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Stamdk Spammable #2
Donatoo
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Reopening, please stop baiting and derailing.
Also, this isnt a buff S&B thread, leave those arguments out.
Also, this isnt a buff S&B thread, leave those arguments out.
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ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭Make stonefist the stomp the ability instead, remove cast time, and give StamDK a 360 cleave as a spammable, which would:
1. Be unique, since for stam at the very least
2. Syngize with melee builds in PvE content, and make soloing content easier.
3. Give StamDK something in PvP for battles where one is surrounded or out numbered.
Outside of that, a altering the another ardent flame ability such as empowering chains to something akin to poison chains. Depending on how it is implemented it could be solid, but it could also have its drawbacks in PvE, that may not be an issue in PvP.6 -
Adenoma✭✭✭✭✭
✭Give all classes that don’t have a reasonable in-class stamina spammable a spammable. Stamina skulls sucks. Poison whip has been asked for since we had the poison morphs added. Cutting dive sucks since it was justifiably changed from being undodgeable.
Unless you run crystal weapon/surprise attack/biting jabs you don’t really have an option. It decreases build diversity for stamina classes to just have dizzying swing. Some of us want some interesting choices instead of saying “well, let’s back bar S&B and front bar 2h….” For that matter, let’s give dw, bow, and S&B decent options too - and at the same time, increase variety for magicka builds because it stinks not having a diversity of options on that end too.Adenoma-Badenoma-Sadenoma2 -
Donatoo✭✭Poison whip will never happen, and it probably shouldnt since even though molten whip is only used in very few builds in pvp.
I'm all for changing empowering chains into some poison chain spammable. And returning stone fist to a healing skill or a class stun. Nobody is ever going to use stone fist in its current state unless they want to gimp themselves.
If we dont see a class spammable on stamina DK, the dots should be reworked into something that gives a bit more utility since they are easily purged by DLC classes and templar.0 -
Ratzkifal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Poison whip will never happen, and it probably shouldnt since even though molten whip is only used in very few builds in pvp.
I'm all for changing empowering chains into some poison chain spammable. And returning stone fist to a healing skill or a class stun. Nobody is ever going to use stone fist in its current state unless they want to gimp themselves.
If we dont see a class spammable on stamina DK, the dots should be reworked into something that gives a bit more utility since they are easily purged by DLC classes and templar.
Ah yes, change Empowering Chains so that the stamDKs get a spammable. Meanwhile magDK is losing a gapcloser and unlike stamDK they can't just use Critical Rush.
Yeah no, I don't want to see Empowering Chains changed even if the Empower effect is underwhelming.
Just scrap poopfist and make a new instant cast melee to mid-range spammable with good immediate single target damage. And make sure it weaves well with light attacks and looks cool. I still think a stone lance that forms around your fist and then crumbles after you poke your enemy with it would look great.
Also don't forget that stamina abilities are supposed to be cheaper than magicka abilities. For some reason poopfist has the same stamina cost as a magicka spammable when it should be a tad lower.This Bosmer was tortured to death. There is nothing left to be done.2 -
ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭So let me play devil advocate for stonegiant, and explain why I would, at least, be partially more interested in the ability changing to the stomp instead of chains.
1. Gives you passive ultimate generation via mountain blessing passive. Faster ultimates give stam DK access to better sustain via battleroar.
2. Gives you as better uptimes of for minor brutality, since you will be casting more often then ever 10 sec.
3. Depending on the party, stagger can buff group dps by 5k a head.
In my opinion the ability issues(in PvE)lie sololy with the different animations and the clunky channel. It makes the ability uniquely difficult to weave, and particularly less effective as range spammable, since it is guaranteed to waste a cast at range.
Now I can't comment on why ZoS, made the channel in the first place. Part of me thinks it was because players did not like the look of the original rock throw, and part of me thinks they wanted to make it harder for tanks take the place of StamDKs in groups. If the latter is the cause, I would prefer them to make the impact of the stagger work like engulfing flames, where the buff to damage taken was effectived by weapon damage(or total stamina).Edited by ke.sardenb14_ESO on July 19, 2021 5:27AM0 -
ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭@Ratzkifal
Now I am 100% theory crafting here, but if the stamDk gets a better spammable, another ability, that undoubtedly cost magikca, will have to change. Someone, somewhere will be lose something, meta or not, so I picked the ability I've seen used the least. In empowering chains case, I have never used it, never seen someone use it, nor have I seen it in any build in all of the 6 years I've played this game.
