Blacknight841 wrote: »I am a little confused by this new phenomenon sweeping across the game. I can understand zenimax not caring about gold buyers/sellers or even bots (or at least not acting on them)... but this directly effects their crown sales. The worst part is that the players are not doing it by themselves, but rather customer support is doing the transaction for them. As it stands, one no longer needs to buy crown crates, or even wait for crown crates to come back in season that are long past, but rather just find someone with the mount they want and buy it from that person (with cash or gold). To further this scenario, it isn't even an in game issue. This is directly done by zenimax customer support. So by all accounts anyone could see this as being blessed by zenimax.
To explain the scenario. Person A wants to sell his radiant apex mount from his inventory to person B. Person A gets the gold or cash from person B. Person A then proceeds to sending a ticket to customer service asking to "gift" their mount to Person B. And bam! 48 hours later Person B has the mount, and Person A is richer.??? It is just asinine, that this even happened once, let alone being systematically done to gain a profit. Not only that, but there is a direct line of proof on the transactions. It is not like people do not know what they are doing.
I truly upset at this point for spending crowns and trying to gamble for a radiant mount, now knowing that all I had to do was buy it from someone else. From my perspective it feels as though the developers are purposefully trying to alienate those that play the game as intended. How are players supposed to care about the game, with situations like this happening?
Ticket Number: 201210-003344 @ZOS_GinaBruno
Blacknight841 wrote: »From my perspective it feels as though the developers are purposefully trying to alienate those that play the game as intended. How are players supposed to care about the game, with situations like this happening?
Ticket Number: 201210-003344 @ZOS_GinaBruno
Blacknight841 wrote: »From my perspective it feels as though the developers are purposefully trying to alienate those that play the game as intended. How are players supposed to care about the game, with situations like this happening?
Ticket Number: 201210-003344 @ZOS_GinaBruno
I am sure ZoS loves that you think opening crown crates has anything to do with gameplay.
furiouslog wrote: »It does not seem likely that this actually happened.
VaranisArano wrote: »Trading in game items, which includes gifting for gold, is allowed by ZOS.
Asking Support to help out is the known workaround for stuff that used to not be giftable, like houses. Support doesn't really care who pays as long as ZOS gets paid.
Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Trading in game items, which includes gifting for gold, is allowed by ZOS.
Asking Support to help out is the known workaround for stuff that used to not be giftable, like houses. Support doesn't really care who pays as long as ZOS gets paid.
Gifting items that can be purchased for crowns sure. Gifting items from your inventory that you are not using just because you would rather have gold, I think not. Can I gift a bout maelstrom staff? A radiant apex cannot be purchased by crowns, so one should not be able to gift the item from their inventory.
This isnt merely about gifting items. This is gifting items a person owns. In essence getting a gold refund from he recipient for crowns spent.
Blacknight841 wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Trading in game items, which includes gifting for gold, is allowed by ZOS.
Asking Support to help out is the known workaround for stuff that used to not be giftable, like houses. Support doesn't really care who pays as long as ZOS gets paid.
Gifting items that can be purchased for crowns sure. Gifting items from your inventory that you are not using just because you would rather have gold, I think not. Can I gift a bout maelstrom staff? A radiant apex cannot be purchased by crowns, so one should not be able to gift the item from their inventory.
This isnt merely about gifting items. This is gifting items a person owns. In essence getting a gold refund from he recipient for crowns spent.
When you gift an item from the crown store, it requires a new injection of crowns to zenimax. This however does not require any injection of crowns into the system,.
Blacknight841 wrote: »furiouslog wrote: »It does not seem likely that this actually happened.
I have submitted proof of the contrary.
Blacknight841 wrote: »If the game has a system in it where you are encouraged to gamble for a cosmetic item, then it should be treated as such. Since you cannot buy a radiant apex mount with crowns directly, it is completely circumventing the system to be able to buy it with gold from someone else. That is not how the crown crates were intended to be played.
furiouslog wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »furiouslog wrote: »It does not seem likely that this actually happened.
I have submitted proof of the contrary.
What proof is that? It seems unlikely that you'd have access to anything that was truly definitive unless you participated in the transaction yourself.
