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How much penetration do you provide as tank?
Ippokrates
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Quick question to all tanks, cause I am trying to see how much we should invest in penetration for stam builds in group content.
Edited by Ippokrates on November 30, 2021 9:56AM How much penetration do you provide as tank? 23 votes
Up to 9k
26%
6 votes
Up to 11k
52%
12 votes
Up to 13k
13%
3 votes
Up to 15k
8%
2 votes
Up to 17k
0%
17k+
0%
1
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pklemming✭✭✭✭✭
✭9K on trash, 11-13k on bosses. Depends on group make up, though. I carry sets for higher levels of debuff, if needed. Crimson is not a bad farm for new tanks, when needed, neither is tremorscale. Alkosh is still a bit more of a pain, though I prefer it over crimson personally. Most tanks have a plethora of sets they have farmed so you can adjust to situations and group make up.
You don't really invest in stuff for stam, you invest in time to get sets for multiple situations, in the same way most healers will have quite a few sets at their disposal, just in case.0 -
WraithShadow13✭✭✭✭i honestly never knew i had to provide anything, as a tank, other than a beefy target for enemies.
What would i need to be doing to add team-wide buffs like pen?3 -
ApoAlaia✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭WraithShadow13 wrote: »i honestly never knew i had to provide anything, as a tank, other than a beefy target for enemies.
What would i need to be doing to add team-wide buffs like pen?
Pierce Armour already provides Major/Minor breach apart from taunting (a smidgen below 9K debuff).
Although this might sound like a cop out anything I might write here was been already written more eloquently and with more confidence here:
https://thetankclub.com/2 -
Ippokrates✭✭✭✭✭Up to 15kWraithShadow13 wrote: »i honestly never knew i had to provide anything, as a tank, other than a beefy target for enemies.
What would i need to be doing to add team-wide buffs like pen?
Well, the additional penetration is not necessary when you are running magicka-dd group, because of light armour, but stamina must take optional penetration from weapons, so it would be nice to know how much I should get to do not waste pen on maces or sharpened and get things like daggers, Nirnhorned or precise traits instead.
But because most of stuff that provide additional penetration is heavy armour (like Crimson Oath), require taunt (Tremorscale) or medium armour (Alkosh), I don't think that these could be provided by healer/support role (maybe stamhealer in the last case, but they are not so popular, right?).Edited by Ippokrates on November 30, 2021 11:35AM1 -
Jazraena✭✭✭✭✭
✭Unless you get a fake tank you will have Major and Minor Breach. Many, but not all, provide Infused Crusher.
Anything beyond that is pure luck.1 -
Grandchamp1989✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Up to 11kMajor and minor breach + infused crusher.
If I run with a stam group I provide Crimson and/or tremorscale aswell.Edited by Grandchamp1989 on November 30, 2021 7:35PM3 -
Sarannah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I always build my tanks to tank, it is up to the DPS to do DPS. However, I do use pierce armor and any other debuffs/buffs the classes provide. Like mark target on nightblade, or the DK damage buff, etc. Not sure how much penetration this provides.
Forcing tanks to wear armorsets which increase groupDPS will only cause more wipes, in my opinion. And having to restart a full fight takes longer, than when a fight itself takes a few seconds longer.
PS: I feel using more DPS to skip bosstactics, is just a cheap copout for players unable to perform those tactics.Edited by Sarannah on November 30, 2021 11:52AM4 -
Larcomar✭✭✭✭✭For RNDs, major breach on trash from caltrops, major/minor breach on bosses from puncture.
For vets, same plus infused crusher.
I can't even remember what those add up to. 5k trash, 9k normal bosses, 12k vet?
I don't generally do trials. But Im pretty casual0 -
Ippokrates✭✭✭✭✭Up to 15kFor RNDs, major breach on trash from caltrops, major/minor breach on bosses from puncture.
For vets, same plus infused crusher.
I can't even remember what those add up to. 5k trash, 9k normal bosses, 12k vet?