Now I can't predict what the new hypothetical ability would do but, let's imagine it remains the teleport/pull that it is now, but instead just cost stam and does poison damage. Let's also assume that stonegiant returns to being a magic stun:
1. The ability would get a 33% cost reduction because of the world in ruin passives.
2. MagDK would get access to the poison status effect in their kit. Which would, not only add an extra dot and 1 more thing to cleanse, but would also proc the combustion passive, meaning it will do 50% more damage and return 500 stamina.
3. MagDK is both the slowest, and worst sustaining build in eso. A pull that doesn't cost your primary resources, should cut down the burden of sustain. In this scenario, MagDK would also get the range stun back with stonegiant, which would also make it harder to run from the DK. You would be able to stun and chain yourself to the target. You could alternatively, chain and fossilize.
4. If the ability were to be brought up to spammable standard, it would at least hit harder, then I does now, regardless of whether regardless of you being mag. ZoS would likely cut its cost further due to it being a spammable.
5. If in, this hypothetical, the stagger debuff was also moved to chains, the MagDk and all of their alies, would do extra damage to the chained target for 5 seconds.1 -
BohnT2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »Make stonefist the stomp the ability instead, remove cast time, and give StamDK a 360 cleave as a spammable, which would:
1. Be unique, since for stam at the very least
2. Syngize with melee builds in PvE content, and make soloing content easier.
3. Give StamDK something in PvP for battles where one is surrounded or out numbered.
Outside of that, a altering the another ardent flame ability such as empowering chains to something akin to poison chains. Depending on how it is implemented it could be solid, but it could also have its drawbacks in PvE, that may not be an issue in PvP.
I'm opposed to a PbAoE that you've proposed for multiple reasons.
1. Major Evasion, most organized smaller groups, stamnbs, stamcros and a plethora of other specs run a source of this via shuffle/eldue. Trying to get kills on someone who has a permanent 20% damage mitigation against your main spammable is a pain in the a**. Playing Stamplar in that case is actually forcing you to stay away from using Jabs because damage gets reduced too much.
2. Positional desyncs in PvP ruin the useage of AoEs especially when trying to hit moving targets you can't rely on what you see on your screen, single target skills at least cancel when they're not going off. This is worsened by the small radius of Poop stomp rn.
This is also my biggest concern, a skill that doesn't reliably hit just isn't an improvement.
3.Thanks to the Devs forcing all skills into their standardization spreadsheet an AoE spammable would have a significantly lower TT equal to deep slash right now and in this case there's no need for a new skill that's just as weak. Also it would be more expensive.
4. Being an AoE ability forces you to split slottable offensive CP. The people running Deep Slash as their spammable already do so but it excludes even more skills to be buffed by CP, something DK already struggles with due to having both direct and damage over time both AoE and single target wise.
Having an instant meele spammable that's only single target and requires a target avoids most of the issues because an AoE spammable would have to tick the following boxes:
8m Radius
Single target spammable TT standard
Single target spammable cost
And I don't see the Devs ever doing this, we'd end up with a compromise that isn't satisfying for anyone just like Poop Fist does now.
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Alucardo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭There's a lot of potential with stone giant. In its current state, it's obviously not great. But it could be turned into a single target, instant melee attack with similar benefits to the current version (stagger). Alternatively it could be a burst option similar to Shalks/Blastbones, where you stomp the ground and a second later a huge earth spike erupts in front of you, dealing significant damage. It could set them off balance, or "stagger" them similar to getting bashed while channelling/resurrecting.
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BohnT2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭There's a lot of potential with stone giant. In its current state, it's obviously not great. But it could be turned into a single target, instant melee attack with similar benefits to the current version (stagger). Alternatively it could be a burst option similar to Shalks/Blastbones, where you stomp the ground and a second later a huge earth spike erupts in front of you, dealing significant damage. It could set them off balance, or "stagger" them similar to getting bashed while channelling/resurrecting.
Please no more delayed damage abilities with way too high burst damage, we got that on warden and necro already and the game would be in a better state without them rather than with more of them.2 -
Ratzkifal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »@Ratzkifal
Now I am 100% theory crafting here, but if the stamDk gets a better spammable, another ability, that undoubtedly cost magikca, will have to change. Someone, somewhere will be lose something, meta or not, so I picked the ability I've seen used the least. In empowering chains case, I have never used it, never seen someone use it, nor have I seen it in any build in all of the 6 years I've played this game.
Now I can't predict what the new hypothetical ability would do but, let's imagine it remains the teleport/pull that it is now, but instead just cost stam and does poison damage. Let's also assume that stonegiant returns to being a magic stun:
1. The ability would get a 33% cost reduction because of the world in ruin passives.
2. MagDK would get access to the poison status effect in their kit. Which would, not only add an extra dot and 1 more thing to cleanse, but would also proc the combustion passive, meaning it will do 50% more damage and return 500 stamina.