Blacknight841 wrote: »If the game has a system in it where you are encouraged to gamble for a cosmetic item, then it should be treated as such. Since you cannot buy a radiant apex mount with crowns directly, it is completely circumventing the system to be able to buy it with gold from someone else. That is not how the crown crates were intended to be played.
@Blacknight841 - If ZOS employees are facilitating the transactions, wouldn't that in its self suggest it is officially supported? Can you provide a link to where ZOS has said that is how crown crates are intended to be played? Or is this just a personal interpretation?
Here is a link to a statement by an official representative regarding the exchange of in-game items for in-game currency: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/5205829/#Comment_5205829
Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Trading in game items, which includes gifting for gold, is allowed by ZOS.
Asking Support to help out is the known workaround for stuff that used to not be giftable, like houses. Support doesn't really care who pays as long as ZOS gets paid.
Gifting items that can be purchased for crowns sure. Gifting items from your inventory that you are not using just because you would rather have gold, I think not. Can I gift a bout maelstrom staff? A radiant apex cannot be purchased by crowns, so one should not be able to gift the item from their inventory.
This isnt merely about gifting items. This is gifting items a person already owns. In essence getting a gold refund from the recipient for crowns spent.
I highly doubt that it is accepted by zos, for me to gift the 100+ mounts from my inventory to other people, and get gold in exchange.
VaranisArano wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Trading in game items, which includes gifting for gold, is allowed by ZOS.
Asking Support to help out is the known workaround for stuff that used to not be giftable, like houses. Support doesn't really care who pays as long as ZOS gets paid.
Gifting items that can be purchased for crowns sure. Gifting items from your inventory that you are not using just because you would rather have gold, I think not. Can I gift a bout maelstrom staff? A radiant apex cannot be purchased by crowns, so one should not be able to gift the item from their inventory.
This isnt merely about gifting items. This is gifting items a person already owns. In essence getting a gold refund from the recipient for crowns spent.
I highly doubt that it is accepted by zos, for me to gift the 100+ mounts from my inventory to other people, and get gold in exchange.
The Radiant Apex mount was purchased with crowns, as is everything in the Crown Crates. So I think that's a moot point. Someone paid for the crown crates at some point, or there would be no mount to gift.
Your contention is that ZOS Support has facilitated this exchange (in which case, it seems logical that they de facto allow it), yet you doubt that ZOS accepts this type of trade.
Hmm.
Honestly, I suspect either someone is overstating what Support will actually let them do or ZOS Support will allow it even though they prefer to not make it an obvious type of gifting (yet.) As I noted, Support has done this for houses, which eventually became giftable for players.
Blacknight841 wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »If the game has a system in it where you are encouraged to gamble for a cosmetic item, then it should be treated as such. Since you cannot buy a radiant apex mount with crowns directly, it is completely circumventing the system to be able to buy it with gold from someone else. That is not how the crown crates were intended to be played.
@Blacknight841 - If ZOS employees are facilitating the transactions, wouldn't that in its self suggest it is officially supported? Can you provide a link to where ZOS has said that is how crown crates are intended to be played? Or is this just a personal interpretation?
Here is a link to a statement by an official representative regarding the exchange of in-game items for in-game currency: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/5205829/#Comment_5205829
It is one thing to gift an item from the crown store, it is another to gift a bound item from your inventory. By your argument, what's the point of binding something to an account if you can still gift it with a letter to zenimax? Because I have an extra perfected maelstrom staff, does that mean I can gift it to someone for gold... or even one of my older houses that I am no longer using, can I gift that to a person for gold? I think not.
Kalik_Gold wrote: »I didn't thinking gifting Gem related items were a thing, proof please...
I did know you could gift straight up crown mounts... but having a Radiant gifted... that's new.
Hallothiel wrote: »Can you show what your proof is please, as whilst you have posted numerous times saying this is happening, that’s all it is - you saying this is happening. That isn’t proof.
Kalik_Gold wrote: »I didn't thinking gifting Gem related items were a thing, proof please...
I did know you could gift straight up crown mounts... but having a Radiant gifted... that's new.
It's done through the help tickets.
Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Trading in game items, which includes gifting for gold, is allowed by ZOS.
