Thechuckage wrote: »

Alurria wrote: »

When i see these threads I get totally apprehensive. Why, I like pet class I have always played one in every game. I try to be responsible knowing that most games have this same problem. So I try to dismiss my pet in crowded town areas. But I also feel like my choice of class is being attacked bysome people not all because it is a problem with pets blocking objects. Most pet classes view their pet as a dot which is what they are. Why is it some people want to take a ability away? Some of the comments in this thread are over the top and totally blame the player for a flaw in the system. There maybe a handful of inconsiderate people who for whatever sick reason find pleasure in interuptions others game time but I'm not one of them. So why punish the rest of us?

If someone truly believes that a pet is so disruptive to game play then I suggest running around where people are dueling or wearing a monster set with visuals that go off while crafting or the annoying rain of arrows some players constantly let lose. Let's be fair pets can block things I agree. Like I said I get some people don't like pets but that doesn't mean that should dictate my use of them. This same problem has spanned every game I have played.

Only the devs can find a solution, last night I did a quest in town involving killing a were wolf so making pets disappear in town would require a rework of more that two quests. Plus there will always be people who are disruptive that is a human problem and Zos can't solve that.

If pets are a consistent problem across games, then they seem to be the common denominator. The solutions I've seen on the thread are not meant to punish the class, merely remove a nuisance while in town. There is no pressing need for them inside a town.
Duels and such should IMO also be banned in town, but that is another discussion to be had.

As for the 2 in town quests (since I brought it up originally) the werewolf in daggerfall and the former argonian slaves in mournhold were the 2 quests I was thinking of. Hardly game breaking to not have a bear of flappy bird for those. Necromancers and werewolves have to take on those quests without their unique abilities, fair for wardens and sorcs to do the same.

If there are other quests in town besides those two, my bad?

The point is this 'every game who has combat pets has this problem in the last 20 years or so' What I take exception with are those who think people are doing things on purpose. For most I am sure it is unconscious behavior. Now if Zos could solve this problem or any game for that matter I have a feeling it would be in game. Necros are reanimating the dead and necromancy has always been evil in most games. I have nothing against it but I don't make those decisions. Anyway, I'm sure something would have been done by now if it were feasible.

It would only be in town in non combat so it wouldn't affect you at all.

Just give me daily crafting writ pickup and turn in at my house instead then.

MooseKnuckles88 wrote: »

I'd be all for a desyncing buffer area/radius during writ turn ins, crafting tables, and certain quest areas, I didn't read all the comments so not sure if anyone already said that.

I like this idea my bear desyncs going through a dungeon door so around crafting tables etc would be fine. I wonder how it would be done and hopefully wouldn't be bugged.

Alurria wrote: »

Thechuckage wrote: »

Alurria wrote: »

When i see these threads I get totally apprehensive. Why, I like pet class I have always played one in every game. I try to be responsible knowing that most games have this same problem. So I try to dismiss my pet in crowded town areas. But I also feel like my choice of class is being attacked bysome people not all because it is a problem with pets blocking objects. Most pet classes view their pet as a dot which is what they are. Why is it some people want to take a ability away? Some of the comments in this thread are over the top and totally blame the player for a flaw in the system. There maybe a handful of inconsiderate people who for whatever sick reason find pleasure in interuptions others game time but I'm not one of them. So why punish the rest of us?

If someone truly believes that a pet is so disruptive to game play then I suggest running around where people are dueling or wearing a monster set with visuals that go off while crafting or the annoying rain of arrows some players constantly let lose. Let's be fair pets can block things I agree. Like I said I get some people don't like pets but that doesn't mean that should dictate my use of them. This same problem has spanned every game I have played.

Only the devs can find a solution, last night I did a quest in town involving killing a were wolf so making pets disappear in town would require a rework of more that two quests. Plus there will always be people who are disruptive that is a human problem and Zos can't solve that.