3. MagDK is both the slowest, and worst sustaining build in eso. A pull that doesn't cost your primary resources, should cut down the burden of sustain. In this scenario, MagDK would also get the range stun back with stonegiant, which would also make it harder to run from the DK. You would be able to stun and chain yourself to the target. You could alternatively, chain and fossilize.
4. If the ability were to be brought up to spammable standard, it would at least hit harder, then I does now, regardless of whether regardless of you being mag. ZoS would likely cut its cost further due to it being a spammable.
5. If in, this hypothetical, the stagger debuff was also moved to chains, the MagDk and all of their alies, would do extra damage to the chained target for 5 seconds.
It can't be both a gapcloser and a spammable at the same time. That would break ZOS' spreadsheet. Most Gapclosers aren't supposed to deal damage and those that do (Critical Rush) cost more than your regular gapcloser, which is already quite a bit more expensive than a spammable. StamDKs wouldn't end up using chains as a spammable as long as it is a gapcloser, not to mention that it's definitely not going to be easy to LA weave like that.
I also doubt magDK are going to waste a global cooldown in hopes of applying a poison status effect, unless the ability has a hybrid scaling perhaps. Eitherway, stamina costs on magicka builds are always a bit iffy because you already have so little stamina to begin with and PvP you need all your stamina for dodgeroll and breakfree. If you waste it on your gapcloser, the fight you just engaged might not turn out in your favor as a result.
Stonefist was reworked with the intention to be a stamina spammable. It should be obvious which skill should get changed to become DKs stamina spammable.This Bosmer was tortured to death. There is nothing left to be done.0 -
ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭@BohnT2
I anticipated the aoe spammable would have more utility in PvE where cleave is far more valuable, counter play is not a factor, and aoe desycns have not been so prevelent. However, based on some other aoe abilities being buffed, and the new aoe focused sets, ZoS may be looking to increasing aoe viability in the future for PvP.
But, I would not be against stonegiant being a single target ability. I think that I'm personally more invested in it being melee and instant cast.0 -
CleymenZero✭✭✭✭✭
✭ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »Make stonefist the stomp the ability instead, remove cast time, and give StamDK a 360 cleave as a spammable, which would:
1. Be unique, since for stam at the very least
2. Syngize with melee builds in PvE content, and make soloing content easier.
3. Give StamDK something in PvP for battles where one is surrounded or out numbered.
Outside of that, a altering the another ardent flame ability such as empowering chains to something akin to poison chains. Depending on how it is implemented it could be solid, but it could also have its drawbacks in PvE, that may not be an issue in PvP.
With the trend to make stam more functional atnrange to compete with mag, I don't think the stomp is the way to go.
Just remove the cast time and stomp from the ability therefore double bow build will be more viable.Edited by CleymenZero on July 19, 2021 1:51PM1 -
BohnT2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭CleymenZero wrote: »ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »Make stonefist the stomp the ability instead, remove cast time, and give StamDK a 360 cleave as a spammable, which would:
1. Be unique, since for stam at the very least
2. Syngize with melee builds in PvE content, and make soloing content easier.
3. Give StamDK something in PvP for battles where one is surrounded or out numbered.
Outside of that, a altering the another ardent flame ability such as empowering chains to something akin to poison chains. Depending on how it is implemented it could be solid, but it could also have its drawbacks in PvE, that may not be an issue in PvP.
With the trend to make stam more functional atnrange to compete with mag, I don't think the stomp is the way to go.
Just remove the cast time and stomp from the ability therefore double now build will be more viable.
Being a ranged skill is trash as it comes with a minimum traveltime, especially when the skill will never be used outside of meele range anyway.
It's just a huge downside 99% of the time for the small benefit it provides by having range for a situation you don't want to be in to begin with.
Not to mention that the skill becomes useless the second someone pops shield ult.
Meele and instant are what a spammable for Stamdk need to be.0 -
ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭@Ratzkifal
I am assuming that nothing will change until I see it in the patch notes. Personally, I hope that the stonegiant ability will change to a melee intsa-cast. But, it could just as easily be changed to a tank debuff in PvE, since that is currently it's primary function, whether ZoS intended it or not. The devs could also look at chains ask "why is there a non-dps skill in what is clearly a dps line?"
The only thing I know for sure is, we won't be getting a poison whip.0 -
WillyOneBlood✭✭✭I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.1
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BohnT2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭WillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
This thread isn't about PvE and the issues with Poop Fist in PvP have been explained so often that I can't be bothered to do so.
