lastango wrote: »

Hey friends. I am not even asking for direct advice because I really need to learn more on my own before I waste anyone's time here... I've been playing ESO since it came out...

II am a total stud on single player. I even seem to fare reasonable well in Dungeons.

As soon as I hit Cyrodiil or do a Battleground, I am absolutely useless - I can cause decent damage, however, I die so fast that I ruin everything for my teammates.

So, where do I go to start learning about why my build sucks and how to improve it? I do not even follow when you guys start talking about cycling trough spells or moves etc.

I need to get back in Battlegrounds, but I need to find a way to survive three hits before I die.

I use two Characters leveled up to 650 CP... I have tons of awesome rare gear from Dungeon drops and trials.

A Stamina Build High Elf Warden and a Stamina Build Imperial Dragonknight. I have every Skills tree available. Mostly use two-hand and dual blades...

I've worked hard to get my critical damage, stamina and stamina regen up as high as I can...

Where do I start?

Thanks, G

Every one melee character in battle grounds die fast cause in battlegrounds champion cause 4 players in onother team most likely will attack the nearest enemy. TESO is an action game. If the opponents are experienced players, then 2 versus 1 will kill very quickly. On battlegrounds u play like melee stam guys rush into the crowd of enemies

I'm relatively new to PvP here, but at the moment first piece of advice is still: Start by getting All Impenetrable trait armor.

PvP requires different gear and builds from PvE.

Crits traditionally are the fastest way to die. To survive longer, most characters guard against Crits.

By extension, because crits are dangerous most opponents boost their own crit resist. This makes it preferable for you as a damage dealer not rely exclusively on crit chance. Make sure you have direct damage boosts also.

Good physical resist is also helpful. In Cyrodiil you're being targeted by multiple people at once like a tank is in a PvE dungeon. You need survivability and self-heals.

The key point about Cyrodiil though is getting some practice and understanding what's going on. It's very easy to run too far ahead or stray too far from your group, making yourself a target. It's also easy to get too focused on the single enemy in front of you and forget the 4 circling behind or up on the walls.

lastango wrote: »

Hey friends. I am not even asking for direct advice because I really need to learn more on my own before I waste anyone's time here... I've been playing ESO since it came out...

II am a total stud on single player. I even seem to fare reasonable well in Dungeons.

As soon as I hit Cyrodiil or do a Battleground, I am absolutely useless - I can cause decent damage, however, I die so fast that I ruin everything for my teammates.

So, where do I go to start learning about why my build sucks and how to improve it? I do not even follow when you guys start talking about cycling trough spells or moves etc.

I need to get back in Battlegrounds, but I need to find a way to survive three hits before I die.

I use two Characters leveled up to 650 CP... I have tons of awesome rare gear from Dungeon drops and trials.

A Stamina Build High Elf Warden and a Stamina Build Imperial Dragonknight. I have every Skills tree available. Mostly use two-hand and dual blades...

I've worked hard to get my critical damage, stamina and stamina regen up as high as I can...

Where do I start?

Thanks, G

1. The best mitigation is not to receive damage at all, heal through it or block in. You dont want to stand with your hands down and absorb damage in PvP. Dodge roll allow you to move out of danger and dodge attack while doing so, break free to be able to block/heal/move, hide behind object against ranged opponents and use the map to your advantage

2. Usually you have different sets for PvP and PvE. Some classes can use atleast one set in both PvP and PvE but mustly you want a PvP optimized setup which is more focused on spell/weapon damage and penetration rather then crit chance and damage (some classes can make good use of all these attributes)

3. Skills. Pick skills which makes it possible to control you opponent. Stun, spammable, buffs, debuffs, DoT, burst heal, HoT and an ultimate which you can combine with other skills. Recognize what´s challenging to play against and learn from it. To know how classes will attack you is very necessary to be able to counter them

4. High elf is a magicka race, which makes it very ineffective as a stamina warden. I would go magicka warden or racechange to nord/orc

5. Find your balance between sustain, mitigation, heal and offense. We all play a bit different and sometimes prioritize different attributes higher then others

oscarovegren wrote: »

Fennwitty wrote: »

I'm relatively new to PvP here, but at the moment first piece of advice is still: Start by getting All Impenetrable trait armor.

Crits traditionally are the fastest way to die. To survive longer, most characters guard against Crits. .

This is not true anymore due to procsets, malacath and impen trait nerfs. You also have a base crit resist now which doesnt make it mandatory to use impen on armor pieces.

I know, that's why I said 'traditionally'. I'm expecting/hoping proc sets get under control someday. You can still get wiped out by random crits quite easily, still seems a good starting point for newbies.

lastango wrote: »

I am a total stud on single player. I even seem to fare reasonable well in Dungeons.

