Blood Ritual is kinda worthless

VioletDracolich · September 2020

To be Frank, why would you have passive outside of giving away bites? You could try to sell bites, but you could also try and enter a guild raffle. Both give you money if you're lucky, but you'd be better off doing literally anything else.

So what I want to discuss is maybe the addition of something to Blood Ritual? Maybe a small buff when you bite someone. IDK anything would be better.

Also this does technically include Blood Moon as well since it too has to no reason to be there outside of giving away bites.

Vevvev · September 2020

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · September 2020

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

Vevvev · September 2020

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

Because I refuse to believe ZOS's ridiculous retcon. Also it'd make continued feeding at stage 4 worthwhile since it would give you an alternative to slotting a non-vampiric heal for your roleplaying adventure! (Since the rules on feed are so restricting to be used anywhere else.)

Also Vampiric Drain heals you and one of the feeding animations is a Vampiric Drain spell so powerful it kills the target! It really should heal and its stupid it doesn't.

Lord-Otto · September 2020

Vevvev wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

Because I refuse to believe ZOS's ridiculous retcon. Also it'd make continued feeding at stage 4 worthwhile since it would give you an alternative to slotting a non-vampiric heal for your roleplaying adventure! (Since the rules on feed are so restricting to be used anywhere else.)

Also Vampiric Drain heals you and one of the feeding animations is a Vampiric Drain spell so powerful it kills the target! It really should heal and its stupid it doesn't.

I actually finally figured it out. There have been hints at the great picture since Harrowstorm, but the Darkstorm prologue provided the last missing pieces of the puzzle.
We are indeed now Bloodfiends, not vampires.
The whole Greymoor story centers around weird experiments with vampirism and lycanthropy. Lamae's blood ritual is nothing else - it's an experiment, much like Arkasis', Lady Thorn's and the thirteenth exarch's. Whereas the Gray Host and Council created Bloodknights, Werewolf Behemoths and Stone Husks, Lamae procures Blood Scions and Bloodfiends. It's one and the same, but mirror images. And these experiments are the thread throughout the Greymoor expansion. Therefore, it's not a retcon.
Lamae's motives for her experiment are different from the Host's ones, though. We've known her motivations from the get go, but never really listened. It's simple, really: She wants to invert vampirism to spite Molag Bal. That's why taking blood makes you weaker now. Why vampirism is a subclass instead of a passive now. Why her version of a Vampire Lord doesn't grant new abilities but just passive boosts. New vampirism is designed deliberately to sh#% on our beloved TES vampirism. By Lamae and ZOS.
Unfortunately, this realization means there will be no future re-vamp. The new version does exactly what it's meant to do, it spites Molag Bal, TES vampires and us old vampires.

Vayln_Ninetails · September 2020

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

Because I refuse to believe ZOS's ridiculous retcon. Also it'd make continued feeding at stage 4 worthwhile since it would give you an alternative to slotting a non-vampiric heal for your roleplaying adventure! (Since the rules on feed are so restricting to be used anywhere else.)

Also Vampiric Drain heals you and one of the feeding animations is a Vampiric Drain spell so powerful it kills the target! It really should heal and its stupid it doesn't.

I actually finally figured it out. There have been hints at the great picture since Harrowstorm, but the Darkstorm prologue provided the last missing pieces of the puzzle.
We are indeed now Bloodfiends, not vampires.
The whole Greymoor story centers around weird experiments with vampirism and lycanthropy. Lamae's blood ritual is nothing else - it's an experiment, much like Arkasis', Lady Thorn's and the thirteenth exarch's. Whereas the Gray Host and Council created Bloodknights, Werewolf Behemoths and Stone Husks, Lamae procures Blood Scions and Bloodfiends. It's one and the same, but mirror images. And these experiments are the thread throughout the Greymoor expansion. Therefore, it's not a retcon.
Lamae's motives for her experiment are different from the Host's ones, though. We've known her motivations from the get go, but never really listened. It's simple, really: She wants to invert vampirism to spite Molag Bal. That's why taking blood makes you weaker now. Why vampirism is a subclass instead of a passive now. Why her version of a Vampire Lord doesn't grant new abilities but just passive boosts. New vampirism is designed deliberately to sh#% on our beloved TES vampirism. By Lamae and ZOS.
Unfortunately, this realization means there will be no future re-vamp. The new version does exactly what it's meant to do, it spites Molag Bal, TES vampires and us old vampires.

