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Small radius by quest npc should be a safe zone
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Skcarkden✭✭✭✭
It is not exact same thing, you can be attacked because you're in pvp zone. Nobody cares about your need to do quests, its common sense in pvp. Figure out the way to go or fail, its fineStarlight_Whisper wrote: »
I can imagine you on the road and a car breaks down. "cmon i don't care what your reason is this a road, for driving so i'm not stopping i'll ram you if i gotta because the situation doesn't matter and i shouldn't have to stop or slow down to adapt for your obvious problem!"
Ye I can imagine a bumper car area where someone got himself confused about controls and run into a wall, ye this guy will get bumped by others.
Tbf I don't understand how you could compare PvP event into real life threatening situation when the two have nothing to do with eachother. Super disrespectful to those that died in car accidents or have relatives that did.
unless that bumper car is turned off in the middle of the course and all support is taken away from that individual the intentionally "missing the point" analogy of yours don't fit.
If you don't understand my analogy, i suggest reading it again, it's really simple. it isn't intended to be a 'perfect' analogy, just to get the point out.
Roads = you drive along them
PvP zones = you fight people.
Car breakdown = stopped moving on a road when roads are designed for moving along
Player talking to an NPC for a quest = Clearly someone who isn't fighting in an assigned pvp zone.
Car driver who thinks roads are ONLY for driving and no exceptions = "that guy is fair game for ramming cause i lack an open mind"
PvP player who sees a pve player talking to an NPC = "i spent years perfecting this pvp build i'm gonna get a cheap kill and tell me guild i just fought and beat 50 emperors at once to feel like a champ"
If you need it further explained... imagine someone petitioning their local road authority to add a set of lights at a very dangerous intersection or crossing point so that pedestrians can actually safely cross for once and all the road ragers going "no! it's a road! roads are made for cars! if you don't have a car you shouldn't be on it at all! "
simply put, there are clearly intentionally PvE elements throughout Cyrodiil and especially Imperial City, if anyone is against allowing players to talk to an NPC safely then clearly they are the real issue here.
If you need someone to be on dialog to win a fight then you aren't playing PvP, you're just going for cheap kills.
There is no valid argument against the notion, anyone who opposes saying "hurr durr it's pvp" is secretly saying that they rely on those cheap kills to feel mighty.7 -
ThorianB✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I disagree(and so does the definition of griefing, FYI). It is griefing when they hang out at quest givers and only kill people interacting with quest givers and then disappear as soon as they are presented with any type of actual combat. THAT is griefing.Their only purpose is to aggravate, hinder, and otherwise lower the enjoyment others are getting from the game. They aren't there to PVP. They are there to gank unsuspecting pvers for easy kills that don't fight back.
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Dusk_Coven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Although this sounds like a good idea, the real problem is PvPers will exploit it. As seen with such things as AP Boosting and Scroll Trolling and Door Camping -- PvP in every MMO is rife with exploiting and cheesing and using cheats when you can hide it.
So for your idea, PvPers would just run over and talk to an NPC whenever they got into trouble, for example. Then just not do anything to advance the dialog. Maybe even close the game without properly logging out so they are still protected "talking" to the NPC until the game times them out.
Whatever idea is good, whatever system is "intended", you can trust the PvP community to ruin.
Edited by Dusk_Coven on February 2, 2021 7:28AM3 -
LashanW✭✭✭✭✭
✭
You generally can't interact with things and NPCs if you are in combat and was hit recently. You need like 10+ seconds of not being hit to be able to interact. So I don't think PvPers can exploit it that much.Dusk_Coven wrote: »So for your idea, PvPers would just run over and talk to an NPC whenever they got into trouble, for example. Then just not do anything to advance the dialog. Maybe even close the game without properly logging out so they are still protected "talking" to the NPC until the game times them out.