If pets are a consistent problem across games, then they seem to be the common denominator. The solutions I've seen on the thread are not meant to punish the class, merely remove a nuisance while in town. There is no pressing need for them inside a town.
Duels and such should IMO also be banned in town, but that is another discussion to be had.

As for the 2 in town quests (since I brought it up originally) the werewolf in daggerfall and the former argonian slaves in mournhold were the 2 quests I was thinking of. Hardly game breaking to not have a bear of flappy bird for those. Necromancers and werewolves have to take on those quests without their unique abilities, fair for wardens and sorcs to do the same.

If there are other quests in town besides those two, my bad?

The point is this 'every game who has combat pets has this problem in the last 20 years or so' What I take exception with are those who think people are doing things on purpose. For most I am sure it is unconscious behavior. Now if Zos could solve this problem or any game for that matter I have a feeling it would be in game. Necros are reanimating the dead and necromancy has always been evil in most games. I have nothing against it but I don't make those decisions. Anyway, I'm sure something would have been done by now if it were feasible.

The people who put bears right on top of pledge givers, writ drops, wayshrines are absolutely doing it 'on purpose'. I have seen them actually in the process of parking their pet 'just right' to block interaction. I have also asked them politely to move their pet to receive nasty responses. And other times they are AFK. But here is the thing you will notice that you NEVER see the bear or other pets in those general areas but NOT BLOCKING interaction. Which you would expect to see even more often it was all just a coincidence.

Merforum wrote: »

Alurria wrote: »

Thechuckage wrote: »

Alurria wrote: »

When i see these threads I get totally apprehensive. Why, I like pet class I have always played one in every game. I try to be responsible knowing that most games have this same problem. So I try to dismiss my pet in crowded town areas. But I also feel like my choice of class is being attacked bysome people not all because it is a problem with pets blocking objects. Most pet classes view their pet as a dot which is what they are. Why is it some people want to take a ability away? Some of the comments in this thread are over the top and totally blame the player for a flaw in the system. There maybe a handful of inconsiderate people who for whatever sick reason find pleasure in interuptions others game time but I'm not one of them. So why punish the rest of us?

If someone truly believes that a pet is so disruptive to game play then I suggest running around where people are dueling or wearing a monster set with visuals that go off while crafting or the annoying rain of arrows some players constantly let lose. Let's be fair pets can block things I agree. Like I said I get some people don't like pets but that doesn't mean that should dictate my use of them. This same problem has spanned every game I have played.

Only the devs can find a solution, last night I did a quest in town involving killing a were wolf so making pets disappear in town would require a rework of more that two quests. Plus there will always be people who are disruptive that is a human problem and Zos can't solve that.

If pets are a consistent problem across games, then they seem to be the common denominator. The solutions I've seen on the thread are not meant to punish the class, merely remove a nuisance while in town. There is no pressing need for them inside a town.
Duels and such should IMO also be banned in town, but that is another discussion to be had.

As for the 2 in town quests (since I brought it up originally) the werewolf in daggerfall and the former argonian slaves in mournhold were the 2 quests I was thinking of. Hardly game breaking to not have a bear of flappy bird for those. Necromancers and werewolves have to take on those quests without their unique abilities, fair for wardens and sorcs to do the same.

If there are other quests in town besides those two, my bad?

The point is this 'every game who has combat pets has this problem in the last 20 years or so' What I take exception with are those who think people are doing things on purpose. For most I am sure it is unconscious behavior. Now if Zos could solve this problem or any game for that matter I have a feeling it would be in game. Necros are reanimating the dead and necromancy has always been evil in most games. I have nothing against it but I don't make those decisions. Anyway, I'm sure something would have been done by now if it were feasible.

The people who put bears right on top of pledge givers, writ drops, wayshrines are absolutely doing it 'on purpose'. I have seen them actually in the process of parking their pet 'just right' to block interaction. I have also asked them politely to move their pet to receive nasty responses. And other times they are AFK. But here is the thing you will notice that you NEVER see the bear or other pets in those general areas but NOT BLOCKING interaction. Which you would expect to see even more often it was all just a coincidence.

