furthermore, while VD's (5)-piece bonus is USELESS in 1v1 scenarios, Plaguebreak remains very competitive with other DoT-proc sets. And in all this, we're not even taking into account that Plaguebreak reacts to purges.

    I'm not sure exactly how this set should be nerfed; but I definitely think it should be - and I'll find something else to use, but right now it's simply too good to pass up.

    I think ZOS should instead look towards "fixing" these game mechanics by... actually changing the game mechanics, rather than this patchwork of item sets.
    Make a Purge cost-buffer like what's existed for roll-dodges and Streak/Ball-Lightning for years, so you can't spam it senselessly? Reduce the efficiency of things like purge, such that players at least have to build towards purging, if they want to keep it up?
    I don't have all the answers, of course, but I'm fairly certain Plaguebreak isn't it.


    ZOS's own descriptions of the set, for refererence:
    "Similar to Dark Convergence, we targeted large groups again with this set, focusing on their ability to have numerous purges running, making locking them down and bleeding them out incredibly difficult to do. Now, larger groups must purge more carefully, running the risk of setting off ticking time bombs and having to heal up the aftermath instead of repeatedly casting it with reckless abandon"
    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/584299/pc-mac-patch-notes-v7-1-5-waking-flame-update-31

    Currently, this set feels like it is a better version of most Damage over Time sets, such as Hunter's Venom or Viper's Sting, where it can output decent pressure but with the added bonus of an explosion if removed early. We've toned down both the Damage over Time and the damage of the explosion against low target counts, while increasing the damage against large target counts to ensure it continues smashing groups who are chain casting purges with reckless abandon. Overall, this should help reduce the need to purge the set and make it far less oppressive to fight against as a solo or low group count player.
    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/590109/pc-mac-patch-notes-v7-2-5-deadlands-update-32

    EDIT:

    For those commenting on it being a "Stamina set" - If you use it on weapons/Jewelry there is absolutely nothing about it that makes it maladapted for magicka builds - in fact, I've seen plenty of magicka builds using this.
    It's Offensive Penetration, Weapon/Spell Damage, Weapon/Spell Damage and a proc which scales of the higher of your weapon/spell damage - perfectly fine for any build, as long as you don't use it on body pieces.

    Lol, this set doesnt need a nerf at all. The damage is already low. If you get taken out by this set because of its dot, you need to work on your set up. If you get taken out from the explosion that mwans you were the X against one player and they got you for ganging up. So no, no nerf needed here just play better and learn to take a lose when you fall for a trap.
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
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    Youyouz06 wrote: »
    On PC EU last night, a whole group of AD (+30) died to this set (group implosion)....and the server went 'bonkers'...we all had a slow bug after and thought we were going to crash.

    Problem is when Necro using both Dark Convergence and Plaguebreak. We cannot break at all, is insta death to everyone all 10+ players caught on it, the Colossus is usually there for the bonus if someone manages to break free who had 60K hp and max resistances.

    Tonight we lost dozens of people easily per jump of 2 guys. Ofc ZOS instead of balancing out PVP and get it back to what it was in early 2014 where battles lasted for quite some time, we are in a damn fragfest of 1 button press nucking whole alliance group.

    I wonder some times what they are thinking when they make such sets. Nothing is not an answer.
    Sets like these are what has kept me from away from Cyro at the level 50+ campaigns and why if I want PVP i choose different games.

    This issie with dark convergence isnt the set procing set or the combo its that this set stuns instead of immobilization. If it immobilized instead of stunning it would allow for players to counter or dodge the attack. That needs to be changed to dark convergence.
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
  • Mr_Stach
    Mr_Stach
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    I don't care about plaguebreak too much except with the Betty Purge. If I'm gonna be nuking myself, I'd like for it to be on my own terms, not when my little buddy is just trying to "help".

    In conclusion, Remove self purge from Betty and just increase its sustain return.
    Altoholic, Frost Warden Sympathizer and Main

    Glacial Guardian - Main - Frost Warden Zealot
    The Frost Man Cometh - PC Frost Backup
  • Holycannoli
    Holycannoli
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    Just learning about this set now. Does it proc with AOE, like you can make multiple plaguecarriers at once?
  • Wolfpaw
    Wolfpaw
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    Keep PB and DC as is, they're great. Really looking forward to Occult Overload buff also. Sick and tired of faction zerging bringing performance down, turn them all into popcorn.

    don't zerg and these sets won't be a problem
    Edited by Wolfpaw on June 2, 2022 4:13PM
  • DRTE
    DRTE
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    What needs to happen is sets that have ramping damage for wiping groups need diminishing returns while in a group similar to rallying cry. the more people in a group the less viable those sets are. lets just say for every person in a group the explosive damage from Plague and dark con and other sets that are made for this type of group burst do 4% less.
    so a group of 12 gets their pb explosive damage reduced by nearly 50% so for small scale and solo players this set is still powerful.
    In saying that yes i can see zerg surfing and procing full damage still but at least it would slow the ball groups from running massive burst from it. certain buffs and heals need to be group only so players can't run next to their group (while not being in the group) while procing full damage. its all a mess but honestly dying to plague is currently the least of my worries. nova harmony bombs are still the most lethal way to kill a strong group.
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  • madman65
    madman65
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    I use this set and found that as a PVP set it still does not breakup ball groups because of cross healing, if it is to continue as a PVP set then yes it needs fixed. As a PVE set, this is great set that does help on Trial and Dungeon mobs. I will state that if ESO/ZOS wants to breakup ball groups then make a nuclear bomb for us to use because the ball group can be as big as 30 - 50 players and yes I have seen them.
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