rapids change
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Canned_Apples✭✭✭✭✭
✭@houndandhorseb16_ESO
It helps new stamina players that don't have a stamina based class heal.
It can get pretty annoying not having one at times, especially in dungeons, even though overland content is a joke.2 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭There is NO excuse for the harm done to older players with this change. Whoever was most responsible for this decision should suffer the fate of Finedrin.
If ZoS wanted to make both Vigor and Rapid Maneuvers unlock at Level 2 of the skill line, they could have done so. Instead, they are adding great amounts of boredom to the game for some of their most loyal players, such as my wife @DarcyMardin, and to a lesser extent me. @DarcyMardin loves to level alts, and has done so across three accounts on PC/NA and two on PC/EU.
I don't quite go to those extremes, and confine my play mainly to the 18 characters I have on PC/NA, each of whom indeed has Assault at Level at least 5. But my greatest enjoyment in the game comes from duoing with my wife, so if she is playing less in the way she prefers, then I'm enjoying the game less myself.
[snip] in not tweaking this change and the amount of tedium they are introducing for their player base is just breathtakingly awful.
[Edited to remove Bashing]Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on August 25, 2020 12:36PM15 -
Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
The ONLY people that could be happy about this is pve people. Vigor sucks when you first get it in pvp, but great in pve for stam characters. Lets see how much the pvp stam characters LOVE having that 200 health regen when you are getting ganked by someone, who caught you with rapids, that you will not have for 2 more LONG, SLOW levels. Forget about a zerg or ball group, no one is waiting for slow mo....
pve people are not happy about this either for the most part. The ONLY people who seem to be happy about it are "pvpers" that are looking forward to farming "low hanging fruit" of pve alts trying to farm up enough ap while being horribly slow so they would keep falling behind and be ,much easier prayEdited by Linaleah on August 24, 2020 11:15PMdirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***7 -
abigfishy✭✭✭✭✭I forgot to mention. Imagine how horrible it will be moving around Cyrodil without Rapids while you are trying to get Rapids...Level 50 Characters
USA
Odette Skullcrusher Nord DK EP Tank
Hannah Smithee Breton Templar DC Healer
Charlotte of the Wild Bosmer NB EP DPS
Rabbath Amman Dark Elf Sorc EP DPS
Lovely Twinkle High Elf Sorc AD Tank
Nepith Dark Elf Warden EP Healer
Tupac Shakoor Redguard Sorc DC Tank
Faire the Last Snow Elf Altmer Warden EP Ice Staff Tank
EU
Soul-Shriven Breton Sorc DC DPS
Makush gro-Shurgal Orc DK DC Tank
Cleopatra Tharn Imperial Sorc EP Healer
Daenerys Targaryin Nord Templar DC Healer
Zar Saarshar Khajiit NB DC Thief
Celrith High Elf Sorc EP Assassin
Falcar Dark Elf NB DC Necromancer
Myriam Blaylock Breton NB EP Vampire
Nivrillin Wood Elf NB DC Werewolf10 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭SydneyGrey wrote: »They only care about PvP, dungeons and trials. They really don't care about players who like to make a dozen alts for fun, or who roleplay. They want to force everyone to do PvP even if they don't want to. Looks like they've ignored all the suggestions people gave them that would work better for everyone.
They could have just added Rapids as the first unlock in the Soul Magic line, but noooo ....
And yet exactly those players whose general gameplay they just smashed are the ones who they rely on for the most revenue.3 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »Kiralyn2000 wrote: »So we PVE players should all look forward to many hours of hideous abuse, name calling and toxic insults one EACH character just so we can actually travel about at a decent speed on a new character? Who thought this was a good idea?
As I mentioned in the other "OMG Rapids" threads - I've been playing since 2016. I've got 8 alts. I've never used Rapids. I've only rarely seen people using it in PvE (like when a crowd of people were running to a Jester daily, and one person pulled ahead, for instance). Until these threads popped up the last few weeks, I'd never seen people talking about how Rapids was Absolutely Necessary For PvE & Alts.
Feels like it came out of nowhere. /shrug
I'm going to guess this is probably because most people are using it out in the open world to get places where you wouldn't see them, and since it's sort of a skill that was always there, no one really spoke of the fact that they used it or found it necessary, until the loss of it became a threat that made those who need it more vocal. I see people use it constantly to get between dragons, dolmens, harrowstorms, and other such timed events where wayshrines are not well placed.
