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The game doesn't feel rewarding
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Starlight_Knight✭✭✭✭✭
✭The game has been through that many pointless changes its waring people out.
imho the game prospects took a big hit when the devs decided to homogenise all classes.
Now everyone wares the same gear and has 90% the same skills on their bar, no matter what class or race you are.
Playing alts is punishing as its a waste of time and achievements aren't shared.
The CP system is gross and out of date, Why am i CP 1548! what's the point!
The fix is to give classes their identity back. and share achievement's across alts.8 -
Vayln_Ninetails✭✭✭✭✭I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
But how is the gameplay supposed to be rewarding when everything in Overland can be sneezed on at lvl 3 and killed? Every quest can be blown through.
If the game really was pushing for a "gameplay over rewards" where's the fun gameplay at, exactly?
Unless the "gameplay is rewarding" part only comes in during end game dungeons and trials and pvp.
If so, then that's pretty bad design if the whole world of the game doesn't offer fun gameplay.5 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
But how is the gameplay supposed to be rewarding when everything in Overland can be sneezed on at lvl 3 and killed? Every quest can be blown through.
If the game really was pushing for a "gameplay over rewards" where's the fun gameplay at, exactly?
Unless the "gameplay is rewarding" part only comes in during end game dungeons and trials and pvp.
If so, then that's pretty bad design if the whole world of the game doesn't offer fun gameplay.
It's not the devs' problem if you're blowing overland content away at level 3 in gold gear and with 810 CPs
!
At that level the game is designed for new players and they don't blow the content away. Only a few players do so at any stage in the game, and for them the rewarding challenge is intended to be in the competitive endgame content, not the easy tutorial content.
I can see that playing overland DLC/Chapter content as elite or even just veteran level characters can be unrewarding, and I'm not averse to the idea of a veteran difficulty option for all overland content even tho I doubt all those who complain about the lack of such an option would use it if it were available.0 -
gatekeeper13✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭How dare you call a game non-rewarding when I ve ran vArx 150+ times (since Medusa set got buffed) and inferno staff didnt drop once?
0/150 feels like a pretty rewarding game to me.
Edited by gatekeeper13 on November 28, 2020 4:52PM6 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
I don't think we are on the same page. Nothing you wrote addresses why a player might not feel rewarded when playing ESO. Most of the "reward" type items in game are found only through the crown store and not through actions in game that motivate us to play, the player does not feel rewarded. This may also be why the turnover rate in ESO is so huge. There is little motivation to play. I suppose this is by design.
For example. In World of Warcraft 99.9% of the mounts, armor, and pets are found through in game activity. You complete task A, and you are rewarded with item B which is often a mount, armor/cosmetic, or a non combat pet. In ESO these occurrences are far and few between. Long chain chapter quest rewards are a skill point and a forgettable piece of armor. Dungeons reward you with a trophy. The trophy is not something that can be easily shown off (cosmetic rewards are often the drive in an MMO as these are indicators of your "stature") and skill points are forgotten as a reward the very second you get it. On top of this, the cosmetic or valuable rewards in ESO are so far and few between that the rewards themselves are watered down and bland because everyone has them.
Here is some basic insight to risk and rewards, and reward incentive.
https://fs.blog/2015/10/the-psychology-of-risk-and-reward/
https://www.verywellmind.com/the-incentive-theory-of-motivation-27953824 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
I don't think we are on the same page. Nothing you wrote addresses why a player might not feel rewarded when playing ESO. Most of the "reward" type items in game are found only through the crown store and not through actions in game that motivate us to play, the player does not feel rewarded. This may also be why the turnover rate in ESO is so huge. There is little motivation to play. I suppose this is by design.
For example. In World of Warcraft 99.9% of the mounts, armor, and pets are found through in game activity. You complete task A, and you are rewarded with item B which is often a mount, armor/cosmetic, or a non combat pet. In ESO these occurrences are far and few between. Long chain chapter quest rewards are a skill point and a forgettable piece of armor. Dungeons reward you with a trophy. The trophy is not something that can be easily shown off (cosmetic rewards are often the drive in an MMO as these are indicators of your "stature") and skill points are forgotten as a reward the very second you get it. On top of this, the cosmetic or valuable rewards in ESO are so far and few between that the rewards themselves are watered down and bland because everyone has them.