I don't like that you're making a lot of sense right now.

Making us into bloodfiends is basically the ultimate spite move.

Also if you put what you said in combination with the fact there's a rumor floating around that vamps were never meant to be playable in the game and the devs didn't want them, but bethesda stepped in.... It makes sense why they would go to great lengths to make vampirism complete trash. Which explains why it started off with only 2 abilities and an ult.

Where as werewolf as almost always been better, has a better kit, and over all is an actual viable optional build.

Vevvev · September 2020

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

Because I refuse to believe ZOS's ridiculous retcon. Also it'd make continued feeding at stage 4 worthwhile since it would give you an alternative to slotting a non-vampiric heal for your roleplaying adventure! (Since the rules on feed are so restricting to be used anywhere else.)

Also Vampiric Drain heals you and one of the feeding animations is a Vampiric Drain spell so powerful it kills the target! It really should heal and its stupid it doesn't.

I actually finally figured it out. There have been hints at the great picture since Harrowstorm, but the Darkstorm prologue provided the last missing pieces of the puzzle.
We are indeed now Bloodfiends, not vampires.
The whole Greymoor story centers around weird experiments with vampirism and lycanthropy. Lamae's blood ritual is nothing else - it's an experiment, much like Arkasis', Lady Thorn's and the thirteenth exarch's. Whereas the Gray Host and Council created Bloodknights, Werewolf Behemoths and Stone Husks, Lamae procures Blood Scions and Bloodfiends. It's one and the same, but mirror images. And these experiments are the thread throughout the Greymoor expansion. Therefore, it's not a retcon.
Lamae's motives for her experiment are different from the Host's ones, though. We've known her motivations from the get go, but never really listened. It's simple, really: She wants to invert vampirism to spite Molag Bal. That's why taking blood makes you weaker now. Why vampirism is a subclass instead of a passive now. Why her version of a Vampire Lord doesn't grant new abilities but just passive boosts. New vampirism is designed deliberately to sh#% on our beloved TES vampirism. By Lamae and ZOS.
Unfortunately, this realization means there will be no future re-vamp. The new version does exactly what it's meant to do, it spites Molag Bal, TES vampires and us old vampires.

I don't like that you're making a lot of sense right now.

Making us into bloodfiends is basically the ultimate spite move.

Also if you put what you said in combination with the fact there's a rumor floating around that vamps were never meant to be playable in the game and the devs didn't want them, but bethesda stepped in.... It makes sense why they would go to great lengths to make vampirism complete trash. Which explains why it started off with only 2 abilities and an ult.

Where as werewolf as almost always been better, has a better kit, and over all is an actual viable optional build.

But.... Why work on werewolf but not vampire? I hate how he is making sense as well but what dev team would go out of their way to not want to add something so much they crush it out of spite? I have a sneaky suspicion they didn't want to add vampires or werewolves and it just so happened they ended up good in certain scenarios. Remember what happened after werewolves became OP after Moon Hunter? They got nerfed into the dirt.

Lord-Otto · September 2020

Vevvev wrote: »

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

Because I refuse to believe ZOS's ridiculous retcon. Also it'd make continued feeding at stage 4 worthwhile since it would give you an alternative to slotting a non-vampiric heal for your roleplaying adventure! (Since the rules on feed are so restricting to be used anywhere else.)

Also Vampiric Drain heals you and one of the feeding animations is a Vampiric Drain spell so powerful it kills the target! It really should heal and its stupid it doesn't.

