New small quest chains in prior zones (revisiting NPCs, locales, etc.) [possible spoilers]

tinythinker · May 2022

So way back on these forums I had mused about opening up new areas with old zones for additional quests. ZOS eventually kind of did that with some of the prologue quests, which was really interesting. Lots of us have asked about when they might make new DLC in existing zones, but we realize ZOS wants to keep adding new zones for as long as possible, which absolutely makes sense!

ZOS has added some dailies for a few NPC guilds to add more life to base game zones (*cough* Psijic Order next?*). In the past (if I find the post I'll link it here) I asked about the possibility of having Alliance themed dailies as well for Hidden Armigers, Ring of Daggers, and Eyes of the Queen for further flavor and lore exploration, etc. Or to add NPC guild quests to old DLC zones, again for more adventure and different angles to explore the area and its story themes. I've seen other people on the forums and elsewhere with similar interests and suggestions.

In this same vein, I was thinking about one-off NPCs or NPC groups or locales that people really liked from the base game or DLCs. Not as dailies, but as short quest chains, each allowing for further NPC development and interaction. Please note this is not asking for more things like Stibbons or the Dwemer Scholar twins just happening to show up in some new DLC zone for a one-off quest. I'm talking 3-5 or so quests that can be in old/existing zones, which may or may not be the original zone an NPC or NPC group appeared in.

This idea won't appeal to everyone, none would, but it gives a chance for devs to revisit and expand on their work and players who enjoyed some one-off NPCs or NPC groups to have a little more fun. A new type of mini-content that can be sprinkled in from time to time.

And yes, it takes dev resources but they find those for ideas they like that players want.

If you did want to see a brief revisit of a locale, NPC, or NPC group which would you pick?

(*This was asked about by others and I've seen the replies that there are enough Summerset dailies...??????? It's the Psijic Order. They sent you all across Tamriel fetching and fixing things. Why in the world would their dailies be limited to a single zone?)

Edit: Added spoiler warning

jle30303 · May 2022

There are not many things I want from previous quest zones, but here are a few:

(1) An option for those people who chose to save Valaste at the end of the Mages Guild, to find the Folium Discognitum (and get their 2 skill points) some other way. Conversely, an option for those who picked the 2 skill points to find a way to save Valaste, because it's not fair that people are forced to permanently gimp themselves just to feel "virtuous" when it doesn't even affect their subsequent gameplay.

(2) A way to save BOTH halves of the couple in the Kulati Mines, Alikr Desert, by picking a boss fight with the spider daedra. Perhaps this should only be accessible to people who have beaten Molag Bal (i.e. have a Soul Magic level of the maximum 6), in which case it should be accessible even to people who have "completed" the older version of the quest and left one or both people behind. We've faced down at least one Daedric Prince - possibly more (Nocturnal, Mehrunes Dagon, arguably Mephala and Clavicus Vile too although we mostly only face their agents and machinations) - why should a not particularly special Spider Daedra be capable of forcing a disadvantageous deal?

At the moment it's particularly badly designed because it isn't even a choice between "save one or the other", it's "save only the Orc or lose both, no option to save the Redguard except by not completing the quest at all". There should at least be a way to save the Redguard and complete the quest, even if it becomes a one-or-the-other thing.

(3) Honestly, if you're going to have both Lyris and Sai show up alive again in major questlines, while Varen remains dead and only appears as a ghost once (at the end of Orsinium), do away with the fictional choice of which one you sacrifice and railroad the player into sacrificing Varen instead. The game and the story basically assume you did that anyway, and handwaves Sai and Lyris back.

(4) Formally link all the Prologue quests (in the game's main zones) to starting the main quests of the Chapters and Story DLCs. Give the Prologue quests "main-quest" shaped arrows rather than "sidequest" shaped arrows. Make it so that when you complete the prologue quest you are automatically either started on the first quest of the relevant Chapter or DLC (this is currently only the case with Clockwork City, where you get a pointer to Divayth Fyr), or - preferably handed a Quest Item which, when used, starts that quest, and can sit in the inventory before that without cluttering up the maximum of 25 quests.