Whatever idea is good, whatever system is "intended", you can trust the PvP community to ruin.---No longer active in ESO---
Platform: PC-EU
CP: 2500+Trial Achievements
Godslayer, Gryphon Heart, Tick-Tock Tormentor, Immortal Redeemer, Dro-m'Athra Destroyer, vMoL no death
Arena Achievements
vMA Flawless, vVH Spirit Slayer
DLC Dungeon Trifectas
Scalecaller Peak, Fang Lair, Depths of Malatar, Icereach1 -
renne✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
I disagree(and so does the definition of griefing, FYI). It is griefing when they hang out at quest givers and only kill people interacting with quest givers and then disappear as soon as they are presented with any type of actual combat. THAT is griefing.Their only purpose is to aggravate, hinder, and otherwise lower the enjoyment others are getting from the game. They aren't there to PVP. They are there to gank unsuspecting pvers for easy kills that don't fight back.
You called a generic comment about PvP happening in a PvP zone griefing. It's not. Because context matters.
What you said there? Yes, that's griefing.
But being killed by someone while you're going to do your quest, as much as it might upset you, is not griefing. Just because you don't like being killed by another player while you're doing your PvE thing in a PvP zone doesn't automatically make it griefing.
Hence: just being killed by another player in a PvP zone isn't griefing.2 -
Starlight_Whisper✭✭✭✭✭
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I disagree(and so does the definition of griefing, FYI). It is griefing when they hang out at quest givers and only kill people interacting with quest givers and then disappear as soon as they are presented with any type of actual combat. THAT is griefing.Their only purpose is to aggravate, hinder, and otherwise lower the enjoyment others are getting from the game. They aren't there to PVP. They are there to gank unsuspecting pvers for easy kills that don't fight back.
You called a generic comment about PvP happening in a PvP zone griefing. It's not. Because context matters.
What you said there? Yes, that's griefing.
But being killed by someone while you're going to do your quest, as much as it might upset you, is not griefing. Just because you don't like being killed by another player while you're doing your PvE thing in a PvP zone doesn't automatically make it griefing.
Hence: just being killed by another player in a PvP zone isn't griefing.
While talking to npc it is though.2 -
Starlight_Whisper✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dusk_Coven wrote: »Although this sounds like a good idea, the real problem is PvPers will exploit it. As seen with such things as AP Boosting and Scroll Trolling and Door Camping -- PvP in every MMO is rife with exploiting and cheesing and using cheats when you can hide it.
So for your idea, PvPers would just run over and talk to an NPC whenever they got into trouble, for example. Then just not do anything to advance the dialog. Maybe even close the game without properly logging out so they are still protected "talking" to the NPC until the game times them out.
Whatever idea is good, whatever system is "intended", you can trust the PvP community to ruin.
Just make it talking to quest npcs... or move quest npcs into alliance building with alliance guards to protect people? We can be creative about this.
Goals
* People can still attack players but let them grab or turn quest from npcs in towns1 -
renne✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Starlight_Whisper wrote: »
I disagree(and so does the definition of griefing, FYI). It is griefing when they hang out at quest givers and only kill people interacting with quest givers and then disappear as soon as they are presented with any type of actual combat. THAT is griefing.Their only purpose is to aggravate, hinder, and otherwise lower the enjoyment others are getting from the game. They aren't there to PVP. They are there to gank unsuspecting pvers for easy kills that don't fight back.
You called a generic comment about PvP happening in a PvP zone griefing. It's not. Because context matters.
What you said there? Yes, that's griefing.
But being killed by someone while you're going to do your quest, as much as it might upset you, is not griefing. Just because you don't like being killed by another player while you're doing your PvE thing in a PvP zone doesn't automatically make it griefing.
Hence: just being killed by another player in a PvP zone isn't griefing.
While talking to npc it is though.
Yes?????????? As I said, context matters.0 -
renne✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Starlight_Whisper wrote: »Dusk_Coven wrote: »Although this sounds like a good idea, the real problem is PvPers will exploit it. As seen with such things as AP Boosting and Scroll Trolling and Door Camping -- PvP in every MMO is rife with exploiting and cheesing and using cheats when you can hide it.
So for your idea, PvPers would just run over and talk to an NPC whenever they got into trouble, for example. Then just not do anything to advance the dialog. Maybe even close the game without properly logging out so they are still protected "talking" to the NPC until the game times them out.
