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Suggestion Partially Intermingled PVP/PVE content
Tornaad
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This suggestion is in part a response to a YouTube video by @NefasQS talking about his concerns about PVP.
Edit:
Just to be clear, there are two separate ideas, that are listed.
Idea 1.
Create daily quests in PVE zones that affect PVP play in Cyrodiil. For example, if the Ebonheart Pact completes more war effort quests than the other two factions, for the next 24 hours they will get a bonus to the war efforts in some manner, like for example extra siege equipment or maybe even a damage bonus.
Idea 2
Additionally, if you have the war stop being so stagnant then it can help spice things up a little. For example, if the Dominion starts doing really well, then let players participate in an invasion of a PVE zone, thus making a PVE zone temporarily PVP while both Players and NPC's try to fight off the invading army.
Now, while I suck at PVP, I did have a lot of fun sneaking through Cyrodill and trying to collect the shards.
The benefit of doing this, is that it gives PVP players a reason to want to go into PVE and thus a reason to want to purchase PVE new zones, which can thus generate more revenue from those players which would then justify putting more resources towards improving the experience for PVP players.
Does anyone else have any ideas for how to improve PVP?
Edited by Tornaad on October 6, 2021 2:45PM Edit:
Just to be clear, there are two separate ideas, that are listed.
Idea 1.
Create daily quests in PVE zones that affect PVP play in Cyrodiil. For example, if the Ebonheart Pact completes more war effort quests than the other two factions, for the next 24 hours they will get a bonus to the war efforts in some manner, like for example extra siege equipment or maybe even a damage bonus.
Idea 2
Additionally, if you have the war stop being so stagnant then it can help spice things up a little. For example, if the Dominion starts doing really well, then let players participate in an invasion of a PVE zone, thus making a PVE zone temporarily PVP while both Players and NPC's try to fight off the invading army.
Now, while I suck at PVP, I did have a lot of fun sneaking through Cyrodill and trying to collect the shards.
The benefit of doing this, is that it gives PVP players a reason to want to go into PVE and thus a reason to want to purchase PVE new zones, which can thus generate more revenue from those players which would then justify putting more resources towards improving the experience for PVP players.
Does anyone else have any ideas for how to improve PVP?
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Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭My feeling on the matter is, that the PVE players in this game are so adamantly against PVP, they wouldn't do the quests. On the flip side, PVP players already have to engage in an inordinate amount of PVE in order to PVP in the first place. People like me, that do both, probably wouldn't mind, but don't see it being a big hit, just more posts complaining about PVP quests taking the slot of PVE quests on the forums.
The only thing PVP needs in this game to make it great again... is performance. Get rid of the lag, random disconnects, slow bug, freezing, macro slices, etc... and that's all it needs.13 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭My feeling on the matter is, that the PVE players in this game are so adamantly against PVP, they wouldn't do the quests. On the flip side, PVP players already have to engage in an inordinate amount of PVE in order to PVP in the first place. People like me, that do both, probably wouldn't mind, but don't see it being a big hit, just more posts complaining about PVP quests taking the slot of PVE quests on the forums.
The only thing PVP needs in this game to make it great again... is performance. Get rid of the lag, random disconnects, slow bug, freezing, macro slices, etc... and that's all it needs.
So why would NefasQS suggest that PVP players do not need to do any PVE content?0 -
redspecter23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Invading a PVE zone with PVP players sounds like a horrible idea. It would be a slaughter. What's the point of that?9 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭redspecter23 wrote: »Invading a PVE zone with PVP players sounds like a horrible idea. It would be a slaughter. What's the point of that?
Ideally it would not just be PVP players verses PVE players it would hopefully be PVP, PVE and NPC players verses invading PVP players.
In the quests to several zones there are already cases where other factions "invade" into the zone. My thought was make that a bit more dynamic.
And yes, I agree that if it was just PVP versus PVE then people like me would get slaughtered.0 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭redspecter23 wrote: »Invading a PVE zone with PVP players sounds like a horrible idea. It would be a slaughter. What's the point of that?
