As a console-only player I can say with absolute confidence I'd be just as mediocre on PC.

Addon's aren't quite the crutch people seem to believe they are, and if you actually watch some of the PC players who post vids to Youtube of the top content, there's a pretty even split between those who use them and those who don't. The most egregious addons mostly just recolor telegraphs, which while helpful, are still in the base game. After a point the controls become muscle memory, and since consoles have the same options for Keyboard and Mouse controls, that negates the "controls" argument.

https://youtu.be/zTau26dYRr0

I would absolutely LOVE to have mouse and keyboard on my PS4

I play on both and addons do not carry you through content. If they did everyone on pc would be a Godslayer.
You still have to learn the mechanics and do them. You still have to not stand in the stupid. You still have to know your rotations.
About the only advantages pc players have over consoles are combat metrics and logs.

I play on pc with a controller. On console when frags are ready you get an auditory cue and you get a visual cue on your skill bar. So you don't need an add on to cast frags competently.
Addons are not an easy mode carry.

Hallothiel wrote: »

This is my personal opinion only, and not meant to be inflammatory, but I think some of the add-ons listed above by @FlopsyPrince are problematic.

LazyWritCrafter seems to be particularly so - on console, you have to consciously make time in your gaming to do daily writs, in order to reap the considerable benefits. Not the case on pc. (And I am sure this feeds into inflation, which is an issue on pc).

Also ones such as Harvest Node maps. It just seems to make things too easy & slightly against the ‘exploration’ part of the game.

I know some pc players will disagree vehemently, but I would remove such add-ons from the game.


But to consider the original op, I think good pc players would have no difficulty adapting. Ones that rely on the ‘help’? Not so much.

You might remove them, but ZOS has not. They are in the game and therefore shuold be in the core game.

What problem does making daily crafting and harvesting easier cause? How does that harm you?

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

The advantage of addons on the PC is so great that I made the very painful decision to swap to the PC from the PS4 a few months back.

Rebuilding from scratch AND losing my ingame stuff (mounts, housing, even Crowns and Crown Gems) is a very high price.

It is not end game, but so many things are so much better now, though the loss of everything still irks me greatly.

This would not have been as necessary if even a few key addons were integrated into the game:

Lazy Writ Crafter
BeamMeUp
Harvest Map
Tramiel Trade Center (for pricing, not location since the deals are almost all snatched up before you can get them)

Lazy Riding Skill Trainer
Auto Research
Caro's Enchantment Learner
Traitbuddy
Personal Assistent
Urich's Skill Point Finder


to name a few of them. The first set is more important. Those quality of life aspects should be in the game, not limited to an addon.

I'm glad Lazy Writ Crafter isn't in the game, the economy on console seems much more healthy than PC. One absolutely giant bonus of playing on Console is the lack of the add-ons that harm the player economy

From an endgame perspective (I’ve done both endgame PVE and PVP) in terms of player ability, console players are NOT better than PC players. There’s this weird idea that addons carry PC players, but this is just not the case. I started on console and switched to PC. I still play with controller and to me, controller is way easier than keyboard and mouse. I just couldn’t learn to use keyboard and mouse after 5 years of controller. I’m sure this is subjective, however I don’t think that keyboard gives you any advantage over a controller user. PC had some advantages in the past, but it’s much closer now.

Zenimax has actually done a very good job in closing the gap between PC and console. There’s still a performance difference (although it’s drastically smaller with next gen consoles) but the platforms are now very close to even playing fields. I will admit that Pre-buffing (especially when Arkasis was good) was absolutely an advantage that PC had over console, so were addons such as Action Duration Reminder. However, Pre-Buffing has been done away with for the most part, and the game has a built in Action Duration Reminder. The last small advantage remaining is Dressing Room. Switching between add set ups and boss set ups can be very helpful, but it’s not game changing.

In a trial like vAS there’s really no advantage that PC has over console. There’s no dressing room benefit, and the only difference is that addons on PC warn you of mechanics. If you’re in the trial with experienced players and you find yourself in a lothis cone, does it really help to see the word “block” on your screen? In practice not really. Good players will already have their finger on the block button because of instinct. Good PC players don’t need add-ons to follow basic game mechanics, so this idea that console players are better because they don’t have addons is just wrong.

Lastly, console players get to live in ignorance about their raid damage. Any experienced endgame PVEr will tell you that dummy parses do not translate into good raid damage. Many console players will assume they are a “good” DPS based on dummy parses, but PC addons would tell them otherwise. A console DPS in an endgame team can get by if they don’t die excessively. However, no one knows if they can do good raid damage while executing mechanics. On PC, everything you do can be seen through logs. Because of this, the bar is set much higher for what a “good” DPS is. Now I’m not saying that PC players are better than console by default. Console players and PC players can be just as good as each other, however, PC endgame will have a higher bar and tangible evidence for what “good” means. As a result, the highest end of PC players in PVE will probably collectively be a better group of players than the highest end of console players. As individuals however, PC players and console players can be just as good as each other.

