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Drop monster helmet on normal.
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AuraStorm43✭✭✭✭✭danielpang32 wrote: »Franchise408 wrote: »Vet rewards should be earned through vet difficulty.
There is no gear / class / skill restriction to do vet dungeons, and if you're not wanting to play vet content anyways, then there's little to no need for monster gear.
You mostly wear only 1 piece anyway, and everyone can just buy the shoulder and combine it with a mythic item that doesn't require playing vet. So I agree.
You just not answering the question. All you say is to avoid/skip the helmet.
How are you going to get a helmet in PUG.
I’ve gotten plenty of vet dlc clears in pugs, especially in the newer dungeons where its way easier
Which monster set are you missing that isn’t puggable? Unhallowed is long sure but its not that hard to pug compared to lair of maarselookEdited by AuraStorm43 on December 10, 2021 6:37AM1 -
danielpang32✭✭✭danielpang32 wrote: »Your comment is not helpful and do no benefit to the game.
Wrong. The comment was 100% correct.
If veteran content is too stressfull and difficult and generally repels you, there is no need to improve your gear accordingly because there is no non-veteran content that requires you to wear a monster set. The current state does benefit the game because it provides a challenge to the players and makes them improve their SKILL level (which is far more important than their gear) in the long run.
But knowing ZOS and the attitude of ESO community and looking back at sticker books and transmute stations and imperfected arena weapons, I expect them to dull down the game improve the QoL even more by introducing an imperfected monster helm mechanic in the future. So stay tuned.
You are incorrect. You are not even answering the question. All you said is to avoid doing vet dungeons or improving player skill. How are you going to improve other player skill in PUG?
If you so believe that the gameplay will be "dull down", then tell me how to finish the DLC vet dungeon in PUG. I am playing healer myself, and I dont see what I can do to improve my PUG team DPS so drastically that they can handle the mechanic. Vet dungeon require player to be so dedicate to become a mono-focus role. And there is so many players are playing hybrid build. And they want the helmet to play with and they couldnt do it.
Those popular youtube/ top% are not even trying to follow the mechanic. They are trying to overpower the dungeon by high damage, in order to avoiding the mechanic.
No, I did not say "avoid them". I said grow a pair, queue up, play them, get used to them, improve your skill level and get the reward instead of play the "oh this is too stressful for me give me the reward anyways though kthx"-card. I don't know where this "you can not play vet DLC dungeons in PUG's" narrative comes from. It is pure nonsense. Of course you can PUG vet DLC dungeons. I do it all the time. Sometimes you're unlucky and get a group that doesn't seem to be able to make it. In that case, you can either try or leave and re-queue.
And why are we talking about vet DLC all of a sudden? We are talking about monster helmets, which are available in all veteran dungeons. Is vCoA1 unPUGable too? When did that happen?
All monster helmet is coming from vet dungeon. And vet dungeons are all available under the PUG system. You dont need to bring up the overall accessible basegame content to make your argument agreeable. Because the vet DLC dungeon number are increasing every single year. And they are the biggest problem in PUG system.
If the game allow a somebody run into the PUG vet dungeon, it means the game is seeing this player as worthy subject to complete the content. Your "leave and re-queue" opinion just told me that the game has a design error that let this "unlucky" happen.0 -
Succuby✭✭✭danielpang32 wrote: »Normal dungeons should drop monster helmet. And the veteran version will be title as "Prefect-".
SO player can improve their gear accordingly.
If you are those "good" player, who try to tell me "find some friend and do vet".
NO, you dont understand what are you try to talk about about and you dont know what is the problem.
If the game allow you to PUG vet dungeon, they should be able to finish as PUG oriented team.
Stop gating ppl from getting gear which has no equivalent subsituation.
If you keep trying to follow the "advice" from those so call top% player, you will jsut follow the same fate as World of Warcraft.
Their veteran dungeons version which called "mythic dungeons". These hard version dungeons have little to no relevant toward the general playerbase.
Because they are to difficult (gear/class/skill restriction), majority of their player refuse to do it because they are stressful and time costing.