(5) Corollary to the above: When you talk to Stuga just to stop her chasing you, she should not give you a quest directly. She should hand you the Invitation to Orsinium, which is a Quest Item. Reading it should start the quest: the player should have the option of not reading it till later, and thus not having the Orsinium quests cluttering up and counting against their maximum of 25 quests.

Ermiq · May 2022

Well, there're certainly a lot of people I would love to meet again. So, for sure, I raise up all my hands and legs to vote for the idea.
However, if you ask for examples, I just got one thing instantly come to my mind (because I just did that quests yesterday) - the Bleakrock island. I would like to get it back from the Covenant raiders. To restore the place and get all the good local people back (except the ones we didn't evacuate during our adventures there).
For now I just have to not start the evacuation quest to keep the place in peace and to be able to meet all those newbie characters going out of the starting house.

Kesstryl · May 2022

I'd just like to have some finished quests make an impact on the world like some of the examples listed above. I'd like to see the village of Crestshade restored once you stop the bloodfiends after it's little quest, and things like that. I know it would involve phasing but the game already does that when a friend I'm grouped with sees a quest NPC that I can't because I already completed that quest and I'm just tagging along for camaraderie. There are so many places where quest completion updating the game world would make it feel like your actions truly had weight.

They already allow us to revisit NPCs with new chapters, but I'd love to see actions in a DLC or chapter update the NPC when we encounter them in a base game zone too. They sort of did that with Lyranthe. After I did Blackwood, I encountered her in a base game quest in Shadowfen, and she actually had dialogue that was related to the Blackwood story. I thought that was so cool! More stuff like this please! How about updating Castle Ravenwatch for those who did the Greymoor story arc. How about some dialogue from Raz if you helped him in Elsweyr. This just makes the NPCs feel a touch more alive and aware.

The_Boggart · May 2022

I always expected an expedition to take back bleakrock

tinythinker · May 2022

Ermiq wrote: »

Well, there're certainly a lot of people I would love to meet again. So, for sure, I raise up all my hands and legs to vote for the idea.
However, if you ask for examples, I just got one thing instantly come to my mind (because I just did that quests yesterday) - the Bleakrock island. I would like to get it back from the Covenant raiders. To restore the place and get all the good local people back (except the ones we didn't evacuate during our adventures there).
For now I just have to not start the evacuation quest to keep the place in peace and to be able to meet all those newbie characters going out of the starting house.

The_Boggart wrote: »

I always expected an expedition to take back bleakrock

Let's go

tinythinker · May 2022

jle30303 wrote: »

(4) Formally link all the Prologue quests (in the game's main zones) to starting the main quests of the Chapters and Story DLCs. Give the Prologue quests "main-quest" shaped arrows rather than "sidequest" shaped arrows. Make it so that when you complete the prologue quest you are automatically either started on the first quest of the relevant Chapter or DLC (this is currently only the case with Clockwork City, where you get a pointer to Divayth Fyr), or - preferably handed a Quest Item which, when used, starts that quest, and can sit in the inventory before that without cluttering up the maximum of 25 quests.

Since many people do the prologue before you can to starter quest of the new zone, the item would be better. Just have the NPC ask you to hold onto it or the narrator text tells you that you think you should keep the item for now. When you log in after the zone is available having it auto-starts that next quest with pop-up narrative text, like getting a message or feeling an urge to travel to a specific spot or something else that gets you headed in the right direction.

tinythinker · May 2022

Kesstryl wrote: »

I'd just like to have some finished quests make an impact on the world like some of the examples listed above. I'd like to see the village of Crestshade restored once you stop the bloodfiends after it's little quest, and things like that. I know it would involve phasing but the game already does that when a friend I'm grouped with sees a quest NPC that I can't because I already completed that quest and I'm just tagging along for camaraderie. There are so many places where quest completion updating the game world would make it feel like your actions truly had weight.

They already allow us to revisit NPCs with new chapters, but I'd love to see actions in a DLC or chapter update the NPC when we encounter them in a base game zone too. They sort of did that with Lyranthe. After I did Blackwood, I encountered her in a base game quest in Shadowfen, and she actually had dialogue that was related to the Blackwood story. I thought that was so cool! More stuff like this please! How about updating Castle Ravenwatch for those who did the Greymoor story arc. How about some dialogue from Raz if you helped him in Elsweyr. This just makes the NPCs feel a touch more alive and aware.

