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Hybridization Problems

  • karekiz
    karekiz
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    This is an MMO. It's not your personal space where you should be able to get every damage buff with one potion and run around dropping 20k mages wrath with a sword.

    Mages Wrath is kinda a *** execute in PvE though.

    *Edit: The only reason you would run it over Execute 2hs Exe is because it would proc Crystal frag.

    Ohh wait Crystal frag? Whats that?

    An ability that procs off of mag only spells. Ohh wait whats that? You mean slotting a bunch of stam abilities alters the parse? whaaaaa
    Edited by karekiz on September 30, 2021 5:46PM
  • DrSlaughtr
    DrSlaughtr
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    Andre_Noir wrote: »
    It's easier to balance when there are specific roles.
    There is no specific roles. There is a DD that allowed to have 3 different executions skills and there another DD that got a single weapon gutted to something tanky-wonky-support nonsense and without even remotely effective execute

    It's easier to balance mag skills for mag builds and stam skills for stam builds. What you wrote has nothing to do with it. You're complaining about class balance which has been an issue since day one and will not be fixed by letting someone throwing stam and mag skills with the equivalent damage as someone who invests completely into one or another.
    I drink and I stream things.
  • karekiz
    karekiz
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    equivalent damage

    Well your going to have over 320 more spell dmg or Physical dmg. You can't have both.

    Then you add the 20%/Crit Rating from potions <Weapon only or Spell Only>.
    Then you add the Food like Ghastly.

    It isn't 100% equal. Sustain would also be quite horrid for a Full leather mag character. I think I tried parsing it and got a couple rotations in before being 100% OOM. So I swapped to a hybrid, and while that worked much better I still needed to invest into sustain in other ways so much that it ended up being worse than a pure build on a parse.
    Edited by karekiz on October 1, 2021 2:11PM
  • kojou
    kojou
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    I may not have a popular opinion on this thread, but IMO the direction they are moving is a lot closer to traditional Elder Scrolls.

    I actually think they should go farther and make all skills cost Magicka, and only use Stamina for roll dodge, block, bash, etc. I never really understood how some feat of effort could turn 1 arrow into a 10+ second volley of arrows if not by magic, or how can a feat of Vigor heal myself and my allies if not by magic? This also solves the problem of being able to invest in Stamina to get high damage and defense. If magicka is about damage and support and stamina is about defense then you have a harder time pushing both at the same time.

    Also, damage, should just be damage and crit should just be crit. I think this is the right call.

    Anyone who says that this will make it so that only a few sets are viable has not looked at very many high end trials builds lately. Unless someone is working in a group oriented support set, or the trial invalidates a set, they are all wearing the same sets. This will just cause a one time shuffle and then everyone will be wearing the same statistical best sets again. PvP has always been a rat race, and will continue to be a mixed bag of sets, and someone will always find some new cheese.

    What this does enable though, is for players to use a 2 handed sword with light armor and actually throw in some 2 handed skills (instead of only being able to use non weapon specific class skills), or use a staff with medium armor, etc. If you just consider aesthetics (and forget about whether your skills are depleting a blue or green bar) you will find that there are actually a lot more options with this model.

    I also think that Armor should have never been linked to the kind of damage you do. It should have only been about the level of protection, types of defense, and the sustain you have, and damage should have only been determined/buffed by the class and weapons.

    If they would have launched with this model it would have saved a lot of endless balance (Stamina vs Magicka vs Hybrid) and tail chasing over the years, but better late than never I guess.
    Playing since beta...
  • DrSlaughtr
    DrSlaughtr
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    I'm reminded of the last few episodes of Mythic Quest where one character wanted to drastically alter the game engine only to realize it's impossible so they just start a new game.

    ZOS should throw these ideas into their next MMO before turning this one into "everyone runs the same 3 hybrid DD builds."
    I drink and I stream things.
  • Jaddman
    Jaddman
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    kojou wrote: »
    I actually think they should go farther and make all skills cost Magicka, and only use Stamina for roll dodge, block, bash, etc.

    That's how it worked in 2014 and it was absolutely terrible.

    Stamina builds were useless, because there wasn't a single stamina-based class skill. Why in the world you would want to bring that back is baffling.

    As if stamina builds for different classes weren't homogenised already, imagine when your ONLY options are weapon skills.

    Why don't we straight up bring the excellent "Click LMB a bunch of times" combat system from single player TES games?
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