Game is for fun. Everytime I finished a dlc vet dungeon. I dont feel a single sensation of joy and success. All I can feel is relieved and I dont want to play them again.
I can solo a lot of vet dunguans and some dlc dunguans. So i think random group can pass it by 4 people.
Do not see reason to refarm all content again to get the same "perfected" stuff because some people can not do it.
Dunguans give no money, now noob can take care run if he wants and get item he wants. If you remove any reason to go vet dunguans add items there "if it is hard content" that reward players with money than.
Pass - get 200 k, pass one more time - get 200 k more.
Or vet content just be useless and only noobs will play this game.5 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yes, I bought my helms from the Golden before I was ready to run vet. It was a great compromise.
I despise doing dungeons, especially vet. So I have purchased all 3 weights of every helm / shoulder that has passed through The Golden over the past few years. Sadly, the rotation on The Golden is far from complete, there are a great many sets that have never appeared and I doubt they ever will, since some are very old sets. In the meantime, I think it has been months since I have seen anything I don't already own on The Golden.
I wish ZOS would just make it pure random or a set rotation (preferable) of every monster set in the game each week, and at least give a chance of something new showing up. I totally get not putting the latest dungeons set there immediately, as they want people to run it, but 6 months or a year later... it should be in the rotation for sure.
Honestly the PvP crowd needs some changes specifically designed to make their play time better and not just something like this
When I think of the benefits of such a thing I think
1) Less bad dps in the queue, which may even lead to less fake tanks in the RND. One of the primary drivers of that is bad dps in vet dungeons. And the primary reasons those dps are there is the helms
2)More ability for PvP players to have a less frustrating experience with the golden
3)A modest buff for good players especially in mid range skill wise
When I think of the bad...
1) some people might be annoyed newer players have it easier
2) ?????
I'm currently drawing a blank0 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I can solo a lot of vet dunguans and some dlc dunguans. So i think random group can pass it by 4 people.
Actually, if you have the gear / skills, it is easier to solo than do it with 3 other completely uncoordinated players. One really bad player can actually stop a group from progressing. I tend to duo with my wife, and we can blow through content that becomes exponentially harder and possibly fail at... when adding 2 more not so good players.
Edited by Kwoung on December 10, 2021 6:45AM1 -
aaisoaho✭✭✭✭✭danielpang32 wrote: »There is alternative ways of getting monster heads: the golden vendor. There is also an alternative to the very difficult realm of veteran DLC dungeons: non-DLC veteran dungeons. Without monster set, you can do dungeons like veteran Crypt of Hearts 1/veteran Fungal Grotto 1 to get a monster set helmet. Ilambris and Kra'gh are okay for dds, Selene performs on a very similar level of dps than for example kjalnar. So there is already a way to progress to get the dlc helmets.
You just not answering the question. All you say is to avoid/skip the DLC helmet.
How are you going to get a DLC helmet in PUG.
I did not say to avoid or skip them. I said that you should try progressing from non-DLC to DLC. To first get monster sets from non-DLC dungeons, and with them get clears in vDLCs. The DLC monster sets aren't even needed if playing dd.
I got my vDLC clears with group finder pugs. I used non-DLC monster sets first.5 -
Xebov✭✭✭✭✭
✭danielpang32 wrote: »And the veteran version will be title as "Prefect-".
The moment you do this ppl will just skip normal and go to vet directly.
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ixthUA✭✭✭✭✭
In vet dungeons half of DDs are newbies and other half are PvPers, both do fine in non-DLC dungeons. Not all DLC dungeons have strong DPDs checks, so they are doable too.spartaxoxo wrote: »The idea is to give PVP a better option than waiting around all year for the golden to come around. And it would also pull a lot of people not built for pve dps out of vet queue, which is a major issue.
By making the Vet version perfected his idea also already rewards people for doing the harder content.
Perfected versions would bring imbalance if they are stronger than current versions, and it would create a lot of additional work for both players and developers. A better solution would be to create an alternative way for PvPers to get their gear, much less work for the same effect. Something like a vendor inside dungeon that trades random reward boxes for PvP points.