Here is some basic insight to risk and rewards, and reward incentive.
https://fs.blog/2015/10/the-psychology-of-risk-and-reward/
https://www.verywellmind.com/the-incentive-theory-of-motivation-2795382
Seemingly so, given that you look to the items in the Crown Store as providing the rewards for your playing the game, while I do not. Those items are of no consequence to me and I do not buy them (with the exception of the odd house which as a non-trader I cannot afford ingame and which I use sub crowns on). I get my rewards from playing the game, to a limited extent in the form of quest reward items but more significantly from the enjoyment I derive from playing the game. We are indeed on a different page.1 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
I don't think we are on the same page. Nothing you wrote addresses why a player might not feel rewarded when playing ESO. Most of the "reward" type items in game are found only through the crown store and not through actions in game that motivate us to play, the player does not feel rewarded. This may also be why the turnover rate in ESO is so huge. There is little motivation to play. I suppose this is by design.
For example. In World of Warcraft 99.9% of the mounts, armor, and pets are found through in game activity. You complete task A, and you are rewarded with item B which is often a mount, armor/cosmetic, or a non combat pet. In ESO these occurrences are far and few between. Long chain chapter quest rewards are a skill point and a forgettable piece of armor. Dungeons reward you with a trophy. The trophy is not something that can be easily shown off (cosmetic rewards are often the drive in an MMO as these are indicators of your "stature") and skill points are forgotten as a reward the very second you get it. On top of this, the cosmetic or valuable rewards in ESO are so far and few between that the rewards themselves are watered down and bland because everyone has them.
Here is some basic insight to risk and rewards, and reward incentive.
https://fs.blog/2015/10/the-psychology-of-risk-and-reward/
https://www.verywellmind.com/the-incentive-theory-of-motivation-2795382
Seemingly so, given that you look to the items in the Crown Store as providing the rewards for your playing the game, while I do not. Those items are of no consequence to me and I do not buy them (with the exception of the odd house which as a non-trader I cannot afford ingame and which I use sub crowns on). I get my rewards from playing the game, to a limited extent in the form of quest reward items but more significantly from the enjoyment I derive from playing the game. We are indeed on a different page.
I appreciate your post, but it's completely out of the ball park in regards to what I am talking about. I do knot know how to make this more clear. I suggested that perhaps the reason people do not feel rewarded is because the rewards for all intents and purposes are bland and unfulfilling. Because they are bland and unfulfilling the player must go to the crown store to obtain items that in other MMORPG's (who set the standard for what it means to play an MMO), these rewards are part of in game activity.
I think to better clarify my position you should re-read the links I previously posted, consider that that means and overlay that with the average player mentality and how that translates into ESO not offering that rewarding emotion we have all learned to expect from other leading MMORPG's.2 -
Everstorm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
But how is the gameplay supposed to be rewarding when everything in Overland can be sneezed on at lvl 3 and killed? Every quest can be blown through.
If the game really was pushing for a "gameplay over rewards" where's the fun gameplay at, exactly?
Unless the "gameplay is rewarding" part only comes in during end game dungeons and trials and pvp.
If so, then that's pretty bad design if the whole world of the game doesn't offer fun gameplay.
It's not the devs' problem if you're blowing overland content away at level 3 in gold gear and with 810 CPs !
At that level the game is designed for new players and they don't blow the content away. Only a few players do so at any stage in the game, and for them the rewarding challenge is intended to be in the competitive endgame content, not the easy tutorial content.
This is such utter bollocks. You can not claim that aiming 80% of your content at completely new players is good game design.
4 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
I don't think we are on the same page. Nothing you wrote addresses why a player might not feel rewarded when playing ESO. Most of the "reward" type items in game are found only through the crown store and not through actions in game that motivate us to play, the player does not feel rewarded. This may also be why the turnover rate in ESO is so huge. There is little motivation to play. I suppose this is by design.