Additionally, my question was to ask for more (or better) ideas to fix PVP.0 -
NylAR✭✭✭✭My feeling on the matter is, that the PVE players in this game are so adamantly against PVP, they wouldn't do the quests. On the flip side, PVP players already have to engage in an inordinate amount of PVE in order to PVP in the first place. People like me, that do both, probably wouldn't mind, but don't see it being a big hit, just more posts complaining about PVP quests taking the slot of PVE quests on the forums.
The only thing PVP needs in this game to make it great again... is performance. Get rid of the lag, random disconnects, slow bug, freezing, macro slices, etc... and that's all it needs.
It's not just this game... It's about every MMO I've played. Players just have to accept it in most games, cause there usually is no choice - so they're not as vocal. But here the PvP and PvE modes are so separate everyone always tries to be vocal, cause " no no no, don't touch or affect my beautiful PvE gameplay ".
I honestly never understood this kind of hate towards PvP.Edited by NylAR on October 6, 2021 3:45AM1 -
redspecter23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »Invading a PVE zone with PVP players sounds like a horrible idea. It would be a slaughter. What's the point of that?
Additionally, my question was to ask for more (or better) ideas to fix PVP.
If it were me, I'd do my best to keep people out of PVP that don't want to be there. I don't really mean that in a negative way. The idea of mixing PVP and PVE has a number of issues. The skill difference between a new player and a vet player is absolutely intense. A new or even average player (or 20 of them) will get demolished by a single solid PVP player. Not only are they not skilled, they are not geared well or even appropriately. They are wearing PVE gear in a PVE zone. The PVP player in this situation is on the hunt, with good knowledge and good gear. In this situation, the fight is fun for only one side and that's the key. The game play model gives a positive experience to one side. The other side will be scrambling to get out of the zone they were having fun in. It's like a hurricane warning. Get to cover, the storm is coming.
Keep PVP in a PVP zone and encourage PVP players to go there. It's a bit of a broken record, but the lag has to be fixed. Stuck in combat needs to be fixed. That's step one and ZOS is working on it.
There needs to be a way to get new players into PVP and allow them to actually contribute in some meaningful way. It's a very small % of the population that sticks around in PVP long enough to become good enough to not die instantly to a pro player. Many leave long before they ever learn to get good enough. Give new players something they can do to affect the map or BG or whatever format they are playing in. If they are having fun (win or lose) they will continue to come back for more. Objective BG's helped this situation. Average players could play the objectives and even if you weren't a pro you could get some wins. 1 v 1? You'd be paste on the floor, but if you focused on the objective, you could sometimes get a win. Elite PVP'ers tend to dislike objectives. It doesn't play to their strengths, but it does allow engagement for new players or inexperienced players. In addition, we need a solid MMR system implemented to keep similarly skilled players together. The numbers are hidden so there is no accountability to determine if the system is even working.1 -
M_Volsung✭✭✭✭✭No... just no."In the Deep Halls, Far from Men;
Forsaken Red Mountain, Twisted Kin;
Hail the Mind, Hail the Stone;
Dwarven Pride, Stronger than Bone"
—Dwemer Inquiries I-III, Thelwe Ghelein10 -
Hapexamendios✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If I'm trying to do dailies and people can come in and kill me, I'll quit.16 -
Indigogo✭✭✭✭✭Please stop this insane myth that pvp players don't spend money and don't buy dlcs.
Everyone I know caved and bought Blackwood to access the new mythics.
That's how powerful the urge is for serious pvpers to get ahead, they'll buy a whole zone to wear one piece of gear.5 -
DreamyLu✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm against it. For me, PvP and PvE are two different game modes. I believe that to mix the two would have mainly negative consequences. A vast majority of PvE players would probably never go to such zones.
