All Radiant Apex mount must be able to be bought with crown gems!!!

gongxizhirwb17_ESO · August 2020

how much crown gem you want each radiant mount cost?1000?2000?3000?or gems when you open 200/300 crates?
everyone has their own opinion.

Scrollup · August 2020

bulcke10 wrote: »

For the 3 years I play on Xbox and bought every season around 45 crates I never get a radiant apex mount 🤔 I have only 1 (special) mount received out of the 250+ crates I bought over the 2 years the flame atronach bear and the rest of the mounts I received are the normal basic ones 🤔 then I have already bought over 3.5k crown gems the coolest looking stuff I can buy with gems from the crates every season like mounts. Skins. Polymorph etc... With only duplicate items we get from stupid stuff maybe it's time to do something back to all the players wo spend a lot of money on the crown crates and let us buy everything from the crates with gems including RADIANT APEX Mount...

Even if you spend 500 dollars there is still no guarantee drop... With this change I think many players will be happy if there duplicates are worth something In the end 😅

We all want the coolest looking mount from the game you released today (Apex senche Rath)

Apex mounts I truly think is a bad SCHEMES ZOS pulls off making money from customers. And I am NOT Bashing either. But the invisible man knows it! lol

Grianasteri · August 2020

Crown Crates = Gambling mechanics.

Gambling has no place in a computer game, especially one in which kids well below the age of 18 participate in, en mass.

[snip]

That said, I tend to buy 1 or 2 15 crate packages per year, using a combination of crowns purchased when on offer, and the crowns awarded via ESO+ Subscription. So in this respect, I am part of the problem. Thankfully I can afford this and have no financial or psychological issues with spending money on one of my hobbies like this.

Others are not so lucky, kids, those in poverty or struggling financially and very much those prone to gambling psychology/addiction. [snip] By all means make money, put things up for purchase, but not via a gambling mechanic.

[edited for bashing]

Thechuckage · August 2020

Kagukan wrote: »

Many, not all, may want the cool mounts but not all are going to spend $100's trying to get them. Some of us have self control.

The old adage holds true "A fool and his money are soon parted"

Grianasteri · August 2020

Thechuckage wrote: »

Kagukan wrote: »

Many, not all, may want the cool mounts but not all are going to spend $100's trying to get them. Some of us have self control.

The old adage holds true "A fool and his money are soon parted"

Some people are psychologically pre disposed to gambling addiction. This spans age, social and financial status, hence poor unemployed peoples to the wealthiest millionaire sports people can become addicted, including the young and old alike.

Loot boxes, i.e gambling mechanics, are part of this problem.

In this respect, its not really about being a fool, and more about having a well established, well oiled, exploitative industry that uses marketing, advertising, inducement, gambling psychology to their financial advantage with little heed paid to the consequences for their customers.

Kiralyn2000 · August 2020

Grianasteri wrote: »

Crown Crates = Gambling mechanics.

Gambling has no place in a computer game, especially one in which kids well below the age of 18 participate in, en mass.

You do realise that "gambling mechanics" - (random rewards, some of them rare; some investment needed to get a chance at a draw; etc) - also describes the random loot mechanics of dungeons/VMA/RPGs in generel/etc? How many Diablo 2 Baal runs did it take to get that rare drop, how much time was spent breaking open another box of boss loot?

And also those $0.25 capsule toy machines I've seen in grocery stores since I was a little kid in the 70's; baseball / collector / CCG card packs; and many other things that have been marketed to children for a long time.

Seems like 'gambling' has been targeted at children since long before video games.

edit: which reminded me of another realization I had a few years ago - Pokemon. Is dog fighting. With endangered wild animals. Marketed to children.

josiahva · August 2020

bulcke10 wrote: »

For the 3 years I play on Xbox and bought every season around 45 crates I never get a radiant apex mount 🤔 I have only 1 (special) mount received out of the 250+ crates I bought over the 2 years the flame atronach bear and the rest of the mounts I received are the normal basic ones 🤔 then I have already bought over 3.5k crown gems the coolest looking stuff I can buy with gems from the crates every season like mounts. Skins. Polymorph etc... With only duplicate items we get from stupid stuff maybe it's time to do something back to all the players wo spend a lot of money on the crown crates and let us buy everything from the crates with gems including RADIANT APEX Mount...

Even if you spend 500 dollars there is still no guarantee drop... With this change I think many players will be happy if there duplicates are worth something In the end 😅

We all want the coolest looking mount from the game you released today (Apex senche Rath)

Years ago as one of my first jobs I used to work at a gas station...people would come in and buy those scratch-off lottery tickets. They would spend $100 on them...win maybe $50-$75 then, spend the entire amount they won on MORE tickets...they would continue to do this until they ran out of "winnings" thinking they were actually winning the entire time because they got so many "winning" tickets over the course of their losing. That is how the lottery works...they give you just enough for you to think you have a chance of winning, encouraging you to throw good money after bad.

