ZENIMAX NEW TERMS OF SERVICE MUST BE ACCEPTED BEFORE LOGING ON TO MY ACCOUNT

Nietzsche · May 2014

I finally gave up on maintenance/patching and decided it was time to cancel my subscription I tried to logon to my account and was presented with a compulsory agreement that I have to accept to manage my account which I didn't obviously.

I'm sorry my friends but that is illegal If I wish to cancel my current subscription under the terms that I accepted INITIALLY then I am entitled to do so, you cannot force anyone to such an agreement to manage their current account.

This new agreement was needed given the ridiculous amounts of downtime/patching/maintenance they have been doing which is unacceptable and loosing them a lot of paying customers.

Notice point 6

6. AVAILABILITY OF SERVICES AND CONTENT; GAME MAINTENANCE, PATCHES, UPDATES; TERMINATION OF SERVICES
7.
"ZeniMax does not guarantee that any Services will be available at all times, in all countries and/or geographic locations, at any given time, or that it will continue to offer any particular Services for any particular length of time. Except as prohibited by applicable law, ZeniMax reserves the right to change and update Content without notice to You. ZeniMax also reserves the right to refuse Your request(s) to acquire Content, and to limit or block any request to acquire Content, including, but not limited to, Downloadable Content, for any reason."
"ZeniMax may patch, update, or modify at any time with or without notice to You. "

Zenimax customer service is going from bad to worse and this is truly disappointing, making you sign an agreement to login to your account is a sneaky move that I would not expect from a company like this.

I will now have to write an email as a official request to cancel my subscription given they are forcing me to accept an agreement to which I do not agree in order to access my account.

I'm out.

Sakiri · May 2014

Seeya. Most MMOs change or otherwise require you to sign that EVERY patch so....

Bangstin · May 2014

Every single mmo works the exactly the same way with their terms of services.

Slash8915 · May 2014

You must be new to MMO's. As the others have said, EVERY MMO I've ever played makes you accept that after each patch.

Nietzsche · May 2014

If you want to carry playing yes, not to manage your account.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · May 2014

That is not new either. Its the same as it always has been.

Kyle_Roberts · May 2014

Herp and a derp.

Soloeus · May 2014

Can someone direct me to any online service that doesn't have these agreements? Or any modern game?

Didn't think so.

"Free Market" remember? They can do anything they want. Enjoy it, your option is regulation of that free market by mandating pro-consumer policies or removing anti-consumer ones.

Sadly, the entire ToS and EULA exists ONLY to give "the company" an umbrella to cancel your account/end the service without notice or accountability. Unfortunately, there are a lot of total jerks out there and this kind of policy was a response to those jerks.

Thanks to a few bad apples, we all must live under Draconian Policies "just in case" someone decides to be jerky and say "but no rule says I can't!". Maybe someone in corporate was afraid of a class action lawsuit on the grounds of not receiving the service? (not being able to log in and play).

Wintermist · May 2014

Reminds me of this lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31HaTbWONmQ

Guizan · May 2014

Accepting new terms of service is ok when patching the game but I think the OP is forced to accept when logging in on the account page on the web. That does seem a bit bad form from Zenimax that one has to accept the terms of service to be able to cancel the use of said service.

Nietzsche · May 2014

They should have it when you login to play or give you the option to cancel your subscription should you not accept the new agreement, instead I am forced to accept a new agreement to cancel my subscription.

Arkadius · May 2014

I don't know, if it's the same in every mmo. But I highly doubt it.
But it doesn't make it less illegal to force a customer to accept a new tos and, if he does not accept, not allow him to cancel the sub.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · May 2014

Guizan wrote: »

Accepting new terms of service is ok when patching the game but I think the OP is forced to accept when logging in on the account page on the web. That does seem a bit bad form from Zenimax that one has to accept the terms of service to be able to cancel the use of said service.

It isnt new. I logged in it didnt ask me to accept anything. The part he linked for sure is not new.

Guizan · May 2014

Soloeus wrote: »

Can someone direct me to any online service that doesn't have these agreements? Or any modern game?