Whatever idea is good, whatever system is "intended", you can trust the PvP community to ruin.
Just make it talking to quest npcs... or move quest npcs into alliance building with alliance guards to protect people? We can be creative about this.
Goals
* People can still attack players but let them grab or turn quest from npcs in towns
Whose alliance are they guards for? Yours? Because whichever alliance owns the town would own the guards, you can't have your alliance unless you flip the town. Which will flag it on the map and draw PvPers there. Or your alliance's guards in neutral towns? Well, they're neutral towns. There's no alliance guards there at all. Oh, they're whoevers alliance they need to be? Well, everyone in the campaign is in the same instance so it's not possible for them to be everyone's alliance, so they'll just attack everyone.
Okay, they're neutral guards. That's either pointless because they don't care they're neutral, or they attack everyone (see: everyone's alliance).
That said, alliance guards are pretty easily killed in PvP anyway. You can solo towns and resources without much effort, so the guards aren't going to be much help either way.
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ThorianB✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I disagree(and so does the definition of griefing, FYI). It is griefing when they hang out at quest givers and only kill people interacting with quest givers and then disappear as soon as they are presented with any type of actual combat. THAT is griefing.Their only purpose is to aggravate, hinder, and otherwise lower the enjoyment others are getting from the game. They aren't there to PVP. They are there to gank unsuspecting pvers for easy kills that don't fight back.
You called a generic comment about PvP happening in a PvP zone griefing. It's not. Because context matters.
What you said there? Yes, that's griefing.
But being killed by someone while you're going to do your quest, as much as it might upset you, is not griefing. Just because you don't like being killed by another player while you're doing your PvE thing in a PvP zone doesn't automatically make it griefing.
Hence: just being killed by another player in a PvP zone isn't griefing.
Yes, the context is in the title of the thread. If i am on my way to a delve and a player runs by me and is like "Oh enemy, kill them" that is different. If that player doesn't vanish as soon as they are met with resistance that is different. But the tactics used in towns is griefing.
I am not against PVP. I typically love it, just not ESO's take on it. The tactics we are talking about here, i would never do because its just wrong. Id try to flip the whole town instead, especially when the griefers i have personally seen are in groups of two to make sure that if you are better than them, they still win.4 -
Morgha_Kul✭✭✭✭✭
✭Starlight_Whisper wrote: »Starlight_Whisper wrote: »
It is not exact same thing, you can be attacked because you're in pvp zone. Nobody cares about your need to do quests, its common sense in pvp. Figure out the way to go or fail, its fineStarlight_Whisper wrote: »
I can imagine you on the road and a car breaks down. "cmon i don't care what your reason is this a road, for driving so i'm not stopping i'll ram you if i gotta because the situation doesn't matter and i shouldn't have to stop or slow down to adapt for your obvious problem!"
Ye I can imagine a bumper car area where someone got himself confused about controls and run into a wall, ye this guy will get bumped by others.
Tbf I don't understand how you could compare PvP event into real life threatening situation when the two have nothing to do with eachother. Super disrespectful to those that died in car accidents or have relatives that did.
There point was that guy was being selfish.
Doesn't make it any less disrespectful.Morgha_Kul wrote: »So... pvp players want to be able to attack people while they're interacting with an NPC. Hmmm... you'd almost think they only want to have a target that can't fight back. So much for wanting pvp for the "challenge."
It's not like they won't win or get to fight after npc talking. Just let people talk to npcs or do it like imperial city.
Quite. But that's the point. In my experience, pvp players don't WANT to fight people. They just want to kill people who can't fight back. Witness the instant stealth kills. Witness the 20-1 gank kills. This is no different. They just want another free target, not an actual fight.Exploring Tamriel since 1994.5 -
The_Lex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Morgha_Kul wrote: »Starlight_Whisper wrote: »Starlight_Whisper wrote: »
It is not exact same thing, you can be attacked because you're in pvp zone. Nobody cares about your need to do quests, its common sense in pvp. Figure out the way to go or fail, its fineStarlight_Whisper wrote: »
I can imagine you on the road and a car breaks down. "cmon i don't care what your reason is this a road, for driving so i'm not stopping i'll ram you if i gotta because the situation doesn't matter and i shouldn't have to stop or slow down to adapt for your obvious problem!"