Even going from delve to delve for skyshards just got a lot worse.5 -
Sgrug✭✭✭✭✭I tried taking my alt into PVP without rapids, 3 hours later still not out of level 3 because I spend all my time running to fights only to have them over before I get this. I try to jump to a UA hoping it will turn into something, luck now is the only effective way to catch a fort fight. This is really bad.
This change has made PVP for anyone without rapids BORING, all it becomes is a horse riding simulator hoping to catch a D or O tick because you can't get to most of the fights. Doing this for 5 support levels is SERIOUSLY LAME!Edited by Sgrug on August 24, 2020 11:34PM9 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭First world propband its hilarious to call out on zos because they secretly wanted to sell more riding books, cuz you know everyone has 17 chars that SOME REASON need rapid manouver.
I have rapids on many toons, use it on the bar of exactly one of those, my gatherer. Cyro needs it admittedly, rest of ESO world the zones are really too small and twisty/multileveled to use it to much effect despite all the many rationalizations to the contrary. First world problem, still waiting for some logical, reasonable rationale for needing it on a multitude of alts, doubt we'll be seeing that anytime soon other than "but but... I wants it!"
OTOH, a majority of stam toons doing any group content can use vigor. Great change.
In PVE, Rapids is most important when you're leveling (actual levels or skyshards/skillpoints or lorebooks as the case may be).
It also can be important for characters who do crafting writs.
On characters who ONLY do dungeons, I don't equip it either.Edited by FrancisCrawford on August 24, 2020 11:33PM0 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭It is such a minimal effort to get to the needed ranks in Assault. I never cared which was first had both anyway in less than 30 minutes.
Ah No! I was Assault Level 4 1/2 and it took an hour half in BG's to get to Level 5. I don't wanna know how long it's gonna take my toons that are assault level 2.
You do realise you can jump into Cyrodiil and repair walls?
Speaking personally, I don't realize that. In most keep captures I've participated in, only doors get breached, and those are repaired by the same people who did the capture as soon as the keep flips, for a fraction of the AP each they got from the keep flip itself. On the rare occasions that walls are breached too, the same occurs.
I have no idea how to reliably find keeps with walls or doors that remain unrepaired long enough for me to get to them.2 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭johnebrown wrote: »First world propband its hilarious to call out on zos because they secretly wanted to sell more riding books, cuz you know everyone has 17 chars that SOME REASON need rapid manouver.
I have rapids on many toons, use it on the bar of exactly one of those, my gatherer. Cyro needs it admittedly, rest of ESO world the zones are really too small and twisty/multileveled to use it to much effect despite all the many rationalizations to the contrary. First world problem, still waiting for some logical, reasonable rationale for needing it on a multitude of alts, doubt we'll be seeing that anytime soon other than "but but... I wants it!"
OTOH, a majority of stam toons doing any group content can use vigor. Great change.
There were other options suggested that would give you your vigor without removing rapids from others.
There is a reason why it is on all 54 of my subbed toons. I didn't put it there just to be a completest. If you really want to know the rational: I don't like slow horses when I start a new toon. Rationale #2: Crafting alts. Rapids saves a substantial amount of time when you have a lot of them. Those are rational and valid reasons.
I usually don't bother leveling an alt until it's existed for some months and has horse speed bought up. AND of course it has Rapids as soon as it reaches Level 10.
I know there are people who are less extreme about such things than I am, but that's the way I've played to date.
Probably, if I ever level an alt again, I'll do what others suggest in this thread and go participate in BGs where I'll be a nearly useless single-barred participant.0 -
etchedpixels✭✭✭✭✭
✭TequilaFire wrote: »Those complaints were made by the same people that are now complaining about rapids now.
What PvE players seem to want is all PvP skills handed to them without doing the content.
I admit I wish the same thong could be done for undaunted for PvP players but grit my teeth and do the content anyway.
No - the problem is that rapids although hiding in cyrodiil is actually an important PvE general skill that makes PvE gameplay work for new characters and newer players, and stops the whole game turning into a tedious pony simulator.