I never buy crown crates from the crown store...the ONLY things I ever spend crowns on are actual content, whether its the DLC dungeon packs, the any race/any alliance packs, imperial pack, etc. Sometimes I will spend crowns(from my sub mind you, I dont actually buy crowns) on some quality-of-life thing like a banker or merchant. Buying things with a random chance is gambling...if you don't enjoy gambling, dont buy the crown crates. It baffles me even more considering everything in those crates is cosmetic. Good for ZOS though, at least they don't put anything that could be considered content in there.

Years ago, I also had a friend who hand an uncanny knack for winning with lottery tickets....he would stop at a gas station, spend a couple dollars on a ticket. and win like $5-10. The difference between him and those people I mentioned earlier is that whether he won or lost on that ticket, he stopped. The fact is buying more tickets does NOT increase the chances if winning, each and every ticket is a hard reset of your chances. You have the same chance to win something if you buy 1 or 100 tickets...buying more tickets does not do anything but increase losses.

akdave0 · August 2020

It takes around 275-300 crates to hit the radiant. Since it only drops on the 5th bonus card. so, if you want to get all 3 radiants per season be prepared to drop 1200/1500$. Now, before you start with the negativity, I am a very wealthy person, I own my own business and have money to throw around without hesitation. I do feel that you should be able to buy them with gems or crowns, I have actually called ZOS numerous times and fought with them about this. People not in my position may never get one of these mounts, to me, it is unfair. But you could say that about many things in this game, VMA Inferno staves, clears on hard mode vet trials without being in a hardcore sweaty guild, etc.....

So OP, i feel your pain, and everyone else who would like to have the radiants without the funds to do so. People are hurting right now when it comes to the subject of money. Devs, all of them whom have microtransaction type goods, should show a bit of kindness and either send a crate at random with the radiant in there, or hold drawings to win one.

PizzaCat82 · August 2020

There's only radiant apex and sweet rolls that you can't buy from crown gems.

They want this to be the case so people with thousands of gems still buy crates.

They wont change it, and as long as everything else is buyable I'm mostly ok with a few exclusives that I'll never own.

OmniDo · August 2020

Sigh...people don't seem to get it.
This platform was intentionally repurposed for this gambling environment.
It's simple Psy-op warfare tactics.

Torulf Jernström gave everyone the bible on it, with virtually no shame whatsoever, and it's been mainstream in the digital entertainment industry since.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNjI03CGkb4

The idea is way older than that, obviously, but one review of this "lecture" and you'll vomit if you happen to be a classic gamer with the classic meritocracy mindset.

Nyladreas · August 2020

Not going to happen. Period.

ZOS has a perfect system inplace that caters to both so called "whales" (players that are more fortunate IRL), and poor players.

Most poor players that really want these mounts will spend an enormous amount of gold (which is extremely easy to make if u have multiple crafters on 2 accounts), to convert them to crowns and then crates. I know people that buy over a 100 every month using just gold.

Then, most whales will just buy as many as they want, we're talking 200-400 crates if not more. Others even 500-1000 crates to sell to the aforementioned poor players for gold.

Then the average middle-class player will buy around 50-100 every month.

I used to be one of those 200-400 crates a month guy, that was way way way before they created all this extra junk to make it "harder" too, and I absolutely regret it.

Do the math on profits ZOS gets that way. If it was just available in the crowns store it would have to cost like 50K, or 5k gems per mount (and thats still generous) to make up for the loss of profit via random chance of crates. LOL

Vahlyance · August 2020

Friggin' mad-lad.
I don't care about the mounts at this point, I want more darn rolls.

idk · August 2020

The reality is the player base as a whole spends enough money on the crown crates that Zos has no reason to change the design. They are making the revenue After all someone has clearly stated they have bought over 250 crates which demonstrates how strongly they support the crate design. Myself, I have bought zero crates and have received one apex mount via the free crates they used to give us.

The crates are just not worth it. The mounts are certainly not worth it.

Rexy18 · August 2020

Imagine spending money on something that offers the same functionality as the mounts you can buy in-game for gold

Prof_Bawbag · August 2020

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Grianasteri wrote: »

Crown Crates = Gambling mechanics.

Gambling has no place in a computer game, especially one in which kids well below the age of 18 participate in, en mass.

You do realise that "gambling mechanics" - (random rewards, some of them rare; some investment needed to get a chance at a draw; etc) - also describes the random loot mechanics of dungeons/VMA/RPGs in generel/etc? How many Diablo 2 Baal runs did it take to get that rare drop, how much time was spent breaking open another box of boss loot?

And also those $0.25 capsule toy machines I've seen in grocery stores since I was a little kid in the 70's; baseball / collector / CCG card packs; and many other things that have been marketed to children for a long time.

Seems like 'gambling' has been targeted at children since long before video games.

edit: which reminded me of another realization I had a few years ago - Pokemon. Is dog fighting. With endangered wild animals. Marketed to children.

Last i checked, I didn't require my credit card to bag myself a Norfleet in Borderlands 2, I didn't require my credit card to buy the sword of one shot awesomeness in Diablo 3 and so on. The last i checked vMA doesn't ask you to get your credit card out again and again to bag yourself an inferno vMA staff. Problematic gambling involves money and luck, rng involves nothing but your time in game.

