The standard parsing dummy these days is the(completely unrealistic, but very popular because it allows people to pat themselves on the back) trial dummy. But really, the CP changes were a nerf to my few toons that were DPS toons as well(well, to all of them, but it especially affected my DPS toons). The fact that you can only slot 4 damage related stars makes almost the entire system virtually worthless compared to what it used to be....you get "more choices" but far fewer options that actually effect combat....ie, if you don't run a specific meta build, your former off-meta build is far weaker than it was.

LashanW wrote: »

What dummy were you parsing on? And what's your exact build? Gear, skills, CP etc. CP especially changed a lot.

The small 3m dummy. But I also used a wraith of crows 6 m dummy and results were comparable. First was mine, a few years old, the crow was a friends, also a few years old.

Here’s my traditional rotation:
Liquid lightning, blockade of storms (leveling unstable morph, seems to be preferred now), bar change. Proc pet, daedric curse, destro clench, heavy attack for sustain. Bar swap. Light attacks between everything, anim cancelling.
Storm atro ulti whenever ready.

Now I’m doing the following rotation, which seems to yield slightly better results at present:
Liquid lightning, unstable wall, bar change. Proc pet, daedric curse, destro clench, heavy attack for sustain. Crystal frags added, so I stay longer on this bar to cast it when it’s ready to insta-cast. That occurs randomly of course, but any of the 3 skills I use on this bar can proc it. Now that I have info on what is happening on the back bar, it’s much easier to swap when the Aoes run down. I probably re-cast the back bar Aoes a bit too soon formerly. Also, formerly I got much higher dps, so go figure.
Bar swap. Light attack weaving between everything, anim cancelling.

One reason I like to have a lightning staff on the front bar is that I do the heavy attack there, taking advantage of my front bar 5 piece while the target is standing in Crushing Wall. That just works better with a lightning staff — you know when you’ve latched onto a target, there’s lots of splash damage in real situations, and it seems to give magicka back progressively. The other reason is that I have tried subbing in a fire staff, and I get about 1k or so less dps, every time. Also, in practice (not on a dummy), the lightning deals lots of splash damage to adds, and off-balance, which is very useful on teams in actual play. I do switch to force pulse when using a fire staff. The fire clench is fun to knock things down, but not as useful for grouped enemies. But I’ve tried all combos of this. Interesting to note that sorc gets a boost in shock damage.

My gear is Siroria 5/5 on front bar. Necro 5/5 throughout. Maelstrom lightning staff on back bar. My experience is that Siroria works well with Crystal frags, as there is more single target direct damage to proc stacks consistently. But when you have situations where you have to stay on the move, I use Mother’s sorrow in place of Siroria. Slightly less dps on dummy, but probably quite more in mobile situations. Most of the gear is golded, except for the jewelry. Spell power glyphs on jewelry, all divines on the gear, with Magicka glyphs. I use illambris, so I have shock and fire glyphs on the staves respectively. Illambris procs quite a lot that way. I’ve tried many other monster sets, including Skoria, but Illambris always gives me the best results.

Mundas is The Shadow.

CP setup, I have tried out various combinations of Deadly Aim, Thaumaturge, Biting Aura, and Master of arms, with Fighting Finesse. At one point I subbed in Backstabber and parsed behind the skellie, but it made no difference. I have Eldritch Insight and Precision maxxed. I have points in War Mage and Piercing. My CP is only 1050 right now, so I can’t get absolutely everything. But I am experimenting with different configurations this week as it’s a free re-spec.

My guess is that small tweaks to this is not gonna do much. And I’m plateau-ing in terms of rotation practice. In the past, I have noticed the biggest gains when I re-worked my CP. I had it balanced really well for what I do. I’d like to see that happening again, but translating it is not as straightforward as I’d hoped. And ESO has also changed quite a lot. Still, people are asking for 70 k dps for vet trials (on console), which I find inconceivable. I see videos of people doing 120 k dps (PC), which I also find inconceivable. If I could do half that I’d be very happy indeed. But I’d have to double what I’m doing now.
I just don’t get it,

Good damage is approximately equal parts gear, abilities, ability uptimes, and skill at light attack weaving. Given how low your damage is, I would say you've got all 4 working against you.

Replace Necropotence with a Crit set, either MS or Medusa. If you don't have Zaan, run either Maw (only applies to sorc) or 1 PC slimecraw (head) and 1 PC zaan (shoulders). All light - if you go with medusa you would front bar it.

Because off balance no longer provides major damage buffs on most builds, going pure shock staves is not going to help you as much as inferno will. Switching to inferno staves can add 5-10K DPS on the trial dummy all on its own.

I'm pretty sure liquid lightning is bad. Run orb instead (the damage morph). If you can't sustain orb, degen is a good substitute.

And work on your LA weaving, and your skill uptimes. You don't need to have perfect animation cancelling to get good damage, although of course the better your timing the more your damage goes up.