Asking Support to help out is the known workaround for stuff that used to not be giftable, like houses. Support doesn't really care who pays as long as ZOS gets paid.
Gifting items that can be purchased for crowns sure. Gifting items from your inventory that you are not using just because you would rather have gold, I think not. Can I gift a bout maelstrom staff? A radiant apex cannot be purchased by crowns, so one should not be able to gift the item from their inventory.
This isnt merely about gifting items. This is gifting items a person already owns. In essence getting a gold refund from the recipient for crowns spent.
I highly doubt that it is accepted by zos, for me to gift the 100+ mounts from my inventory to other people, and get gold in exchange.
The Radiant Apex mount was purchased with crowns, as is everything in the Crown Crates. So I think that's a moot point. Someone paid for the crown crates at some point, or there would be no mount to gift.
Your contention is that ZOS Support has facilitated this exchange (in which case, it seems logical that they de facto allow it), yet you doubt that ZOS accepts this type of trade.
Hmm.
Honestly, I suspect either someone is overstating what Support will actually let them do or ZOS Support will allow it even though they prefer to not make it an obvious type of gifting (yet.) As I noted, Support has done this for houses, which eventually became giftable for players.
Support has allowed the gifting of houses, by buying a new house for that person. That is clear. What this issue highlights, is gifting a mount from a persons inventory. The gifting system allows for the purchase of a NEW item for a recipient, not for gifting old items already in a persons inventory. Gifting old and unused items bound to a players account is a different scenario entirely. In all gifting transactions, zenimax gets new crowns spent. This scenario is circumventing that. Instead it is recycling old items for a profit (after all you can only use one mount at a time). Also if it is an accepted thing, then why make anything bound to an account at all? Furthermore this will lead to a general influx of tickets for gifting items, taking away from the ability of zenimax concentrating on tickets that put more emphasis on gameplay.
Kalik_Gold wrote: »Kalik_Gold wrote: »I didn't thinking gifting Gem related items were a thing, proof please...
I did know you could gift straight up crown mounts... but having a Radiant gifted... that's new.
It's done through the help tickets.
Wow, that right there is a slap in the face, when real help tickets for Bots, Bugs and other issues are put on hold. I also put in tickets for out of season Crown Items before and were denied. It must be a whale thing where they buy so much they get special privileges, a regular player/payer would be denied I assume.
VaranisArano wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Trading in game items, which includes gifting for gold, is allowed by ZOS.
Asking Support to help out is the known workaround for stuff that used to not be giftable, like houses. Support doesn't really care who pays as long as ZOS gets paid.
Gifting items that can be purchased for crowns sure. Gifting items from your inventory that you are not using just because you would rather have gold, I think not. Can I gift a bout maelstrom staff? A radiant apex cannot be purchased by crowns, so one should not be able to gift the item from their inventory.
This isnt merely about gifting items. This is gifting items a person already owns. In essence getting a gold refund from the recipient for crowns spent.
I highly doubt that it is accepted by zos, for me to gift the 100+ mounts from my inventory to other people, and get gold in exchange.
The Radiant Apex mount was purchased with crowns, as is everything in the Crown Crates. So I think that's a moot point. Someone paid for the crown crates at some point, or there would be no mount to gift.
Your contention is that ZOS Support has facilitated this exchange (in which case, it seems logical that they de facto allow it), yet you doubt that ZOS accepts this type of trade.
Hmm.
Honestly, I suspect either someone is overstating what Support will actually let them do or ZOS Support will allow it even though they prefer to not make it an obvious type of gifting (yet.) As I noted, Support has done this for houses, which eventually became giftable for players.
Support has allowed the gifting of houses, by buying a new house for that person. That is clear. What this issue highlights, is gifting a mount from a persons inventory. The gifting system allows for the purchase of a NEW item for a recipient, not for gifting old items already in a persons inventory. Gifting old and unused items bound to a players account is a different scenario entirely. In all gifting transactions, zenimax gets new crowns spent. This scenario is circumventing that. Instead it is recycling old items for a profit (after all you can only use one mount at a time). Also if it is an accepted thing, then why make anything bound to an account at all? Furthermore this will lead to a general influx of tickets for gifting items, taking away from the ability of zenimax concentrating on tickets that put more emphasis on gameplay.
