Mitigation on PTS is beyond overtuned

techyeshic · July 2021

maximusrex45 wrote: »

techyeshic wrote: »

There's a lot of crazy in this patch. I keep leaning more and more into it being intentional to run players off. Cyrodiil is wanted for the story and fantasy experience. PvP is in the way.

There is ZERO reason they can't add a PvE Cyrodiil to the rest of the PvE world while keeping the instanced PvP Cyrodiil in place, if that is truly what they want.

Maybe. But I think it would have a lot to do with the uproar as that zone works and Cyrodiil as we know it now would remain in its laggy state. I have to assume ZOS is tired of hearing about the performance issues as much as I at least know I am tired of having to complain about it. Being unable to fix it has to be just as frustrating as playing in it.

Extinct_Solo_Player · July 2021

TTK is literally perfect right now, if you actually wanna make a change that's good for the game REVERT SERVER SIDE CHANGES BACK TO CLIENT. literally, if you're going to do something drastic make it something that alleviates the abysmal performance we have been enduring for the past year.

DrSlaughtr · July 2021

Extinct_Solo_Player wrote: »

TTK is literally perfect right now, if you actually wanna make a change that's good for the game REVERT SERVER SIDE CHANGES BACK TO CLIENT. literally, if you're going to do something drastic make it something that alleviates the abysmal performance we have been enduring for the past year.

I agree but it would require them to invest in software to prevent cheat tables and trainers which is what caused them to shift to server side to begin with. $$$

neferpitou73 · July 2021

TheEndBringer wrote: »

Extinct_Solo_Player wrote: »

TTK is literally perfect right now, if you actually wanna make a change that's good for the game REVERT SERVER SIDE CHANGES BACK TO CLIENT. literally, if you're going to do something drastic make it something that alleviates the abysmal performance we have been enduring for the past year.

I agree but it would require them to invest in software to prevent cheat tables and trainers which is what caused them to shift to server side to begin with. $$$

True. But either way they have to invest money to fix this because the band-aid fixes are obviously not working. Might as well spend it on the thing that will

Wuuffyy · July 2021

Agree w title.

React · July 2021

Extinct_Solo_Player wrote: »

TTK is literally perfect right now, if you actually wanna make a change that's good for the game REVERT SERVER SIDE CHANGES BACK TO CLIENT. literally, if you're going to do something drastic make it something that alleviates the abysmal performance we have been enduring for the past year.

Thank you for saying this. Anyone who seriously understands the eso combat system knows that the absolute most performance-impacting change in the past two years was the range and location calculations being moved to the server. Not only did it worsen overall game performance, but it also brought combat functionality to the lowest point it has ever been in. Melee range abilities became about 50% as reliable, instant aoes like dawnbreaker, jabs, sweeps, cleave, steel tornado, etc began to miss unexplaindedly.

All of this supposedly to prevent some "cheating". A massive deterioration of experience for everyone in the game because a very small number of players were ruining the experience for other small groups of players at a time.

Nser · July 2021

Reverse the old battle spirit or do it 40% no one want tank Meta

StaticWave · July 2021

Brrrofski wrote: »

twing1_ wrote: »

I think the increased mitigation is to aid players who are newer to PvP. Increasing TTK in pretty much any game is almost always targeted at making the game more forgiving toward newer players.

I have plenty of PvE only friends that I've tried to bring into PvP environments, and their biggest complaint is that they die before they can do anything. It's extremely frustrating from their point of view, and because of this it drives them away from PvP.

You are right about the PvP population decreasing in numbers over time, and I think this is more to do with the extremely high learning curve to jumping into PvP environments rather than an increase in the number of PvP players leaving for something else. The idea behind increasing the TTK is to lower the barrier to entry for PvP, and attracting more new players to it rather than retaining the current PvP population.

Having gotten over the PvP learning curve and being already established in the PvP community, I can understand how it's frustrating to not be able to kill other players as quickly, which as you've mentioned turns into more stalemates between competent combatants. But from the perspective of a player 100% new to PvP and trying to learn for the first time (which is the only population that can actually increase the PvP population numbers vs just retaining it), the increased mitigation makes PvP a lot more forgiving, and consequently less frustrating.

I see the increased mitigation as a necessary evil for the health of PvP as a whole, as the increased mitigation promotes less experienced PvPers to actually spend the time to learn the ropes vs just avoiding it all together, and hopefully this will eventually increase the numbers of the PvP population as a whole.

It won't help new players though.

Good players will be godlike next patch. How is that an incentive to play when you throw everything at someone and their health doesn't go down 10%?

New players will never kill anyone. They'll still die though.

Dice tried to do this in BF V recently and led to a decrease in numbers. New players still died more than they killed and established players hated it. They ended up reverting it.

And we've had years of over the top tanky metas and pvp player base has continuously declined.

Riddle me this: Why are good players being punished because they are better at the game?

StaticWave · July 2021

Xebov wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

I dont really understand the thought process going from the TTK is too low so we must increase everyone's mitigation. Good players are already very hard to kill by 5+ randoms, they wait until they can line up all their procs and kill most casual players in burst attack. This has everything to do with strong combo's like Clever Alchemist + Vateshran 2H + Balorgh + Dawnbreaker. Even in HA this will deal a high amount of damage which a lot of players dont know how to avoid to protect against.

Giving everyone extra mitigation means good players become even more tanky, I dont know how much this will actually help the more casual players.

Nothing you can do will help casual players. The core problem is that PvP has the same gap in terms of effectiveness, gear, animation canceling and weaving like PvE and as long as its not adressed nothing will change.

A problem to this issue in general is also that players always view it from a worst case point, so changes are projected on the best 5 or 10%. So we come up with "class X overperformes" because we have a couple of super successful players while most players of the class struggle to get anywhere.

Another problem is also because the majority of players don't want to accept that they aren't as good as they thought and instead of looking to improve they blame better players for using "cheat/hacks" or refuse to ask for help.