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Would you want a placeable trader for your house?
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Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yes
Except that would not happen. It's one of those things where a developer tries to mitigate potential issues, but an issue that actually never materializes. Many many many games have had changes to mechanics or added things to the game that they said they'd never do for XYZ reason.Also, I was clear that Zenimax, according to my guildmate, did comment on why there were not going to increase functionality in homes that are found in cities because they want players to have a reason to go to such cities.
Allowing people to sell furniture only out of their home will be no more detrimental than placing guild traders out in the middle of nowhere where no one is to be seen.
Secondly. It makes ZERO sense (due to the concern that you assert they have), to NOT allow homes in cities, if anything it should be city only homes that are allowed that feature. If you want to drive people to the cities, create homes in the cities where players list furniture with their own furniture stall. That DRIVES people to the cities. Their logic is backwards.
It makes no sense at all. Player homes in cities with furniture stalls would drive traffic to cities.The only clarity I added was that I was not going to search the internet for this as it was apparently in one of their streams. Hard to search for that. Not concerned if anyone believes they said it or not, or even if my guildmate is right or wrong since it does not change anything of value. However, it does make a lot of sense.
Again, I respect your opinion on what might happen with such additions but all we can offer is our opinions and guesses based on our opinions. It has been a nice discussion though.
I would argue its less of an opinion or guess, and more of acute observation of into the psychology of people who play MMORPGs that I have observed for almost 20 years. Simply, many of the things the developers are concerned about, are not actual problems or something to be concerned about.
In fact, I get a very strong feeling that most of the pushback on good ideas for this game has less to do with the idea and more to do with....well lets just say things that go beyond the scope of trying to make the game fun.0 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yesspartaxoxo wrote: »They're adequate for finding general items widely available. But for rarer goods it's a terrible system that doesn't take into proper consideration a player's time and assumes they have all day to spend shopping for imaginary items on a video game.
Eh. I think it's a fair tradeoff for the generally better prices on console. There's way less flipping going on and browsing small traders can often make you find a good deal, which can be a fun surprise.
Flipping is a problem, and probably the primary reason a number of TTC users don't support just adding an auction house. But at least I can usually find a specific item I'm looking for - outside of general crafting materials - within a reasonable amount of time without having to navigate a hundred different vendors and dozens of load screens. So if I have to pay more to avoid that headache I'll gladly do so.
I'm not one of those people who enjoy shopping different vendors looking for a good deal or a fun surprise. But if you are, then I can understand why you like the system.
How is flipping a problem? The person listing the item got what they requested and the person that purchases the item when it is listed again gets what they wanted. I do not know how this is a problem as I have seen it happen in other games where friends found a good deal, purchased it, and listed it again for a gain.
Because the economy is not ever reaching or vast. In fact, with ESO, its actually a pretty small economy per MMORPG standards. This allows people with deep pockets to purchase items, literally all the items of a particular item and relist them, controlling the market.
This is why the developers made the trade guilds in the first place is it not? I always found it....odd that they would offer the API for trading (so addons could be made) that circumvented the design goals of the guild trader in the first place.
Anyway, MM, TTC and custom private addons allow for easy collection of these items which are flipped for extreme prices.
I watched a handful of guild traders rise the price of mundane runes last year (before you started the game). Flipping is extremely bad for the economy, in fact its bad for the economy IRL as well.0 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭YesFlipping is extremely bad for the economy, in fact its bad for the economy IRL as well.
Honestly it's only recently that I really began to appreciate ZOS's initial design on guild traders as I used to want an auction house. But seeing the console economy now vs the PC economy, as well as thinking about other MMOs with auction houses I played long term (which had the same issues as PC economy) I have really come to appreciate it. It creates a real barrier to flipping that doesn't eliminate it for those who are diligent and work hard at it. And also makes it harder to monoplize through wealth.Edited by spartaxoxo on December 9, 2021 4:11AM0 -
Amottica✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Just show me the results already
Except that would not happen. It's one of those things where a developer tries to mitigate potential issues, but an issue that actually never materializes. Many many many games have had changes to mechanics or added things to the game that they said they'd never do for XYZ reason.Also, I was clear that Zenimax, according to my guildmate, did comment on why there were not going to increase functionality in homes that are found in cities because they want players to have a reason to go to such cities.
Allowing people to sell furniture only out of their home will be no more detrimental than placing guild traders out in the middle of nowhere where no one is to be seen.