I don't generally do trials. But Im pretty casual
9100 on normal, 18200 on vet, but some arena bosses and mobs have 12100, so not sure if you do not have those values in vet dungs/trials too.0 -
Mumbles_the_Tank✭✭✭Forcing tanks to wear armorsets which increase groupDPS will only cause more wipes, in my opinion. And having to restart a full fight takes longer, than when a fight itself takes a few seconds longer.
PS: I feel using more DPS to skip bosstactics, is just a cheap copout for players unable to perform those tactics.
Feel what you like, you’re still wrong on every point.
Penetration is vital and as much a primary responsibility for a good tank as holding taunt. They’ve made it way easier these days but running Crusher/Major/Minor should be the bare minimum even for magicka comps.
PS. We saw and cleared all the mechs just fine before we learned to skip them
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MEBengalsFan2001✭✭✭✭✭Up to 11kIppokrates wrote: »Quick question to all tanks, cause I am trying to see how much we should invest in penetration for stam builds in group content.
I provide minor courage and a damage shield for the group. I use puncture and staff has the debuff as well. Should I provide more, IMO no. Top level enemies have 18K resistance. My job isn't to completely remove the resistance for my group. The DPS in groups should have around 5-8K pen on them to ensure they are maxing out their damage, which isn't hard to do.2 -
Vevvev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Up to 11kI have Infused Crusher boosted by Torug's Pact and Puncture giving Major and Minor Breach.PC NA - Ceyanna Ashton - Breton Vampire MagDK1 -
Fennwitty✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Up to 9kMy answer is something of an 'average' when doing dungeons.
I can provide more Penetration for harder fights and in trials, and routinely do in dungeons as well if Crushing procs. I just don't pay as much attention to ensuring Crusher uptime in dungeons. More about area control and taunting the dangerous adds.PC NA1 -
pklemming✭✭✭✭✭
✭I always build my tanks to tank, it is up to the DPS to do DPS. However, I do use pierce armor and any other debuffs/buffs the classes provide. Like mark target on nightblade, or the DK damage buff, etc. Not sure how much penetration this provides.
Forcing tanks to wear armorsets which increase groupDPS will only cause more wipes, in my opinion. And having to restart a full fight takes longer, than when a fight itself takes a few seconds longer.
PS: I feel using more DPS to skip bosstactics, is just a cheap copout for players unable to perform those tactics.
The use of things like War machine, Saxheel, Drake's Rush, Arkasis, Elemental Catalyst, Powerful Assault, etc all help augment the group. It is not one, or the other. We still tank hard modes, we still do mechanics, we just make the group or trial more efficient.1 -
bmnoble✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Up to 11kPierce Armour and Tremorscale on bosses/dangerous ads. Razor Caltrops on trash that there is little time to taunt one by one.
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Succuby✭✭✭Up to 9kMumbles_the_Tank wrote: »Forcing tanks to wear armorsets which increase groupDPS will only cause more wipes, in my opinion. And having to restart a full fight takes longer, than when a fight itself takes a few seconds longer.
PS: I feel using more DPS to skip bosstactics, is just a cheap copout for players unable to perform those tactics.
Feel what you like, you’re still wrong on every point.
Penetration is vital and as much a primary responsibility for a good tank as holding taunt. They’ve made it way easier these days but running Crusher/Major/Minor should be the bare minimum even for magicka comps.
PS. We saw and cleared all the mechs just fine before we learned to skip them
Fully disagree As a tank i want to do dps, not buf other peoples DPS. Game do not give me this option. A lot of games let tanks do good dps, wow is not exeption, but in teso tank do 4 k dps.
You force people play like they do not want, thats why so small amount of tanks you see.
They just will not play the way that they do not like. Good player do not care is some thing effective or not if he do not like it. He care do effective thingth he likes. Or just will not do. He just will not play than, thats why so small number of tanks you see.Edited by Succuby on December 1, 2021 11:13AM1