This may be an odd thing to say, but have you done vMA? There is some overlap with PvP. If a build survives and sustains in vMA, it's roughly in the right spot for PvP as well. The exception is, if you are so good at vMA that you can mow down everything with a glass cannon and you get a 600K+ score. In that case it won't translate to PvP.

So, where do I go to start learning about why my build sucks and how to improve it? I do not even follow when you guys start talking about cycling trough spells or moves etc.

On a stamden or stam DK you want to keep your defensive buffs up at all times. On my stam DK that includes Rally, Hardened Armor and Cauterize. Get an addon, such as Action Duration Reminder, if on PC. I also always Vigor before switching from the defensive bar to the attacking bar and I have Shuffle, which is a more situational buff, but can be good to keep up against templars and when there's a lot of AOE in general.

I need to get back in Battlegrounds, but I need to find a way to survive three hits before I die.

Try a few dodge rolls. You should survive longer than 3 seconds. You can't really sustain that, but dodge rolling towards an obstacle that you can run around and inhibit ranged attacks from hitting you is crucial.

A Stamina Build High Elf Warden

That's a no. Switch race to a stamina race. I recommend Nord for the tankiness.

and a Stamina Build Imperial Dragonknight.

That should be OK for a stamina build.

I have every Skills tree available. Mostly use two-hand and dual blades...

While it's possible to use that combination, the main attraction was Blackrose dual-wield weapons in the past and those have been nerfed into oblivion. If you feel you lack survival, your choice is simple. You need 1H+Shield on your back bar and you probably want 2H on the front bar, especially on the DK, because Rally (or Forward Momentum) is a much better skill than the DK Major Brutality skill. 1H+S also synergises with the DK blocking class passive.

I've worked hard to get my critical damage

Let me stop you right there. How high? Critical damage is terribly important in PvE. In CP PvP, however, 40% is plenty on your classes or you might wear Malacath and do no crit damage at all.

stamina and stamina regen up as high as I can...

Yeah, well, hmm. I personally like around 2k stam regen, which is probably higher than other people use, especially on the warden with that Bull Netch. Stamina regen is nice, especially when you're still learning. Stamina on the other hand ... it's nice to get it to around 30K in CP, but your main focus should be weapon damage, especially on the DK, because that class gets Minor Brutality from Earthen Heart skills.

For reference, this is my stam DK:

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=239243

So why am I using that gear and those skills:

Coward's Gear on the back bar. A set that can be back barred, so we can fit Wild Hunt and Bloodspawn and another 5-piece set into the build. Also gives DK mobility, something the class lacks. People may tell you they use Malacath or something else, but I think there an awful lot of fast players around these days. Can't beat them. Join them.

Wild Hunt ring. Personally I think it's the best mythic in any PvP build and, for me at least, it's a must have.

Titanborn Any damage-focused set might do for the front bar, such as Spriggan or New Moon. I'm happy with Titanborn. It has synergy with DK. You can let your health run a bit low, then you leap your opponent, which hits harder than with any other set and DK ult restores some health.

Bloodspawn The default choice for DKs since time immemorial. More ults = better sustain on that class = more leaps and executes.

Being a Nord Not a high damage class, but since I'm running a medium armor DK with quite an aggressive setup, a good choice to get some tankiness. Then there's the ult-gen passive. Ideal for DK.

Stone Giant Most people use Dizzying Swing. It's the better choice by popular consensus, however I prefer Stone Giant in open world. Basically I run up to people trying to get a Venomous Claw and Noxious Breath on them, but after that I can hit them from range, if they back off. If their health gets low, I leap and execute. Stone Giant is an Earthen Heart skill and gives you the Minor Brutality passive you want on DK. If you used Dizzying Swing instead, you would run Fragmented Shield on the back bar. That skill, however, has a high magicka cost. It eats into your magicka sustain and takes another skill slot. Something else will need to go. If you lose Shuffle, you lose your source of snare immunity and you might switch Rally to Forward Momentum. You gained Major Mending from Fragmented Shield, but you lost a heal. It's swings and roundabouts. I prefer the setup without Fragmented Shield and with 3 heals, which are:

Rally Burst heal for emergencies, Major Brutality and a sustain skill. A high value skill. Can't live without it.

Resolving Vigor Can't live without this either (literally). As a short HOT it complements Rally rather than competes with it.

Cauterize As a longer HOT, this complements the other two heals. You need all 3 heals IMO and I think the way these heals complement each other on DK is rather good.

Shuffle The AOE damage reduction works against templars and is nice to have. The real reason we're running this is snare / root removal and immunity. I wouldn't go without it, although this is the skill I would drop, if you really want to use something else.