Didn't think so.

Well usually you agree on terms when you first create an account, and then there is an agreement in the client that you have to agree to whenever they change the terms. Having to agree to the terms entering the account management pages to change your subscription is not really ok.

Nietzsche · May 2014

Go the below response from the team, another perfect example of GREAT customer service, what part of the I CANNOT LOGON TO THE ACCOUNT GIVEN THAT I AM FORCED TO ACCEPT AN AGREEMENT DID YOU NOT GET CARLOS?

"Thank you for contacting The Elder Scrolls Online Team.

We apologize for any inconvenience this issue may have caused you!

I am sorry to hear that you are displeased with the server maintenance times. Unfortunately, we experienced and unscheduled emergency maintenance, in order to improve players gaming experience.
I assure you that our team is working hard to make sure everything will be running smooth soon.

In order to cancel a subscription, please follow the information below:

1. Login to the account page
2. Under the "Game Time Remaining" section click on the 'Manage subscription' option
3. Choose the option to cancel the subscription

Should you need any further assistance please feel free to contact us again!

Thank you for your patience and understanding!

Warm Regards,
Carlos the Summoner
The Elder Scrolls Online Team"

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · May 2014

Guizan wrote: »

Soloeus wrote: »

Can someone direct me to any online service that doesn't have these agreements? Or any modern game?

Didn't think so.

Well usually you agree on terms when you first create an account, and then there is an agreement in the client that you have to agree to whenever they change the terms. Having to agree to the terms entering the account management pages to change your subscription is not really ok.

AGAIN its not new. Look at this link. The last time the terms of use was updated was in January.

http://www.zenimax.com/legal_terms_us

Darlon · May 2014

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Guizan wrote: »

Soloeus wrote: »

Can someone direct me to any online service that doesn't have these agreements? Or any modern game?

Didn't think so.

Well usually you agree on terms when you first create an account, and then there is an agreement in the client that you have to agree to whenever they change the terms. Having to agree to the terms entering the account management pages to change your subscription is not really ok.

AGAIN its not new. Look at this link. The last time the terms of use was updated was in January.

http://www.zenimax.com/legal_terms_us

and that's just not true...

I just visited the account page (I admit I haven't been there for a week or 2) and had to accept a new version... I have been there after launch though, so the change happened in the last few weeks.. and NOT in january...

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · May 2014

lol its the same agreement. Look at my link and what he posted. Its the exact same wording. Has been there since day 1. Its not new at all just something flagged as you hadnt accepted it yet. There is no "new" version. Its the same version as always.

KerinKor · May 2014

Nietzsche wrote: »

Go the below response from the team, another perfect example of GREAT customer service, what part of the I CANNOT LOGON TO THE ACCOUNT GIVEN THAT I AM FORCED TO ACCEPT AN AGREEMENT DID YOU NOT GET CARLOS?

Given you only need to access your account in order to rage-quit then your refusal to accept this new term seems somewhat over-emotional and infantile?

Bromburak · May 2014

Nietzsche wrote: »

6. AVAILABILITY OF SERVICES AND CONTENT; GAME MAINTENANCE, PATCHES, UPDATES; TERMINATION OF SERVICES
7.
"ZeniMax does not guarantee that any Services will be available at all times, in all countries and/or geographic locations, at any given time, or that it will continue to offer any particular Services for any particular length of time. Except as prohibited by applicable law, ZeniMax reserves the right to change and update Content without notice to You. ZeniMax also reserves the right to refuse Your request(s) to acquire Content, and to limit or block any request to acquire Content, including, but not limited to, Downloadable Content, for any reason."
"ZeniMax may patch, update, or modify at any time with or without notice to You. "

Problem with that is, you can push it far beyond any limit of customer acceptance and you will pay a high price as company providing the not available service on a long term.

Especially if you miss communicating properly to your customers.
And having more and more spontanous maintenance times will run any company into "trouble" because many customers will not accept this any longer what always results into financial consequences.