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danielpang32✭✭✭
Adding perfected monster sets will make power creep even worse. And ZoS would definitely make us farm them again instead of upgrading the monster sets we've already acquired.danielpang32 wrote: »Normal dungeons should drop monster helmet. And the veteran version will be title as "Prefect-".
If perfected monster sets are not added then this change would further reduce incentives to do a veteran dungeon. Monster set is one of the few unique incentives to do a vet dungeon, it should stay like that.
Maybe they are not intended for the general playerbase.danielpang32 wrote: »Their veteran dungeons version which called "mythic dungeons". These hard version dungeons have little to no relevant toward the general playerbase.
There is no power creep. In contrary, it reduces the gap between one player to another. Because now, the situation is one player has helmet, one dosent have it.
Providing Prefect- version, and letting normal version drop in normal dungeon means both player can access the helmet. Even thought the state of the helmet is different, the gap is smaller.
Veteran dungeons is too allow player to challenge themselves by facing a difficult content in the game and the achievement has already given them far better reward than normal dungeon counterpart.0 -
danielpang32✭✭✭danielpang32 wrote: »And the veteran version will be title as "Prefect-".
The moment you do this ppl will just skip normal and go to vet directly.
According to the situation in trial, there is plenty of groups running normal trial content to get themselves the entry version of the gear. So, your comment is incorrect.0 -
danielpang32✭✭✭AuraStorm43 wrote: »danielpang32 wrote: »danielpang32 wrote: »Your comment is not helpful and do no benefit to the game.
Wrong. The comment was 100% correct.
If veteran content is too stressfull and difficult and generally repels you, there is no need to improve your gear accordingly because there is no non-veteran content that requires you to wear a monster set. The current state does benefit the game because it provides a challenge to the players and makes them improve their SKILL level (which is far more important than their gear) in the long run.
But knowing ZOS and the attitude of ESO community and looking back at sticker books and transmute stations and imperfected arena weapons, I expect them to dull down the game improve the QoL even more by introducing an imperfected monster helm mechanic in the future. So stay tuned.
You are incorrect. You are not even answering the question. All you said is to avoid doing vet dungeons or improving player skill. How are you going to improve other player skill in PUG?
If you so believe that the gameplay will be "dull down", then tell me how to finish the DLC vet dungeon in PUG. I am playing healer myself, and I dont see what I can do to improve my PUG team DPS so drastically that they can handle the mechanic. Vet dungeon require player to be so dedicate to become a mono-focus role. And there is so many players are playing hybrid build. And they want the helmet to play with and they couldnt do it.
Those popular youtube/ top% are not even trying to follow the mechanic. They are trying to overpower the dungeon by high damage, in order to avoiding the mechanic.
No, I did not say "avoid them". I said grow a pair, queue up, play them, get used to them, improve your skill level and get the reward instead of play the "oh this is too stressful for me give me the reward anyways though kthx"-card. I don't know where this "you can not play vet DLC dungeons in PUG's" narrative comes from. It is pure nonsense. Of course you can PUG vet DLC dungeons. I do it all the time. Sometimes you're unlucky and get a group that doesn't seem to be able to make it. In that case, you can either try or leave and re-queue.
And why are we talking about vet DLC all of a sudden? We are talking about monster helmets, which are available in all veteran dungeons. Is vCoA1 unPUGable too? When did that happen?
All monster helmet is coming from vet dungeon. And vet dungeons are all available under the PUG system. You dont need to bring up the overall accessible basegame content to make your argument agreeable. Because the vet DLC dungeon number are increasing every single year. And they are the biggest problem in PUG system.
If the game allow a somebody run into the PUG vet dungeon, it means the game is seeing this player as worthy subject to complete the content. Your "leave and re-queue" opinion just told me that the game has a design error that let this "unlucky" happen.
If you’re having so much trouble you could you know, organize a group with people who need the same gear? I dunno why some people complain so much about pugs yet insist on doing pugs
[snip] How are you going to PUG vet DLC dungeon. If game allow player to PUG vet DLC dungeon, it means They are suppose to be doable bu PUG group.