The skill doesn't work and there is no reason why Stamdk should be pushed into a niche that it can never compete in and the only reason it's pushed into this niche is the lack of an instant meele spammable.
Please don't translate your experience from casual gameplay to PvP as it's not helping the discussion at all.2 -
ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭@WillyOneBlood
So I mentioned that stonegiant looked good on paper above, and stagger is a phenomenal buff. I get about the same number you do with it.But ill try to explain at least why I don't like it.
Compare that with wrecking blow where the unbuffed tool tip is 11/12k, hitting for about 21/23k buffed(at least my numbers).
Next look at lethal arrows 10k unbuffed, 19k buffed.
Now both abilities hit harder then most class spammables, but in a full rotation other spammables will out perform both of these. In wrecking blows case, you can 2-3 more casts of of class spammable before needing to renew your backbar dots, resulting in higher net damage. In arrows case, range abilities have a travel time regardless of you position in relation to the target, creating a delay melee abilities don't have. Stonegiant has both of these issues, without the tool tip to compensate for casting fewer abilities.0 -
WillyOneBlood✭✭✭WillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
This thread isn't about PvE and the issues with Poop Fist in PvP have been explained so often that I can't be bothered to do so.
The skill doesn't work and there is no reason why Stamdk should be pushed into a niche that it can never compete in and the only reason it's pushed into this niche is the lack of an instant meele spammable.
Please don't translate your experience from casual gameplay to PvP as it's not helping the discussion at all.
Okay well this thread isn't about PvP, nowhere in the post did the op mention PvP. The skills works, you just don't know how to use it properly. The initial aoe stomp of the fist does the same amount of damage as the following 3 hits, so it is a melee spammable. My experience of playing since 2015 with Flawless Conqueror, Spirit Slayer, Gryphon Heart and countless other achievements, titles and skins using the skill as a spammable sine it was first introduced is a little more than a casual experience. You just don't know how to use the skill.0 -
ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭WillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
This thread isn't about PvE and the issues with Poop Fist in PvP have been explained so often that I can't be bothered to do so.
The skill doesn't work and there is no reason why Stamdk should be pushed into a niche that it can never compete in and the only reason it's pushed into this niche is the lack of an instant meele spammable.
Please don't translate your experience from casual gameplay to PvP as it's not helping the discussion at all.
This thread doesn't explicitly state PvP or PvE only, nor is it in the PvP forum. As the game is still going to be a blend of both playstyles, both playstyles need to be considered when looking at the issues the DK is facing.1 -
Donatoo✭✭WillyWillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
As in the #1 thread, please stop derailing and baiting.
Thank you3 -
WillyOneBlood✭✭✭WillyWillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
As in the #1 thread, please stop derailing and baiting.
Thank you
What? Op asked about having a second spammable for a DK. I replied about the Stone fist being good enough not to need a second spammable. How is that derailing or baiting? [snip]
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Icy on July 19, 2021 4:50PM2 -
BohnT2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »WillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
This thread isn't about PvE and the issues with Poop Fist in PvP have been explained so often that I can't be bothered to do so.
The skill doesn't work and there is no reason why Stamdk should be pushed into a niche that it can never compete in and the only reason it's pushed into this niche is the lack of an instant meele spammable.
Please don't translate your experience from casual gameplay to PvP as it's not helping the discussion at all.
This thread doesn't explicitly state PvP or PvE only, nor is it in the PvP forum. As the game is still going to be a blend of both playstyles, both playstyles need to be considered when looking at the issues the DK is facing.
A change towards a instant meele spammable would affect PvE very slightly, while the effects on PvP are huge and this is why the topic is more PvP related than PvE.
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BohnT2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭WillyOneBlood wrote: »WillyWillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
As in the #1 thread, please stop derailing and baiting.
Thank you
What? Op asked about having a second spammable for a DK. I replied about the Stone fist being good enough not to need a second spammable. How is that derailing or baiting?[snip]
The reasons as to why Poop Fist is trash have been repeated over and over again, there is no point repeating them because everyone who has ever used the ability in PvP knows that it is trash.
You're baiting by saying the ability is good and people don't know how to use it, please refrain from doing so.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on July 19, 2021 4:52PM0 -
WillyOneBlood✭✭✭ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »WillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
This thread isn't about PvE and the issues with Poop Fist in PvP have been explained so often that I can't be bothered to do so.
The skill doesn't work and there is no reason why Stamdk should be pushed into a niche that it can never compete in and the only reason it's pushed into this niche is the lack of an instant meele spammable.
