Furniture Limit increase

Lazarus_Rising · October 2020

I made a post for this one year ago when i made the decision to buy myself wraithhome and go a bit into housing. Since then the limit has still not increased and for wraithome it is not enough at all and probably for another houses. This should have happened earlier. Your stream statement about not to much items so everyone can enjoy it doesnt count at all since dungeons have also way more items than you can place into houses. I hope you don't go the way to make us buy it later for crowns. So please increase the limit finally...

Lintashi · October 2020

There was an update on this several months ago. Verdict: there will be no increase in predictable future. Reason for this is console and low end pc capabilities to show many animated and lightning objects at once. They just placed bar very low, to avoid crashes that were reported at the moment of pts for housing release.

VaranisArano · October 2020

As Lintashi says, ZOS posted an update in February of this year with their reasoning for not increasing the furnishing limit.

Statement: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/512076/february-2020-furnishing-limit-status-update

Now, you can say these reasons "don't count" if you want to, but that really won't matter as long as ZOS treats them as valid reasons.

XxCaLxX · October 2020

Honestly I think the limit would be fine if they would just change the attunables. Nearly 250 crafting tables, mundus, transmute and target dummies. Nearly half of the item limit is taken up by things necessary for a guild hall. Been many posts about it but nothing done. More and more sets get added and some point it's just too much.

Taleof2Cities · October 2020

XxCaLxX wrote: »

Honestly I think the limit would be fine if they would just change the attunables. Nearly 250 crafting tables, mundus, transmute and target dummies. Nearly half of the item limit is taken up by things necessary for a guild hall. Been many posts about it but nothing done. More and more sets get added and some point it's just too much.

The best solution is to just get another house to use as your personal home, @XxCaLxX.

Leave the guild hall as your primary so guildies can still access it.

XxCaLxX · October 2020

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

XxCaLxX wrote: »

Honestly I think the limit would be fine if they would just change the attunables. Nearly 250 crafting tables, mundus, transmute and target dummies. Nearly half of the item limit is taken up by things necessary for a guild hall. Been many posts about it but nothing done. More and more sets get added and some point it's just too much.

The best solution is to just get another house to use as your personal home, @XxCaLxX.

Leave the guild hall as your primary so guildies can still access it.

I don't really want a personal home. Personally I don't see the point in furnishing a house that has no use. Ppl like it and that's fine but the point I was meaning to make is 95% of houses aren't laid out so that can be used as a guild hall. If you want it to look right and organized it needs modification. That along with tables consumes item limit. Cold harbor is a great layout for a guild hall but it gets old. I think they need more like it with different themes.

Taleof2Cities · October 2020

I know you won’t like to hear it, @XxCaLxX, but the actual name of the of the base game feature is “housing” ... not “guild halls”.

So, you’re not the target player of this feature.

That said there are plenty of larger homes in the game that can accommodate 5-piece crafting tables. One of my trading guilds uses Moon-Sugar Meadow ... so you might want to check out the layout.

Chaos2088 · October 2020

The item limit for the big homes do need to be increased.

Taleof2Cities · October 2020

Chaos2088 wrote: »

The item limit for the big homes do need to be increased.

Here’s the official thread from ZOS, @Chaos2088, on why they’re not doing a limit increase:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/512076/february-2020-furnishing-limit-status-update#latest

Artim_X · October 2020

I would love for the limit to be doubled. That alone would help greatly. However, as others have mentioned ZOS has given their current stance on it, so until they change how housing items work or update things on their end there probably won't be an increase in the cap.

You mention dungeon items. However, it should be noted that what you're seeing are assets that may not necessarily be treated as a individual item. For instance, everything on a table in a dungeon might actually be coded as one item or perhaps even as part of the terrain itself. When dueling someone in a house it is quite possible to end up under a nearby furnishing item and if you're on an artificial floor that is significantly above a real floor then your aoe abilities will not work on the artificial floor (blockade goes through the floor while something like lightning flood will treat it as an invalid location and not activate). What I'm trying to say is there is a reason why you can't interact with the world like you can in the single player games cause what you're seeing is just part of the world and not an individual item that can be interacted with. So it is not really a good example for increasing the furnishing cap.

There is a reason why a lot of things in the world, even in vanilla content have yet to become available as a furnishing, since ZOS has yet to turn those assets into a placeable/potentially intractable item.

JoeCapricorn · October 2020

At some point, however, there will be so many craftable sets that not even a 700 slot house would be able to contain all of the attunable crafting stations.