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 10, 2021 7:12PM0 -
thorwyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭They are.And if the dam breaks open many years too soon
And if there is no room upon the hill
And if your head explodes with dark forebodings too
I'll see you on the dark side of the moon4 -
deleted221106-002999✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭danielpang32 wrote: »
[snip] How are you going to PUG vet DLC dungeon. If game allow player to PUG vet DLC dungeon, it means They are suppose to be doable bu PUG group.
You seem to be avoiding the alternate solution the game already provides you: use the golden vendor in cyrodiil if you are unhappy with running vet dungeons for helms. You may have to wait a bit for the helm you want to appear, though.
This has been suggested several times in this thread.
Regarding the pug question: vet pug groups are mostly ok for most vet dungeons including dlc ones. You can usually tell the bad groups very quickly and can vote-to-kick or drop group after the first trash pull or first boss. If you've struggled to find a good group then that's incredibly bad luck only - maybe change the time you choose to queue to somewhat alter the queueing players' demographic might get you better results? Or pre-form your own group/part-group via friends/guild/zone chat?
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 10, 2021 7:12PM9 -
colossalvoids✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭danielpang32 wrote: »AuraStorm43 wrote: »danielpang32 wrote: »danielpang32 wrote: »Your comment is not helpful and do no benefit to the game.
Wrong. The comment was 100% correct.
If veteran content is too stressfull and difficult and generally repels you, there is no need to improve your gear accordingly because there is no non-veteran content that requires you to wear a monster set. The current state does benefit the game because it provides a challenge to the players and makes them improve their SKILL level (which is far more important than their gear) in the long run.
But knowing ZOS and the attitude of ESO community and looking back at sticker books and transmute stations and imperfected arena weapons, I expect them to dull down the game improve the QoL even more by introducing an imperfected monster helm mechanic in the future. So stay tuned.
You are incorrect. You are not even answering the question. All you said is to avoid doing vet dungeons or improving player skill. How are you going to improve other player skill in PUG?
If you so believe that the gameplay will be "dull down", then tell me how to finish the DLC vet dungeon in PUG. I am playing healer myself, and I dont see what I can do to improve my PUG team DPS so drastically that they can handle the mechanic. Vet dungeon require player to be so dedicate to become a mono-focus role. And there is so many players are playing hybrid build. And they want the helmet to play with and they couldnt do it.
Those popular youtube/ top% are not even trying to follow the mechanic. They are trying to overpower the dungeon by high damage, in order to avoiding the mechanic.
No, I did not say "avoid them". I said grow a pair, queue up, play them, get used to them, improve your skill level and get the reward instead of play the "oh this is too stressful for me give me the reward anyways though kthx"-card. I don't know where this "you can not play vet DLC dungeons in PUG's" narrative comes from. It is pure nonsense. Of course you can PUG vet DLC dungeons. I do it all the time. Sometimes you're unlucky and get a group that doesn't seem to be able to make it. In that case, you can either try or leave and re-queue.
And why are we talking about vet DLC all of a sudden? We are talking about monster helmets, which are available in all veteran dungeons. Is vCoA1 unPUGable too? When did that happen?
All monster helmet is coming from vet dungeon. And vet dungeons are all available under the PUG system. You dont need to bring up the overall accessible basegame content to make your argument agreeable. Because the vet DLC dungeon number are increasing every single year. And they are the biggest problem in PUG system.
If the game allow a somebody run into the PUG vet dungeon, it means the game is seeing this player as worthy subject to complete the content. Your "leave and re-queue" opinion just told me that the game has a design error that let this "unlucky" happen.
If you’re having so much trouble you could you know, organize a group with people who need the same gear? I dunno why some people complain so much about pugs yet insist on doing pugs
[snip] How are you going to PUG vet DLC dungeon. If game allow player to PUG vet DLC dungeon, it means They are suppose to be doable bu PUG group.
