50K Crows? You can buy a character in the Crown Store for less than that.

I've been on PC for 3 months, I have 7 maxed toons, 9 on Xbox. Its not that bad man.... it really only takes 2 days to level an alt and collect ss's

I also would love class change token. Also play nightblade and really do not enjoy playstyle of the class.

I wanted to switch class now for more than a year, but I kept playing because of achievements and unlocks I have. I do have all other classes at max level. But I am one main char person. My NB has master crafter unlock, I don't even want to think of unlocking all crafting on another character (motifs and styles as well), getting achievements for completing all alliances etc.

So all of this kept me playing NB, which in turn keeps adding even more achievements on this toon and making it harder to stop playing character that I do not enjoy as much anymore....

Oh and redoing same content over and over on a new toon is not fun, it gets grindy and boring fast....

Araneae6537 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

I don’t know why there isn’t a class change; surely race is the most integral part of a character and you can change that.

Your class interacts with way more systems than your race does. It honestly wouldn't surprise me if changing your character class risks some serious database corruption on the back end.

That’s true; I was thinking of it more from a lore standpoint. From that standpoint, retraining in a new class makes more sense than somehow (magically? miraculously?) changing the essence of who or what your character is. It actually hadn’t occurred to me that it might not be possible for logistical reasons.

Yeah, the lore perspective is a little more complicated, but class changes in ESO are a bit more involved than you might expect.

So, in the single player games, you play as a a character educated in the Mages Guild's model for magic and spellcasting. Except, in ESO, that basically never happens.

So, in Oblivion and Morrowind, Nightblades are just normal Guild educated mages who focus on illusion to be stealthier, but ESO's Nightblades actually practice Shadow Magic. This is an entirely different magic system, and we actually saw it in The Elder Scrolls: Shadowkey, so it's not something cooked up for ESO.

The Dragon Knights are educated in Akaviri Martial Arts, which involve a lot of shouting, and trying really hard to be a dragon, on the hope that, "fake it 'till you make it," applies to flying, fire breathing, death lizards.

The Templars draw their power from Meridia (or the Aedra, it's not 100% clear.)

The Sorcerer is most like Guild educated mages of the 3rd and 4th Eras... except they're also drawing knowledge from the Daedra.

The Necromancer is the runner up here, but again, they're practicing soul magic, which is something the Mages Guild really doesn't want anything to do with.

Finally, the Warden uses nature magic, akin to witches and wyresses across Tamriel.

The thing is, all of these are fundamentally incompatible approaches to magic. While our characters can learn a common pool of abilities (from skill and guild lines) there's a vast range of magical abilities that are exclusive to their class, and that's reflected in the lore. It's not just, "hey, here's three skill lines that are unique to your class."

Tandor wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

I am completely baffled at why anyone would be *against* someone else being able to change their character's class. I don't see what possible effect that could have on anyone else. It doesn't take anything away from anyone. People should be able to play whatever toon they are attached to in whatever way they think is fun. The constant arguing against people having fun makes no sense.

Because at the moment there is a decent balance of supply between the classes, but introduce class change tokens and players would be playing the current FOTM class until next time it changes and then they'd play the next FOTM class. Moreover, people want to reduce the frequency of class balance changes rather than increase them - which is what would happen if ZOS knew that every time they tweaked the classes they'd sell more tokens. Plus if there was a FOTM class then anyone not of that class would struggle to get into groups, so those who didn't want to change class would come under pressure to do so. Lastly, it would entail massive coding changes to the game the cost and time of which could arguably be put to much better use to the benefit of all players and not just the few that occasionally argue for the ability to change class.

For all these and doubtless other reasons such an idea if implemented would have a very definite effect on other players.

claiming people would change based on FOTM builds is the laziest/simplest and most absurd response ever.

"oh no, all those hardcore pvp fanatics with the maximum amount of characters and mixed between each class and various races would be able to buy a token and switch their nightblade to another templar for the newest flavour of the month build instead of just switching to their templar, will someone PLEASE find a way to stop all those hardcore pvp fanatics with the maximum amount of characters and mixed between each class and various races from being able to buy a token and switch their nightblade to another templar for the newest flavour of the month build instead of just switching totheir templar! "

"oh if only i was smart enough to think of 1 class change per account per 6 months-1 year or something"

I'd suggest limiting it to once per 6months-1year but somehow i feel like your go to response will be "when i say flavour of the month i didn't mean literally per month"

[snip]

[Edited to remove Rude Comments]

Skcarkden wrote: »

[snip]

Actually, a point to worrying about flavor of the month jumps, which has nothing to do with the player. A developer who was slightly less... ethical, could use class change tokens combined with significant balance changes to, "encourage," players to jump between classes on a frequent basis. We already see some grumblings along this line related to racial changes, but class changes would be a step beyond that. (This isn't even an entirely hypothetical scenario, I've seen this in other games.)