Oh no doubt there are jerks everywhere but not everyone does this and to punish a whole bunch of people who don't do this is wrong. On the other hand there are many many not nice behaviors people do in game to make things unpleasant for others. How about the guy who sees you fighting a npc near a chest and they run up and unlock it and scoot away, or the ones who come from behind you as you are about to engage killing a boss when they were not there before? Or how bout the ones who race ahead to kill the npc you need to kill and now you have to wait. I could go on but you get my drift. I am not saying it's not annoying at the same time it's not the end of the world. To punish everyone for the sins of a few others seems a bit of overkill to me.

I will say this again I always try to dismiss my pet at the way shrine in town at ones in the middle of no where I move off to the side if I'm not riding out right away. I further think if this was such a great problem Zos would have looked into it. And of all the games I have played this complaint about pet classes pets has been discussed. You will find this same complaint on other forums for other games.

Alurria wrote: »

When i see these threads I get totally apprehensive. Why, I like pet class I have always played one in every game. I try to be responsible knowing that most games have this same problem. So I try to dismiss my pet in crowded town areas. But I also feel like my choice of class is being attacked bysome people not all because it is a problem with pets blocking objects. Most pet classes view their pet as a dot which is what they are. Why is it some people want to take a ability away? Some of the comments in this thread are over the top and totally blame the player for a flaw in the system. There maybe a handful of inconsiderate people who for whatever sick reason find pleasure in interuptions others game time but I'm not one of them. So why punish the rest of us?

If someone truly believes that a pet is so disruptive to game play then I suggest running around where people are dueling or wearing a monster set with visuals that go off while crafting or the annoying rain of arrows some players constantly let lose. Let's be fair pets can block things I agree. Like I said I get some people don't like pets but that doesn't mean that should dictate my use of them. This same problem has spanned every game I have played.

Only the devs can find a solution, last night I did a quest in town involving killing a were wolf so making pets disappear in town would require a rework of more that two quests. Plus there will always be people who are disruptive that is a human problem and Zos can't solve that.

As one of the people who is openly (and probably overly-vocally) against large/flappy pets in general, I find your post to be a very fair and reasonable point of view. I try to keep in mind that some of the things that annoy me greatly about ESO are other players' favorite aspects of the game, and temper my own viewpoints accordingly.

The thing that gets under my skin most about "the issue" with pets is how easily the complaints could be addressed, and the variety of ways one could go about it. It's not like these are unsolvable problems. They don't even seem terribly difficult.
ZOS just makes apparently no effort at all to help "us" players who feel pets are intruding on our experience a bit too much, despite the problem steadily escalating for literal years. I don't want ZOS to punish vanity pet lovers or ruin combat-pet-reliant classes -- I just want them to tone down the annoyance factor for the rest of us. The complaints are pretty straightforward, and the solutions seem pretty simple...


Combat pets block interactables. They shouldn't do that. That's pretty much it for this one. Make them like Mounts, or Assistants, or non-combat pets, or other players, or literally everything else in the game that doesn't block interaction for no damn reason. (Seriously, what's the logic for other people's pets blocking my progress, ZOS?! I'd love to hear a good reason.)

Pets can become downright obnoxious when they're flappin around at eye level and all over the edges of my screen no matter which direction I face. Especially when multiple people have them. It's almost like seeing a mouse scurrying along the floorboards out of the corner of your eye. Twilights are giving me a minor phobia at this point. The simplest solution is to add an option in Settings that allows us to just completely hide other people's Combat Pets, and another setting to hide others' Vanity Pets too. Now it's up to individual players how much of other people's pets they want to see. Boom, done.
Or we could probably solve both problems at once by reworking Combat Pets to just not be full-time always-on "permanent" summons anymore. They shouldn't be anyway. It's dumb design that they need to be double-barred, and having them be hangin out when they're not needed is impractical for all the issues they cause. Get rid of the universally reviled cast times on them, and turn them into long duration skills. You get assistance from your pet for ~2 minutes (or whatever), then you have to resummon it again as needed... you know, like most all other skills in ESO, and similar to the other TES games. People have their pets crawling and flapping and bumbling all over the place mostly out of laziness; if they just went away automatically, most all the problems we have with them just stop being a big deal since they'll seldom be around when not needed. While we're at it, let's apply this same logic to the Banker & Merchant! After ~60 seconds of no interaction, they despawn. And suddenly the pet whiners (which I count myself among) have a LOT less to complain about.