AdamLAD wrote: »

ESO is harder to play on a controller compared to mouse and key. Regardless of addons. If theres an Xbox group with the same achievements as a PC group. Accomplishing it on a controller is more impressive and skilled as its vastly inferior to a mouse and key board. Never mind addons.

Not for me.

I 100% cannot play this game on keyboard and mouse. I use a controller on my PC, and keyboard / mouse is so bad for me that if my controller battery dies or I have some other controller issue, I just have to log off. I cannot play this game on keyboard and mouse. Controller is a far superior way to play in my eyes.

Hallothiel wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Hallothiel wrote: »

This is my personal opinion only, and not meant to be inflammatory, but I think some of the add-ons listed above by @FlopsyPrince are problematic.

LazyWritCrafter seems to be particularly so - on console, you have to consciously make time in your gaming to do daily writs, in order to reap the considerable benefits. Not the case on pc. (And I am sure this feeds into inflation, which is an issue on pc).

Also ones such as Harvest Node maps. It just seems to make things too easy & slightly against the ‘exploration’ part of the game.

I know some pc players will disagree vehemently, but I would remove such add-ons from the game.


But to consider the original op, I think good pc players would have no difficulty adapting. Ones that rely on the ‘help’? Not so much.

You might remove them, but ZOS has not. They are in the game and therefore shuold be in the core game.

What problem does making daily crafting and harvesting easier cause? How does that harm you?

The problem of making crafting & harvesting easier is that it can (& apparently does on PC) have a negative effect on the game economy. Writs especially give decent gold & mats etc & if can do quickly on all 18 characters, that’s quite a haul *every day* for little or no effort. On console, as I said, you have to do it manually and consciously decide to spend game time on that.

Harvesting information just seems to go against the exploration spirit of the game, that’s all. And again its about having to decide what focus you will have in the game - I have limited time playing so make decisions about what to do.

As I have never played games on a PC with the ability to mod/use add-ons and so have always played a game as released.

Just because Zos allows them on PC (which I don’t think they should) does not mean they are ‘core game’ otherwise they would have added them to the console.

As I said, these are my opinions only, and there is no need to get defensive about what I say. If you use them on PC, I care not a jot. I just would personally not want them on console.

I have leveled over 20 charters on console to max crafting (and almost full research) and I am in the middle of leveling about 10 on the PC.

That is a significant time sink even with addons. It also takes a significant amount of time, with all the logging off and on, to swap between characters and addons do nothing for that.

I definitely prefer the process on the PC, but it is not a "simple matter now" at least from my perspective and I have done it on both.

You can believe what you want though. I just find so many are against almost any QoL request that I do respond a bit harder. Prices do seem a bit higher on the PC, but that is a purely subjective feeling as I am rebuilding there now. I had over 2 mil gold on both NA and EU on the PS4, with the less simple crafting (for the most part).

corrosivechains wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

The advantage of addons on the PC is so great that I made the very painful decision to swap to the PC from the PS4 a few months back.

Rebuilding from scratch AND losing my ingame stuff (mounts, housing, even Crowns and Crown Gems) is a very high price.

It is not end game, but so many things are so much better now, though the loss of everything still irks me greatly.

This would not have been as necessary if even a few key addons were integrated into the game:

Lazy Writ Crafter
BeamMeUp
Harvest Map
Tramiel Trade Center (for pricing, not location since the deals are almost all snatched up before you can get them)

Lazy Riding Skill Trainer
Auto Research
Caro's Enchantment Learner
Traitbuddy
Personal Assistent
Urich's Skill Point Finder


to name a few of them. The first set is more important. Those quality of life aspects should be in the game, not limited to an addon.

I'm glad Lazy Writ Crafter isn't in the game, the economy on console seems much more healthy than PC. One absolutely giant bonus of playing on Console is the lack of the add-ons that harm the player economy

it'd be interesting to see if ZoS incorporated addon support into consoles, just to see how much of an impact on the economy those addons ACTUALLY have on the market(Or Vice Versa, and remove the support on PC). They definitely streamline the process, but at the end of the day people who are doing daily writs for gold will do them regardless.

I doubt you will get to see this. The crafting updates did help, but I still tried to craft ahead on the console, so I could skip crafting many days. The ability to only show quest items might make it go much quicker as I think about it however, so some of the functionality is already there, but it is still not as simple.

I don't expect them to update that much, though I might play the PS4 as well again (as if I had the time) if they did that.

zaria wrote: »

Path wrote: »

No.
I am and have always been a PC player.

And it was in how to pirate bad games

Oh I remember pirating games. (and music) Heck, it was challenging. A learning experience.

No need for it now but at the time it was exhilarating.