For example. In World of Warcraft 99.9% of the mounts, armor, and pets are found through in game activity. You complete task A, and you are rewarded with item B which is often a mount, armor/cosmetic, or a non combat pet. In ESO these occurrences are far and few between. Long chain chapter quest rewards are a skill point and a forgettable piece of armor. Dungeons reward you with a trophy. The trophy is not something that can be easily shown off (cosmetic rewards are often the drive in an MMO as these are indicators of your "stature") and skill points are forgotten as a reward the very second you get it. On top of this, the cosmetic or valuable rewards in ESO are so far and few between that the rewards themselves are watered down and bland because everyone has them.
Here is some basic insight to risk and rewards, and reward incentive.
https://fs.blog/2015/10/the-psychology-of-risk-and-reward/
https://www.verywellmind.com/the-incentive-theory-of-motivation-2795382
Seemingly so, given that you look to the items in the Crown Store as providing the rewards for your playing the game, while I do not. Those items are of no consequence to me and I do not buy them (with the exception of the odd house which as a non-trader I cannot afford ingame and which I use sub crowns on). I get my rewards from playing the game, to a limited extent in the form of quest reward items but more significantly from the enjoyment I derive from playing the game. We are indeed on a different page.
I appreciate your post, but it's completely out of the ball park in regards to what I am talking about. I do knot know how to make this more clear. I suggested that perhaps the reason people do not feel rewarded is because the rewards for all intents and purposes are bland and unfulfilling. Because they are bland and unfulfilling the player must go to the crown store to obtain items that in other MMORPG's (who set the standard for what it means to play an MMO), these rewards are part of in game activity.
I think to better clarify my position you should re-read the links I previously posted, consider that that means and overlay that with the average player mentality and how that translates into ESO not offering that rewarding emotion we have all learned to expect from other leading MMORPG's.
I'm happy to accept that we are, as you said, on a different page. But don't apply too many "average player" and "we have all learned to expect" comments to just the one page. Different players, different pages.0 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
But how is the gameplay supposed to be rewarding when everything in Overland can be sneezed on at lvl 3 and killed? Every quest can be blown through.
If the game really was pushing for a "gameplay over rewards" where's the fun gameplay at, exactly?
Unless the "gameplay is rewarding" part only comes in during end game dungeons and trials and pvp.
If so, then that's pretty bad design if the whole world of the game doesn't offer fun gameplay.
It's not the devs' problem if you're blowing overland content away at level 3 in gold gear and with 810 CPs !
At that level the game is designed for new players and they don't blow the content away. Only a few players do so at any stage in the game, and for them the rewarding challenge is intended to be in the competitive endgame content, not the easy tutorial content.
This is such utter bollocks. You can not claim that aiming 80% of your content at completely new players is good game design.
Ignore by all means my stated support for a veteran level difficulty option for that 80%, which you conveniently left off your quote.0 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
I don't think we are on the same page. Nothing you wrote addresses why a player might not feel rewarded when playing ESO. Most of the "reward" type items in game are found only through the crown store and not through actions in game that motivate us to play, the player does not feel rewarded. This may also be why the turnover rate in ESO is so huge. There is little motivation to play. I suppose this is by design.
For example. In World of Warcraft 99.9% of the mounts, armor, and pets are found through in game activity. You complete task A, and you are rewarded with item B which is often a mount, armor/cosmetic, or a non combat pet. In ESO these occurrences are far and few between. Long chain chapter quest rewards are a skill point and a forgettable piece of armor. Dungeons reward you with a trophy. The trophy is not something that can be easily shown off (cosmetic rewards are often the drive in an MMO as these are indicators of your "stature") and skill points are forgotten as a reward the very second you get it. On top of this, the cosmetic or valuable rewards in ESO are so far and few between that the rewards themselves are watered down and bland because everyone has them.
Here is some basic insight to risk and rewards, and reward incentive.
https://fs.blog/2015/10/the-psychology-of-risk-and-reward/
https://www.verywellmind.com/the-incentive-theory-of-motivation-2795382
Seemingly so, given that you look to the items in the Crown Store as providing the rewards for your playing the game, while I do not. Those items are of no consequence to me and I do not buy them (with the exception of the odd house which as a non-trader I cannot afford ingame and which I use sub crowns on). I get my rewards from playing the game, to a limited extent in the form of quest reward items but more significantly from the enjoyment I derive from playing the game. We are indeed on a different page.