Maybe rapids needed to move into a non PvP skill line (world skills etc), but as it stands it's also a PvE skill in the wrong place. That was hidden because every PvE player visited cyrodiil and did the training ritual. Purge has elements of this too but it's not an essential PvE skill just a useful one particularly when dragons are involved.
It's not about PvP skills. If this argument was about things like siege shields nobody in the PvE game would give a monkeys.
And I apologize in advance to everyone who gets me in their battlegrounds team, because I suck at it, have the wrong skills and builds for it and am just grinding it on several chars to get rapids back. I imagine it'll be full of us for some time.
Too many toons not enough time5 -
Sgrug✭✭✭✭✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »johnebrown wrote: »First world propband its hilarious to call out on zos because they secretly wanted to sell more riding books, cuz you know everyone has 17 chars that SOME REASON need rapid manouver.
I have rapids on many toons, use it on the bar of exactly one of those, my gatherer. Cyro needs it admittedly, rest of ESO world the zones are really too small and twisty/multileveled to use it to much effect despite all the many rationalizations to the contrary. First world problem, still waiting for some logical, reasonable rationale for needing it on a multitude of alts, doubt we'll be seeing that anytime soon other than "but but... I wants it!"
OTOH, a majority of stam toons doing any group content can use vigor. Great change.
There were other options suggested that would give you your vigor without removing rapids from others.
There is a reason why it is on all 54 of my subbed toons. I didn't put it there just to be a completest. If you really want to know the rational: I don't like slow horses when I start a new toon. Rationale #2: Crafting alts. Rapids saves a substantial amount of time when you have a lot of them. Those are rational and valid reasons.
I usually don't bother leveling an alt until it's existed for some months and has horse speed bought up. AND of course it has Rapids as soon as it reaches Level 10.
I know there are people who are less extreme about such things than I am, but that's the way I've played to date.
Probably, if I ever level an alt again, I'll do what others suggest in this thread and go participate in BGs where I'll be a nearly useless single-barred participant.
I went into BG, having never really gotten into them, to see about AP, as expected I was blasted for being a newb and a no load in the group tonight, very unpleasant experience. I went into Cyrodill only to find myself now playing horse riding simulator, this change has significantly impacted game-play for low level toons in a very negative way.Edited by Sgrug on August 24, 2020 11:51PM8 -
Ariont✭✭✭So going through all my characters 4 of them have lost their rapids on one account. No telling what I'll lose on my alt account. No idea if any of them even got their skill points refunded, even though I understand that the refunding is pouched.
My 5+ year old character even lost her rapids. There is no way that that character will ever see pvp . She was never intended to go there and as a magic character vigor is totally USELESS.
At the very least those that had the skill should have been grandfathered in and if that wasn't possible then vigor should have been placed in support as was suggested numerous times during testing.
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Sgrug✭✭✭✭✭So going through all my characters 4 of them have lost their rapids on one account. No telling what I'll lose on my alt account. No idea if any of them even got their skill points refunded, even though I understand that the refunding is pouched.
My 5+ year old character even lost her rapids. There is no way that that character will ever see pvp . She was never intended to go there and as a magic character vigor is totally USELESS.
At the very least those that had the skill should have been grandfathered in and if that wasn't possible then vigor should have been placed in support as was suggested numerous times during testing.
Beginning to believe this change was actually intended to get players like you and me to spend 3k crowns and buy the skill line. Money is rapidly becoming the top choice of speculation for the real reason of this change.Edited by Sgrug on August 25, 2020 12:01AM7 -
Floppyjo✭✭✭So this Vigor is just a group heal and has no bearing on stamina recovery or stamina as a resource at all, correct?
I'm just trying to understand, what appears to look more and more like an excuse from this team on this decision. How does this benefit stamina players? They have taken something uniquely beneficial to all classes, something that cannot be talented anywhere else and replaced it with something that only benefits stamina player for the first few levels of their leveling experience.
