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Would a macro using 1 key to do 3-5 LAs sequentially be against TOS & potentially get you banned?
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ChaosWotan✭✭✭✭✭"I should hope that's clear enough"
Yeah... Molly's statement is clear. No macros!
So, if you are handicapped either stop playing ESO or get banned from ESO.
What a lose-lose situation.
Still, I would rely on the mercy of the devs if you actually are sick and need macros to play.0 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭I was really hoping to see a mod comment on this. If a player needs help to be brought on equal ground bc of a disability why would he/she get in trouble for this? I see the point to about pvp a player macroing but even last night I went up against a player id bet my whole account he was macroing but nothing ever happens to those players atleast to my knowledge. how would they catch him if he did it? Id say the OP has a legit case to violate the TOS0 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭ADA compliance refers to the Americans with Disabilities Act Standards for Accessible Design, which states that all electronic and information technology must be accessible to people with disabilities.
Accessibility can be viewed as the “ability to access” and benefit from some system or entity. The concept often focuses on people with disabilities or special needs (such as the Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities) and their right of access, enabling the use of assistive technology.
Sorry but OP would win against TOS i think2 -
Idinuse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Anyone that lets hardware, and armor sets too for that matter, play the game for them, should never talk about some sort of "skills" they posses in playing this game. Period. Unless the ToS has changed, it clearly says using Software or Hardware to get an advantage over other players is against the ToS.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2512949/#Comment_2512949
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en-GB/discussion/comment/2089721/#Comment_2089721Sed ut perspiciatis unde omnis iste natus error sit voluptatem accusantium dolorem que laudantium, totam rem aperiam, eaque ipsa quae ab illo inventore veritatis et quasi architecto beatae vitae dicta sunt explicabo. Nemo enim ipsam voluptatem quia voluptas sit aspernatur aut odit aut fugit, sed quia consequuntur magni dolores eos qui ratione voluptatem sequi nesciunt. Neque porro quisquam est, qui dolorem ipsum quia dolor sit amet, consectetur, adipisci velit, sed quia non numquam eius modi tempora incidunt ut labore et dolore magnam aliquam quaerat voluptatem. Ut enim ad minima veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullam corporis suscipit laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur? Quis autem vel eum iure reprehenderit qui in ea voluptate velit esse quam nihil molestiae consequatur, vel illum qui dolorem eum fugiat quo voluptas nulla pariatur?0 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭Anyone that lets hardware, and armor sets too for that matter, play the game for them, should never talk about some sort of "skills" they posses in playing this game. Period. Unless the ToS has changed, it clearly says using Software or Hardware to get an advantage over other players is against the ToS.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2512949/#Comment_2512949
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en-GB/discussion/comment/2089721/#Comment_2089721
ADA supercedes any and all1 -
markulrich1966✭✭✭✭✭
✭DUTCH_REAPER wrote: »ADA compliance refers to the Americans with Disabilities Act Standards for Accessible Design, which states that all electronic and information technology must be accessible to people with disabilities.
Accessibility can be viewed as the “ability to access” and benefit from some system or entity. The concept often focuses on people with disabilities or special needs (such as the Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities) and their right of access, enabling the use of assistive technology.
Sorry but OP would win against TOS i think
I had googled and looked through some corresponding results. Might be wrong, but it seems that the acts refer only to work contracts.
So as an employer you are bound to them, but not as a game publisher.
I think the issue would have a lesser "bad taste", if playstyles that were available as a fallback wouldn't be deleted step by step.
Examples are the nerf of iceheart, and the removal of crystal blast.
Both were far from BiS, but allowed people with handicaps to participate at least in basic gameplay like dungeons and some bosses. The more such easy playstyles get removed, the more they depend on macros to be able to play a simple rotation/weaving.Edited by markulrich1966 on September 17, 2020 1:26PM2 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭markulrich1966 wrote: »DUTCH_REAPER wrote: »ADA compliance refers to the Americans with Disabilities Act Standards for Accessible Design, which states that all electronic and information technology must be accessible to people with disabilities.