I appreciate your post, but it's completely out of the ball park in regards to what I am talking about. I do knot know how to make this more clear. I suggested that perhaps the reason people do not feel rewarded is because the rewards for all intents and purposes are bland and unfulfilling. Because they are bland and unfulfilling the player must go to the crown store to obtain items that in other MMORPG's (who set the standard for what it means to play an MMO), these rewards are part of in game activity.
I think to better clarify my position you should re-read the links I previously posted, consider that that means and overlay that with the average player mentality and how that translates into ESO not offering that rewarding emotion we have all learned to expect from other leading MMORPG's.
I'm happy to accept that we are, as you said, on a different page. But don't apply too many "average player" and "we have all learned to expect" comments to just the one page. Different players, different pages.
True, we are in fact on different pages but only because you refrain to acknowledge my OP, even though you replied to me directly. There is basic human psychology that backs up my assertion, which you have not addressed. Please stay on topic (as my OP was).3 -
Kurat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Wow, so much negativity here, gosh.
0,1% of player base complaining in forums while money keeps flowing in coz the rest is spending in crown store.0 -
dcam86b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭The players have to take responsibility for their poor experience as well.
If you're not having fun with something, try doing something else or just stop playing and come back another time.
You signed the TOS just like the rest of us, nothing else other than to wait.0 -
Nairinhe✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Wow, so much negativity here, gosh.
0,1% of player base complaining in forums while money keeps flowing in coz the rest is spending in crown store.
Well, that's the point of this thread.
And haven't you seen the general "wtf" reaction to this Black Fredas sale if we are speaking about crown store?
Haven't you seen that half of comments under ZOS twitter posts are about crashes?
I have doubts that it's as little a fraction of playerbase as you claim, who are unhappy.3 -
Everstorm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
But how is the gameplay supposed to be rewarding when everything in Overland can be sneezed on at lvl 3 and killed? Every quest can be blown through.
If the game really was pushing for a "gameplay over rewards" where's the fun gameplay at, exactly?
Unless the "gameplay is rewarding" part only comes in during end game dungeons and trials and pvp.
If so, then that's pretty bad design if the whole world of the game doesn't offer fun gameplay.
It's not the devs' problem if you're blowing overland content away at level 3 in gold gear and with 810 CPs !
At that level the game is designed for new players and they don't blow the content away. Only a few players do so at any stage in the game, and for them the rewarding challenge is intended to be in the competitive endgame content, not the easy tutorial content.
This is such utter bollocks. You can not claim that aiming 80% of your content at completely new players is good game design.
Ignore by all means my stated support for a veteran level difficulty option for that 80%, which you conveniently left off your quote.
But you contradicted yourself. You first say it's not the devs' problem and then you offer support for a solution that only the devs can provide.Edited by Everstorm on November 29, 2020 10:17AM5 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
But how is the gameplay supposed to be rewarding when everything in Overland can be sneezed on at lvl 3 and killed? Every quest can be blown through.
If the game really was pushing for a "gameplay over rewards" where's the fun gameplay at, exactly?
Unless the "gameplay is rewarding" part only comes in during end game dungeons and trials and pvp.
If so, then that's pretty bad design if the whole world of the game doesn't offer fun gameplay.
It's not the devs' problem if you're blowing overland content away at level 3 in gold gear and with 810 CPs !
At that level the game is designed for new players and they don't blow the content away. Only a few players do so at any stage in the game, and for them the rewarding challenge is intended to be in the competitive endgame content, not the easy tutorial content.
This is such utter bollocks. You can not claim that aiming 80% of your content at completely new players is good game design.
Ignore by all means my stated support for a veteran level difficulty option for that 80%, which you conveniently left off your quote.
But you contradicted yourself. You first say it's not the devs' problem and then you offer support for a solution that only the devs can provide.