I think they are just plain outright lieing, they are looking at the 30% movement speed buff and thinking "Oh no, these people on the dolmen trains are leveling to damn fast and it's cutting our subscription time revenue down, we can get people to run around at 2 thirds the speed and thus pull in more subscription money, let's move it and we can just tell them a story about how we've had to do it so new stamina players can heal themselves, because of the design flaw we have there of having no heal for new stamina characters built into their classes, oh yeah, they'll buy it"
My subscription is CANCELLED and I have a list on a board above my PC, on that list it says "ESO - Remember what they did with rapid maneuver", I hold companies to account for greed, not just ZoS, I have a few on the board. We are in control of their profit's, they are not. I have done this exact thing with Blizzard too, 6 months hiatus due to their poor customer offerings, where in previous times they would have had 6 months of subscriptions and the more games that come out now, enable even more choices. It only takes 1 issue to push a person away and they can stay away for months as they play another game and get far more satisfaction from a company that might treat them with more respect.Edited by Floppyjo on August 25, 2020 12:31AM8 -
joerginger✭✭✭✭✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »Elvenheart wrote: »I just wish that someone from ZO$ would come out and say why all the reasonable well thought out suggestions that would have made everyone happy seemed to have been ignored without consideration, like swapping vigor with the first skill in the support line, or some of the other possibilities. Just a “This is why we couldn’t do that” type of post. Otherwise I am going to believe like a lot of others that it was to try and get is to by speed lessons and/or skill tree unlocks when possible.
Or sheer laziness on ZoS' part.
Nah, no laziness whatsoever, quite the opposite. They want to "persuade" us non-PvP-lovers with alts to buy the Assault skill line we unlocked on our main character on 17 alt characters. Yes, the riding lessons for newer characters are the other obvious choice, but I believe their monetizing engineers want even more right now. The skill lines are so ridiculously expensive, they promise ZoS an absurdly huge amount of money of course, so we're talking about a huge amount of money they look forward to grabbing by slowing our fully leveled characters down to the crawl ZoS considers normal speed.
Unfortunaterly for them this is the very thing that pisses off harmless unimportant people like myself who even occasionally recommended this game to friends and spent more than a litte bit of money of money over the years. I have a second account which I (for the sake of convenoence, I like to think, but for being at least somewhat tolerable in truth) paid the subscription for every month - until today. My main account is on a yearly subscription, so it's going to take a while until that runs out. But after pissing me off that badly, the company and its monetizing gurus won't see a single cent from me ever again. I absolutely regret every single bit of real life currency I wasted on virtual crowns. So I'll keep logging in and I'll keep wasting my precious time on dailies, especially crafting writs, but today made sure that it is absolutely unnecessary for me to care even the faintest bit about this game. It's not just the quality of expansions and gameplay in general that has gone down the drain, no, this is accompanied by the company even harder than ever before squeezing every single possible real life coin from its players .
It's obvious we're in the melking phase before they will soon afterwards switch off this game.
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phairdon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Created a new character 4 days ago. Learned rapid maneuver 2 days ago. The skill is now locked due to the update. @ZOS_GinaBruno Surely this is a mistake?
After completing a character check, MULTIPLE characters lost access to rapids. Some characters gained rapids months ago. I do not want a skill point refund. Please put rapids back on peoples characters. find another way to implement the change without taking skills away from players. not acceptable.
Edited by phairdon on August 25, 2020 3:26AMYour immersion is breaking my entitlement. Buff Sorc's. Darkshroud the cremator Death by furRubeus BlackFluffy knight BladesThe Fat PantherPsijic Fungal SausageFlesheater the VileCaspian Rafferty FernsbyArchfiend Warlock PiersThe Black BishopEvil Wizard Lizard (EU)Neberra Vestige Fajeon (EU)Salanis Deathstick (EU)Blood Mage Alchemist (EU)4 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭joerginger wrote: »[They want to "persuade" us non-PvP-lovers with alts to buy the Assault skill line we unlocked on our main character on 17 alt characters. Yes, the riding lessons for newer characters are the other obvious choice, but I believe their monetizing engineers want even more right now. The skill lines are so ridiculously expensive, they promise ZoS an absurdly huge amount of money of course, so we're talking about a huge amount of money they look forward to grabbing by slowing our fully leveled characters down to the crawl ZoS considers normal speed.
Actually, those of us complaining can't buy the Assault skill line "right now" even if we want to.