Accessibility can be viewed as the “ability to access” and benefit from some system or entity. The concept often focuses on people with disabilities or special needs (such as the Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities) and their right of access, enabling the use of assistive technology.
Sorry but OP would win against TOS i think
I had googled and looked through some corresponding results. Might be wrong, but it seems that the acts refer only to work contracts.
So as an employer you are bound to them, but not as a game publisher.
I think the issue would have a lesser "bad taste", if playstyles that were available as a fallback wouldn't be deleted step by step.
Examples are the nerf of iceheart, and the removal of crystal blast.
Both were far from BiS, but allowed people with handicaps to participate at least in basic gameplay like dungeons and some bosses. The more such easy playstyles get removed, the more they depend on macros to be able to play a simple rotation/weaving.
Its not work contracts only. My oldest child is spastic quadriplegic and we know the law extremely well. The only defense ZOS would have is to either prove the person using the "software" (macro) is not truly disabled.3 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭But all of this is moot anyways because to my knowledge there is no way to determine if a player is using a macro on their end correct?0 -
Idinuse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭DUTCH_REAPER wrote: »But all of this is moot anyways because to my knowledge there is no way to determine if a player is using a macro on their end correct?
Very true.Sed ut perspiciatis unde omnis iste natus error sit voluptatem accusantium dolorem que laudantium, totam rem aperiam, eaque ipsa quae ab illo inventore veritatis et quasi architecto beatae vitae dicta sunt explicabo. Nemo enim ipsam voluptatem quia voluptas sit aspernatur aut odit aut fugit, sed quia consequuntur magni dolores eos qui ratione voluptatem sequi nesciunt. Neque porro quisquam est, qui dolorem ipsum quia dolor sit amet, consectetur, adipisci velit, sed quia non numquam eius modi tempora incidunt ut labore et dolore magnam aliquam quaerat voluptatem. Ut enim ad minima veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullam corporis suscipit laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur? Quis autem vel eum iure reprehenderit qui in ea voluptate velit esse quam nihil molestiae consequatur, vel illum qui dolorem eum fugiat quo voluptas nulla pariatur?1 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭had a guy the other day said he played with a controller and his controller can rapid fire LAs. wouldnt that be the same as a macro or no? Im not computer smart for this stuff like stringing skills together.lol I just faceroll buttons 1-5 and try not to stand in redEdited by DUTCH_REAPER on September 17, 2020 1:38PM0 -
alainjbrennanb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Come on guys dont get angry about this, its just a game, the t&c's are a contract you signed and are legal but never mind that, the bigger issue is, zos may and i say may one day say to its self about macro's/cheat engine etc enough is enough and lock the game to there servers, thus no add ons, no macros etc, to me macro for cosmetic stuff is ok but for combat is a big no no, in pvp it gives an unfair advantage, i know this may be a tangent but you would not whisper me in pvp and tell me your gear sets, skills and rotation, as it would give me an unfair advantage a macro can do this, but like i said they help in rping and norm questing, but if zos sees to much bickering about the subject they may just lock the game in to there serversMain character dk - Vanikifar whitestrike1
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alainjbrennanb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭DUTCH_REAPER wrote: »had a guy the other day said he played with a controller and his controller can rapid fire LAs. wouldnt that be the same as a macro or no? Im not computer smart for this stuff like stringing skills together.lol I just faceroll buttons 1-5 and try not to stand in red
you can do that on a keyboard just like skills, you just bash the button, crystal frags and snipe can be bashed and no cool downMain character dk - Vanikifar whitestrike0 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭alainjbrennanb16_ESO wrote: »Come on guys dont get angry about this, its just a game, the t&c's are a contract you signed and are legal but never mind that, the bigger issue is, zos may and i say may one day say to its self about macro's/cheat engine etc enough is enough and lock the game to there servers, thus no add ons, no macros etc, to me macro for cosmetic stuff is ok but for combat is a big no no, in pvp it gives an unfair advantage, i know this may be a tangent but you would not whisper me in pvp and tell me your gear sets, skills and rotation, as it would give me an unfair advantage a macro can do this, but like i said they help in rping and norm questing, but if zos sees to much bickering about the subject they may just lock the game in to there servers
Definitely not mad. Nothing but love for my fellow eso players
I do have a thing for fighting for ADA rights tho. It hits close to home and papa bear wants to help all have equal footing. 0 -
ZOS_LunaradminGreetings!