Secondly. It makes ZERO sense (due to the concern that you assert they have), to NOT allow homes in cities, if anything it should be city only homes that are allowed that feature. If you want to drive people to the cities, create homes in the cities where players list furniture with their own furniture stall. That DRIVES people to the cities. Their logic is backwards.
It makes no sense at all. Player homes in cities with furniture stalls would drive traffic to cities.The only clarity I added was that I was not going to search the internet for this as it was apparently in one of their streams. Hard to search for that. Not concerned if anyone believes they said it or not, or even if my guildmate is right or wrong since it does not change anything of value. However, it does make a lot of sense.
Again, I respect your opinion on what might happen with such additions but all we can offer is our opinions and guesses based on our opinions. It has been a nice discussion though.
I would argue its less of an opinion or guess, and more of acute observation of into the psychology of people who play MMORPGs that I have observed for almost 20 years. Simply, many of the things the developers are concerned about, are not actual problems or something to be concerned about.
In fact, I get a very strong feeling that most of the pushback on good ideas for this game has less to do with the idea and more to do with....well lets just say things that go beyond the scope of trying to make the game fun.
I understand as we all have our rationale and logic for our opinions. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on yours. I think it is great how players can share their thoughts on such ideas and respect each other's thoughts on the matter.0 -
FlopsyPrince✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Sylvermynx wrote: »Not my idea of fun. I don't like the trader system in this game, and I have no interest in being involved with it.
I don't like the guild trader either, but my own banker should provide all the benefits of any other banker.PC
PS4/PS50 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yesspartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »They're adequate for finding general items widely available. But for rarer goods it's a terrible system that doesn't take into proper consideration a player's time and assumes they have all day to spend shopping for imaginary items on a video game.
Eh. I think it's a fair tradeoff for the generally better prices on console. There's way less flipping going on and browsing small traders can often make you find a good deal, which can be a fun surprise.
Flipping is a problem, and probably the primary reason a number of TTC users don't support just adding an auction house. But at least I can usually find a specific item I'm looking for - outside of general crafting materials - within a reasonable amount of time without having to navigate a hundred different vendors and dozens of load screens. So if I have to pay more to avoid that headache I'll gladly do so.
I'm not one of those people who enjoy shopping different vendors looking for a good deal or a fun surprise. But if you are, then I can understand why you like the system.
That's understandable. I have only had the problem of having to deal with like a hundred different traders once in the past year. So while it was incredibly frustrating experience, it happens so rarely that I personally wouldn't want to deal with higher prices on more regular purchases to fix it.
But I usually am not searching for rare items and most of my purchases are fairly simple, so it's very rare for me not to find the item in say Vardenfell if it wasn't in a major city. And 99% of the time major cities have everything I need.
I do wonder if there is more variety at our traders too though. One thing I noticed people saying a lot in these threads from PC is that they have to meet a number of sales to remain in trade guilds. That's not a thing on console. It's basically all dues based. So people who have items that sell slower tend to also be in these major trading hubs due to the increased visibility. Is also the case that almost anything can be bought in like 6-7 cities on PC?
How often do you come across that issue?
Well I haven't for awhile since I use the TTC website. That usually helps me find the item I'm looking for in a reasonable amount of time.
But back before I used the website, frequently. Probably every time I went to look for a motif or some specific piece of gear i wanted.1 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yesspartaxoxo wrote: »They're adequate for finding general items widely available. But for rarer goods it's a terrible system that doesn't take into proper consideration a player's time and assumes they have all day to spend shopping for imaginary items on a video game.
Eh. I think it's a fair tradeoff for the generally better prices on console. There's way less flipping going on and browsing small traders can often make you find a good deal, which can be a fun surprise.
Flipping is a problem, and probably the primary reason a number of TTC users don't support just adding an auction house. But at least I can usually find a specific item I'm looking for - outside of general crafting materials - within a reasonable amount of time without having to navigate a hundred different vendors and dozens of load screens. So if I have to pay more to avoid that headache I'll gladly do so.
I'm not one of those people who enjoy shopping different vendors looking for a good deal or a fun surprise. But if you are, then I can understand why you like the system.
How is flipping a problem? The person listing the item got what they requested and the person that purchases the item when it is listed again gets what they wanted. I do not know how this is a problem as I have seen it happen in other games where friends found a good deal, purchased it, and listed it again for a gain.
Probably best if I don't get into it, since this thread is about personal traders. I don't want to be accused of derailing the thread.0