If they change the rules so that you can buy that line without making Grand Overlord on another character, that will be very strong evidence for your theory. But as of now, your suggested explanation is almost the only one that can be ruled out.Edited by FrancisCrawford on August 25, 2020 12:53AM2 -
ZaroktheImmortal✭✭✭✭✭
✭This update is bad for both pvers and pvpers. Mounts on new toons start off really really slow. And it's even worse in cyrodil if your mount isn't fast cause have you tried getting anywhere in cyrodil? Even at max speed with rapids it can be a bit of a trip and now well this is going to make it rather difficult to level the line at all cause it'll take forever to get anywhere in cyrodil where you go to level the skill line to get the thing to make the mount go faster4 -
ZaroktheImmortal✭✭✭✭✭
✭Honestly why not just put these things both on the first thing of the alliance skill line or just make it access to everyone right off maybe create a new tab in the world thing cause these are things used by both pvers and pvpers and maybe replace them with abilities that are more to helping pvp side than one that both use.1 -
heaven13✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »joerginger wrote: »[They want to "persuade" us non-PvP-lovers with alts to buy the Assault skill line we unlocked on our main character on 17 alt characters. Yes, the riding lessons for newer characters are the other obvious choice, but I believe their monetizing engineers want even more right now. The skill lines are so ridiculously expensive, they promise ZoS an absurdly huge amount of money of course, so we're talking about a huge amount of money they look forward to grabbing by slowing our fully leveled characters down to the crawl ZoS considers normal speed.
Actually, those of us complaining can't buy the Assault skill line "right now" even if we want to.
If they change the rules so that you can buy that line without making Grand Overlord on another character, that will be very strong evidence for your theory. But as of now, your suggested explanation is almost the only one that can be ruled out.
Alliance War Skills at rank 10 =\= Grand Overlord.
Assault and Support 10 are unlocked at alliance War rank 13 (which requires a total of just over 1 mil AP). Grand Overlord requires almost 61 mil to get to rank 49. While I don't agree with the change, even though all my alts still have rapids, let's not overexaggerate the issue with dramatizations because it doesn't help your position.
Edit to add actual reference link. UESP is your friend.Edited by heaven13 on August 25, 2020 1:25AMPC/NAMountain God | Leave No Bone Unbroken | Apex Predator | Pure Lunacy | Depths Defier | No Rest for the Wicked | In Defiance of DeathMeet my characters :
Defanged the Devourer | Nature's Wrath | Relentless Raider | True Genius | Bane of Thorns | Subterranean Smasher | Ardent Bibliophile
vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vDSA | vMoL HM | vHoF HM | vAS+2 | vCR+2 | vBRP | vSS HM | vKA | vRGIT DOESN'T MATTER BECAUSE THEY'RE ALL THE SAME NOW, THANKS ZOS2 -
Zephiran23✭✭✭✭Many years ago in beta we were able to enter Cyrodiil and participate in PVP. Most of us didn't have horses and it took way too long to reach anything. In a later beta cycle players were given mounts and the experience improved dramatically - fights at keeps could be reached and scouting missions achieved in a reasonable time frame. If you died and no one resurrected you getting back to that area of interest was possible. Movement speed was shown to be important.
In Northern Elsweyr the 3 dragons initially were under continual assault. A mixture of new players and veterans participated. Dragons were tanked and low level players in the zone had a chance to survive the fight with minimal deaths and could enjoy the experience. Once achievements had been completed by the veterans, participation dropped over time before falling off a cliff once new dragons were added in Southern Elsweyr.
The exception being the Northern most dragon. The main reasons for this are poor location of wayshrines and the subsequent long ride times to reach the feeding ground. Again players with slow mounts and no Rapids were not willing to put themselves through the effort required to ride to fights that did provide them with a good level of rewards.
In Greymoor, the Harrowstorms have provided another example of the importance of being able to travel quickly. The world bosses are mostly conveniently located near wayshrines and finding enough players to take them down is a fairly quick process. Harrowstorms are less conveniently located and provide very poor rewards (now upgraded). Thus outside peak times getting sufficient players to fight them is a chore. Similarly in Blackreach, once players had completed the achievements participation has decreased.
Like with the change to Maelstrom arena weapons, these changes seem to have been made without properly considering who the player base actually is. Players for the most part don't like inconvenience and certainly don't like the removal of abilities or items they already have. This latest change was brought in with a small explanation in the notes, but despite numerous complaint threads, no further correspondence has been entered into. This is not a good example of communication from ZOS.