Ye I can imagine a bumper car area where someone got himself confused about controls and run into a wall, ye this guy will get bumped by others.
Tbf I don't understand how you could compare PvP event into real life threatening situation when the two have nothing to do with eachother. Super disrespectful to those that died in car accidents or have relatives that did.
There point was that guy was being selfish.
Doesn't make it any less disrespectful.Morgha_Kul wrote: »So... pvp players want to be able to attack people while they're interacting with an NPC. Hmmm... you'd almost think they only want to have a target that can't fight back. So much for wanting pvp for the "challenge."
It's not like they won't win or get to fight after npc talking. Just let people talk to npcs or do it like imperial city.
Quite. But that's the point. In my experience, pvp players don't WANT to fight people. They just want to kill people who can't fight back. Witness the instant stealth kills. Witness the 20-1 gank kills. This is no different. They just want another free target, not an actual fight.
Gankers want instant stealth kills. Not every PvP player is a ganker.0 -
Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Dusk_Coven wrote: »Although this sounds like a good idea, the real problem is PvPers will exploit it. As seen with such things as AP Boosting and Scroll Trolling and Door Camping -- PvP in every MMO is rife with exploiting and cheesing and using cheats when you can hide it.
So for your idea, PvPers would just run over and talk to an NPC whenever they got into trouble, for example. Then just not do anything to advance the dialog. Maybe even close the game without properly logging out so they are still protected "talking" to the NPC until the game times them out.
Whatever idea is good, whatever system is "intended", you can trust the PvP community to ruin.
if you are already in combat, you cannot initiate conversation. problem solved. we literally have a precedent of this working in a form of IC.dirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***3 -
renne✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Morgha_Kul wrote: »Starlight_Whisper wrote: »Starlight_Whisper wrote: »
It is not exact same thing, you can be attacked because you're in pvp zone. Nobody cares about your need to do quests, its common sense in pvp. Figure out the way to go or fail, its fineStarlight_Whisper wrote: »
I can imagine you on the road and a car breaks down. "cmon i don't care what your reason is this a road, for driving so i'm not stopping i'll ram you if i gotta because the situation doesn't matter and i shouldn't have to stop or slow down to adapt for your obvious problem!"
Ye I can imagine a bumper car area where someone got himself confused about controls and run into a wall, ye this guy will get bumped by others.
Tbf I don't understand how you could compare PvP event into real life threatening situation when the two have nothing to do with eachother. Super disrespectful to those that died in car accidents or have relatives that did.
There point was that guy was being selfish.
Doesn't make it any less disrespectful.Morgha_Kul wrote: »So... pvp players want to be able to attack people while they're interacting with an NPC. Hmmm... you'd almost think they only want to have a target that can't fight back. So much for wanting pvp for the "challenge."
It's not like they won't win or get to fight after npc talking. Just let people talk to npcs or do it like imperial city.
Quite. But that's the point. In my experience, pvp players don't WANT to fight people. They just want to kill people who can't fight back. Witness the instant stealth kills. Witness the 20-1 gank kills. This is no different. They just want another free target, not an actual fight.
See this kind of thing is why people don't take PvEers complaints about having to PvP seriously, because they can't tell the difference between gankers, bombers and literally every other build. Anyone who kills anyone else quickly and easily is automatically considered a ganker.2 -
Starlight_Whisper✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dusk_Coven wrote: »Although this sounds like a good idea, the real problem is PvPers will exploit it. As seen with such things as AP Boosting and Scroll Trolling and Door Camping -- PvP in every MMO is rife with exploiting and cheesing and using cheats when you can hide it.
So for your idea, PvPers would just run over and talk to an NPC whenever they got into trouble, for example. Then just not do anything to advance the dialog. Maybe even close the game without properly logging out so they are still protected "talking" to the NPC until the game times them out.