Personally, I would never return to those zones. Even more, depending how big is the part of the world dead to me due to this, I could even quit the game.I'm out of my mind, feel free to leave a message... PC/NA10 -
RevJJ✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well, judging by how much people hate the pvpve in IC and how PVErs hate going there for events way more than going to Cyrodiil… I don’t think this would work.2 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭Please stop this insane myth that pvp players don't spend money and don't buy dlcs.
Everyone I know caved and bought Blackwood to access the new mythics.
That's how powerful the urge is for serious pvpers to get ahead, they'll buy a whole zone to wear one piece of gear.
I wouldn't know. If it is a myth, then it is a really pervasive one.0 -
Integral1900✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I’m telling you now that if you unleash PVP on a PVE zone you will get exactly what happened in Imperial city, namely a zone with virtually nobody in it except a few PVPers hunting round for something to do.
Besides, from a storytelling point of view the three banners war makes no sense whatsoever except as part of the larger plot to destroy the world, and if you know where to look in reapers march you will find this is literally the case.
The only thing it’s achieved is to weaken the defences of this world against the plain meld, it’s one thing for the leaders of a world to struggle to work together in the face of a virus, it’s quite another for them to refuse to work together in the face of the literal annihilation of their entire planet!Edited by Integral1900 on October 6, 2021 8:18AM4 -
Gythral✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Imperial City? Anyone remember how that went!“Be as a tower, that, firmly set,
Shakes not its top for any blast that blows!”
Dante Alighieri, The Divine Comedy4 -
pdblake✭✭✭✭✭
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It's not just this game... It's about every MMO I've played. Players just have to accept it in most games, cause there usually is no choice - so they're not as vocal. But here the PvP and PvE modes are so separate everyone always tries to be vocal, cause " no no no, don't touch or affect my beautiful PvE gameplay ".
I honestly never understood this kind of hate towards PvP.
Because a lot of people have come to ESO from the single player ES games and just do not want to do it.
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EF321✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Idea 2
Additionally, if you have the war stop being so stagnant then it can help spice things up a little. For example, if the Dominion starts doing really well, then let players participate in an invasion of a PVE zone, thus making a PVE zone temporarily PVP while both Players and NPC's try to fight off the invading army.
Nigthblades camping wayshrines, writ turn in areas, skyshards, guild traders, survey locations, undaunted camps...1 -
ResidentContrarian✭✭✭✭✭Not everything someone says on YT is gold.
Not everything anyone says is gold.
Critical thinking should always be applied when glancing a proposal of any sort.
Who will the changes benefit? Who will it inconvenience? Who really cares and why? What does the proposer gain from the proposal?8 -
Hurbster✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭If that was implemented then I'd go elsewhere and not participate.So they raised the floor and lowered the ceiling. Except the ceiling has spikes in it now and the floor is also lava.6 -
Gleitfrosch✭✭✭✭Mixing PvE and PvP in the same zone causes one issue:
You can use PvP gear to do PvE content, surely not as good as a real PvE player but still good enough to beat most NPCs. Also you do not have to fear other players because they are either not looking for PvP or because you are geared to defend yourself. On the other hand using PvE gear in such zones makes you an easy prey for PvP players.
In a mixed zone there will always be players who just want to do PvE and gear up for that. Being a PvE player in ESO myself, I would not want to be put in the same zone with PvP players.
Your first proposal on the other hand could be interesting for PvE players, but I think some PvP players would disagree to be influenced by non-pvp activities.0 -
Gleitfrosch✭✭✭✭It's not just this game... It's about every MMO I've played. Players just have to accept it in most games, cause there usually is no choice - so they're not as vocal. But here the PvP and PvE modes are so separate everyone always tries to be vocal, cause " no no no, don't touch or affect my beautiful PvE gameplay ".
I honestly never understood this kind of hate towards PvP.
I would not say it is hate towards PvP, more a different expectation from the game or what PvP should look like.
I assume most players play ESO for the PvE content and want to spend a few relaxing hours doing so.