At the very least, we'd like to hear from ZOS now and then to just acknowledge us on things like this. Even if they have zero plans for doing anything about it, it'd be nice to know they at least hear us. These threads pop up all the time, basically since the beginning, and as far as I know our concerns go utterly ignored. It doesn't feel good as a player/customer, and it is a driving factor in breeding resentment towards the (mostly blameless) players who enjoy using their pets as intended. It's unnecessary and easily-preventable strife. ZOS, please...

Alurria wrote: »

GreenHere wrote: »

Alurria wrote: »

When i see these threads I get totally apprehensive. Why, I like pet class I have always played one in every game. I try to be responsible knowing that most games have this same problem. So I try to dismiss my pet in crowded town areas. But I also feel like my choice of class is being attacked bysome people not all because it is a problem with pets blocking objects. Most pet classes view their pet as a dot which is what they are. Why is it some people want to take a ability away? Some of the comments in this thread are over the top and totally blame the player for a flaw in the system. There maybe a handful of inconsiderate people who for whatever sick reason find pleasure in interuptions others game time but I'm not one of them. So why punish the rest of us?

If someone truly believes that a pet is so disruptive to game play then I suggest running around where people are dueling or wearing a monster set with visuals that go off while crafting or the annoying rain of arrows some players constantly let lose. Let's be fair pets can block things I agree. Like I said I get some people don't like pets but that doesn't mean that should dictate my use of them. This same problem has spanned every game I have played.

Only the devs can find a solution, last night I did a quest in town involving killing a were wolf so making pets disappear in town would require a rework of more that two quests. Plus there will always be people who are disruptive that is a human problem and Zos can't solve that.

As one of the people who is openly (and probably overly-vocally) against large/flappy pets in general, I find your post to be a very fair and reasonable point of view. I try to keep in mind that some of the things that annoy me greatly about ESO are other players' favorite aspects of the game, and temper my own viewpoints accordingly.

The thing that gets under my skin most about "the issue" with pets is how easily the complaints could be addressed, and the variety of ways one could go about it. It's not like these are unsolvable problems. They don't even seem terribly difficult.
ZOS just makes apparently no effort at all to help "us" players who feel pets are intruding on our experience a bit too much, despite the problem steadily escalating for literal years. I don't want ZOS to punish vanity pet lovers or ruin combat-pet-reliant classes -- I just want them to tone down the annoyance factor for the rest of us. The complaints are pretty straightforward, and the solutions seem pretty simple...


Combat pets block interactables. They shouldn't do that. That's pretty much it for this one. Make them like Mounts, or Assistants, or non-combat pets, or other players, or literally everything else in the game that doesn't block interaction for no damn reason. (Seriously, what's the logic for other people's pets blocking my progress, ZOS?! I'd love to hear a good reason.)

Pets can become downright obnoxious when they're flappin around at eye level and all over the edges of my screen no matter which direction I face. Especially when multiple people have them. It's almost like seeing a mouse scurrying along the floorboards out of the corner of your eye. Twilights are giving me a minor phobia at this point. The simplest solution is to add an option in Settings that allows us to just completely hide other people's Combat Pets, and another setting to hide others' Vanity Pets too. Now it's up to individual players how much of other people's pets they want to see. Boom, done.