They're not avoiding anything as you can already pug any dlc dungeon without much issue, vet queue often brings enough good players for a clear and in situation where all the newbies met it's still manageable if they're trying enough and have a hour or two to spare, can't expect 15 min run with zero experience. Not getting group matching your competence or carrying you through? Tough luck, try next time or improve your play to be the one player who's critical to the groups success - there's also solo arenas on vet to train alone.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 10, 2021 7:13PM4 -
Succuby✭✭✭I can solo a lot of vet dunguans and some dlc dunguans. So i think random group can pass it by 4 people.
Actually, if you have the gear / skills, it is easier to solo than do it with 3 other completely uncoordinated players. One really bad player can actually stop a group from progressing. I tend to duo with my wife, and we can blow through content that becomes exponentially harder and possibly fail at... when adding 2 more not so good players.
I can do the same in craft gear on 300+ cp character, but much longer
Just drop and do not resurect bad player if such big problems he makes, or buy carry, a lot of options better than to a lot of players refarm their gear again and make it gold.
I already run mailstorm 100 times and than 100 times more ti get the same but peflrfected weapon. See no reason in such changes.
Add simple monster helmets that have no 1 set bonus, not add new items exp players will need to refarm for million times.
Simple monster helmet - for normals - OK, with no bonus from 1 set item. No perfected anything with next nerf of dps, so you need refarm all gear again.Edited by Succuby on December 10, 2021 7:27AM1 -
wolfie1.0.✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »In FFXIV normal dungeons are harder than vet DLC dungeons here, and in FFXIV you need to do them to progress main story.
I've been running vet dungeons for 6 months by now (PUG, solo queue) and only few of them can fail if DPS check is not passed (need at least 20K combined DPS for some of them).
The idea is to give PVP a better option than waiting around all year for the golden to come around. And it would also pull a lot of people not built for pve dps out of vet queue, which is a major issue.
By making the Vet version perfected his idea also already rewards people for doing the harder content.
But also wouldn't that mean that the perfected version becomes the new meta and a requirement to grind? It would need to be powerful enough to make it worth completing on vet vs normal. Thus making it more of a must have and invalidating the original helm. Comparing it to other perfected vs non perfected gear it's almost like going off trait.
I am on the fence with this and my gut is that if zos rolls with this then they will further gut monster sets.
Anytime zos makes a change that players want or demand we don't always get exactly what we want.0 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭danielpang32 wrote: »AuraStorm43 wrote: »danielpang32 wrote: »danielpang32 wrote: »Your comment is not helpful and do no benefit to the game.
Wrong. The comment was 100% correct.
If veteran content is too stressfull and difficult and generally repels you, there is no need to improve your gear accordingly because there is no non-veteran content that requires you to wear a monster set. The current state does benefit the game because it provides a challenge to the players and makes them improve their SKILL level (which is far more important than their gear) in the long run.
But knowing ZOS and the attitude of ESO community and looking back at sticker books and transmute stations and imperfected arena weapons, I expect them to dull down the game improve the QoL even more by introducing an imperfected monster helm mechanic in the future. So stay tuned.
You are incorrect. You are not even answering the question. All you said is to avoid doing vet dungeons or improving player skill. How are you going to improve other player skill in PUG?
If you so believe that the gameplay will be "dull down", then tell me how to finish the DLC vet dungeon in PUG. I am playing healer myself, and I dont see what I can do to improve my PUG team DPS so drastically that they can handle the mechanic. Vet dungeon require player to be so dedicate to become a mono-focus role. And there is so many players are playing hybrid build. And they want the helmet to play with and they couldnt do it.
Those popular youtube/ top% are not even trying to follow the mechanic. They are trying to overpower the dungeon by high damage, in order to avoiding the mechanic.
No, I did not say "avoid them". I said grow a pair, queue up, play them, get used to them, improve your skill level and get the reward instead of play the "oh this is too stressful for me give me the reward anyways though kthx"-card. I don't know where this "you can not play vet DLC dungeons in PUG's" narrative comes from. It is pure nonsense. Of course you can PUG vet DLC dungeons. I do it all the time. Sometimes you're unlucky and get a group that doesn't seem to be able to make it. In that case, you can either try or leave and re-queue.
And why are we talking about vet DLC all of a sudden? We are talking about monster helmets, which are available in all veteran dungeons. Is vCoA1 unPUGable too? When did that happen?