I like PvP but only if it is not decided by gear and ingame skills (not player skills). In ESO much depends on the gear you wear in PvP and some classes have an advantage in PvP due to their design. Therefore I never saw ESO as a PvP game and do not intend to participate in PvP.Edited by Gleitfrosch on October 6, 2021 12:55PM1 -
Sylvermynx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No thank you. Not interested. Had all the pvp I ever want, and the sort of thing you propose would lead to griefing.Hapexamendios wrote: »If I'm trying to do dailies and people can come in and kill me, I'll quit.If that was implemented then I'd go elsewhere and not participate.
Makes three of us. I'm not going to mess with stuff like that ever again. But hey - I'll happily fish in Cyrodiil. Maybe you pvp folks can find me there to kill me. I won't even block.4 -
ixthUA✭✭✭✭✭I come from a mmo where pvp is enabled everywhere, including towns. Server split into neitrals and fighting guilds. For fighting guilds, everywhere they go they have a good chance to be ganked on spot, for example when taking daily quests. For neutral guilds, they are not on kill on sight list, but if a member of fighting guild decides to kill a member of neutral guild - neutral guild member will have no assistance from his guild, basically free to kill. And there are PKers, who simply like to kill random people, who preferably cannot fight back.0 -
moo_2021✭✭✭✭✭It's not just this game... It's about every MMO I've played. Players just have to accept it in most games, cause there usually is no choice - so they're not as vocal. But here the PvP and PvE modes are so separate everyone always tries to be vocal, cause " no no no, don't touch or affect my beautiful PvE gameplay ".
I honestly never understood this kind of hate towards PvP.
If it's an option, sure.
But I don't want having to worry about others killing me when I farm mats or craft or fight world bosses, because there are a lot of jerks who would rather take advantage of others' vulnerabilities than to cooperate or fight fairly.
Ask yourself how do you enjoy questing or crafting something in IC?1 -
myskyrim26✭✭✭✭✭
✭I played several MMOs. If a game has a PVE-PVP zone, such zone is just DEAD. In ESO I will never buy a chapter or DLC with mixed PVE-PVP content. I don't PVP. I hate the fact that I can't explore Cyrodiil and IC now because of PVP players.Edited by myskyrim26 on October 6, 2021 2:14PM6 -
Darrett✭✭✭✭My feeling on the matter is, that the PVE players in this game are so adamantly against PVP, they wouldn't do the quests. On the flip side, PVP players already have to engage in an inordinate amount of PVE in order to PVP in the first place. People like me, that do both, probably wouldn't mind, but don't see it being a big hit, just more posts complaining about PVP quests taking the slot of PVE quests on the forums.
The only thing PVP needs in this game to make it great again... is performance. Get rid of the lag, random disconnects, slow bug, freezing, macro slices, etc... and that's all it needs.
It's not just this game... It's about every MMO I've played. Players just have to accept it in most games, cause there usually is no choice - so they're not as vocal. But here the PvP and PvE modes are so separate everyone always tries to be vocal, cause " no no no, don't touch or affect my beautiful PvE gameplay ".
I honestly never understood this kind of hate towards PvP.
Because when a guy logs in after spending 10 hours at work to play a fun game, he doesn’t want to get instantly killed by somebody with an overpowered PvP build camping his quest target.6 -
Feljax✭✭✭✭I know this will never fly but figured I'd mention it. When I played WoW starting way back at release in 2004, I played on a PvP server. Every zone after a few of the lower level zones were full PvPvE. This made the game very interesting. You were never sure how things were going to go. Every now and then you had a ganker. More often than not, you could manage well enough without being harassed. My favourite encounters were when players from opposite factions could put aside their differences and work together.
This also forced you to spec more towards PvP while you were in the overland, just in case you got jumped. There were also plenty of times when you would go to the rescue of a faction member who was being ganked. Never a dull moment.
If this were implemented in ESO, you would see an initial spike in ganking and people would generally be pissed but eventually it would taper off and you'd end up with a pretty interesting experience in my opinion.
Now I don't expect this kind of change to happen in ESO. Just saying that if they did that, I wouldn't be against it.0