AND/OR they could try a bunch of half measures that would help alleviate things in a less "all or nothing" kind of way, such as; reducing the flapping, flailing, twitching and jiggling speed/intensity of pets' movements, or reduce their opacity, or make it where you can only see the pets of people you're grouped with, or increase the radius (or however it works) within which pets are hidden while in menus, or have pets automatically unsummon when entering towns (but still be summonable if you need them), or make them Criminal Acts, and the list goes on and on. I'm not saying they're all good ideas necessarily, but they are all something to take a stab at addressing the problem. Which is more than nothing... which is all we've got so far.

Or we could probably solve both problems at once by reworking Combat Pets to just not be full-time always-on "permanent" summons anymore. They shouldn't be anyway. It's dumb design that they need to be double-barred, and having them be hangin out when they're not needed is impractical for all the issues they cause. Get rid of the universally reviled cast times on them, and turn them into long duration skills. You get assistance from your pet for ~2 minutes (or whatever), then you have to resummon it again as needed... you know, like most all other skills in ESO, and similar to the other TES games. People have their pets crawling and flapping and bumbling all over the place mostly out of laziness; if they just went away automatically, most all the problems we have with them just stop being a big deal since they'll seldom be around when not needed. While we're at it, let's apply this same logic to the Banker & Merchant! After ~60 seconds of no interaction, they despawn. And suddenly the pet whiners (which I count myself among) have a LOT less to complain about.


At the very least, we'd like to hear from ZOS now and then to just acknowledge us on things like this. Even if they have zero plans for doing anything about it, it'd be nice to know they at least hear us. These threads pop up all the time, basically since the beginning, and as far as I know our concerns go utterly ignored. It doesn't feel good as a player/customer, and it is a driving factor in breeding resentment towards the (mostly blameless) players who enjoy using their pets as intended. It's unnecessary and easily-preventable strife. ZOS, please...

I have zero problems with my pet being despawned, but what if it happens in a dungeon as an example. We often talk about fights before we actually do a boss fight to make sure everyone is on the same page that can last a minute or two or more. Then there is the cast time of a bear not to mention the animation of casting( it's rather weird) if my pet were instant cast it wouldn't bother me having it despawn it also is a ultimate ability. I don't know or pretend to know how easy or hard it would be to fix it. I do know you can not punish everyone for the actions of a few inconsiderate people.

To be clear, my problems with pets have little to do with people intentionally parking them on things I need to interact with (though that is an annoyance I could do without). And my proposal to change pets to be long duration skills would not significantly impede their use in dungeons and whatnot; having such generous durations would make them among the easiest-to-manage skills in the entire game.

For me, and many, it's more about their disruptive design than anything else. The immersion-killing sensory overload of having wings flappin, and bears bouncing, and hounds woofin, and critters chittering, and wings flappin, and wings flappin, and lights pulsating, and ponies prancing, and wings flappin, and echateres whining, and wings flappin... at all times... in every city you go to... at any time of day... it's just too much, man! It's obtrusive. It can even feel invasive at times. Pets' wings and mounts' buttholes are inches away from my camera multiple times a day, and there's nothing I can do about it except seriously hamper my own play or not play at all. It sucks, quite frankly. It doesn't bother many players at all, but it does bother a good portion of us, too.

And if you really want to know what a pain pets can be, become a dedicated tank for a week. I generally don't make a big deal about this aspect of it, because I know that pet builds are way too many players' preferred way to play... but damn do pet wranglers make my life harder as a tank. They're more up in my business than the enemies they're supposed to be fighting. They put sand in my v... uh... undies... something fierce. And it's because of their poor design.

I get that the majority of this isn't the players' fault, which is why I put the responsibility on ZOS. But that doesn't change the fact that it's a real pain point for other players who've done nothing wrong. I'm not saying players with pets should be punished, abolished, or anything like that -- but they're not automatically immune to having how they affect others be looked at either. A compromise is in order. And even though these forum threads probably amount to little more than shouting at the wind, I'm just trying to offer reasonable solutions so both sides can be happy.