Yeah phasing needs to be fixed anyway. You should have the option to "sink down" while grouped to an earlier stage to help friends.

Yes, they bring some NPCs back for one offs, but that's not the same as a mini-quest chain and as you say it would be fun to have such chains in the base game or old DLC rather than just new DLC.

Also yeah, many locales like Crestshade and Bleakrock would be interesting to revisit and feel like you had an impact. Can stil have bloodfiends or Covenant troops hanging around nearby to fight.

WiseSky · May 2022

jle30303 wrote: »

There are not many things I want from previous quest zones, but here are a few:

(1) An option for those people who chose to save Valaste at the end of the Mages Guild, to find the Folium Discognitum (and get their 2 skill points) some other way. Conversely, an option for those who picked the 2 skill points to find a way to save Valaste, because it's not fair that people are forced to permanently gimp themselves just to feel "virtuous" when it doesn't even affect their subsequent gameplay.

(2) A way to save BOTH halves of the couple in the Kulati Mines, Alikr Desert, by picking a boss fight with the spider daedra. Perhaps this should only be accessible to people who have beaten Molag Bal (i.e. have a Soul Magic level of the maximum 6), in which case it should be accessible even to people who have "completed" the older version of the quest and left one or both people behind. We've faced down at least one Daedric Prince - possibly more (Nocturnal, Mehrunes Dagon, arguably Mephala and Clavicus Vile too although we mostly only face their agents and machinations) - why should a not particularly special Spider Daedra be capable of forcing a disadvantageous deal?

At the moment it's particularly badly designed because it isn't even a choice between "save one or the other", it's "save only the Orc or lose both, no option to save the Redguard except by not completing the quest at all". There should at least be a way to save the Redguard and complete the quest, even if it becomes a one-or-the-other thing.

(3) Honestly, if you're going to have both Lyris and Sai show up alive again in major questlines, while Varen remains dead and only appears as a ghost once (at the end of Orsinium), do away with the fictional choice of which one you sacrifice and railroad the player into sacrificing Varen instead. The game and the story basically assume you did that anyway, and handwaves Sai and Lyris back.

(4) Formally link all the Prologue quests (in the game's main zones) to starting the main quests of the Chapters and Story DLCs. Give the Prologue quests "main-quest" shaped arrows rather than "sidequest" shaped arrows. Make it so that when you complete the prologue quest you are automatically either started on the first quest of the relevant Chapter or DLC (this is currently only the case with Clockwork City, where you get a pointer to Divayth Fyr), or - preferably handed a Quest Item which, when used, starts that quest, and can sit in the inventory before that without cluttering up the maximum of 25 quests.

(5) Corollary to the above: When you talk to Stuga just to stop her chasing you, she should not give you a quest directly. She should hand you the Invitation to Orsinium, which is a Quest Item. Reading it should start the quest: the player should have the option of not reading it till later, and thus not having the Orsinium quests cluttering up and counting against their maximum of 25 quests.

Please use spoilers next time if you can not everyone has done all the quests.

Bat · May 2022

jle30303 wrote: »

(2) A way to save BOTH halves of the couple in the Kulati Mines, Alikr Desert, by picking a boss fight with the spider daedra. Perhaps this should only be accessible to people who have beaten Molag Bal (i.e. have a Soul Magic level of the maximum 6), in which case it should be accessible even to people who have "completed" the older version of the quest and left one or both people behind. We've faced down at least one Daedric Prince - possibly more (Nocturnal, Mehrunes Dagon, arguably Mephala and Clavicus Vile too although we mostly only face their agents and machinations) - why should a not particularly special Spider Daedra be capable of forcing a disadvantageous deal?

I know this quest is supposed to be a bit sad but I couldn't help but laugh when that Orc lady came into the room and said "Do you know how long I've been looking for you?"

tinythinker · May 2022

I was just thinking about a couple of NPCs from the Summerset DLC that would be fun to have a mini-quest chain for outside of that island:

Manacar the hulkynd: he could easily be sent off-island to fetch something for one of the nobles who want to keep their hands clean.

Silurie, the former member of the Divine Prosecution who explores the dangerous and unexplained. Lots of things could take her across Tamriel.