ESO mmo or a single play game?

ThePlayer · September 2020

It seems to me that recently ZOS has lost sight of the fact that the game is an online game .. little is done in my opinion to imply a vision of a group game, and also the farming itself for the gear, for the achievements is quite simple or focused only on a few aspects of the game (naturally without looking for that exaggerated farming of oriental games).

I write this because yesterday as a tank (not DD or healer) I was unable to enter the new dungeons by going in the queue, after half an hour of waiting I preferred to play another game ..

Now maybe I can be wrong but in this game there is a basic component that is missing, something that actually pushes players to do dungeons, trials, etc ... even the gear apart from some small variations is unchanged and still easy to obtain, then at ZOS the task of getting players to do! of course, the daily rewards for low-level players are not enough.

Gythral · September 2020

Mass enforced PvP argues against this,
along with the 50% of every years content being for the 2%

zaria · September 2020

Finder is bugged, probably better now but the first day it was totally broken.

Then doing dungeons its smart to do pledge dungeons even if you want to do the quest or farm gear as its much more players queued and also better players.

madrab73 · September 2020

It's an mmo, join a guild that runs dungeons or ask in zone chat.

ThePlayer · September 2020

That's exactly what I'm talking about, bring out new dungeons, ZOS make players focus on those as well!!
, for example by giving transmute crystals for the first month for all runs in new dungeons regardless of whether they are pledge or not .

This is one of the many examples I could do but nothing like this is done in this game.

ThePlayer · September 2020

Madrab73 what you saying could even works, sometime, but not always.
A part of this incentive must also be given by ZOS, of this I'm sure.

VaranisArano · September 2020

ESO is an MMO in a franchise built off of five single-player games. It's not surprising that ZOS is trying to walk the line of providing a great single-player experience to fans coming from TES games like Skyrim or Morrowind while also adding regular MMO content like dungeons, trials, and special events.

As for encouraging the average player to do dungeons, we've already got story quests, achievements, gear, monster sets, motifs, cosmetics, housing items, leads, event tickets, transmute crystals, and daily random dungeon exp. What would you like to add to the pot?

ThePlayer · September 2020

VaranisArano how many CPs you got already? i have more then 1150

Still you do dungeons for the xp? Still you do dungeons for the monster set? (ok it may happen that you are looking for a modified monster set), Often you do dungeons/trials for the gear? Still you do event for get another Indrik mount?

Now I don't want to be pessimistic (I've been playing for a long time, I like the game), just realistic that something is missing in the game, maybe something that focuses on players with +810 CPs, but surely there is a lack of Quality of Life Improvement .

Rungar · September 2020

you can get a group for most base game dungeons via the finder but you cant for the dlcs. I imagine its a combination of not having the dlc and having no interest in them.

for instance in the last week or so i had no problems getting pugs for 5 of the base game dungeons that i needed to be run multiple times for the antiquities system ( spindelclutch/elden hollow1/blackheart haven/direfrost/crypt of hearts) . I ran each of these on normal multiple times. None of them were pledges and there was no issue. I also noticed that in almost every case the people I was grouped with were sub 50 and many appeared new to the game.

in contrast i tried castle thorn on normal 3 times now on my tank and no takers. Long ago i warned zos about these dlc dungeons. They should of looked into it.

madrab73 · September 2020

The 40g update didn't help yesterday either. Lots of players missing due to download time. My guilds were full of people running new content though, even the pvp guilds.

BlueRaven · September 2020

ThePlayer wrote: »

VaranisArano how many CPs you got already? i have more then 1150

Still you do dungeons for the xp? Still you do dungeons for the monster set? (ok it may happen that you are looking for a modified monster set), Often you do dungeons/trials for the gear? Still you do event for get another Indrik mount?

Now I don't want to be pessimistic (I've been playing for a long time, I like the game), just realistic that something is missing in the game, maybe something that focuses on players with +810 CPs, but surely there is a lack of Quality of Life Improvement .

They were listing all the incentives to do dungeons. Just because you personally have already claimed those incentives, does not mean the incentives are not present for other people.