Given their baiting nature, we've removed some posts from this thread. It’s okay and very normal to disagree with others, and even to debate, but provoking conflict, baiting, inciting, mocking, etc. is never acceptable in the ESO community.
Thank you for your understanding, and please keep the Community Rules in mind when posting on the forums.The Elder Scrolls Online - ZeniMax Online Studios
Forum Rules | Code of Conduct | Terms of Service | Home Page | Help Site0 -
Rungar✭✭✭✭✭
✭the way i see it i dont really care if people use macros or not. I only really care if the macros provide an advantage or not and this is something only zos can address.
look at it this way: if macros were of none or minimal effect then there would be no problem letting the man overcome his disability with using one.
its up to zos to make macros of little or none effect and the only way to make that true is to get rid of weaving and slap 300-400 weapon and spell dmg debuff for 2 seconds when you block.
after that were down to a true 1 second gcd and i cant see macroing of being of any real benefit other than the odd ganker lining up a burst, which wont have the same strength it did before. Even this though is addressable by making procs cost ultimate.Old Rungar always gives what's needed.
Current ideas for ESO improvement
Rungar's Mystical Emporium of Ideas junkyard0 -
ChaosWotan✭✭✭✭✭" ... help all have equal footing."
The storylines of ESO clearly show that the devs support the underdog. They are good people (though their financial overlords have forced them to work within the framework of a greedy crown store) so I would not worry about it. Not everything has to be spelled out in a legal contract. Better that they use money on improving the game instead of paying lawyers to make the ToS legally perfect. If you are handicapped and get banned for macros, take ESO to court if or when such a ban ever happens. But Zeni will never let it go that far. It would be bad PR. And against their own basic values.
Live and let live
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mairwen85✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ChaosWotan wrote: »"I should hope that's clear enough"
Yeah... Molly's statement is clear. No macros!
So, if you are handicapped either stop playing ESO or get banned from ESO.
What a lose-lose situation.
Still, I would rely on the mercy of the devs if you actually are sick and need macros to play.
Or use an adaptive controller, keyboard, and/or mouse. Several examples posted in this thread. I'm sorry, but disability and handicap are not an excuse for using macros. If you cannot play ESO due to some physical impairment, the same will be true for many other games that require equal measures of input and control--so the same adaptive input devices would be suggested as the best solution. There are options out there, and many more are being developed. As I said, and have said in several threads, I happen to do volunteer work in the promotion of such devices and on behalf of a UK based charity that invests in the development and customization of said devices. So it's far from stop playing or get banned, and more a case of look at what's out there to support you and make gaming (any gaming) accessible. The alternative, automating your inputs, is cheating as per the TOS, plain and simple.
Edited by mairwen85 on September 17, 2020 7:25PM3 -
Iarao✭✭✭✭Using a macro to do combat moves is most certainly against the ToS. If you are clearing the dungeon solo I am not sure who would report you though there is a chance this thread could gets Zos' attention.
Regardless, I would suggest finding a different means to execute your LAs for the sake of your shoulder. I have heard of a player who had serious shoulder issues and used a game controller with a one-hand or one-bar build he created and a WW build is a one-bar build. Essentially a simplified build. It helped. Some here in the forums may have ideas to help you.
Good luck.
i dont know anything about writing macros, but what would they be for if not for combat stuff?0 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Using a macro to do combat moves is most certainly against the ToS. If you are clearing the dungeon solo I am not sure who would report you though there is a chance this thread could gets Zos' attention.
Regardless, I would suggest finding a different means to execute your LAs for the sake of your shoulder. I have heard of a player who had serious shoulder issues and used a game controller with a one-hand or one-bar build he created and a WW build is a one-bar build. Essentially a simplified build. It helped. Some here in the forums may have ideas to help you.
Good luck.
i dont know anything about writing macros, but what would they be for if not for combat stuff?