Using Vigor prior to this patch required players to first know that it was there and then do sufficient PVP to unlock it. As a result I, and I'm fairly sure a lot of other players, developed a playstyle that didn't require it and found other ways to heal. Sure there were way too many deaths leveling my main to veteran ranks, but on my newer alts deaths have been very rare. This is independent of champion points, my EU server characters have none and seem to be coping.
On PC you can easily use Rapids with an addon and it doesn't need to take up one of your combat slots. (Provided you're not dragging in some of the local wildlife and are stuck in combat.) Assist Rapid Riding has over 450, 000 downloads and is not the only addon to provide this functionality. For most questing PVE content, Vigor is just going to take up a slot that could be put to better uses.6 -
Noisivid✭✭✭✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »joerginger wrote: »[They want to "persuade" us non-PvP-lovers with alts to buy the Assault skill line we unlocked on our main character on 17 alt characters. Yes, the riding lessons for newer characters are the other obvious choice, but I believe their monetizing engineers want even more right now. The skill lines are so ridiculously expensive, they promise ZoS an absurdly huge amount of money of course, so we're talking about a huge amount of money they look forward to grabbing by slowing our fully leveled characters down to the crawl ZoS considers normal speed.
Actually, those of us complaining can't buy the Assault skill line "right now" even if we want to.
If they change the rules so that you can buy that line without making Grand Overlord on another character, that will be very strong evidence for your theory. But as of now, your suggested explanation is almost the only one that can be ruled out.
I have the Alliance War skill line maxed on a couple of characters. So I suppose I could buy it... not going to though.
Unfortunately I also have alot of characters that I just don't PvP with and now they can't use rapids...
I just spent an hour running battlegrounds (three matches, won one match, second place on one, last place on another) on one of those characters and the Assault line is at high level three, will be at level four with the next match. (yay, that was fun /sarcasm)
Does ZoS really think I'm going to do this on 10+ non-PvP characters? Just to get back to where I was before? I am not going to buy the skill line for these characters.
Rapids is an essential Quality of Life skill for my general PvE characters. Collecting Skyshards, lorebooks, general questing, Psijiic quest line, crafting surveys, etc are all extremely tedious without it and I'm not going to play a game for the tedium. In Cyrodil it's pretty much essential in order to get to the battles. The only times I don't use it are dungeons, trials and battlegrounds.
I'm probably not quitting the game over this, so no you can't have my stuff... BUT, I will note that New World and Ashes of Creation are launching fairly soon in the MMO defintion of "soon"
@ZOS_GinaBruno, @ZOS_RichLambert,Vogon Poet Laureate10 -
carlos424✭✭✭✭✭It is such a minimal effort to get to the needed ranks in Assault. I never cared which was first had both anyway in less than 30 minutes.
Please show us how you get it done in "less than 30 minutes"
Not during Midyear Mayhem... and not with a dedicated ball group you run with... since I don't think most PVE players have access to those groups.
Ya thats bs3 -
Noisivid✭✭✭✭Canned_Apples wrote: »@houndandhorseb16_ESO
It helps new stamina players that don't have a stamina based class heal.
It can get pretty annoying not having one at times, especially in dungeons, even though overland content is a joke.
While I agree with you with you on this ( I generally run Stamina builds) this is a problem with ESO class design. They really should fix this issue by changing the class skills... but they probably won't.Edited by Noisivid on August 25, 2020 1:35AMVogon Poet Laureate0 -
Sgrug✭✭✭✭✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »joerginger wrote: »[They want to "persuade" us non-PvP-lovers with alts to buy the Assault skill line we unlocked on our main character on 17 alt characters. Yes, the riding lessons for newer characters are the other obvious choice, but I believe their monetizing engineers want even more right now. The skill lines are so ridiculously expensive, they promise ZoS an absurdly huge amount of money of course, so we're talking about a huge amount of money they look forward to grabbing by slowing our fully leveled characters down to the crawl ZoS considers normal speed.
Actually, those of us complaining can't buy the Assault skill line "right now" even if we want to.
If they change the rules so that you can buy that line without making Grand Overlord on another character, that will be very strong evidence for your theory. But as of now, your suggested explanation is almost the only one that can be ruled out.