No contradiction there. It's perfectly reasonable to say that it isn't down to the developers that people are romping through level 3 content with 810cps. Equally, if there is a solution that the developers can provide I'd have no problem with that.0 -
Everstorm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »I have to wonder if the game does not feel rewarding because much of the stuff we obtain is done through the crown store instead of "earning" it. Obviously there is a lot of content earned that is not done through the crown store like titles, but the amount of mounts, pets, outfits, houses, costumes that are only offered with crowns may not give us that same level of earned satisfaction. Its like how many teenagers treat their first car (often given to them) terribly, and do not respect it. But the first one they purchase with their own money is treated with much more respect.
All of that is entirely down to the player. This isn't one of those games where you have no option but to buy a mount in the cash shop, for example. The game is perfectly playable without going near the Crown Store. If someone is only playing in order to collect e.g. mounts or costumes then of course they will need to use the Crown Store a lot, but is ESO the right game for them? Surely this is a game where it's the gameplay that is supposed to be rewarding, not the collection of cosmetic items.
But how is the gameplay supposed to be rewarding when everything in Overland can be sneezed on at lvl 3 and killed? Every quest can be blown through.
If the game really was pushing for a "gameplay over rewards" where's the fun gameplay at, exactly?
Unless the "gameplay is rewarding" part only comes in during end game dungeons and trials and pvp.
If so, then that's pretty bad design if the whole world of the game doesn't offer fun gameplay.
It's not the devs' problem if you're blowing overland content away at level 3 in gold gear and with 810 CPs !
At that level the game is designed for new players and they don't blow the content away. Only a few players do so at any stage in the game, and for them the rewarding challenge is intended to be in the competitive endgame content, not the easy tutorial content.
This is such utter bollocks. You can not claim that aiming 80% of your content at completely new players is good game design.
Ignore by all means my stated support for a veteran level difficulty option for that 80%, which you conveniently left off your quote.
But you contradicted yourself. You first say it's not the devs' problem and then you offer support for a solution that only the devs can provide.
No contradiction there. It's perfectly reasonable to say that it isn't down to the developers that people are romping through level 3 content with 810cps. Equally, if there is a solution that the developers can provide I'd have no problem with that.
A: stating it isn't a contradiction doesn't make it so.
B: there is no level 3 content in the game. There is a handful of tutorials and then there is the rest of the quest content which is all the same "difficulty".
C: everything that a sizable part of the players experience as an issue is a problem for the devs. There will be a point when people start leaving.
[snip] Sure, there are people who aren't bothered that stuff is trivial for them but there a lot of people who hate it. Else this issue wouldn't keep showing up over and over on the forums.
It's also stupidity to assume that people who participate in the endgame are per definition not interested in the quest content. That quest content is only intended for casual players.
And there is also people like me. People who bought and play ESO for the quest content but aren't interested in trials and pvp. People that have been playing for years, that like soloing dungeons and world bosses, that are way over 810 because 810 isn't a sign of being elite but something that simply happens when you play the game.
[Edited to remove Bashing]Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on November 29, 2020 2:54PM5 -
Slyclone✭✭✭✭To me, I stopped questing because the rewards are simply too low.
When I quest, I am broke. When I farm, I can afford to make sets.
Game is amazing in many ways. Just needs a quality pass. A 6 month one.
As for being lvl 3 with 810 cp, there is always the option not to spend the points.
But still, I feel my lvl 3 can smoke public dungeon bosses faster than my 810.
That, is not right, imo.
And the fact that I MUST do dungeons and Trials to be able to compete in PVP is also something I dislike about the game.
Otherwise, it's an okay game.
The art is amazing. The story is amszing.
The set balance pass is still so far off, considering only 5% of sets are even considered in end game content.
Everything takes time, but i think they depleted that time.
Hope they learned something from it.That's it, that's all.1 -
I don't believe the term ethical applies to this situation.
There's plenty wrong, there's plenty good. What you might take issue with as one person, may not be as much of a priority to another player.
Your last sentence... You determine how long you remain loyal to a product. A gun is not held to your head. Take ownership of that.0 -
StarOfElyon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Every night I play the game and put down the controller in disappointment because the game crashed during a BG match.0