ThePlayer · September 2020

BlueRaven for people like me? I think the players with +1000 CPs are enough in the game and they are usually the ones doing dungeons, ZOS what listing for us?

eKsDee · September 2020

ESO becoming the weird singleplayer MMO hybrid it's striving to be today was inevitable when they decided to open the game up to the traditional TES audience. Even though I'd really like to see them return more to the game's MMO roots, it's simply not going to happen because the vast majority of players want it to be a singleplayer-but-with-friends game.

I don't like how ESO is catering more and more to these players, since I feel it's going against what ESO should be as an MMO, but the most I can do is simply move on, if it's hurting my enjoyment of the game, and that's exactly what I've done. Rather than banging your head against the wall, I'd seriously suggest you do the same, if it's hurting your enjoyment of the game.

AcadianPaladin · September 2020

I favor single player games. I've been playing ESO for the last several years because of its mass and scale that dwarfs Oblivion and Skyrim combined. The fact that it is multiplayer is a drawback that I live with. Thankfully, the game is pretty solo - friendly.

Despite +1350 CP, I continue to enjoy the game, spending time on content that I enjoy. I try all content but have a long list of content I no longer do because I simply don't enjoy it. Trials, VetDLC dungeons, dragons, PvP are on that list. And there are no 'rewards' or 'incentives' on Nirn that are going to somehow make me play content I don't enjoy. Happily, there is loads of content that I do enjoy.

JamuThatsWho · September 2020

ThePlayer wrote: »

BlueRaven for people like me? I think the players with +1000 CPs are enough in the game and they are usually the ones doing dungeons, ZOS what listing for us?

Why are you focusing on CP/XP gains so much when there's loads of stuff to do dungeons for?

Achievements, collectibles, gear, motifs, furnishings, leads, transmute crystals, etc.

There's so much more in group content than XP.

JTD · September 2020

Cyrodil is an mmo.

All the other content except (veteran) trial and dungeons are single player. There is no need to communicate with other players or interact with them. That is the curse of the Elder Scrolls license in a game... it attracts people who aren't here for the 'mmorpg' but here for the TES name.

Donny_Vito · September 2020

Sounds like you need to join a good guild and start socializing! Plenty of fun people out there to play with that makes this game exciting.

redlink1979 · September 2020

ThePlayer wrote: »

(...) as a tank (not DD or healer) I was unable to enter the new dungeons by going in the queue (...)

@ThePlayer This is unsual, at least. When I queue as a tank or as a healer, I won't stay in queue for more than a few seconds. Perhaps you queued at a time when there's few ppl online?

Narvuntien · September 2020

Both

VaranisArano · September 2020

ThePlayer wrote: »

VaranisArano how many CPs you got already? i have more then 1150

Still you do dungeons for the xp? Still you do dungeons for the monster set? (ok it may happen that you are looking for a modified monster set), Often you do dungeons/trials for the gear? Still you do event for get another Indrik mount?

Now I don't want to be pessimistic (I've been playing for a long time, I like the game), just realistic that something is missing in the game, maybe something that focuses on players with +810 CPs, but surely there is a lack of Quality of Life Improvement .

At right about 1000 CP, I suspect I'm not an average player across the whole game. Maybe an average post-CP 810 player? After all, I do see plenty of other CP 810s doing dungeons, so something among the rewards listed must be drawing them back in.

As for me, I do them for story, furnishings, keys, events, cosmetics like the Undaunted style pages, regrinding gear when ZOS changes the meta, and random dungeon exp for leveling alts.

On the other hand, rewards are only so effective. Look at the upcoming Imperial City Event. Last year, there was a segment of players who hated PVP but still chose to go to Imperial City instead of running one of the two PVE-only dungeons. We'll find out if the same repeats itself this year soon.

I'm still curious what rewards you want added.

etchedpixels · September 2020

ThePlayer wrote: »

Now maybe I can be wrong but in this game there is a basic component that is missing, something that actually pushes players to do dungeons,

You can't "push" players into things. It's game not a job. You can tempt them - and ESO IMHO does this very well, pointing people to PvP via the Cyrodil messages, via the BG "For Glory" quest and to dungeoneering via the Undaunted.