I have the Alliance War skill line maxed on a couple of characters. So I suppose I could buy it... not going to though.
Unfortunately I also have alot of characters that I just don't PvP with and now they can't use rapids...
I just spent an hour running battlegrounds (three matches, won one match, second place on one, last place on another) on one of those characters and the Assault line is at high level three, will be at level four with the next match. (yay, that was fun /sarcasm)
Does ZoS really think I'm going to do this on 10+ non-PvP characters? Just to get back to where I was before? I am not going to buy the skill line for these characters.
Rapids is an essential Quality of Life skill for my general PvE characters. Collecting Skyshards, lorebooks, general questing, Psijiic quest line, crafting surveys, etc are all extremely tedious without it and I'm not going to play a game for the tedium. In Cyrodil it's pretty much essential in order to get to the battles. The only times I don't use it are dungeons, trials and battlegrounds.
I'm probably not quitting the game over this, so no you can't have my stuff... BUT, I will note that New World and Ashes of Creation are launching fairly soon in the MMO defintion of "soon"
@ZOS_GinaBruno, @ZOS_RichLambert,
This change has convinced me to look for a new game, also not leaving at this time but now I have started looking. This is from a player with 3 accounts and who has bought ALL the DLC's and Chapters AND has always had ESO+. If this the way I will be treated from now on where they take away what I have already earned then it is time to look elsewhere. I regret buying this latest DLC now in a big way.
@ZOS_GinaBruno, @ZOS_RichLambert,Edited by Sgrug on August 25, 2020 1:42AM8 -
ZaroktheImmortal✭✭✭✭✭
✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »joerginger wrote: »[They want to "persuade" us non-PvP-lovers with alts to buy the Assault skill line we unlocked on our main character on 17 alt characters. Yes, the riding lessons for newer characters are the other obvious choice, but I believe their monetizing engineers want even more right now. The skill lines are so ridiculously expensive, they promise ZoS an absurdly huge amount of money of course, so we're talking about a huge amount of money they look forward to grabbing by slowing our fully leveled characters down to the crawl ZoS considers normal speed.
Actually, those of us complaining can't buy the Assault skill line "right now" even if we want to.
If they change the rules so that you can buy that line without making Grand Overlord on another character, that will be very strong evidence for your theory. But as of now, your suggested explanation is almost the only one that can be ruled out.
I have the Alliance War skill line maxed on a couple of characters. So I suppose I could buy it... not going to though.
Unfortunately I also have alot of characters that I just don't PvP with and now they can't use rapids...
I just spent an hour running battlegrounds (three matches, won one match, second place on one, last place on another) on one of those characters and the Assault line is at high level three, will be at level four with the next match. (yay, that was fun /sarcasm)
Does ZoS really think I'm going to do this on 10+ non-PvP characters? Just to get back to where I was before? I am not going to buy the skill line for these characters.
Rapids is an essential Quality of Life skill for my general PvE characters. Collecting Skyshards, lorebooks, general questing, Psijiic quest line, crafting surveys, etc are all extremely tedious without it and I'm not going to play a game for the tedium. In Cyrodil it's pretty much essential in order to get to the battles. The only times I don't use it are dungeons, trials and battlegrounds.
I'm probably not quitting the game over this, so no you can't have my stuff... BUT, I will note that New World and Ashes of Creation are launching fairly soon in the MMO defintion of "soon"
@ZOS_GinaBruno, @ZOS_RichLambert,
This change has convinced me to look for a new game, also not leaving at this time but now I have started looking. This is from a player with 3 accounts and who has bought ALL the DLC's and Chapters AND has always had ESO+. If this the way I will be treated from now on where they take away what I have already earned then it is time to look elsewhere. I regret buying this latest DLC now in a big way.
@ZOS_GinaBruno, @ZOS_RichLambert,
Yeah, they really took a huge dump on their playerbase with this update. You got to think some people at ZOS thought this would be a good idea...I mean, really?6 -
WoodenHeart✭✭✭✭I've lost rapids on 16 of 18 characters, and don't have the will to continue with this game. I feel like I'm trying to sprint in molasses now... and I refuse to play a game that lets me acquire skills, get used to using them EVERY DAY for YEARS, and then removes them for no apparent reason. Bye ESO.
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