Whatever idea is good, whatever system is "intended", you can trust the PvP community to ruin.
if you are already in combat, you cannot initiate conversation. problem solved. we literally have a precedent of this working in a form of IC.
I think this is a good idea0 -
ks888✭✭✭✭.
Edited by ks888 on February 2, 2021 9:09PMDC NA - Norri - Khole RIP - [Mostly Outnumbered]** I have too many toons **RIP every alt I deleted - where am I? what year is it?0 -
Goregrinder✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Starlight_Whisper wrote: »
The day I stop getting kicked from dungeons, is the day I'll consider showing anyone mercy in a PVP zone.1 -
Starlight_Whisper✭✭✭✭✭
✭Goregrinder wrote: »Starlight_Whisper wrote: »
The day I stop getting kicked from dungeons, is the day I'll consider showing anyone mercy in a PVP zone.
No need for mercy. Just zos should make it so we can talk to npcs. Feel free to jump us afterwards0 -
SidraWillowsky✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I'm now picturing all PvEers of the same alliance huddled together around the NPC while they wait for help to arrive :P
Maybe limit the invulnerability period to 5-7 seconds (enough time to turn in one quest and pick up another) to prevent people from just sitting in safe zone?
Or just move the damn quest NPCs outside of buildings. I think even just doing that would help a lot.0 -
zvavi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Roads = you drive along them
Car driver who thinks roads are ONLY for driving and no exceptions = "that guy is fair game for ramming cause i lack an open mind"
I read your example loud and clear. The aim of roads is safely to get from point a to b in the most efficient way. Ramming anything on those roads, goes against the aim of roads. Your example, is disrespectful to all those who died in car accidents, and the fact that it got 3 awesomes is disgusting me (as someone who lost a relative). It has nothing to do with your PoV that people that kill questers that are obviously questers are mean for no reason, which I agree with.
What I don't agree with, is expecting not to be attacked while questing there. If the pool has a big sign in the entrance free for all water battle, I would expect to get hit even if I go swimming that day.Edited by zvavi on February 2, 2021 9:36PM0 -
Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭SidraWillowsky wrote: »I'm now picturing all PvEers of the same alliance huddled together around the NPC while they wait for help to arrive :P
Maybe limit the invulnerability period to 5-7 seconds (enough time to turn in one quest and pick up another) to prevent people from just sitting in safe zone?
Or just move the damn quest NPCs outside of buildings. I think even just doing that would help a lot.
safe zone happens when you click on npc, ends when you stop. and in case you are thinking of just sitting there in conversation indefinitely - make the time before npc moves and ends the conversation themselves, i don't know... a minute, 2 minutes should definitely be enough? 5-7 seconds is not enough to listen to the voiceover/read all of the text. 2 minutes gives you enough time to talk to npc, but not so much that you can use it as a get out of jail free card.Edited by Linaleah on February 2, 2021 9:35PMdirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***0 -
Morgha_Kul✭✭✭✭✭
✭Morgha_Kul wrote: »Starlight_Whisper wrote: »Starlight_Whisper wrote: »
It is not exact same thing, you can be attacked because you're in pvp zone. Nobody cares about your need to do quests, its common sense in pvp. Figure out the way to go or fail, its fineStarlight_Whisper wrote: »
I can imagine you on the road and a car breaks down. "cmon i don't care what your reason is this a road, for driving so i'm not stopping i'll ram you if i gotta because the situation doesn't matter and i shouldn't have to stop or slow down to adapt for your obvious problem!"
Ye I can imagine a bumper car area where someone got himself confused about controls and run into a wall, ye this guy will get bumped by others.
Tbf I don't understand how you could compare PvP event into real life threatening situation when the two have nothing to do with eachother. Super disrespectful to those that died in car accidents or have relatives that did.
There point was that guy was being selfish.
Doesn't make it any less disrespectful.Morgha_Kul wrote: »So... pvp players want to be able to attack people while they're interacting with an NPC. Hmmm... you'd almost think they only want to have a target that can't fight back. So much for wanting pvp for the "challenge."
It's not like they won't win or get to fight after npc talking. Just let people talk to npcs or do it like imperial city.