70K parses are on the trial dummy, not the small ones. They're equivalent to 35K or so on the smaller dummies.

sarahthes wrote: »

Good damage is approximately equal parts gear, abilities, ability uptimes, and skill at light attack weaving. Given how low your damage is, I would say you've got all 4 working against you.

Replace Necropotence with a Crit set, either MS or Medusa. If you don't have Zaan, run either Maw (only applies to sorc) or 1 PC slimecraw (head) and 1 PC zaan (shoulders). All light - if you go with medusa you would front bar it.

Because off balance no longer provides major damage buffs on most builds, going pure shock staves is not going to help you as much as inferno will. Switching to inferno staves can add 5-10K DPS on the trial dummy all on its own.

I'm pretty sure liquid lightning is bad. Run orb instead (the damage morph). If you can't sustain orb, degen is a good substitute.

And work on your LA weaving, and your skill uptimes. You don't need to have perfect animation cancelling to get good damage, although of course the better your timing the more your damage goes up.

70K parses are on the trial dummy, not the small ones. They're equivalent to 35K or so on the smaller dummies.

Thanks, man, this gives me some things to work on. I do have Zaan (im pretty sure) but it’s quite situational as I recall?
Fire staves on a TRIAL dummy...now I get it. Will try that.

Off balance not a thing anymore...sigh... I only have one maelstrom fire staff however, and my magblade hogs it. That’s the next sad story I’m sure. Maybe my sorc will borrow it... Lightning not good on the back bar now either?

I’m leveling the mystic orb, I like it. Will try.

Will continue to work on LA weaving, I know it’s very important, and I have practiced it a lot in the past. I just know when I tend to reach a plateau where it’s not getting better, then I have to look at other factors.

Thanks again.

Locriana wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

Replace Necropotence with a Crit set, either MS or Medusa. If you don't have Zaan, run either Maw (only applies to sorc) or 1 PC slimecraw (head) and 1 PC zaan (shoulders). All light - if you go with medusa you would front bar it.

So, if I’m subbing MS for Siroria, look to combine MS and Medusa? (I have de-conned so much Medusa in the past....will be farming Arx again I guess..). Or what else to combine with MS. I even have a fire staff for that . Good luck getting a fire staff for Medusa...do they exist?

Yes, MS and Medusa is the current combo. You can still run MS and Siroria, its not like Siroria dropped to nothing.

And yes, enjoy the Medusa farm. Upside is you should be able to get a group for it relatively easily. Second upside, there are lots of chests in there to help. I've found the necklace to be harder to get than the fire staff.

A lot of the morphs you use have been changed over the years. Unstable Wall is now better than Blockade, Daedric Prey is better than Curse, Crushing Shock is better than Force Pulse (for single target), Twilight Tormentor is better than Matriarch, Lightning Flood is better than Liquid Lightning (although I wouldn’t use either of these anymore). Shock Clench isn’t worth using for single target, the best spammables are Crystal Frags or Elemental Weapon. Strangely Boundless Storm has become the only class DoT worth casting, assuming you can stay in melee range for its long duration.

For sets you can’t go wrong with Siroria + Sorrow. I wouldn’t really recommend Medusa this patch, especially on Sorc. Just try to find a bar slot for Barbed Trap. One crit set is enough, and you’ll still need Spell Damage as well as Minor Slayer for some content.

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

A lot of the morphs you use have been changed over the years. Unstable Wall is now better than Blockade, Daedric Prey is better than Curse, Crushing Shock is better than Force Pulse (for single target), Twilight Tormentor is better than Matriarch, Lightning Flood is better than Liquid Lightning (although I wouldn’t use either of these anymore). Shock Clench isn’t worth using for single target, the best spammables are Crystal Frags or Elemental Weapon. Strangely Boundless Storm has become the only class DoT worth casting, assuming you can stay in melee range for its long duration.

For sets you can’t go wrong with Siroria + Sorrow. I wouldn’t really recommend Medusa this patch, especially on Sorc. Just try to find a bar slot for Barbed Trap. One crit set is enough, and you’ll still need Spell Damage as well as Minor Slayer for some content.

Thanks for this. And yeah I meant daedric prey.
I used to use crushing shock for team situations, guess no need to level force pulse now.. Why is CS better, just for the interrupt? Used to be you sacrificed some damage to do the interrupt. Like in vet Hel Ra.

I use the other pet, I cal, him Sparky. I can’t stand Twilight’s flappy wings in my face all the time. But I’m leveling tormentor anyway, will try it. The flapping is not too bad in an actual fight. I notice people using both pets. Is this better than slotting inner light now?

Need psijic on this sorc, I guess. I’m amazed I don’t have it. I do on my Magblade, but never used it much. I really do not like the hitch/delay on elemental weapon. Have they improved that?

