Magblade 1-2 shotting is kinda Nutso in the buttso …

celner4_ESO · July 2021

So is magblade 1-2 shotting out of stealth now even in 5 heavy w pariahs? Any class being able to do that would be deadbrained but being able to spam restealth on top of that is like the definition of handicap accessible I don’t get the logic in making that a thing I can use a stealth pot sure assuming I know one is near, but if I’m not blocking the 2 magblades I was fighting were critting almost 15k with soul harvests then imbued weapon for 8-9k with 2 4K light attacks before and after but with the 1 harvest on opener I’m dead in less then a second like they didn’t even have to conceal wep stun. I got the recap screen shots on psn I just don’t understand how to counter this cause unless you know they are there in IC and they get the pop u are screwed, I thought about using sithis but like then I ran into 2 magblades both doing same thing and no way to survive it and they reatealth and shade out. Less then wanting to complain and more so want the advice of anyone else who knows how to counter this at all so I can still enjoy some form of combat vs the remedial ganks xD other then playing a magblade and circle jerking in stealth till one gets the first pop :P

[Snip]. overpowered without the benefit of having any skilled gameplay cause turns out I got my on my magblade using spinners with crafty alf/clever alch and balorghs and boom was getting same results (self buff>Pot>imbue weapon>light>harvest and if needed light>sap/conceal wep after). And if all else failed not getting the 1 shot just 1 sap essence critting for 5-7k on their dodge roll and Ded ez. And then shade restealth it’s so broken lmaoooo

[Edited for inappropriate content/language]

Edited title to help keep the word TOXIC from the thread 😁

fred4 · July 2021

[EDIT: Not sure you were talking about being double-teamed or separate incidents, see my comments at the bottom of this post.]

Your main problem is that you were being double-teamed by two coordinated players. By all accounts, if they were decent, they should kill you. If they hit you for 15K SH and 8-9K Concealed, they were either paper thin, in which case a detection potion and one well-timed DK leap would probably kill them, or your build / playstyle isn't as tanky as you think it is, despite Pariah.

My friend (stamblade) and I (magblade) fought a good DK yesterday who appeared to be running Vateshran 2H, Malacath, and some tanky (probably heavy armor) setup with that. We could not kill him and we're pretty good, my friend especially. That DK was still dangerous to me and eventually killed me with a leap combo, which I am sore about, consisting of a 9K leap, Vateshran proc and 9K executioner. I got careless. Nightblade defense on a high damage build consists almost entirely of situational awareness (or in my case a high sustain build). Look at it from our side, man. You're passively tanky on a DK / warden / necro bruiser / Pariah build or at least that passive tankiness is part of your defense. I (the nightblade) have to work actively for my elusiveness. If you know how to work detection properly, mainly if you use detection potions, I am really screwed.

I will grant you that things have changed. Even the DK my friend and I were fighting, we almost got him a few times. Even a single burst of mine almost did and I play a balanced magblade build, not a complete glass cannon. This is definitely different from previous patches, where a tanky stam bruiser spec half-decently played was completely unassailable for me. At the same time, if you're complaining about balance, this patch? Nah. Balance is fine. You got double-teamed. If those two were coordinated on Discord, that makes a huge difference.

On the other hand, I don't know how to read your post. If you are talking about two separate incidents then my first question is: Are you sure those weren't stamblades? Stamblades still hit you harder. In any case, you can't gank a properly specced and played bruiser build 1v1, even with the best mag / stamblade. With a 1-shot stamsorc ... maybe, but the meta is ever shifting. People (on PC EU / CP) have become tankier again. You have to ... but that's fine. You just wear a tankier set up. Pariah alone is not enough. For example my stam DK wears Pariah, but is built in such a way that it has 35K of both resistances (buffed) before the Pariah proc. However, if you really want to counter most would-be melee gankers, I recommend Zoal and Slippery CP.

Hmm, I must have missed reading about your own magblade experience when I first read your post. I play magblade long term, but I don't play that kind of setup. I would only advise to play that more long term and see how strong it really is. There are IMO worse things out there, such as the Crystal / Crushing / Overload stamsorc, or at least there were for a while. Of course you are going to kill some targets with that build. There are always days where a build seems super strong only for you to run into a brick wall on the next. Would you fancy going into an AvA inside a cramped resource tower with that, for example? Against experienced players? I suppose you'll do alright with Shadow Image, but don't say that doesn't require skill.

exeeter702 · July 2021

How is that toxic?

On second thought, when the hell did unbalanced and toxic mean the same thing?

Actually when the hell did magblade become op?

The sooner the words cringe and toxic make their exit from internet vernacular the better.

EndOfGreen · July 2021

Being killed in 1v2 fight is kind acceptable, considering they were both striking from stealth. I would be more frustrating if you could win. I had worst situations, when in BG three 1500+ CP and my magblade barely could kill a Necro. It took at least 15 seconds.

gariondavey · July 2021

I've lived to see it! People complaining about magblade!!!!