How it used to work:
Person A wants to gift a house to Person B.
Person A asked Support to charge them X Crowns and to gift the house to Person B.
Support takes X Crowns for ZOS from Person A and gifts the house to Person B.
You can insert whatever item you like. Some people had luck doing it with some older items no longer in the Crown Store.
How this Radiant Mount gifting thing apparently works:
Person A spends loads of Crowns on Crown Crates.
Person A gets Radiant Apex Mount.
Person A asks Support to gift it to Person B.
Support does apparently does so, because ZOS already profited from Person A spending loads of crowns to get the Radiant Apex mount in the first place.
In both cases, ZOS gets their profit from people spending crowns to get the item they gifted.
Blacknight841 wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »From my perspective it feels as though the developers are purposefully trying to alienate those that play the game as intended. How are players supposed to care about the game, with situations like this happening?
Ticket Number: 201210-003344 @ZOS_GinaBruno
I am sure ZoS loves that you think opening crown crates has anything to do with gameplay.
if the game has a system in it where you are encouraged to gamble for a cosmetic item, then it should be treated as such. Since you cannot buy a radiant apex mount with crowns directly, it is completely circumventing the system to be able to buy it with gold from someone else. That is not how the crown crates were intended to be played.
Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Blacknight841 wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »Trading in game items, which includes gifting for gold, is allowed by ZOS.
Asking Support to help out is the known workaround for stuff that used to not be giftable, like houses. Support doesn't really care who pays as long as ZOS gets paid.
Gifting items that can be purchased for crowns sure. Gifting items from your inventory that you are not using just because you would rather have gold, I think not. Can I gift a bout maelstrom staff? A radiant apex cannot be purchased by crowns, so one should not be able to gift the item from their inventory.
This isnt merely about gifting items. This is gifting items a person already owns. In essence getting a gold refund from the recipient for crowns spent.
I highly doubt that it is accepted by zos, for me to gift the 100+ mounts from my inventory to other people, and get gold in exchange.
The Radiant Apex mount was purchased with crowns, as is everything in the Crown Crates. So I think that's a moot point. Someone paid for the crown crates at some point, or there would be no mount to gift.
Your contention is that ZOS Support has facilitated this exchange (in which case, it seems logical that they de facto allow it), yet you doubt that ZOS accepts this type of trade.
Hmm.
Honestly, I suspect either someone is overstating what Support will actually let them do or ZOS Support will allow it even though they prefer to not make it an obvious type of gifting (yet.) As I noted, Support has done this for houses, which eventually became giftable for players.
Support has allowed the gifting of houses, by buying a new house for that person. That is clear. What this issue highlights, is gifting a mount from a persons inventory. The gifting system allows for the purchase of a NEW item for a recipient, not for gifting old items already in a persons inventory. Gifting old and unused items bound to a players account is a different scenario entirely. In all gifting transactions, zenimax gets new crowns spent. This scenario is circumventing that. Instead it is recycling old items for a profit (after all you can only use one mount at a time). Also if it is an accepted thing, then why make anything bound to an account at all? Furthermore this will lead to a general influx of tickets for gifting items, taking away from the ability of zenimax concentrating on tickets that put more emphasis on gameplay.
How it used to work:
Person A wants to gift a house to Person B.
Person A asked Support to charge them X Crowns and to gift the house to Person B.
Support takes X Crowns for ZOS from Person A and gifts the house to Person B.
You can insert whatever item you like. Some people had luck doing it with some older items no longer in the Crown Store.
How this Radiant Mount gifting thing apparently works:
Person A spends loads of Crowns on Crown Crates.
Person A gets Radiant Apex Mount.
Person A asks Support to gift it to Person B.
Support does apparently does so, because ZOS already profited from Person A spending loads of crowns to get the Radiant Apex mount in the first place.
In both cases, ZOS gets their profit from people spending crowns to get the item they gifted.
This would be true if zos rolled new crown crates for the person and then charged them the total crowns. This however is a fact of gifting previous crown crate mounts that a person has bound to their account. In your scenario A a new house is purchased, in your scenario B, no new purchase is made.