All monster helmet is coming from vet dungeon. And vet dungeons are all available under the PUG system. You dont need to bring up the overall accessible basegame content to make your argument agreeable. Because the vet DLC dungeon number are increasing every single year. And they are the biggest problem in PUG system.
If the game allow a somebody run into the PUG vet dungeon, it means the game is seeing this player as worthy subject to complete the content. Your "leave and re-queue" opinion just told me that the game has a design error that let this "unlucky" happen.
If you’re having so much trouble you could you know, organize a group with people who need the same gear? I dunno why some people complain so much about pugs yet insist on doing pugs
[snip] How are you going to PUG vet DLC dungeon. If game allow player to PUG vet DLC dungeon, it means They are suppose to be doable bu PUG group.
While I support your overall idea, vet dlcs are doable in pug groups. I just did Vet Fang Lair with a PUG today.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 10, 2021 7:13PM1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I already run mailstorm 100 times and than 100 times more ti get the same but peflrfected weapon. See no reason in such changes.
They could have chosen to upgrade our gear to the vet version automatically and it was one of the main devs that made the decision to not do that, and many of his crew disagreed. I would hope they would not repeat that decision as I strongly feel it was a mistake.
We can have stuff have both a perfect and normal version AND not make people refarm perfect gear, the two are not mutually exclusive.Edited by spartaxoxo on December 10, 2021 7:32AM0 -
Olen_Mikko✭✭✭✭✭
✭That's a hard No! Vet dungeons are easy enough and there's already great variatons to replace monsteri sets.
This game is already way too easy and that just makes it even easier.
NB enthusiastic:- Woodhippie stamblade - DW hard-hitter / PvE
- Know-it-all elf Magblade - Healer / PvE & PvP
- Hate-them-all elf Magblade - Destrostaff AoE monster / PvE
- Cyrodiil-Refugee stamblade - Stamina Tank / PvE
Go dominion or go home
Nightblade-Hipster. I played Nightblade before it was cool - from 1.5 onwards.9 -
Succuby✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I already run mailstorm 100 times and than 100 times more ti get the same but peflrfected weapon. See no reason in such changes.
They could have chosen to upgrade our gear to the vet version automatically and it was one of the main devs that made the decision to not do that, and many of his crew disagreed. I would hope they would not repeat that decision as I strongly feel it was a mistake.
We can have stuff have both a perfect and normal version AND not make people refarm perfect gear, the two are not mutually exclusive.
It is more simple to give Simple monster sets, if they add some thing perfected - they just nerf dps after that.
It is better to add simple monster sets for normals with no other changes in game.
And if for arenas may be it is - solo hard to pass, for dunguans you already have random finder where with some luck party pass even without farmer of helmets action.
What for is such big changes ?Edited by Succuby on December 10, 2021 7:41AM1 -
Arthtur✭✭✭✭✭
✭1) Perfected Monster Set. Rly? So we have to farm all the helmets again? And buy all the shoulders too? What about no? Maybe instead of using monster set use mythic or 2x arena weapon?
2) There is Golden Vendor. Even if its bad its still exists and is an option.
3) Why dont make Monster Sets without 1p bonus and then put them into normals? So all "veteran" players dont have to farm they sets again.
4) and the most important one. I dont belive a PvP player will skip any possible bonus in his build xD Like rly? U wanna tell me that PvP player will forget about that sweet 1k stamina/magicka/health or 4% healing done/taken or 124 WD/SD bonus?
Im not even gonna talk about those leads from PvP i had to farm... or about that PA set that i needed to farm too...
Also its funny. Tanks complain about fake dds in dungeons - ppl are discusing what "fake" means and saying that there is not such thing as fake dd. PvP player complains that he cant get a monster set in pugs - yes we have to do something about it!
My experience of PvP players in vet dlc dungeons = DD - Less than 10k dps, dont knows mechs, half of the time a toxic player. Healer - only heals, 0 group buffs, 0 communication. Tanks - S&B but no taunt, i got only one tank like that but oh well.