I actually finally figured it out. There have been hints at the great picture since Harrowstorm, but the Darkstorm prologue provided the last missing pieces of the puzzle.
We are indeed now Bloodfiends, not vampires.
The whole Greymoor story centers around weird experiments with vampirism and lycanthropy. Lamae's blood ritual is nothing else - it's an experiment, much like Arkasis', Lady Thorn's and the thirteenth exarch's. Whereas the Gray Host and Council created Bloodknights, Werewolf Behemoths and Stone Husks, Lamae procures Blood Scions and Bloodfiends. It's one and the same, but mirror images. And these experiments are the thread throughout the Greymoor expansion. Therefore, it's not a retcon.
Lamae's motives for her experiment are different from the Host's ones, though. We've known her motivations from the get go, but never really listened. It's simple, really: She wants to invert vampirism to spite Molag Bal. That's why taking blood makes you weaker now. Why vampirism is a subclass instead of a passive now. Why her version of a Vampire Lord doesn't grant new abilities but just passive boosts. New vampirism is designed deliberately to sh#% on our beloved TES vampirism. By Lamae and ZOS.
Unfortunately, this realization means there will be no future re-vamp. The new version does exactly what it's meant to do, it spites Molag Bal, TES vampires and us old vampires.

I don't like that you're making a lot of sense right now.

Making us into bloodfiends is basically the ultimate spite move.

Also if you put what you said in combination with the fact there's a rumor floating around that vamps were never meant to be playable in the game and the devs didn't want them, but bethesda stepped in.... It makes sense why they would go to great lengths to make vampirism complete trash. Which explains why it started off with only 2 abilities and an ult.

Where as werewolf as almost always been better, has a better kit, and over all is an actual viable optional build.

But.... Why work on werewolf but not vampire? I hate how he is making sense as well but what dev team would go out of their way to not want to add something so much they crush it out of spite? I have a sneaky suspicion they didn't want to add vampires or werewolves and it just so happened they ended up good in certain scenarios. Remember what happened after werewolves became OP after Moon Hunter? They got nerfed into the dirt.

See, I don't think ZOS were like "haha, vampires suck!". I think it was more like "we're making our own version of vampirism now, and if you don't like it, then cure it!". The whole screwing and spiting of the old vampirism is akin to the "The Last Jedi" situation with its message of "Destroy the Past!". They want to dismantle old vampirism in favor of their own vision, just like Rian Johnson did with Star Wars.

Jeremy · September 2020

VioletDracolich wrote: »

To be Frank, why would you have passive outside of giving away bites?

You wouldn't.

But isn't being able to help out friends, guild members, or even strangers by sparing them the trouble or money of having to become a Vampire the old fashioned way worth a skill point?

Ratzkifal · September 2020

I think Lord-Otto nailed it. Not only does most of what he said make sense, it's also perfectly in line with the explanations we managed to get out of ZOS on the topic.
The only part I'm not sold on is them doing it to "destroy the past". Them having their own vision which they want to stick to is quite evident though with phrases being used like "as it should be" and "we kind of had it backwards". I just don't think they want to unmake what vampirism was before and pretend it always has been the way it's now. If that was the case they would not have bothered to make new lore and give us explanations at all, which, although they did not do a lot of, they did do.

Now I do think the lore explanation we got is satisfactory in terms of all the questions it originally raised and I am fine with this version of vampirism existing but what I don't like is that we players are forced to be part of this experiment or not be vampires at all. It's not representative of what being a vampire in Tamriel is like and is what you would call "railroading" in roleplay terms. "You either do it this way or not at all!" And that's especially painful when "this way" is not even mainstream within that universe...