Quite. But that's the point. In my experience, pvp players don't WANT to fight people. They just want to kill people who can't fight back. Witness the instant stealth kills. Witness the 20-1 gank kills. This is no different. They just want another free target, not an actual fight.
See this kind of thing is why people don't take PvEers complaints about having to PvP seriously, because they can't tell the difference between gankers, bombers and literally every other build. Anyone who kills anyone else quickly and easily is automatically considered a ganker.
I understand what you are saying, but literally EVERY experience I have had in pvp (not just in this game) has been one like I described... where one person has NO chance to be competitive, for whatever reason. It might be that instant kill stealth attack. It might be a 20-1 gank. It might be a matter of one player having his character completely twinked out with gamebreaking gear, while the other has only just entered the pvp zone for the first time (indeed, I find a LOT of veteran pvp players with maxed out gear love to camp out where new players will be appearing for the first time).
To me, pvp is supposed to be about competition. To hear the defenders of pvp talk about it, they prefer pvp because it gives them a challenge... they seek thinking foes who would pose an actual threat to them. Then they do the kinds of things I described. It's unfortunate, because I'm certain there are those who DO seek a challenge. Alas, they seem to be the minority.
Tell me, if you found yourself in a fight with a newbie who literally COULD NOT hurt you... would you walk away or just obliterate him in one attack? It seems most pvp players would just kill the new guy, then complain when he doesn't come back.
The reality is, pvp is NOT well suited to games like this, where there is guaranteed to be an imbalance between players, resulting from gear and builds. For pvp to be competitive for all, all the participants must be roughly the SAME. That way, victory goes to the more skillful player.Exploring Tamriel since 1994.1 -
renne✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Morgha_Kul wrote: »I understand what you are saying, but literally EVERY experience I have had in pvp (not just in this game) has been one like I described... where one person has NO chance to be competitive, for whatever reason. It might be that instant kill stealth attack. It might be a 20-1 gank. It might be a matter of one player having his character completely twinked out with gamebreaking gear, while the other has only just entered the pvp zone for the first time (indeed, I find a LOT of veteran pvp players with maxed out gear love to camp out where new players will be appearing for the first time).
You must just be incredibly unlucky or only do a specific thing in PvP in this game, because that's the opposite of the experiences I've had in the VAST majority of PvP in ESO. That's also certainly not remotely like what the majority of PvP in this game is like, either. Cyrodiil: a little bit but the majority is not like that. Battlegrounds: sometimes, but not like that. Imperial City: well... a bit of that but not entirely, either.1 -
Dusk_Coven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The OP has the idea BACKWARDS.
Instead of protecting PvE NPCs we should be un-protecting PvP NPCs.
Why should a PvPer not be fair game when they are spending their Tel Var in the Imperial City? Isn't that how PvPers think?Edited by Dusk_Coven on February 3, 2021 3:57AM0 -
renne✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Dusk_Coven wrote: »The OP has the idea BACKWARDS.
Instead of protecting PvE NPCs we should be un-protecting PvP NPCs.
Why should a PvPer not be fair game when they are spending their Tel Var in the Imperial City? Isn't that how PvPers think?
You want to have merchants just... hanging out in the city or sewer, full of dremora and daedra? I mean, sure, but why would a merchant just be chilling somewhere in the IC waiting for customers to come by where the place IS lousy with dremora and daedra, including inside the buildings? Setting up a shop upstairs or in the sewers makes absolutely no sense because there are no customers because the people are dead or prisoners, whereas customers can come by in the alliance bases in the sewers.0 -
LightYagami✭✭✭✭✭Tbf I don't even understand why PvE quests in PvP zone gives tickets in a PvP event
Absolutely.
They can get tickets from PvP events by doing something like "rescuing a few NPCs", "Find a few items", etc.