There's even the possibility of a developer releasing more powerful classes (which need to be purchased), and then if you wanted to convert characters you were previously using, you'd need a class change token. (Again, not a hypothetical, something I've seen in other MMOs.)

Now, I'm not especially worried about ZOS going down that route, but there is a legitimate concern behind someone saying, "let's just drop this entirely."

Right now, the classes are (more or less) balanced, but having class change tokens would create an environment that offered incentives to ensuring that balance rotated on a fairly regular basis.

starkerealm wrote: »

Skcarkden wrote: »

[snip]

Actually, a point to worrying about flavor of the month jumps, which has nothing to do with the player. A developer who was slightly less... ethical, could use class change tokens combined with significant balance changes to, "encourage," players to jump between classes on a frequent basis. We already see some grumblings along this line related to racial changes, but class changes would be a step beyond that. (This isn't even an entirely hypothetical scenario, I've seen this in other games.)

There's even the possibility of a developer releasing more powerful classes (which need to be purchased), and then if you wanted to convert characters you were previously using, you'd need a class change token. (Again, not a hypothetical, something I've seen in other MMOs.)

Now, I'm not especially worried about ZOS going down that route, but there is a legitimate concern behind someone saying, "let's just drop this entirely."

Right now, the classes are (more or less) balanced, but having class change tokens would create an environment that offered incentives to ensuring that balance rotated on a fairly regular basis.

ZOS: "Oh no.... everyone decided to log in to one of their many many alts instead of buying another class change token... why do pvp players have to be so cheap and use character slots they bought instead of class change tokens we could sell them? can't beliueve we wasted development resources on only 15 people!"

Again, most people already have lots of characters, anyone who would buy them on the regular would already have lots of characters to counter that. and in the same, if ZOS is shady enough to intentionally rework a class just to force people to buy tokens, again, those people would have lots of characters already.

Though I would argue ZOS in good faith would have to give free tokens out whenever they would do such class changes/edits/tweaks/etc. other games do that, although other games are more humble and don't pretend their the first MMO so everything is a fresh idea without past lessons learned by past games that made mistakes. so i guess we'd see if ZOS ever made rookie mistakes someone already found the answers to.

So what's so special with this toon that you need to resort to this? So you have close to 💯 achievements? Or have you spent like an obscene amount of money on the character through the crown store?

I mean you want to spend 50k crowns, close to $400 AUD.

Assuming the reason is because you've done all content then you can probably just make a sorcerer and just spend less than half of that on unlocking all the skill lines and skyshards.

Nyladreas wrote: »

Yamenstein wrote: »

So what's so special with this toon that you need to resort to this? So you have close to 💯 achievements? Or have you spent like an obscene amount of money on the character through the crown store?

I mean you want to spend 50k crowns, close to $400 AUD.

Assuming the reason is because you've done all content then you can probably just make a sorcerer and just spend less than half of that on unlocking all the skill lines and skyshards.

I've already explained it but it seems that a mod has (for some odd reason) removed that comment from this thread.

It's a combination of:

1) It being my first character
2) My first level 50
3) Top Alliance Rank on that character
4) Numerous achievements on that character
5) Done all quests and exploration on that character
6) Leveled and Collected just about everything that is collectible on that character
7) All crafting traits
8) Mount training
9) Have personal story for that character and personal ties to it as well as friendships
10) Character has existed for 5+ years
Bonus: Roleplay reasons

I did write it in a more elaborate way before, but tbh since it got deleted without any note or given reason, I'm just going to keep it in brief points above.

Also I've commented before that I have 14 different maxed out characters already on this account. It's 2 or 3 of each class ingame.

So It's not like I can't just go and level another character and be done with it. I have already done that in fact. I have already played over XXX hours on stamsorc (which is what i want to be). So no, just making a new character is NOT AN OPTION.

Preach. And still some folk don't get it and just mindlessly spout stuff like "just level another character, rotfl it's easy".

Hapexamendios wrote: »

Nothing is worth 50k crowns. That's just ridiculous.