Please don't translate your experience from casual gameplay to PvP as it's not helping the discussion at all.
This thread doesn't explicitly state PvP or PvE only, nor is it in the PvP forum. As the game is still going to be a blend of both playstyles, both playstyles need to be considered when looking at the issues the DK is facing.
A change towards a instant meele spammable would affect PvE very slightly, while the effects on PvP are huge and this is why the topic is more PvP related than PvE.
Let's change whatever skill we want because it affects PvE very slightly, I only play PvP and that's all matters to me in the game. Let's focus everything in the game on PvP. I shouldn't have to learn the game properly and adapt my build to utilize different skills in different situations. [snip] Let's change dry skill an every set into PvP skills and sets because it wot only affect PvE very slightly.
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Icy on July 19, 2021 4:53PM2 -
WillyOneBlood✭✭✭WillyOneBlood wrote: »WillyWillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
As in the #1 thread, please stop derailing and baiting.
Thank you
What? Op asked about having a second spammable for a DK. I replied about the Stone fist being good enough not to need a second spammable. How is that derailing or baiting?[snip]
The reasons as to why Poop Fist is trash have been repeated over and over again, there is no point repeating them because everyone who has ever used the ability in PvP knows that it is trash.
You're baiting by saying the ability is good and people don't know how to use it, please refrain from doing so.
You don't know how to use it if you're saying it's trash. [snip]
[edited for baiting & to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on July 19, 2021 4:57PM1 -
WillyOneBlood✭✭✭ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »WillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
This thread isn't about PvE and the issues with Poop Fist in PvP have been explained so often that I can't be bothered to do so.
The skill doesn't work and there is no reason why Stamdk should be pushed into a niche that it can never compete in and the only reason it's pushed into this niche is the lack of an instant meele spammable.
Please don't translate your experience from casual gameplay to PvP as it's not helping the discussion at all.
This thread doesn't explicitly state PvP or PvE only, nor is it in the PvP forum. As the game is still going to be a blend of both playstyles, both playstyles need to be considered when looking at the issues the DK is facing.
A change towards a instant meele spammable would affect PvE very slightly, while the effects on PvP are huge and this is why the topic is more PvP related than PvE.
Then post your question on the PvP forum, not the PTS forum.1 -
Donatoo✭✭WillyOneBlood wrote: »WillyWillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
As in the #1 thread, please stop derailing and baiting.
Thank you
What? Op asked about having a second spammable for a DK. I replied about the Stone fist being good enough not to need a second spammable. How is that derailing or baiting?[snip]
You are telling people they dont know how to play. But I think its been proven enough that there legit isnt a place for stonefist in pvp. Also I dont have to add anything because most of it has already been said thusfar and I agree with their ideas and perspective. I dont think that your experience in overland zone with stonefist and their achievements add anything constructive to this discussion either, so lets leave it at that.
I'd ask that you leave discussion because I dont want to open a #3 thread.
Thanks.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on July 19, 2021 4:58PM2 -
WillyOneBlood✭✭✭WillyOneBlood wrote: »WillyWillyOneBlood wrote: »I main a StamDK and I think Stone Fist is one o the best spammables in the game if you use it properly. My fist in a group with all the usual buffs hits for 18k, It's around 9/10k unbuffed. And it's the only spammable I can think of that applies a debuff (stagger) that increases damage taken from the whole group and the first hit is aoe. I've played for years and done almost everything, all achievements etc apart from the dlc trial trifectas on my StamDK, I don't understand why it gets so much hate. People need to stop comparing all the classes and how this class doesn't have that but that class has this. People need to work with what each class does.
As in the #1 thread, please stop derailing and baiting.
Thank you
What? Op asked about having a second spammable for a DK. I replied about the Stone fist being good enough not to need a second spammable. How is that derailing or baiting?[snip]
You are telling people they dont know how to play. But I think its been proven enough that there legit isnt a place for stonefist in pvp. Also I dont have to add anything because most of it has already been said thusfar and I agree with their ideas and perspective. I dont think that your experience in overland zone with stonefist and their achievements add anything constructive to this discussion either, so lets leave it at that.
I'd ask that you leave discussion because I dont want to open a #3 thread.
Thanks.
Post this in the PvP forum if you don't want a PvE perspective on it. You didn't mention anywhere when you made this thread that is was only about PvP. [snip] If you post something in a forum, you need to be prepared to discuss other people's opinion about it. If you don't want that then make a private PvP thread for you and only the people that agree with you. [snip]
[edited for baiting & to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on July 19, 2021 5:00PM2
This discussion has been closed.