Ideally I'd like to see vampires being able to make a choice to follow Lamae, get the Scion ultimate, reverse feeding etc
or go the traditional route with no Scion transformation but essentially the same skill effect. This could work through morphing the vampire ultimate or a morphable rank1 passive or a new respec altar. Lastly the Vampire Lord set could overwrite both forms into vampire lords (with wings) and some sort of extra buff to make it worth using, with the added drawback of needing to feed twice to change from one stage to the next. The regular vampire drawbacks are already enough that we don't need the set to amplify them.

VioletDracolich · September 2020

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

Also if you put what you said in combination with the fact there's a rumor floating around that vamps were never meant to be playable in the game and the devs didn't want them, but bethesda stepped in.... It makes sense why they would go to great lengths to make vampirism complete trash. Which explains why it started off with only 2 abilities and an ult.

Can I ask any sources for this rumor as it is the first I am hearing of this? If it is just a rumor, I wouldn't put stock in it. However, if there is evidence for it I would begin doing some things.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · September 2020

Vampirism just needs a few tweaks to be viable...

- You should gain 200 base Health Regeneration based on Stage, in return you receive 3% less healing per stage, this would equal anywhere between 800 extra base health regeneration and 12% less healing received at stage 4, base health regeneration would be high enough to become a viable resource and allow Vampires to build as Regenerator Builds.

- Vampiric Drain should be an execute dealing around 300% more damage based on enemy health remaining.

- Perfect Scion in addition to the existing effects should also boost weapon and spell damage by 620 making it an actual choice between having a Bat Cloak or a massive boost to attack power for 20 seconds.

- Blood Frenzy should become a "Bats" Gap Closer that absorbs health, morphs would increases health absorbed or inflict all enemies hit with Minor Lifesteal for 5 seconds.

VioletDracolich · September 2020

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vampirism just needs a few tweaks to be viable...

- You should gain 200 base Health Regeneration based on Stage, in return you receive 3% less healing per stage, this would equal anywhere between 800 extra base health regeneration and 12% less healing received at stage 4, base health regeneration would be high enough to become a viable resource and allow Vampires to build as Regenerator Builds.

- Vampiric Drain should be an execute dealing around 300% more damage based on enemy health remaining.

- Perfect Scion in addition to the existing effects should also boost weapon and spell damage by 620 making it an actual choice between having a Bat Cloak or a massive boost to attack power for 20 seconds.

- Blood Frenzy should become a "Bats" Gap Closer that absorbs health, morphs would increases health absorbed or inflict all enemies hit with Minor Lifesteal for 5 seconds.

With the exception of the Blood Frenzy suggestion, I like most of those ideas. I personally do like Blood Frenzy as is for the most part. Maybe reduce it's cost a little bit maybe? I know a lot of people hate the skill, but I personally think it's a fun risk reward.

Vayln_Ninetails · September 2020

VioletDracolich wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vampirism just needs a few tweaks to be viable...

- You should gain 200 base Health Regeneration based on Stage, in return you receive 3% less healing per stage, this would equal anywhere between 800 extra base health regeneration and 12% less healing received at stage 4, base health regeneration would be high enough to become a viable resource and allow Vampires to build as Regenerator Builds.

- Vampiric Drain should be an execute dealing around 300% more damage based on enemy health remaining.

- Perfect Scion in addition to the existing effects should also boost weapon and spell damage by 620 making it an actual choice between having a Bat Cloak or a massive boost to attack power for 20 seconds.

- Blood Frenzy should become a "Bats" Gap Closer that absorbs health, morphs would increases health absorbed or inflict all enemies hit with Minor Lifesteal for 5 seconds.

With the exception of the Blood Frenzy suggestion, I like most of those ideas. I personally do like Blood Frenzy as is for the most part. Maybe reduce it's cost a little bit maybe? I know a lot of people hate the skill, but I personally think it's a fun risk reward.

Blood Frenzy is a pretty trash skill no matter which way you look at it. The risk/reward isn't even worth it in most cases. It just isn't fun and the majority agree.

Vamps could use a gap closer and a way to steal HP....