I absolutely agree. None of those service tokens or homes are worth their prices in the crown store. ZOS should revisit their pricing schemes. Microtransactions should be microtransactions.1 single digital house shouldn't cost 65-75 GBP = approx. a week's food for working folks

Lol dude... you know this can't be done. No matter how desperate you may be, they won't change your character's class and I'm sure you're well aware of that.

Just create a new character and start moving your things (motifs, traits, etc) to the new toon.

If Class Change tokens get introduced you could basically change your whole character in a instant.

Name Change
Alliance Change
Race Change
Class Change

In my option, that’s ridiculous.

Tandor wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

I am completely baffled at why anyone would be *against* someone else being able to change their character's class. I don't see what possible effect that could have on anyone else. It doesn't take anything away from anyone. People should be able to play whatever toon they are attached to in whatever way they think is fun. The constant arguing against people having fun makes no sense.

Plus if there was a FOTM class then anyone not of that class would struggle to get into groups

This has already been the case in some high-end groups for a long time. Lots of good groups want a decent amount of necros for the major vulnerability. I've seen very good people drop out of groups before the run started because they noticed there weren't any necros and they felt the group wouldn't have enough damage. You still can't get into a lot of good groups for certain trials if you try to bring a stam character. Class change tokens wouldn't affect this at all as the vast majority of groups don't care about trying to guarantee that they beat the trial and will take anyone on any class. I still think necros were a mistake tbh.

Skcarkden wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Skcarkden wrote: »

[snip]

Actually, a point to worrying about flavor of the month jumps, which has nothing to do with the player. A developer who was slightly less... ethical, could use class change tokens combined with significant balance changes to, "encourage," players to jump between classes on a frequent basis. We already see some grumblings along this line related to racial changes, but class changes would be a step beyond that. (This isn't even an entirely hypothetical scenario, I've seen this in other games.)

There's even the possibility of a developer releasing more powerful classes (which need to be purchased), and then if you wanted to convert characters you were previously using, you'd need a class change token. (Again, not a hypothetical, something I've seen in other MMOs.)

Now, I'm not especially worried about ZOS going down that route, but there is a legitimate concern behind someone saying, "let's just drop this entirely."

Right now, the classes are (more or less) balanced, but having class change tokens would create an environment that offered incentives to ensuring that balance rotated on a fairly regular basis.

ZOS: "Oh no.... everyone decided to log in to one of their many many alts instead of buying another class change token... why do pvp players have to be so cheap and use character slots they bought instead of class change tokens we could sell them? can't beliueve we wasted development resources on only 15 people!"

Again, most people already have lots of characters, anyone who would buy them on the regular would already have lots of characters to counter that. and in the same, if ZOS is shady enough to intentionally rework a class just to force people to buy tokens, again, those people would have lots of characters already.

Though I would argue ZOS in good faith would have to give free tokens out whenever they would do such class changes/edits/tweaks/etc. other games do that, although other games are more humble and don't pretend their the first MMO so everything is a fresh idea without past lessons learned by past games that made mistakes. so i guess we'd see if ZOS ever made rookie mistakes someone already found the answers to.

I am one of those people. I have 33 characters, though only 21 of them are level 50. (And, actively only play about 27 of them.)

In either case, once you get beyond the 8 starting character slots, you'd be paying for either more character slots or class change tokens to keep characters viable.

Ryuvain wrote: »

You are missing one point, those who chase the meta already make alts of most classes. So them balancing classes to rake in money wouldn't affect most.

On that point, it would mostly affect people who are actually dedicated to a character, not chasing meta. You still have a point, just wanted to bring that up.

Still, it's silly to pass up this opportunity. It's free money. I'd pay myself for one, but until then I can't truly enjoy the game. Since they keep passing up on it, I can only guess they truly dont pay attention to the forums at all.

It's shocking how many devs don't even understand their own game. That's not only restricted to this game either.

They do keep an eye on the forums. Though, I think Rich's forum permissions were seriously curtailed after an incident with a troll a few years ago. They just don't post often. From personal experience, the devs are (unsurprisingly) very knowledgeable about the game, it's just that they also frequently have access to significant information we (as players) do not.

This can result in dev teams that balance to the metrics rather than the actual game, but it also means that they do have tools to better judge the state of the game.

I don't know exactly what the problem with class change tokens is, but I'm inclined to believe it's not the team choosing to, "leave money on the table." I'm willing to bet that there's some serious technical limitation in there, probably with the database, that makes class changes way more difficult than it looks on paper.