Hardened Armor Every class needs to run their armor buff in PvP. It's just a given. This skill also gives DKs +12% healing. Essential. With the Cyrodiil tests going on Hardened was the better morph, although Volatile Armor is probably more popular, since the spikes it shoots out can detect nightblades.

Camouflaged Hunter This passive skill is just too good not to slot in a standard stat-based build. +10% crit, +3% weapon damage and Minor Berserk. It's ostensible main function is merely a nice to have: NB detection. Just spam Breath instead.

Executioner Essential to finish people off. You kill people with Leap + Execute combos on DK.

Take Flight THE DK signature skill and the main reason to play this class. You see anyone within 28m at low health in a chaotic fight - or just the person you've dotted up and softened up a bit - you leap and execute them.

Finally there are your two DOTs:

Venomous Claw and Noxious Breath The whole idea of DK is to DOT people up then hit them hard. Breath gives you penetration and can kill bad nightblades just by spamming it. Venomous Claw ramps up. These DOTs hit harder than their tooltips let on.

Corrosive Armor Your defensive ultimate. I like this back bar ult, because it's costly. DKs restore resources in proportion to ult cost used, that's the main reason I prefer it over Spell Shield, the obvious alternative.

Finally note that I'm mostly using the Physical Resitance + Health + Stamina potion. Covering crit with Camou Hunter and having next to no magicka requirement in this build opens up this potion, which gives another 5K physical resistance that stacks with other armor buffs.

Incidentally, I just troubleshooted a friend's stamden build and this is what we ended up with:

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=282309

She is also a player who is still learning to get better at PvP. I don't play this build myself, but you can see a lot of parallels to the DK I play. We deliberately stayed away from Dizzying for now, because Cutting Dive is easier to land and heals you from a passive. I did make sure to enable the Tactician and Exploiter passives though, potentially gaining Off Balance from CP.

There's the signature speed and snare removal I like to run, with Coward's, Shuffle and Wild Hunt. There's Camouflaged Hunter and Rally as well as the obligatory Resolving Vigor, Major Resolve skill and the Bull Netch. Even though Rally also gives you Major Brutality, it's hard to say no to the sustain these skills give you. The Bull Netch, in particular, continues to give you valuable sustain while blocking or sprinting.

Note that this character is a dark elf purely because that's what my friend plays. It would probably be better off as a Nord as well. Magicka sustain is not needed in this build.

These are not Kristofer ESO type builds. He typically runs 2h / bow. That is a lot squishier. I make up for the lack of Major Expedition you can get from dodge rolling with a bow by wearing Coward's Gear. The idea behind my builds is to use 1H + Shield, yet still be really fast. You also get Major Protection while sprinting and I deliberately build for very low needed magicka sustain, allowing you to focus on damage and stamina sustain and using that potion that gives you an extra 5K physical resistance.

A lot of things have been nerfed. Healing is down compared to previous patches and even wearing Pariah doesn't feel that great unless you build an all out troll build, like a previous poster suggested. The most important thing to make you a little bit tanky is IMO using 1H + Shield. This allows you to make balanced builds that still have very good damage. My friend also loves the speed.

I hate heavy armor by the way. Heavy armor is strange. It has resource passives that give you magicka and stamina while fighting. It can feel great in a brawl. It feels really bad, if you're trying to run away or simply create some distance, which with Coward's Gear you absolutely can. Heavy Armor is not only slower, it also sustains badly when you're trying to get away from combat. I never liked it. Medium gives you more regen upfront as well as dodge roll cost reduction and speed. When you're used to medium, heavy armor feels really inconsistent.

Magicka stacking works on magden. I don't have my build up-to-date on UESP, but something like this:

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=205586

This works in CP, because Dampen Magic gets huge when you push that much magicka, albeit UESP shows you the ideal scenario with Northern Storm and Master's staff both procced. A few noteworthy points:

* Living Trellis is brilliant when you have big shields. You can pump it as a small burst heal.
* I like that Infused Restore Health enchant on the main weapon. More healing = easier to stay on the attack.
* Yes, that's the Bull Netch. You need stam sustain for dodge roll / break free. Getting it from the Bull Netch also works while blocking or sprinting.
* This build's downfall is a lack of speed. You're a sitting duck, if you get zerged, despite Bird of Prey. Better play in a group.

Magden DDs have two general problems, lack of a reliably-timed CC - which is why we're using Clench - and lack of an execute - which is why we're aiming for huge damage. It's a rotation-heavy class and build, but quite easy to play, since there isn't much of a burst rotation to consider, just pressure and Deep Fissure every 3 seconds.

Magdens are also renowned for control builds, builds that freeze enemies in place and are a pain to play against, but that don't do huge damage. I actually just duelled such a build, one with 40K health. The Arctic Blast heal scales with health, that's one reason to run that type of build. The duelist I faced combined that with Gripping Shards and the Vampire Lord ulti.