Also just a stat steriod that kills yourself is so boring concept and design wise. An ability that is actually useful and provides mobility to classes that don't have it would be much better.

Not to mention the entire concept of blood frenzy does not fit with vampire lore in ES at all. Vampires have NEVER sacrificed their own HP for power. It is more of an ability that bloodfiends use

Vayln_Ninetails · September 2020

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vampirism just needs a few tweaks to be viable...

- You should gain 200 base Health Regeneration based on Stage, in return you receive 3% less healing per stage, this would equal anywhere between 800 extra base health regeneration and 12% less healing received at stage 4, base health regeneration would be high enough to become a viable resource and allow Vampires to build as Regenerator Builds.

- Vampiric Drain should be an execute dealing around 300% more damage based on enemy health remaining.

- Perfect Scion in addition to the existing effects should also boost weapon and spell damage by 620 making it an actual choice between having a Bat Cloak or a massive boost to attack power for 20 seconds.

- Blood Frenzy should become a "Bats" Gap Closer that absorbs health, morphs would increases health absorbed or inflict all enemies hit with Minor Lifesteal for 5 seconds.

All of these suggestions are perfect and are exactly what vampire needs. Especially the blood frenzy and drain changes.

Vayln_Ninetails · September 2020

VioletDracolich wrote: »

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

Also if you put what you said in combination with the fact there's a rumor floating around that vamps were never meant to be playable in the game and the devs didn't want them, but bethesda stepped in.... It makes sense why they would go to great lengths to make vampirism complete trash. Which explains why it started off with only 2 abilities and an ult.

Can I ask any sources for this rumor as it is the first I am hearing of this? If it is just a rumor, I wouldn't put stock in it. However, if there is evidence for it I would begin doing some things.

I saw a few people talking about it on the forum, unfortunately I can't find any concrete evidence. I will keep searching, but hey.

Honestly, I could see this being the case. The evidence against ZOS hating vampires is very compelling.

VioletDracolich · September 2020

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

I saw a few people talking about it on the forum, unfortunately I can't find any concrete evidence. I will keep searching, but hey.

Honestly, I could see this being the case. The evidence against ZOS hating vampires is very compelling.

The post where people are talking about it would be a source, granted a bad source but a source none the less. If you could provide those posts it would be helpful in finding out if the rumors are unfounded or not.

Considering this game has multiple people working on it, I doubt each and every one of them hates vampires.

Xarico · September 2020

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vampirism just needs a few tweaks to be viable...

- You should gain 200 base Health Regeneration based on Stage, in return you receive 3% less healing per stage, this would equal anywhere between 800 extra base health regeneration and 12% less healing received at stage 4, base health regeneration would be high enough to become a viable resource and allow Vampires to build as Regenerator Builds.

- Vampiric Drain should be an execute dealing around 300% more damage based on enemy health remaining.

- Perfect Scion in addition to the existing effects should also boost weapon and spell damage by 620 making it an actual choice between having a Bat Cloak or a massive boost to attack power for 20 seconds.

- Blood Frenzy should become a "Bats" Gap Closer that absorbs health, morphs would increases health absorbed or inflict all enemies hit with Minor Lifesteal for 5 seconds.

Great ideas. I would also suggest healing to full health upon feeding and Mesmerize working on all NPCs, not only the merchants.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · September 2020

Xarico wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vampirism just needs a few tweaks to be viable...

- You should gain 200 base Health Regeneration based on Stage, in return you receive 3% less healing per stage, this would equal anywhere between 800 extra base health regeneration and 12% less healing received at stage 4, base health regeneration would be high enough to become a viable resource and allow Vampires to build as Regenerator Builds.

- Vampiric Drain should be an execute dealing around 300% more damage based on enemy health remaining.

- Perfect Scion in addition to the existing effects should also boost weapon and spell damage by 620 making it an actual choice between having a Bat Cloak or a massive boost to attack power for 20 seconds.

