People parse on whatever they are comfortable with, they can parse highest with or whatever the current meta is.

FluffWit wrote: »

Ringing_Nirnroot wrote: »

Because magicka is ranged and more flexible I guess, at least that’s what my old guild master told me. Stam isn’t really favored especially in trials that are not melee friendly

That's true for the actual trials but doesn't relate to parsing- beating up a test dummy.

People mostly parse if they’re in the top tier of players who plan to do trial content. The vast majority don’t parse.

Those who are parsing will use the build they plan to use for trials, which is overwhelmingly magicka.

It's pretty simple. Magicka is ranged and therefore more flexible and easier to maintain dps. Stamina is meele and therefore less flexible but has more dps in general (at least in most cases). You could say the balance is that stamina is harder to play but therefore gives more dps.

Stam dps have it rough rn. Trials and dungeons seem to be more stam/melee friendly, but they require more help in buffs/debuffs.

Ease of use.

- ranged combat
- Higher pen
- Higher crit chance through armor
- Easier to support
- Strong shields

Basicly custom made for vet trials and hm..

Hallothiel wrote: »

When was it stam @colossalvoids?

When was this mythical time that stam was the dps of choice for end game?

Yes, there have been times when it is more viable to include stam, but the end game meta has virtually always been magic-based. Hell, you can see that from the design of the trial mechs!

It is one of the main things about this game that needs addressing, but hey, hasn’t for years so not holding my breath.

This last update was, in my opinion, utterly rubbish.

+1 on this needs addressing. It seems they are pushing stamina in PvP and magicka in PvE, and they are doing very little to shift and fix this.
Also better stamina support sets would go a long way in pushing stamdds a little in PvE.

Personally I think it’s a myth. Stam hits more than hard enough. Stam DPS has the flexibility to wear support sets as well which is where mag heavy groups tend to shine when you look at what support sets boost group damage the most. Zen, Catalyst, MK all light sets and much more difficult to work into a stam build. Brittle is even harder to work in.

On the mag side you can throw any of those sets on a Necro or Warden. Necro also brings major vulnerability to the group, if they pair that with master architect that’s even more damage with major slayer. This is the reason why Necro is so popular because they are probably the most clunky of the mag classes to play. You haven’t experienced frustration until you’ve had the joy of trying to cast blastbones in a mobile fight.

Back to stam. Those sets I mentioned above one of them is off the table. MK isn’t happening because conditional it requires less than 50% stam. It’s much easier to maintain a low stam pool when it’s capped at 10K vs 35K That leaves Zen and Catalyst, which both fit well on a warden, but you have to front bar it. Mag can body the set if you choose leaving stronger front bar options. Stam can wear war machine as well but it’s a greater DPS loss than MA on a mag toon.

I wear Catalyst in both stam and mag comps. On the parse dummy I hit 93K on my MagCro with catalyst. On Stamden I hit 101K on the dummy with it. Now if you’ve got a great uptime with catalyst in a stam comp where a Stamcro tank can drop a 500 Sax colossus in execute and everyone is running the 2H execute that groups damage will push much higher than mag comp.

Only NB execute can push higher, Templar too this but channel time hold their exe damage back else they would be OP and instead of 3 Cro and 3 NB in a group you would have 4 magplar. Anyway boosting damage of 8 execute skills in a stam comp versus 3-4 in a mag comp is a huge difference. Stam is superior in execute when the team is competent.

As with mag comps you just have to build for it. You also need to have a better understanding of mechs. With stam comps you can always wait for the giant AOE and then shield or side step it or block cast through a certain mech. When the boss shouts something or throws it’s hand in the air you better know what that means. Proactive vs reactive. That’s stam vs mag in a nutshell.

As someone above said the 'Meta" right now and has been for about two years is magicka. Magicka have range, do great damage and have shields that most stam just can't do. Also as was said magicka have better access to support type sets to buff group damage. So in the last 4 Trials Magicka has reigned. That being said with a little digging you can find Stamina outparses Magicka by 3-10k depending on class and set-up. The problem is that requires you to stand right on the trial dummies butt and never move, never have to worry about standing in stupid, which does not work in trials. Stamina is in the best place it's been in at least two years and you can do just fine as a stam toon in any Vet dungeon in the game and get your achievements just fine. You can do Vet trials if you have a group willing to work it out so it is stamina friendly. Until ZoS stops making the mechanics of the trials completely trash for stam toons though it will continue to be easier and "meta" for magicka toons to shine in all the newer trials. Remember the only fully ranged stam weapon is bow and bow/bow is quite a bit behind the other weapons in parsing. For transparency my main is a bow/bow stamsorc and I can parse 90k with Rele/Tzogvin's set up in running skills and have done a 100k + parse with complete cheese, but when a mag toon in running gear/ skills can do that 100k no cheese it is no wonder that guilds pushing for score want magicka.

Viyvos wrote: »

It's pretty simple. Magicka is ranged and therefore more flexible and easier to maintain dps. Stamina is meele and therefore less flexible but has more dps in general (at least in most cases). You could say the balance is that stamina is harder to play but therefore gives more dps.

Bow / Bow is range ... balance seems to me like sucks.

I think Stamina DD is in the worst place it has been for a long time and as a Stamblade main I have really felt it as of late. Whilst it is true that in the past they have been able to out damage magicka builds and whilst it is also true that it is also possible to still do 100k+ damage on a stamina build there is an underlying flaw that has been persistent for a while.

Magicka is easier to play.

Even if magicka did considerably less dps, they spend less time dead and it is simply because magicka builds are ranged and thus mostly out of harms way, or at least can get out of the red sooner. As a Stamina, you have to be extremely fast sometimes to dodge the one shot mechanics or get out of the stupid. It wasn't always so bad but recently some bosses have aoe that is so persistent that the only option to do any damage is stand away and shoot a bow, making dps plummet. Humans naturally take the path of least resistance and like to feel awesome and that is a whole lot easier with magic. Sure you could technically do as well with Stamina but you need double the effort and for what? More likely you'll be a burden on the healer.

The solutions are simple. Make stamina clearly beat magicka in dps as they are taking the higher risks. Magicka is more reliable but less risky and more manageable as a resource, they are less likely to die generally and so always a viable choice for persistent dps. Stamina being the higher damage dealer by any measure rewards the more risky play style and will appeal to those wanting to go for records or investing in that playstyle. Because right now there is no reward or incentive to play Stamina DD endgame.

The other solution would be to simply make Stam a little tankier. Not tank levels obviously but it would make the magicka based mech of many trials and dungeons more doable without rocking the boat too much. Stam needs a bit more leeway as they are in the thick of it 24/7

Some of world bosses just break whatever shield I cast by one strike. And very often there are high damaging AoEs around the whole melee range.

Healing is just weak compared to restoration staff with class healings which are mostly magicka based

So we get melee range and weaker healing, while enemy spams AoEs and strong melee attack. That's just downright unfriendly to stamina builds. Why not throw targeted ground AoE at player location and snare? or deadly ranged attack at full 28m? or projectile shield?


Changing build would work for sure but magicka builds wouldn't need to change.