Who knows, maybe someday ZOS might get around to taking a look at all this feedback and decide to do something about it! :P

Elsonso wrote: »

GreenHere wrote: »

nd if you really want to know what a pain pets can be, become a dedicated tank for a week. I generally don't make a big deal about this aspect of it, because I know that pet builds are way too many players' preferred way to play... but damn do pet wranglers make my life harder as a tank. They're more up in my business than the enemies they're supposed to be fighting. They put sand in my v... uh... undies... something fierce. And it's because of their poor design.

I have been in dungeons, in other games, where DPS players have been asked to ditch the pet if the pet is known to taunt or draw aggro away from the tank.

Yep. In WoW, in my friends and family guild, I was the tank with my hunter and pet - except after my nephew started to play, and was a dedicated tank. So then I went back to ranged DPS, after unsummoning the pet. There's no reason to aggravate the tank!

Alurria wrote: »

Thechuckage wrote: »

Alurria wrote: »

When i see these threads I get totally apprehensive. Why, I like pet class I have always played one in every game. I try to be responsible knowing that most games have this same problem. So I try to dismiss my pet in crowded town areas. But I also feel like my choice of class is being attacked bysome people not all because it is a problem with pets blocking objects. Most pet classes view their pet as a dot which is what they are. Why is it some people want to take a ability away? Some of the comments in this thread are over the top and totally blame the player for a flaw in the system. There maybe a handful of inconsiderate people who for whatever sick reason find pleasure in interuptions others game time but I'm not one of them. So why punish the rest of us?

If someone truly believes that a pet is so disruptive to game play then I suggest running around where people are dueling or wearing a monster set with visuals that go off while crafting or the annoying rain of arrows some players constantly let lose. Let's be fair pets can block things I agree. Like I said I get some people don't like pets but that doesn't mean that should dictate my use of them. This same problem has spanned every game I have played.

Only the devs can find a solution, last night I did a quest in town involving killing a were wolf so making pets disappear in town would require a rework of more that two quests. Plus there will always be people who are disruptive that is a human problem and Zos can't solve that.

If pets are a consistent problem across games, then they seem to be the common denominator. The solutions I've seen on the thread are not meant to punish the class, merely remove a nuisance while in town. There is no pressing need for them inside a town.
Duels and such should IMO also be banned in town, but that is another discussion to be had.

As for the 2 in town quests (since I brought it up originally) the werewolf in daggerfall and the former argonian slaves in mournhold were the 2 quests I was thinking of. Hardly game breaking to not have a bear of flappy bird for those. Necromancers and werewolves have to take on those quests without their unique abilities, fair for wardens and sorcs to do the same.

If there are other quests in town besides those two, my bad?

The point is this 'every game who has combat pets has this problem in the last 20 years or so' What I take exception with are those who think people are doing things on purpose. For most I am sure it is unconscious behavior. Now if Zos could solve this problem or any game for that matter I have a feeling it would be in game. Necros are reanimating the dead and necromancy has always been evil in most games. I have nothing against it but I don't make those decisions. Anyway, I'm sure something would have been done by now if it were feasible.

My point, the players intent is irrelevant. Malicious or not, when a pet is blocking something, its blocking something.

The point with the necros (and the werewolves) is they are blocked from a larger amount of skills during an in-town fight. More so than a sorc or warden would be without a pet. The point still stands that pets are not needed in towns.

I do not count on Zos being benevolent, accurate or timely with fixing issues. There is no reason to not advocate for a change you want to see. I think pets in town are an issue and there have been multiple suggestions on how to deal with that singular issue.

Starlight_Whisper wrote: »

Sorc pets are a least smaller and not fully solid but warden bear just makes interaction nearly impossible on things

While it's true that Sorc pets are less thing-blocking-y, they're also at least 4 times as visually annoying. I'd take an army of dopey Warden bears swarming the town over the onslaught of flappy wings in every direction that we have now, honestly.

Twilights are the biggest offenders by a country mile, at least in my book. And I'm not as bothered by them, but I have no love for the bright purple monkeys either. Warden bears may look a bit... derpy -- but at least they're bears, ya know?