- Blood Frenzy should become a "Bats" Gap Closer that absorbs health, morphs would increases health absorbed or inflict all enemies hit with Minor Lifesteal for 5 seconds.

Great ideas. I would also suggest healing to full health upon feeding and Mesmerize working on all NPCs, not only the merchants.

If anything mesmerize should allow combat feeding on weaker NPCs resulting in an instant kill, it would not be overpowered given how easy it is to actually kill these NPCs, I feel the health regeneration boost would actually play well into the idea that a Vampire could rely on their passive supernatural healing over restorative healing spells to keep them alive and perfect scion would become a more alluring choice if it had the damage boost that Blood Frenzy provided as part of the morph minus the health drain

Not to mention replacing Blood Frenzy with Bats would give the Vampire a much needed Bat related attack.

hakan · September 2020

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

what??? thats not true. and in old games hp regen was disabled too. vamp can heal thru dmg, it did before and still can. bfb nerf was because it removed the sustain part in pve

Vayln_Ninetails · September 2020

hakan wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

what??? thats not true. and in old games hp regen was disabled too. vamp can heal thru dmg, it did before and still can. bfb nerf was because it removed the sustain part in pve

It is true. Feeding DOES stop you from healing. The more you feed, you get to a point to where your health doesn't regen.

Lol....

Vayln_Ninetails · September 2020

VioletDracolich wrote: »

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

I saw a few people talking about it on the forum, unfortunately I can't find any concrete evidence. I will keep searching, but hey.

Honestly, I could see this being the case. The evidence against ZOS hating vampires is very compelling.

The post where people are talking about it would be a source, granted a bad source but a source none the less. If you could provide those posts it would be helpful in finding out if the rumors are unfounded or not.

Considering this game has multiple people working on it, I doubt each and every one of them hates vampires.

This is true, I swear I saw a few peeps talking about it on one of the many vampire-rework-hate threads, but I can't find it now. All I remember is seeing someone talking about Bethesda probably stepped in to get vamps added since even in base-game pre greymoor they were a very lackluster skill line.

And the whole 'multiple people' thing doesn't really matter if the director or lead game designer hates vampires. It doesn't matter what the devs think.

Which is why the devs who originally were going to give us vampire lord (by giving blood scion full on bat-like wings) were told to clip them off.

hakan · September 2020

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

hakan wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

what??? thats not true. and in old games hp regen was disabled too. vamp can heal thru dmg, it did before and still can. bfb nerf was because it removed the sustain part in pve

It is true. Feeding DOES stop you from healing. The more you feed, you get to a point to where your health doesn't regen.

Lol....

regen isnt healing in MMO sense. in old game you didnt regenerate in daylight, this is how they implemented it here.

and it doesnt matter if you dont build anyway i dont understand why you guys so stuck on this.

Vayln_Ninetails · September 2020

hakan wrote: »

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

hakan wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Maybe have it where feeding on a target heals you to full health? Old feed used to heal you and since the new feed can only be used on weak NPCs out of combat a full heal would be fine.

It would also be inconsistent with the current system because as the way it stands, feeding stops you from healing so why would you actively heal by feeding?

what??? thats not true. and in old games hp regen was disabled too. vamp can heal thru dmg, it did before and still can. bfb nerf was because it removed the sustain part in pve

It is true. Feeding DOES stop you from healing. The more you feed, you get to a point to where your health doesn't regen.

Lol....

regen isnt healing in MMO sense. in old game you didnt regenerate in daylight, this is how they implemented it here.

and it doesnt matter if you dont build anyway i dont understand why you guys so stuck on this.

Still means less healing over all and natural regen is pretty important.

We're stuck on it because new vampire is objectively trash and the downsides are not worth its bonuses at all. The skill line is poorly designed, poor visuals, and poor creativity. The passives are pretty alright though, aside from the weaknesses. If they want to keep these level of weaknesses, vamps need at least one more passive buff. Currently it's a ratio of 3-1 in terms of buffs/weaknesses based on stage.