Locriana wrote: »

Off balance not a thing anymore...sigh... I only have one maelstrom fire staff however, and my magblade hogs it. That’s the next sad story I’m sure. Maybe my sorc will borrow it... Lightning not good on the back bar now either?

You only need 1 of an item now. No need to farm multiple copies. You can construct as many maelstrom fire staves as you want, in any trait you want, at a transmute station. Transmute stations are no longer just for changing trait of existing items. You can create items now.

What do sorc people have as their 4 slotted CP damage skills? I currently have Deadly Aim, Thaumaturge, Biting Aura, and Fighting Finesse.
I had Master at arms at one point. There is such a range of what sorcs do, between damage over time, aoe, single target...and direct damage seems to figure in all of that... Seems I should include Master at arms in there, but what to remove?

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Locriana wrote: »

What do sorc people have as their 4 slotted CP damage skills? I currently have Deadly Aim, Thaumaturge, Biting Aura, and Fighting Finesse.
I had Master at arms at one point. There is such a range of what sorcs do, between damage over time, aoe, single target...and direct damage seems to figure in all of that... Seems I should include Master at arms in there, but what to remove?

Crystal Fragments and that mage blast one. Also the "put a bubble around me".

Thanks but I’m asking about the Champion points....the slotted bits in the blue (warfare) section. Not cast-able skills.

Locriana wrote: »

Oh and why all light armor now? I have not found a reference to the benefits of that. I’m accustomed to the 5 light, 1 medium and 1 heavy for the Undaunted passive.

They recently abolished the system of "you need 5 pieces to get a bonus" for the armour passives.
Now, it's "you get a bonus for every piece you wear". Esp. relevant are Prodigy (spell crit) and Concentration (spell pen) for every piece of Light Armour worn, so seven pieces will net you a higher bonus than five. Evocation (mag recovery) is also helpful.
Also, they have quite dramatically increased basic resources (i.e. base health, magicka, stamina), and so the resources part of the Undaunted passive is not that important any more.

As for CP, try to fit in Backstabber for group content (and dummy parsing, just stand behind it). Depends on your skill choice, of course, but the AoE star is probably the least useful.

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

josiahva wrote: »

The standard parsing dummy these days is the(completely unrealistic, but very popular because it allows people to pat themselves on the back) trial dummy.

The trial dummy is not about patting people on the back. It is about giving every player, regardless of build, the same buffs and debuffs. That allows you to do apples-to-apples comparisons in a way you cannot with the 3m/6m dummies. Some builds just naturally get solo buffs and debuffs that boost their 3m/6m numbers in ways that are not available to other builds. But many of those other builds have buffs and debuffs that can be very useful to the group even if it is not apparent running solo. The trial dummy goes a little overboard in the buffs/debuffs it gives you, and their uptimes, but it creates a level playing ground.

Does giving you almost every buff and debuff in the game inflate DPS? Yes. But it inflates everybody's DPS in the same way. It is not supposed to be realistic. It is supposed to be standardized and it mostly succeeds at that.

That is bull crap, my parses on the trial dummy with all my alts are always 2x the other dummies.
People just love big numbers, BIGGER IS BETTER!

Locriana wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

A lot of the morphs you use have been changed over the years. Unstable Wall is now better than Blockade, Daedric Prey is better than Curse, Crushing Shock is better than Force Pulse (for single target), Twilight Tormentor is better than Matriarch, Lightning Flood is better than Liquid Lightning (although I wouldn’t use either of these anymore). Shock Clench isn’t worth using for single target, the best spammables are Crystal Frags or Elemental Weapon. Strangely Boundless Storm has become the only class DoT worth casting, assuming you can stay in melee range for its long duration.

For sets you can’t go wrong with Siroria + Sorrow. I wouldn’t really recommend Medusa this patch, especially on Sorc. Just try to find a bar slot for Barbed Trap. One crit set is enough, and you’ll still need Spell Damage as well as Minor Slayer for some content.

Thanks for this. And yeah I meant daedric prey.
I used to use crushing shock for team situations, guess no need to level force pulse now.. Why is CS better, just for the interrupt? Used to be you sacrificed some damage to do the interrupt. Like in vet Hel Ra.

I use the other pet, I cal, him Sparky. I can’t stand Twilight’s flappy wings in my face all the time. But I’m leveling tormentor anyway, will try it. The flapping is not too bad in an actual fight. I notice people using both pets. Is this better than slotting inner light now?

Need psijic on this sorc, I guess. I’m amazed I don’t have it. I do on my Magblade, but never used it much. I really do not like the hitch/delay on elemental weapon. Have they improved that?

Ele Weapon feels alright to me, I know some don’t like it. I think it did get a little smoother at one point.

Crushing Shock and Force Pulse now do the same damage to the targeted enemy, but Crushing costs significantly less and helps sustain. Force Pulse just gives some splash damage when you need to kill adds as well as a boss.