Personally i think Zenimax is working hard but they know very well that reaction and numbers of customers could be better in the business.

Such servicing issues have influence on the revenue.
Doesnt matter if customers accept those servicing terms at release. For a business its still important that you keep those customers happy as long you can.

IMHO the real problem is not the availability of technical services its more the way how zenimax treat customers including communication. They pushing it as far they can, and apparently management thinks this is the right strategy. Good luck with that.

Sakiri · May 2014

Guizan wrote: »

Soloeus wrote: »

Can someone direct me to any online service that doesn't have these agreements? Or any modern game?

Didn't think so.

Well usually you agree on terms when you first create an account, and then there is an agreement in the client that you have to agree to whenever they change the terms. Having to agree to the terms entering the account management pages to change your subscription is not really ok.

Blizzard and SOE both require you to accept eula/tos every patch, regardless of if it changes.

Asking for an agreement going into account management is a bit odd.

And that provision isnt new.

Wintermist · May 2014

They require it to play, but not to edit your account. There's a huge difference.

Sakiri · May 2014

Darlon wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Guizan wrote: »

Soloeus wrote: »

Can someone direct me to any online service that doesn't have these agreements? Or any modern game?

Didn't think so.

Well usually you agree on terms when you first create an account, and then there is an agreement in the client that you have to agree to whenever they change the terms. Having to agree to the terms entering the account management pages to change your subscription is not really ok.

AGAIN its not new. Look at this link. The last time the terms of use was updated was in January.

http://www.zenimax.com/legal_terms_us

and that's just not true...

I just visited the account page (I admit I haven't been there for a week or 2) and had to accept a new version... I have been there after launch though, so the change happened in the last few weeks.. and NOT in january...

That isnt a new version.

Thats you being asked to continue agreeing to the same contract.

Bangstin · May 2014

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

lol its the same agreement. Look at my link and what he posted. Its the exact same wording. Has been there since day 1. Its not new at all just something flagged as you hadnt accepted it yet. There is no "new" version. Its the same version as always.

What this guy said.

knaveofengland · May 2014

all games have a legal notes we have to agree to its common , so they done a up date to cover something they didn't have now they have covered it,
we all would like the time spent on other things, but these legal notes have to be done we all dislike them but still that's the legal side of things

Darlon · May 2014

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

lol its the same agreement. Look at my link and what he posted. Its the exact same wording. Has been there since day 1. Its not new at all just something flagged as you hadnt accepted it yet. There is no "new" version. Its the same version as always.

Funny thing is it is the 3rd time since january that I had to accept it (and yes, I have accepted it before)... that is a bit weird then ??

and it still leaves the issue of the guy not able to end his subscription without accepting it again... which is bs..

Nietzsche · May 2014

Regardless of being new or not you cannot force anyone to sign something if you wish to cancel your current agreement.

Laura · May 2014

Read your google agreements and cellphone contracts while your at it that is pretty tame.

Is this for real or a really good troll.

Some people are dumb. Like really really dumb. So dumb and cynicle it makes me cringe. (Disclaimer: this is an off topic statement and directed at nobody in particular some people are, in fact, dumb.)

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · May 2014

Its Zenimax's game they can make you accept the agreement again if they want to. You go in cancel your account and thats the end.

dinges · May 2014

You people heavily miss the point of the OP. He IS right in his proclaim and yes, this gets done by other MMO's as well but these are not "extra" conditions... This is literally cleaning your plate from any responsibility. Worse it indicates that its not getting solved. When it explodes in the media they got their bases covered.

Its sad.

Skeksi · May 2014

I would advise you to call customer service, ask to be escalated until you get someone on the phone who is able to cancel your subscription for you and then request written confirmation to be emailed to you stating that the subscription has been cancelled. You may have to be prepared to stay on hold for long periods of time, but I would insist on staying on the line while your call is escalated, as you may not receive a call back.

Alternatively agree to the terms and conditions and cancel your account. That would be quicker and effectively have the same outcome. You would also be sure it was actually cancelled.