So sorry but im against it. And im not saying that u are one of those bad player that i got. I just dont belive that adding weaker/stronger monster sets would change anything.3 -
wolfie1.0.✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I already run mailstorm 100 times and than 100 times more ti get the same but peflrfected weapon. See no reason in such changes.
They could have chosen to upgrade our gear to the vet version automatically and it was one of the main devs that made the decision to not do that, and many of his crew disagreed. I would hope they would not repeat that decision as I strongly feel it was a mistake.
We can have stuff have both a perfect and normal version AND not make people refarm perfect gear, the two are not mutually exclusive.
True, unless zos chooses that it be mutually exclusive, as what happened with VMA weapons. Having weapons drop from NMA was a player request and they implemented it and we didn't get exactly what we wanted, and we still technically havn't in that regard. But that is also par for the course for ZOS very very few changes that players request are granted without ZOS adding their own little twist to it.
Do we really trust zos not to throw a similar snag at this? I don't0 -
Stirvik✭✭Go and join the queue for a Random VET dungeon, You find most VET players are more than willing to help, remember everyone was a noob at some point.2
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bmnoble✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I don't see the harm, they already made Maelstrom weapons available in normal, a lot of monster sets that see little use are needlessly beyond the reach of players who just want to screw around with them in overland, without having to do a Vet DLC dungeon to get their hands on them.
The base game vet dungeons are not too bad, getting a group for even a normal DLC dungeon can be a pain at times let alone some of the Vet DLC ones.
For me its not a case of difficulty its a case of input lag in the Vet dungeons, on the same level as being in the big fights in Cyrodiil where skills don't always activate or your bar does now want to swap properly, its not as big an issue in normal dungeons but in Vet difficulty being unable to react to a mechanic in time means you die, making doing the content a pain, especially as the DLC ones tend to be more mechanic heavy.1 -
KhajiitLivesMatter✭✭✭✭I don't see the harm, they already made Maelstrom weapons available in normal, a lot of monster sets that see little use are needlessly beyond the reach of players who just want to screw around with them in overland, without having to do a Vet DLC dungeon to get their hands on them.
The base game vet dungeons are not too bad, getting a group for even a normal DLC dungeon can be a pain at times let alone some of the Vet DLC ones.
For me its not a case of difficulty its a case of input lag in the Vet dungeons, on the same level as being in the big fights in Cyrodiil where skills don't always activate or your bar does now want to swap properly, its not as big an issue in normal dungeons but in Vet difficulty being unable to react to a mechanic in time means you die, making doing the content a pain, especially as the DLC ones tend to be more mechanic heavy.
the harm?
1. [snip] ALL players who have helmets so far will need grind them AGAIN with the same difficulty - which is unfair [snip]
2. it feels bad if everyone gets the stuff u took time and afford to get
3. why should every beginner have best gear avialbe(and honestly 1k stats dont matter at all) dont know any GOOD game where a new player has the same gear 2h in the game as a expierienced 1000h+ player
4.me and MANY others hated the maelstrom change cause we needed to waste way to much time to get our stuff again and honestly if i have to do that again with 100+ monster mask pieces i would straight up qiet
[edited for bashing & profanity bypass]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 10, 2021 11:28AM7 -
wheresbes✭✭✭✭danielpang32 wrote: »[snip] How are you going to PUG vet DLC dungeon. If game allow player to PUG vet DLC dungeon, it means They are suppose to be doable bu PUG group.
You 100% can PUG vet dungeons.
When I started doing dungeons, even normal ones were hard. Now, I PUG at least 1 random vet daily and the majority of times it goes smoothly, even DLC ones. My combination of class and race is a mess according to meta standards, yet I haven't got any particular issue.
If you like running this type of content, you should get comfortable in normal dungeons, have a read on vet mechs (xynode makes good guides), and start with an easy vet, such as wayrest sewers 1. Trust me, it gets easier the more you do them.
Anyway, to reply to your question, it would be ok for me to have a perfected version for vets and a non-perfected for normals. Dungeons are probably my favourite content in-game and with the curated drops it won't be an issue to fill the new pieces of the sticker book.