That figure stands at 59 sets right now. We would have to have 175 to hit the 700 slot limit.

It will take about 19 years assuming we get six new craftable sets per year on average (with the Chapter and DLC)

By then we'll have desktop calculators capable of running Crysis in 4K

Sylvermynx · October 2020

JoeCapricorn wrote: »

At some point, however, there will be so many craftable sets that not even a 700 slot house would be able to contain all of the attunable crafting stations.

That figure stands at 59 sets right now. We would have to have 175 to hit the 700 slot limit.

It will take about 19 years assuming we get six new craftable sets per year on average (with the Chapter and DLC)

By then we'll have desktop calculators capable of running Crysis in 4K

Agreed!

Chaos2088 · October 2020

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Chaos2088 wrote: »

The item limit for the big homes do need to be increased.

Here’s the official thread from ZOS, @Chaos2088, on why they’re not doing a limit increase:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/512076/february-2020-furnishing-limit-status-update#latest

Yeah we all know

still they should increase it in the big homes.

XxCaLxX · October 2020

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

I know you won’t like to hear it, @XxCaLxX, but the actual name of the of the base game feature is “housing” ... not “guild halls”.

So, you’re not the target player of this feature.

That said there are plenty of larger homes in the game that can accommodate 5-piece crafting tables. One of my trading guilds uses Moon-Sugar Meadow ... so you might want to check out the layout.

I didn’t come here to argue with you. I’m just pointing out the facts of anyone that wants an organized guild hall will struggle to fit everything needed. I in fact do use Moon Sugar Meadows now. Though I don’t just simply throw the tables down on the ground and call it a day. I take pride in my guilds and my work so I like for it to look good. Whether I’m the targeted player for this feature or not those 236 attunables, other stations and target dummies were intended for housing. So I don’t see the issue in someone asking for that to be compressed somehow. Many have discussed it and a single table for each craft with a drop down menu for each set seems fairly reasonable.

starkerealm · October 2020

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

XxCaLxX wrote: »

Honestly I think the limit would be fine if they would just change the attunables. Nearly 250 crafting tables, mundus, transmute and target dummies. Nearly half of the item limit is taken up by things necessary for a guild hall. Been many posts about it but nothing done. More and more sets get added and some point it's just too much.

The best solution is to just get another house to use as your personal home, @XxCaLxX.

Leave the guild hall as your primary so guildies can still access it.

Long term, it does feel like we're going to need a new solution for crafted sets in guildhalls. Really, we need a new solution for guildhalls in general, but, for the moment, those attuned stations are expanding. Twenty Four new stations every year is stacking up. Even if we're not at risk of running out of slots in the immediate future, that's still a lot of real estate taken up by crafting.

Shadowasrial · October 2020

I mean I can’t see another 300 items being that much of a strain on a large home. Assuming you space out your animated and light furnishings

trackdemon5512 · October 2020

It’s the fact that the server has to recall the placement of every single item when a home is loaded in. Each item has its own physics with lighting and in some cases physicality so players can’t interact with them. Add to that some are interactable and others are dynamic in that they have addition visual effects. And then you have the possibility of 11 additional players running around, interacting, fighting dummies, etc.

All of this puts a significant strain on a system’s memory. In fact the memory for consoles can be tested before you hit the 700 max in homes. At that point you can no longer place items and major textures will fail to load. If this is done without other players in the home then that too will lead to issues if another player enters a home that is already at its limits.

Until the base amount of memory for a system is increased you will not see a furniture increase. Until then ZOS has wisely moved onto managing the assets and making them more dynamic without impacting memory loads. This has allowed houseguests and pets/mounts that can now move around a home.

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo · October 2020

I think the eso + feature of additional housing items should be removed and everyone should have max slots. It's a disgusting feature in my opinion.

VaranisArano · October 2020

Youyouz06 wrote: »

I think the eso + feature of additional housing items should be removed and everyone should have max slots. It's a disgusting feature in my opinion.

As someone who doesn't subscribe, its easy enough to decorate my houses during the free ESO+ trial periods. I can't change my mind about items during the interim until the next one, but it works well for decorating houses to the max.

...and now I'm not sure if that's an argument for or against keeping it an ESO+ feature.

I guess I should ask: if ZOS made that a free feature, what Housing benefit would you add to ESO+, knowing that extra slots, changes to the amount of furnishing types and visitors, and a furnishing bag are all off limits according to comments by ZOS?