If doing PvE actions drop tickets in PvP events, can we get tickets by doing PvP during PvE events?No improvement on Cyrodill servers -> no ESO plus renewal.0 -
Morgha_Kul✭✭✭✭✭
✭Morgha_Kul wrote: »I understand what you are saying, but literally EVERY experience I have had in pvp (not just in this game) has been one like I described... where one person has NO chance to be competitive, for whatever reason. It might be that instant kill stealth attack. It might be a 20-1 gank. It might be a matter of one player having his character completely twinked out with gamebreaking gear, while the other has only just entered the pvp zone for the first time (indeed, I find a LOT of veteran pvp players with maxed out gear love to camp out where new players will be appearing for the first time).
You must just be incredibly unlucky or only do a specific thing in PvP in this game, because that's the opposite of the experiences I've had in the VAST majority of PvP in ESO. That's also certainly not remotely like what the majority of PvP in this game is like, either. Cyrodiil: a little bit but the majority is not like that. Battlegrounds: sometimes, but not like that. Imperial City: well... a bit of that but not entirely, either.
I honestly haven't pvped much in ESO, and I rarely go to Cyrodiil, so my sample size with ESO is pretty small. However, I'm referring to my experience of pvp across many games in over 35 years of gaming. I can count on one hand the number of positive pvp experiences I've had EVER (there's been two).
The first was playing Red Baron 3D Multiplayer. I was flying a Fokker E3 Eindecker, and came across a solo player in a Nieuport 11. The two planes were roughly contemporary, so we engaged for nearly an hour, both taking damage, until we both ran out of ammo. At that point, we waggled at each other and went off on our way. That was fun... because it was an even matchup, and we both had some success. More, the battle wasn't over in 2 seconds, which allowed us the time to enjoy the engagement.
The second was playing City of Heroes. There is a pvp zone there where people would frequently go to duel. Now, the whole zone was pvp, but this one platform was generally regarded as duels only. People would stand around there to watch and participate in one on one combats, and it was expected that no one would attack anyone there.
I was playing a Mastermind, a pet summoning character (Bots and Force Fields, if you know the game). A Scrapper (melee dps) player decided he was going to ambush me while I was watching, but he couldn't hit me through my force field power. However, his attacks alerted my bots, and they started attacking him. He kept trying to hit me for a bit, and then finally tried to run away. I decided to pursue him. He tried to fly up into the air to get away from my bots, but I had a group fly power and pursued him again. He ran quickly up so I came up with a plan to pursue him until my bots fell behind, to the ground. I would then drop my force field and engage him with a power that would disable his flight power. He thought he had me when I dropped my field, but my attack dropped him to the ground doing massive damage. He had only 1 hp left as I swooped in to finish him off... but someone blindsided me before I could attack him and they doubleteamed me to death while I was held.
This one was fun too, because it involved some strategy and clever tactics from BOTH of us. He tried to goad me into an attack, not realizing I was trying to get him to do just that. Again, it was a pretty even match (until someone interfered), and wasn't over in a couple of seconds, so we had time to enjoy the battle.
Those are the only two pvp experiences I've ever had that were enjoyable.
When I played Battlefield 1942, it would inevitably be a game of spawn camping. You spawn and immediately die.
When I played Star Wars Galaxies, it was unbalanced classes ganking and teabagging.
When I played Star Wars the Old Republic, it was unbalanced gearing, ganking and nonstop stuns and holds, so no fighting back.
It's always the same, so I've not seen any reason to play pvp here. I liked the idea of besieging castles, I thought that was a COOL idea, but when I went out to try it, I couldn't even leave the entry area, as there were 30 guys waiting around outside the gate obliterating anyone who tried to come out.
When I finally got into a fight with someone, he was ENTIRELY impervious to all my attacks, while he was able to annihilate me in one or two hits. There was NO balance at all, no skill required.
On one occasion, I tried to help defend a castle, and found I was completely unable to contribute anything. My attacks were less than trivial to everyone, and I had no ability to survive anything. My healing was nerfed into the ground, so I couldn't even contribute THAT.
So, I've not bothered with it. To be competetive I'd have to grind for years to get all the supermegapowerful gear and boost my dps to around 10 million or something ridiculous, which would trivialize the rest of the game... and I don't WANT that.
But that's ME. Others may have better experiences. Others may and DO enjoy pvp, whatever form it takes. That's fine. More power to them.Exploring Tamriel since 1994.0