Players are different. You might want to read Richard Bartle's writings on this from the early 1990s where he first really identified and formalised some of the divisions in players and gaming styles. It's from back when "massively multiplayer" was 40 people and the era of MUDs not 3D MMOs but they haven't changed.

There are a lot of people who treat ESO as 'I've finished Skyrim and I'm not waiting 10 years for the sequel (plus four more for a debugged version...)". It's a legitimate play style. They pay, they play the enjoy.

There are already big incentives for group play
- Battlegrounds gets you a ton of cool gear, styles and a big pile of XP first time you don't come bottom each day (aka first time you get less newbs on your side than the opposition)
- The first random dungeon of the day gets you a ton of XP. The first time you do each dungeon you get a skill point
- Each public dungeon group event is a skill point
- Each dungeon gives you lots of gear you can't get elsewhere
- Several public dungeons give you runeboxes, pets and other toys

And for mostly solo players - they don't care. If you are playing ESO as a quest story line in the style of Skyrim because that is how you want to play then other people are just noise, and guild stores exist solely so you can buy materials not grind them.

There are even guilds for solo players, where they may do dungeons but as a guild group and slowly, enjoying the story line, opening every barrel and sack, and sometimes even roleplaying bits of it. It's not terribly compatible with the speedrunning/farming mindset and the two don't mix well 8)

If you hate the dungeon finder, find some guilds. Lots of people only do dungeons in guild groups because
- discord voice chat beats random groups
- queues
- fake tanks
- bad attitudes
- kicking people < CP 160
- all the dungeon finder bugs

JKorr · September 2020

ThePlayer wrote: »

It seems to me that recently ZOS has lost sight of the fact that the game is an online game .. little is done in my opinion to imply a vision of a group game, and also the farming itself for the gear, for the achievements is quite simple or focused only on a few aspects of the game (naturally without looking for that exaggerated farming of oriental games).

I write this because yesterday as a tank (not DD or healer) I was unable to enter the new dungeons by going in the queue, after half an hour of waiting I preferred to play another game ..

Now maybe I can be wrong but in this game there is a basic component that is missing, something that actually pushes players to do dungeons, trials, etc ... even the gear apart from some small variations is unchanged and still easy to obtain, then at ZOS the task of getting players to do! of course, the daily rewards for low-level players are not enough.

I hate to point out that "pushing players" to do content of any type is not a good idea. Many players do *not* want to be pushed to do content they don't enjoy doing. "Push" me to do pvp, and I quit. "Push" me to do trials or other content I have no interest in, and I quit. In the past, when they did release content that required groups to complete, it wasn't overwhelmed by players after the first few days. They ended up nerfing the difficulty and redoing the zone so no groups were required.

AlnilamE · September 2020

If you waited more than 5 minutes for a dungeon as a tank, leave the queue and restart, because your queue is bugged.

You will ALWAYS get a group as a tank, no matter what the dungeon, because there are enough people in the "random" queue to fill a group for you.

One of my guildies is a tank and he runs Scalecaller all the time because it's his favourite dungeon. He always get a group within a minute.

ThePlayer wrote: »

That's exactly what I'm talking about, bring out new dungeons, ZOS make players focus on those as well!!
, for example by giving transmute crystals for the first month for all runs in new dungeons regardless of whether they are pledge or not .

This is one of the many examples I could do but nothing like this is done in this game.

I want to do the new dungeons, but I haven't had the time yet, and they are not going anywhere. But guildies have run them, and they were the pledge this week as well, so I'm sure plenty of people are doing it.

Wifeaggro13 · September 2020

Gythral wrote: »

Mass enforced PvP argues against this,
along with the 50% of every years content being for the 2%

95%of this game is played solo. Just because they add 2 dungeons and a raid does not equate 50%of the content. The difference is dungeons and trials have a far larger replayabliity. The game tried to make itself to many things. Now it just feels souless

idk · September 2020

ThePlayer wrote: »

That's exactly what I'm talking about, bring out new dungeons, ZOS make players focus on those as well!!
, for example by giving transmute crystals for the first month for all runs in new dungeons regardless of whether they are pledge or not .