Swomp23 wrote: »

Although it is very possible that the people giving you advice on the forums are way better than any Youtuber, it’s also possible they are complete noobs talking out of their asses. On Youtube, when you see a guy successfully 1vXing, you know he knows what he’s talking about.

I know that wasn't directed at me - and all the other responses in this thread looked sound as well to be honest - but in case the OP wants to see what I do :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FR0M7hlpFXk

lastango wrote: »

Hey friends. I am not even asking for direct advice because I really need to learn more on my own before I waste anyone's time here... I've been playing ESO since it came out...

II am a total stud on single player. I even seem to fare reasonable well in Dungeons.

As soon as I hit Cyrodiil or do a Battleground, I am absolutely useless - I can cause decent damage, however, I die so fast that I ruin everything for my teammates.

So, where do I go to start learning about why my build sucks and how to improve it? I do not even follow when you guys start talking about cycling trough spells or moves etc.

I need to get back in Battlegrounds, but I need to find a way to survive three hits before I die.

I use two Characters leveled up to 650 CP... I have tons of awesome rare gear from Dungeon drops and trials.

A Stamina Build High Elf Warden and a Stamina Build Imperial Dragonknight. I have every Skills tree available. Mostly use two-hand and dual blades...

I've worked hard to get my critical damage, stamina and stamina regen up as high as I can...

Where do I start?

Thanks, G

I think the best way to learn PvP is to play worldbosses .. You can start on maps from base game, those se are usually easier, then you can go to some DLC areas
If you have decend build and can kill DLC worldboss alone you are prepared to go PvP..
But cyro is more about caution than being good. Remember you are playing against player not mob especially if you are playing solo pvp, dont just rush and die

hexentb16_ESO wrote: »

Npc don't penetrate but players do. Boost your resists a little extra. Also, if your health is below 25k smart pvp groups will take you out first because they'll assume you're a weak noob or a deadly ganker who went full damage.

Make sure you have at least one good heal and an unstoppable ability or potion slotted.

I suggest watching some pvp strategy videos on YouTube or getting a pvp vet to instruct you. JoinIng a pvp guild would be a good idea too.

As for sets....well that is up to you. Lots of players like to go one offensive and one defensive set. A lot of nightblades go full offense because they've got invisibility.

You could go with two defensive sets if you want to be a pain in the ass to take down.

My pain in the ass build is...

Nord Dragonknight

Mark of the Pariah
Alesian Order
Titanic Cleave(Maul)
Puncturing Remedy(Sword and Shield)

Brawler Morph for the maul adds a damage shield. Rest of the 2H bar is Draconic Power abilities.

Food is a max health and health recovery recipe.
A potion that heals, increases health recovery by 20%, and adds physical resist and spell resist.
Mundus stone is steed.

Look up this build. It basically gives you an obscene amount of Physical and Spell resistance and health recovery. Casuals can't even put a dent in it and ball groups will hate you because you heal back any damage super fast while using Brawler (cleave morph). Its dps isn't the greatest though.

You don't even need to block with this build.

@hexentb16_ESO can you actually kill anyone with that build though, or is this for "hold your ground" type BGs?

hexentb16_ESO wrote: »

Mariusghost84 wrote: »

@hexentb16_ESO can you actually kill anyone with that build though, or is this for "hold your ground" type BGs?

Yes if you hit enough enemies with your Brawler ability with the Titanic Cleave/Master's Maul equipped and they don't have a healer. With these sets equipped you can switch a bunch of other stuff to damage boosting instead and still be fairly hard to kill.

One Vs One won't yield any kills usually. If you're with others you could slot a bunch of CCs on your 1h and shield bar and let them do most of the damage. A lot of people think pvp is all about damage but CCs are just as important.

Other alternative sets that could be used for a build like this are...

Eternal Vigor
Permafrost
Beeker's Gear
Orgnum's Scales

Orgnum's scales is a crafted set and can be made in medium for that skill's damage and stamina recovery boosts. It can also be worn with Eternal Vigor for a total added 2k health recovery when your health drops below 50%. However if you make your character too squishy that'll become less useful.

Permafrost adds 1k health recovery when a damage shield is active on you. This basically means you'll have a 100% uptime on it if you were to stick to my build suggestion for using the Brawler ability as one of your main attacks.

Beekeeper's Gear only adds 900 health recovery BUT is just a flat stat added so it has a 100% uptime.

Of course all the sets listed increase your health recovery much more if you use the ability suggestions for the build I posted.

@hexentb16_ESO Thanks for replying and your insight. I found out my true and only PVP love is nb so i wont even atempt a build like that, buts its very interesting to see how players like you (that i cant kill) build!