The example in the thread with ZOS commentary we've been discussing was for automating emotes. ZOS still didn't allow it.0 -
Svann✭✭✭ChaosWotan wrote: »"I should hope that's clear enough"
Yeah... Molly's statement is clear. No macros!
So, if you are handicapped either stop playing ESO or get banned from ESO.
Has anyone ever actually got banned for mouse/keyboard macros?Edited by Svann on September 19, 2020 2:03AM0 -
Togal✭✭✭✭Please aviod Macros, its basicly treated like scripting. you will get yo butt slammed by the ban hammer.1
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AlnilamE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭DUTCH_REAPER wrote: »I was really hoping to see a mod comment on this. If a player needs help to be brought on equal ground bc of a disability why would he/she get in trouble for this? I see the point to about pvp a player macroing but even last night I went up against a player id bet my whole account he was macroing but nothing ever happens to those players atleast to my knowledge. how would they catch him if he did it? Id say the OP has a legit case to violate the TOS
Equal ground with whom, though? The OP started this thread because they are soloing dungeons designed for 4 players. That's a bit above average, don't you think?The Moot Councillor1 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭DUTCH_REAPER wrote: »I was really hoping to see a mod comment on this. If a player needs help to be brought on equal ground bc of a disability why would he/she get in trouble for this? I see the point to about pvp a player macroing but even last night I went up against a player id bet my whole account he was macroing but nothing ever happens to those players atleast to my knowledge. how would they catch him if he did it? Id say the OP has a legit case to violate the TOS
Equal ground with whom, though? The OP started this thread because they are soloing dungeons designed for 4 players. That's a bit above average, don't you think?
Very good point.0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Why would there be any rules against using macros in PVE, especially while soloing, for someone like me who has arthritis? That is just idiotic.
But I would understand IN PVP ONLY, NOT allowing any macros that, for instance, did LA-skill-Bash with one keystroke/button.
BTW to the OP, IMO even as bad as Group Finder is these days, it is still less damaging to the body than running solo to farm dungeons.
@Merforum There is competitive PvE, even solo. That is what the leaderboards are about. However, just doing solo quests few might even notice. However, it is still a risk.
Corrected my mistype
I don't think someone with arthritis can do those anyway. Obviously if someone is cheating on leaderboards and stuff like that they should be dealt with on case by case basis.
I had a healer with a disease similar to Parkinson's heal leaderboard runs. It is inaccurate to suggest that someone with serious movement impairing ailments cannot do leaderboard runs. Macros are nowhere near as helpful for healers as they need to be reactive to damage phases vs having a standard rotation.2 -
ChaosWotan✭✭✭✭✭Macros are good for grinding mobs in Craglorn. And maybe to burst gank. Besides that they are too inflexible to be (reliably) useful. Try macros in vMA. Not a good idea. Using a macro for one single LA before a skill attack is a convenience but unnecessary if you don't have a handicap, because this kind of weaving is easy and quickly becomes a habit. It can also create pain if you got arthritis for example.1
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daemondamian✭✭✭✭Thanks everyone for all the further replies, suggestions & information. I may look into getting a trackball.
As to having an unfair advantage by using a macro or not being as physically mentally capable/able as standard average players who are not - well I've already stated I won't make or use the macro as proposed in the title but I wanted to point out something I found funny;
I was curious as to how many times per second a macro could or would make a single click of a mouse button, what the average clicks per second was & what mine was.
So I found an online test & my CPS rate was 4.5
The average is like 10 or something? 1 -
mairwen85✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭daemondamian wrote: »Thanks everyone for all the further replies, suggestions & information. I may look into getting a trackball.
As to having an unfair advantage by using a macro or not being as physically mentally capable/able as standard average players who are not - well I've already stated I won't make or use the macro as proposed in the title but I wanted to point out something I found funny;
I was curious as to how many times per second a macro could or would make a single click of a mouse button, what the average clicks per second was & what mine was.
So I found an online test & my CPS rate was 4.5 The average is like 10 or something?
Good job you only need to click 1x per second and a single key press to weave in ESO then, or twice if LA spamming as WW (1x per 700ms).
Edited by mairwen85 on September 22, 2020 8:36AM0