This is one of the many examples I could do but nothing like this is done in this game.

The very fact they delivered more group content, that at least three of the four major updates deliver group content, proves Zos is not ignoring grouping in ESO.

Heck, MMORPGs tend to not have to incentivize new content as is being suggested here. The fact it is new is incentive enough. So your example does not support the argument put forth in the OP.

BTW, most that do the group dungeons when they come out are pre-made groups. I tend to find that even having just one random player in a group for a new dungeon is problematic because they tend to have no idea what to do. Also, many wait until the DLC is on sale before buying it and transmutation crystals are pretty irrelevant in that choice.

TheTwistedRune · September 2020

ThePlayer wrote: »

It seems to me that recently ZOS has lost sight of the fact that the game is an online game .. little is done in my opinion to imply a vision of a group game, and also the farming itself for the gear, for the achievements is quite simple or focused only on a few aspects of the game (naturally without looking for that exaggerated farming of oriental games).

I write this because yesterday as a tank (not DD or healer) I was unable to enter the new dungeons by going in the queue, after half an hour of waiting I preferred to play another game ..

Now maybe I can be wrong but in this game there is a basic component that is missing, something that actually pushes players to do dungeons, trials, etc ... even the gear apart from some small variations is unchanged and still easy to obtain, then at ZOS the task of getting players to do! of course, the daily rewards for low-level players are not enough.

So you want ZOS to push players to do content they would rather not just so you can do the content you want to do? That strikes me as a little unfair.

You should look to Guilds or friends to do group content if you are struggling with PUGS, not force players to do content they don't want to do. ESO has never claimed to be group focused, it has content for all playstyles and that is part of its appeal, it caters for a wide variety of players.

Syldras · September 2020

eKsDee wrote: »

ESO becoming the weird singleplayer MMO hybrid it's striving to be today was inevitable when they decided to open the game up to the traditional TES audience

They never "opened it", it has been like that from the start. I know plenty of people who gave ESO a try when it was released, just because of TES, although they normally didn't care for MMOs.

eKsDee wrote: »

Even though I'd really like to see them return more to the game's MMO roots, it's simply not going to happen because the vast majority of players want it to be a singleplayer-but-with-friends game.

The absurd thing is, people were wishing for an co-op mode for the "normal" TES games since Morrowind. There were enough who were a bit startled when ESO was announced, because all that people were wishing for was co-op for 2 to 4 people at most, not an MMO.

etchedpixels wrote: »

There are even guilds for solo players, where they may do dungeons but as a guild group and slowly, enjoying the story line, opening every barrel and sack, and sometimes even roleplaying bits of it. It's not terribly compatible with the speedrunning/farming mindset and the two don't mix well 8)

Do you have any suggestions for PC EU?

AndrewQ84 · September 2020

The other issue is the dps that que as tanks. This takes up the slots for actual tanks, making the ques last longer. However, that being said, there is a buggy issue with the que right now. I qued up for a random dungeon the other day with a full guild group. Tank, 2 DPS and a healer. Full group..... no insta pop. It went on like it was searching for a group for us for about 10 minutes before we tried to que again. This time with an insta pop. It was totally weird.

gatekeeper13 · September 2020

The reason whyI like this game so much is partially because it is an awesome fusion of single player and multiplayer content. If you weaken it's single player part, it will lose what makes it different and unique.

TineaCruris · September 2020

They are working on making it a single player game. The MMO part of the game requires server upgrades and the associated financial investments.

Tandor · September 2020

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Gythral wrote: »

Mass enforced PvP argues against this,
along with the 50% of every years content being for the 2%

95%of this game is played solo. Just because they add 2 dungeons and a raid does not equate 50%of the content. The difference is dungeons and trials have a far larger replayabliity. The game tried to make itself to many things. Now it just feels souless

I imagine what he's saying is that there are 4 content releases each year, and 2 of them comprise dungeons. I don't think that's unreasonable, but I do think ZOS are missing a trick by not opening up the appeal of those dungeon DLCs by including a couple of delves in them.