Wyrd88 · July 2021

Shaming a playstyle is kinda toxic.

[Snip]

[Edited for removed content]

Its_MySniff · July 2021

exeeter702 wrote: »

How is that toxic

The sooner the words cringe and toxic make their exit from internet vernacular the better.

Thank you for that bit of wisdom. I just recently joined, but read the forums frequently over the past couple years.Those two words could be banned as far as I'm concerned. Add gaslight and strawman as well. Apologies for the off topic reply. Cheers.

celner4_ESO · July 2021

fred4 wrote: »

[EDIT: Not sure you were talking about being double-teamed or separate incidents, see my comments at the bottom of this post.]

Your main problem is that you were being double-teamed by two coordinated players. By all accounts, if they were decent, they should kill you. If they hit you for 15K SH and 8-9K Concealed, they were either paper thin, in which case a detection potion and one well-timed DK leap would probably kill them, or your build / playstyle isn't as tanky as you think it is, despite Pariah.

My friend (stamblade) and I (magblade) fought a good DK yesterday who appeared to be running Vateshran 2H, Malacath, and some tanky (probably heavy armor) setup with that. We could not kill him and we're pretty good, my friend especially. That DK was still dangerous to me and eventually killed me with a leap combo, which I am sore about, consisting of a 9K leap, Vateshran proc and 9K executioner. I got careless. Nightblade defense on a high damage build consists almost entirely of situational awareness (or in my case a high sustain build). Look at it from our side, man. You're passively tanky on a DK / warden / necro bruiser / Pariah build or at least that passive tankiness is part of your defense. I (the nightblade) have to work actively for my elusiveness. If you know how to work detection properly, mainly if you use detection potions, I am really screwed.

I will grant you that things have changed. Even the DK my friend and I were fighting, we almost got him a few times. Even a single burst of mine almost did and I play a balanced magblade build, not a complete glass cannon. This is definitely different from previous patches, where a tanky stam bruiser spec half-decently played was completely unassailable for me. At the same time, if you're complaining about balance, this patch? Nah. Balance is fine. You got double-teamed. If those two were coordinated on Discord, that makes a huge difference.

On the other hand, I don't know how to read your post. If you are talking about two separate incidents then my first question is: Are you sure those weren't stamblades? Stamblades still hit you harder. In any case, you can't gank a properly specced and played bruiser build 1v1, even with the best mag / stamblade. With a 1-shot stamsorc ... maybe, but the meta is ever shifting. People (on PC EU / CP) have become tankier again. You have to ... but that's fine. You just wear a tankier set up. Pariah alone is not enough. For example my stam DK wears Pariah, but is built in such a way that it has 35K of both resistances (buffed) before the Pariah proc. However, if you really want to counter most would-be melee gankers, I recommend Zoal and Slippery CP.

Hmm, I must have missed reading about your own magblade experience when I first read your post. I play magblade long term, but I don't play that kind of setup. I would only advise to play that more long term and see how strong it really is. There are IMO worse things out there, such as the Crystal / Crushing / Overload stamsorc, or at least there were for a while. Of course you are going to kill some targets with that build. There are always days where a build seems super strong only for you to run into a brick wall on the next. Would you fancy going into an AvA inside a cramped resource tower with that, for example? Against experienced players? I suppose you'll do alright with Shadow Image, but don't say that doesn't require skill.

I was speaking about one mag blade and then 2 I’m sorry I reworded it and did not move the talk about the 2 magblades I encountered using imbue+conceal+harvest+sap. I’m assuming wearing mech acuity with harpooners kilt and spinners or clever alchemist or crafty alfiq based on what I’ve tried now. But at 29k hp not blocking from the pop I die after sap is used just from 1 of them and I’m in 5heavy with pariahs. I actually swapped to my magblade and have not played my other characters since, you global easily it’s hilarious I’m going to just enjoy it till it gets nerfed if it does I’m specifically doing mechanical acuity with spinners, harpooners kilt, and 1pc balorgh 3 bloodthirsty w mag recovery inferno staff fb, my imbue critting my buddy in 5 heavy pariah with stuhn’s and engine for 8-9k, harvest for 13-15k light attacks4-5k and sap critting for 6-8k. Very squishy yes bug purge and stealth on back bar I rarely have been caught out of stealth if I don’t happen to kill them lol and if it’s 4-5 people if they aren’t fast enough at using a detect pot it’s pretty easy mop up but if they do detect I just shade out and wait for repopping when their detect pot is down. People should try this *** out it’s horribly annoying to be the victim of but dayumn it’s fun I understand why people would be playing it. Veryyyyyy op in a group of 2 or 3+ Of the same build 😂 already op solo doing 1v2-5 so far just restealthing or shading out to reset, I feel no shame though since I’m not a bomber so sue me

vesselwiththepestle · July 2021

I don't know if it was a Magblade or Stamblade, but yesterday I saw something really cool.