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo · October 2020

VaranisArano wrote: »

Youyouz06 wrote: »

I think the eso + feature of additional housing items should be removed and everyone should have max slots. It's a disgusting feature in my opinion.

As someone who doesn't subscribe, its easy enough to decorate my houses during the free ESO+ trial periods. I can't change my mind about items during the interim until the next one, but it works well for decorating houses to the max.

...and now I'm not sure if that's an argument for or against keeping it an ESO+ feature.

I guess I should ask: if ZOS made that a free feature, what Housing benefit would you add to ESO+, knowing that extra slots, changes to the amount of furnishing types and visitors, and a furnishing bag are all off limits according to comments by ZOS?

Goodies for example : Furntiure plans, materials, leads could be associated to ESO+
I don't understand how paying money gives you the ability to lift furniture from the ground.

starkerealm · October 2020

Shadowasrial wrote: »

I mean I can’t see another 300 items being that much of a strain on a large home. Assuming you space out your animated and light furnishings

From what I understand, the item load is a geometric issue. The more items you add to a house, the more calculations that need to be done with how they relate to each other and the players navigating that space. So, when you add a new item, the performance hit is related to how many other items are in the house already.

This makes me suspect two things:

Exceeding 1k items causes serious performance issues on the consoles. (I'm counting the collection items, like undaunted trophies, towards the item cap.)
Houses are assigned their caps based on their relative price. This might sound nefarious, but I suspect the larger houses are priced the way they are because they're actually have a larger footprint on the server and its overall performance. If we were looking at local content only, and it was just a performance issue, it would probably be feasible to have 700 cap inn rooms, but because those rooms are extremely common, and cheap, they're limited so their server load is negligible. If someone has a 700 cap house, they've either been quite active in the game for quite some time (meaning they're helping keep the game alive), or they've spent a considerable amount of cash on the house, in addition they're also paying $15 a month for ESO+. So, they get a heftier load on the server because they're paying for it.

PrimusNephilim · October 2020

XxCaLxX wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

XxCaLxX wrote: »

Honestly I think the limit would be fine if they would just change the attunables. Nearly 250 crafting tables, mundus, transmute and target dummies. Nearly half of the item limit is taken up by things necessary for a guild hall. Been many posts about it but nothing done. More and more sets get added and some point it's just too much.

The best solution is to just get another house to use as your personal home, @XxCaLxX.

Leave the guild hall as your primary so guildies can still access it.

I don't really want a personal home. Personally I don't see the point in furnishing a house that has no use. Ppl like it and that's fine but the point I was meaning to make is 95% of houses aren't laid out so that can be used as a guild hall. If you want it to look right and organized it needs modification. That along with tables consumes item limit. Cold harbor is a great layout for a guild hall but it gets old. I think they need more like it with different themes.

Not sure if its still available for purchase at this moment, but have you considered Moon-Sugar Meadow as alternate location for a guildhall? Very little to do in regards to laying out the work stations, mundus stones, etc.

zaria · October 2020

trackdemon5512 wrote: »

It’s the fact that the server has to recall the placement of every single item when a home is loaded in. Each item has its own physics with lighting and in some cases physicality so players can’t interact with them. Add to that some are interactable and others are dynamic in that they have addition visual effects. And then you have the possibility of 11 additional players running around, interacting, fighting dummies, etc.

All of this puts a significant strain on a system’s memory. In fact the memory for consoles can be tested before you hit the 700 max in homes. At that point you can no longer place items and major textures will fail to load. If this is done without other players in the home then that too will lead to issues if another player enters a home that is already at its limits.

Until the base amount of memory for a system is increased you will not see a furniture increase. Until then ZOS has wisely moved onto managing the assets and making them more dynamic without impacting memory loads. This has allowed houseguests and pets/mounts that can now move around a home.

Client has to recall the placement, server just do one database call and send an list to client.
Server will need to update the base then an item is moved or status changed but this is the same no matter of number of items.

starkerealm · October 2020

zaria wrote: »

Server will need to update the base then an item is moved or status changed but this is the same no matter of number of items.

Except, it's not. The calculations for each item need to take into account the other items in the house. The more items in, the more work the backend needs to deal with.

badmojo · October 2020

I would pay crowns for seperate inside and outside limits with a long load screen between them. Essentially they could make the interior and exterior act like two different houses each with a limit of 700 items. That way nobody is having to load more than 700 items at once but it would effectively double our furnishings.