Lord-Otto · September 2020

VioletDracolich wrote: »

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

I saw a few people talking about it on the forum, unfortunately I can't find any concrete evidence. I will keep searching, but hey.

Honestly, I could see this being the case. The evidence against ZOS hating vampires is very compelling.

The post where people are talking about it would be a source, granted a bad source but a source none the less. If you could provide those posts it would be helpful in finding out if the rumors are unfounded or not.

Considering this game has multiple people working on it, I doubt each and every one of them hates vampires.

It was me. I mentioned it somewhere. And I only heard that rumour from another player. So it really isn't a reliable source, but just a rumour. Would explain why the skill line was so small initially, though.

VioletDracolich · September 2020

Lord-Otto wrote: »

It was me. I mentioned it somewhere. And I only heard that rumour from another player. So it really isn't a reliable source, but just a rumour. Would explain why the skill line was so small initially, though.

Sadly without a reliable source I can only say the rumors are most likely untrue with a dash of speculation.

Also the small skill count for og vampire could just be the fact that they couldn't think of anything good given the lore/gameplay limitations at the time. Generic TES vampires are kinda bland normally, they didn't have much in the base games outside of one or two powers per bloodline. It's not a sign they hated vampires, but it is a sign they either did with what they had at the time or didn't have time really.

VioletDracolich · September 2020

Vayln_Ninetails wrote: »

This is true, I swear I saw a few peeps talking about it on one of the many vampire-rework-hate threads, but I can't find it now. All I remember is seeing someone talking about Bethesda probably stepped in to get vamps added since even in base-game pre greymoor they were a very lackluster skill line.

And the whole 'multiple people' thing doesn't really matter if the director or lead game designer hates vampires. It doesn't matter what the devs think.

Which is why the devs who originally were going to give us vampire lord (by giving blood scion full on bat-like wings) were told to clip them off.

Two things:
1. The wings were likely a design decision. Fun fact about character design, elements deemed unnecessary are usually removed in most situations. Given the player's inability to fly, heck even float honestly, wings are almost completely unnecessary in terms of design. Also before anyone says it the "But vampire lords had wings in Skyrim" argument doesn't apply because, VLs could float in Skyrim adding to the design choice.
2. The vampire rework hate threads add very little to the conversation outside of speculation and conspiracy theories. While these two things can be fun in moderation, the level I often see is just problematic in the forums. Don't spread unfounded rumors with no credible sources please, it doesn't help.

Lord-Otto · September 2020

Well, I wouldn't speculate as much if the devs would actually COMMUNICATE. Instead they're throwing self-indulgent ESO Lives and censor the forums.
And how do DK wings make him fly?

VioletDracolich · September 2020

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Well, I wouldn't speculate as much if the devs would actually COMMUNICATE. Instead they're throwing self-indulgent ESO Lives and censor the forums.
And how do DK wings make him fly?

That design choice comes from two points.
1. Their Dragon Leap ultimate allow for a long leap in the air, almost flight-like.
2. They're Dragon Knights. It's literally in the name.

Lord-Otto · September 2020

VioletDracolich wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Well, I wouldn't speculate as much if the devs would actually COMMUNICATE. Instead they're throwing self-indulgent ESO Lives and censor the forums.
And how do DK wings make him fly?

That design choice comes from two points.
1. Their Dragon Leap ultimate allow for a long leap in the air, almost flight-like.
2. They're Dragon Knights. It's literally in the name.

No, the wings I'm talking about reflect projectiles. Or, absorb them now. Mitigate!
Swarming Scion is bat-themed, it's in the description. So bat wings by your logic.

Vevvev · September 2020

Dragonknight's ultimate is the closest thing to flight we have in ESO. Always fun to use it to fly after people in hard to get locations, which surprises them since they never expect it. It can also be fun sometimes to give the Blood Scion wings by slotting Protective Scale and flapping them but its just for show...