To reply to some other things I've read in the comments:
1. You don't necessarily need head and shoulders for PVP, shoulders and 1 mythic can be a better solution on some occasions
2. Stop making differences between PVPers and PVErs; I keep meeting great PVE players being also great at PVP and great PVP players being also amazing in dungeons. Anyone can swap gear/CP/skills, it's even easier now with the armory.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 10, 2021 7:14PM3 -
Parrot1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭Monster sets provide little to no overall benefit to dps compared to the rest of your sets and skills. It’s a few K dps which isn’t really huge.
If someone isn’t able to comfortable complete veteran dungeons it would have even less benefit.
For me this request is lowering the bar even further to resolve an issue in which the “fix” won’t make any impact at all as the OP believes these are required to complete the content to begin with which is nonsense.
It also would penalise all other players with these new “non-perfect” sets and make them need to famr the perfect versions for the extra stats they would provide. Not to mention the balance issues in introducing new stats for perfected along with the already existing 1 piece stats.
Also The comparison to wow is nonsense. Mythic dungeons drop higher item level sets which has a much bigger impact on your dps output than gear will in Eso. Mythics require certain ilvl to complete them and the higher you have the easier it should be but class and gear is hardly a requirement unless you are pushing very high keys.4 -
caesarvs✭✭✭✭monster sets contribute little to overall dps. Just look at the parses around there. If you cant complete veteran dungeons, even the base game ones, without monsters sets, then you don't need they, you need to learn how to play the game first, it's "veteran" content after all.10
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bmnoble✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭KhajiitLivesMatter wrote: »I don't see the harm, they already made Maelstrom weapons available in normal, a lot of monster sets that see little use are needlessly beyond the reach of players who just want to screw around with them in overland, without having to do a Vet DLC dungeon to get their hands on them.
The base game vet dungeons are not too bad, getting a group for even a normal DLC dungeon can be a pain at times let alone some of the Vet DLC ones.
For me its not a case of difficulty its a case of input lag in the Vet dungeons, on the same level as being in the big fights in Cyrodiil where skills don't always activate or your bar does now want to swap properly, its not as big an issue in normal dungeons but in Vet difficulty being unable to react to a mechanic in time means you die, making doing the content a pain, especially as the DLC ones tend to be more mechanic heavy.
the harm?
1. [snip] ALL players who have helmets so far will need grind them AGAIN with the same difficulty - which is unfair [snip]
2. it feels bad if everyone gets the stuff u took time and afford to get
3. why should every beginner have best gear avialbe(and honestly 1k stats dont matter at all) dont know any GOOD game where a new player has the same gear 2h in the game as a expierienced 1000h+ player
4.me and MANY others hated the maelstrom change cause we needed to waste way to much time to get our stuff again and honestly if i have to do that again with 100+ monster mask pieces i would straight up qiet
@KhajiitLivesMatter
Missed the OP talk of perfected versions due to their spelling. I don't agree with adding perfected versions of the monster sets to the game.
But don't see much of an issue with the monster helms dropping in normal in addition to vet just like with any other gear piece in those dungeons, people can already buy the helms/shoulders on the golden vendor without having set foot in a dungeon.
With the amount of them have been nerfed, to push people to using the mythics, at least to me I don't consider many of them to be "the best gear" as people put its often better to just be using 2, 1 piece bonuses from them in a lot of cases, which is a shame because quite a few of them are fun to use but not a viable as other options.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 10, 2021 7:09PM0 -
Xebov✭✭✭✭✭
✭danielpang32 wrote: »danielpang32 wrote: »And the veteran version will be title as "Prefect-".
The moment you do this ppl will just skip normal and go to vet directly.
According to the situation in trial, there is plenty of groups running normal trial content to get themselves the entry version of the gear. So, your comment is incorrect.
I would not compare vet trials and vet dungeons on that level. Besides that ppl already skip normal dungeons on pledges to do vet for the better rewards even if they are not ready and a perfected piece would likely cause similar issues.
Iam not against dropping the helmets on normal, iam just not a fan of adding perfected versions.0