Thevampirenight · October 2020

starkerealm wrote: »

Shadowasrial wrote: »

I mean I can’t see another 300 items being that much of a strain on a large home. Assuming you space out your animated and light furnishings

From what I understand, the item load is a geometric issue. The more items you add to a house, the more calculations that need to be done with how they relate to each other and the players navigating that space. So, when you add a new item, the performance hit is related to how many other items are in the house already.

This makes me suspect two things:
Exceeding 1k items causes serious performance issues on the consoles. (I'm counting the collection items, like undaunted trophies, towards the item cap.)

Houses are assigned their caps based on their relative price. This might sound nefarious, but I suspect the larger houses are priced the way they are because they're actually have a larger footprint on the server and its overall performance. If we were looking at local content only, and it was just a performance issue, it would probably be feasible to have 700 cap inn rooms, but because those rooms are extremely common, and cheap, they're limited so their server load is negligible. If someone has a 700 cap house, they've either been quite active in the game for quite some time (meaning they're helping keep the game alive), or they've spent a considerable amount of cash on the house, in addition they're also paying $15 a month for ESO+. So, they get a heftier load on the server because they're paying for it.

inventory space might also count as well I'm guessing. But that is more character wide and thus can be an issue as well there is a reason why they are careful with the inventory space. Now with the sticker book, I can see there being benefits with that. It would allow players to decon a lot of stuff they have it they have it collected now they don't need to keep it in inventory or banks and well it can save up a lot of space I can imagine. If most people that hoarded sets and junk sets even with many characters had that book then what would happen is they can clear most of those out and hopefully maybe it would help the servers and who knows make it possible for an increase.

Grianasteri · October 2020

This has been an issue for a long time, not just the over all housing limits, but the limits within that for special items like mounts and guests, are now far too low and it only gets worse with every update.

You will likely get replies citing the official Zos response to this issue, which like the OP and so many others, I really don't accept as valid. I dont accept the reasoning that everyone has to suffer worse functionality, because some peoples hardware cant cope. Just make the housing availability dependent on hardware capability then surely?

Sadly whatever anyone may think, it does not seem any increases or adjustments are coming any time soon... but in the mean time of course, here is more, much more, furnishing items and special items that you cant actually fit in your house. Makes perfect sense.

zaria · October 2020

starkerealm wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

Server will need to update the base then an item is moved or status changed but this is the same no matter of number of items.

Except, it's not. The calculations for each item need to take into account the other items in the house. The more items in, the more work the backend needs to deal with.

Why, only player interaction who might be relevant for server is collision detection, this is just for players, spells and perhaps moving npc.

starkerealm · October 2020

zaria wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

Server will need to update the base then an item is moved or status changed but this is the same no matter of number of items.

Except, it's not. The calculations for each item need to take into account the other items in the house. The more items in, the more work the backend needs to deal with.

Why, only player interaction who might be relevant for server is collision detection, this is just for players, spells and perhaps moving npc.

It has to do with the zone physics calculations. I'm honestly not sure why, either.

idk · October 2020

XxCaLxX wrote: »

Honestly I think the limit would be fine if they would just change the attunables. Nearly 250 crafting tables, mundus, transmute and target dummies. Nearly half of the item limit is taken up by things necessary for a guild hall. Been many posts about it but nothing done. More and more sets get added and some point it's just too much.

Are you suggesting Zos add a new attunable crafting station that will handle multiple sets so players and guilds have to start the grind to get these new tables and use up fewer spaces in their home?

Brilliant idea, but do you think most will pony up the money (or time grinding for master writs) to get these tables that will cost several times what the current tables cost?

Edit: And as Ta2C pointed out, we do not actually have guild halls. I do think Zos needs to add guild halls but again, that would require new purchases.

XxCaLxX · October 2020

idk wrote: »

XxCaLxX wrote: »

Honestly I think the limit would be fine if they would just change the attunables. Nearly 250 crafting tables, mundus, transmute and target dummies. Nearly half of the item limit is taken up by things necessary for a guild hall. Been many posts about it but nothing done. More and more sets get added and some point it's just too much.

Are you suggesting Zos add a new attunable crafting station that will handle multiple sets so players and guilds have to start the grind to get these new tables and use up fewer spaces in their home?

Brilliant idea, but do you think most will pony up the money (or time grinding for master writs) to get these tables that will cost several times what the current tables cost?

Edit: And as Ta2C pointed out, we do not actually have guild halls. I do think Zos needs to add guild halls but again, that would require new purchases.

No I am not suggesting that. I'm suggesting new crafting stations for each craft that any existing attuned stations or any future attuned stations can be added to them.