We (DC) were at a ressource together with some randoms. Suddenly I see a AD player appear. The player is just there for less than a second. Like one moment they are there, then not. I don't see ANY animation. Just standing there like a mirage for a tiny moment.

And one of the randoms lies dead in the dirt.

I don't think anyone else has noticed it, because noone reacted.

Yep, seems balanced to me. Totally balanced. High risk, high reward.

celner4_ESO · July 2021

vesselwiththepestle wrote: »

I don't know if it was a Magblade or Stamblade, but yesterday I saw something really cool.

We (DC) were at a ressource together with some randoms. Suddenly I see a AD player appear. The player is just there for less than a second. Like one moment they are there, then not. I don't see ANY animation. Just standing there like a mirage for a tiny moment.

And one of the randoms lies dead in the dirt.

I don't think anyone else has noticed it, because noone reacted.

Yep, seems balanced to me. Totally balanced. High risk, high reward.

See that is cool but the thing is it very well could have been server lag and knowing there is server lag and already slow bar swap/break free issues that give stealthy gankers a distinct advantage coming from stealth getting the opener with first hit and doing enough damage at times I don’t even have to always conceal stun but bash weaving it’s so fast the game can’t even keep up with it at times much less the player lol and making it a habit to disguise weave between conceals if it’s even needed at that point (rarely, usually sapping after u pop will finish making it seem like to the receiver of the tank that u 1 shot them lol) but you become extremely hard to target and detect stealth weaving. And if there’s a detect pot you shade out. I primarily play IC/bgs though cause the lag in cyrodil on ps4 is a joke. Mega servers was a horrid idea

would have been a lot better to have cross server play with multiple NA/EU servers but maintain t integrity of those individual servers under less load seeing as there’d only be cross play in grouped content or when you are grouped in open world whoever the party leader is would be the person inviting to their server. Considering how WoW is so smooth and responsive across the board game play wise and this game still has issues in 4v4v4 matches is a god damn shame cause this game if it played as smooth and as responsive as WoW would be the best pvp mmorpg bar none IMO with how the gearing progression system works and how it’s set/builds based… went on a tangent but yeah server lag/bar swap and break free lag will make a night blade seem like a god or as u said a mirage, really cool, totally balanced xD

Xeniph · July 2021

Pariah won't save you in a gank. In fact I would say that in my testing it doesn't even apply any mitigation on the opening combo.

It takes about 2 seconds for Pariah to apply the armor buff, by which point if it's a competent ganker, you should be dead.

celner4_ESO · August 2021

Xeniph wrote: »

Pariah won't save you in a gank. In fact I would say that in my testing it doesn't even apply any mitigation on the opening combo.

It takes about 2 seconds for Pariah to apply the armor buff, by which point if it's a competent ganker, you should be dead.

The proc is resistances based not armor, and the inherent armor and health increases you get from just the first 3 set bonuses as well as all the passives from 5 heavy those all apply, as well as major/minor resolve while those are active I’m almost 35k resistances buffed and very rarely am caught without resolve active, I get your point on the delay before the resistances proc for the 5 piece but at that point it’s getting over 40k resistances with 15.5k armor rating and 29k hp and 2.2k cr, resto back bar so no sword and shield but I saw not much difference in the two and that’s also potentates 3% dmg reduc and psijic ulti’s 5% dmg reduc as well as using the cp slottables unassailable and duelists rebuff from blue tree and juggernaut from red tree, to give an idea of the total amounts of dmg reduction there are on top of the base stats. So still disgusting and can’t make much sense of it even with the sets being utilized as the magblade just seems nutty if not slightly broken :P reminds me of going against streaker specs in sithis and triple shield stacking with the broken buff to shielding it gives which wasn’t intended and will be fixed in the future I hope. Makes you wonder what other small passive bugs are affecting other classes and there gameplay for better or worse. A bummer that a certain amount of integrity and fidelity of the balancing and bug fixing is hugely lacking which is not good in any games pvp when that’s an issue be it hackers on a FPS or a large amount of known and unknown bugs affecting pvp play. Sorry for spelling errors on an iPhone atm

Alucardo · August 2021

You're either wearing paper or they lied to you and they aren't running 2 defensive sets and heavy armor.

Brrrofski · August 2021

exeeter702 wrote: »

How is that toxic?

On second thought, when the hell did unbalanced and toxic mean the same thing?

Actually when the hell did magblade become op?

The sooner the words cringe and toxic make their exit from internet vernacular the better.

I totally agree.

[snip]

Builds can be overpowered, annoying, unbalanced, broken etc yes, but I wouldn't call builds or people that play them, toxic.

[snip]
[edited for spamming]