Not gonna slate you because on the whole, you are one of the better posters on here. But on this occasion your analogy is grasping at straws at best. They're not even comparable until such a time vMA weapons and dungeons get locked behind premium loot boxes.

If CC's were only given out on a free basis and people were still complaining, then it would make sense. Those collecting cards, you may have a point.

Mavor · August 2020

bulcke10 wrote: »

Even if you spend 500 dollars there is still no guarantee drop

That is precisely how gambling works. You spend as much money as you are willing, knowing your chances for the jackpot are *extremely* low. Maintaining the expectation of hitting the jackpot is just fooling yourself.

Mayrael · August 2020

Pff... Nothing will change. Why because this gives them profit. If you could buy the thing you want directly you would spend let's say 100-200$. Now there are people that are willing to spend 1000+$ to get this item, because it's random. It adds rarity to that item etc. etc. In general [snip] does it not to please you but to earn money. I totally hate crown crates and gambling approach but since there are people who don't care, crates are not going anywhere.

[edited for bashing]

SamanthaCarter · August 2020

They can make a lot more money if a radiant apex cost is 5k or 10k gems period.

Gorreck · August 2020

amm7sb14_ESO wrote: »

I actually don't inherently have a problem with microtransactions or the crown store or *even* crown crates because if people want to spend money on it, then more power to them. Sometimes I like to as well.

But what I hate is when items that I would be more than happy to spend money on directly are locked behind rng gambling mechanics. I saw a number of mounts in the crown store that I'd be happy to spend real money on to acquire, but they are apex rewards so they are locked behind crown gems, which means I have to buy a whole slew of crates that I don't want to decon the items that I don't want to slowly accumulate the amount of crown gems necessary to get the mount, and I probably won't be able to acquire the amount of crown gems needed anyways before they cycle out for the next theme, meaning any money I do spend on crates to gather gems ends up getting wasted because I can't even get what I want period.

I was happy enough to buy expensive mounts (that I wanted) directly from the Crown Store (even though I wish games were like they used to be an you could earn everything in game one way or another - but that time has passed, unfortunately).

But once they added unavoidable gambling into getting mounts, I just decided this was not for me and never will be, dispite the fact I might have bought many of those mount if they were directly buyable.

SamanthaCarter · August 2020

We need more crowns crates seasons at the same time

SamanthaCarter · August 2020

My gems are useless https://imgur.com/gallery/BZFO8Ou

Grianasteri · August 2020

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Grianasteri wrote: »

Crown Crates = Gambling mechanics.

Gambling has no place in a computer game, especially one in which kids well below the age of 18 participate in, en mass.

You do realise that "gambling mechanics" - (random rewards, some of them rare; some investment needed to get a chance at a draw; etc) - also describes the random loot mechanics of dungeons/VMA/RPGs in generel/etc? How many Diablo 2 Baal runs did it take to get that rare drop, how much time was spent breaking open another box of boss loot?

And also those $0.25 capsule toy machines I've seen in grocery stores since I was a little kid in the 70's; baseball / collector / CCG card packs; and many other things that have been marketed to children for a long time.

Seems like 'gambling' has been targeted at children since long before video games.

edit: which reminded me of another realization I had a few years ago - Pokemon. Is dog fighting. With endangered wild animals. Marketed to children.

I am/we are primarily discussing paid for gambling mechanics. Not grind or RNG within the game. That's very different, though may employ similar actual mechanics, you are not paying for that gamble each time... i.e gambling - loot boxes.

Also, $0.25 to gamble on a wee toy, all of which are similar in nature, is hardly comparable to the disgustingly over priced loot boxes in many games. Same for the card packs, which I loved to collect as a child, that was mainly about swapping with friends, rather than the gamble of what you got, though that was clearly an element & yes a form of gambling. Though I have no data, I also imaging the statistical chance of getting what you want, is somewhat better for the toy machine and card packs, than the loot boxes Apex rewards.

Its a real stretch to compare these with the money & coercion involved in loot box mechanics.

f047ys3v3n · August 2020

NinchiTV wrote: »

Me seeing that lich horse I'll probably never get

For what it is worth, I enjoy seeing all the mounts that I don't have but would like. It's sort of like a treasure hunt. Some of these things are so rare you don't see them for 6 months at a go. Sort of exciting when you do.

What annoys me is when somebody else is riding my mount. It's my mount and I don't want to share.

I guess I can be mature and have a good outlook on life sometimes and be a petty narcissist other times.

Grianasteri · August 2020

OmniDo wrote: »

Sigh...people don't seem to get it.
This platform was intentionally repurposed for this gambling environment.
It's simple Psy-op warfare tactics.

Torulf Jernström gave everyone the bible on it, with virtually no shame whatsoever, and it's been mainstream in the digital entertainment industry since.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNjI03CGkb4

The idea is way older than that, obviously, but one review of this "lecture" and you'll vomit if you happen to be a classic gamer with the classic meritocracy mindset.

Such a great summary of exactly what I have been talking about. So many people do not understand this is what is going on, its deep, complex psychological manipulation.

So many people should watch this video. The gaming industry is broken and although we can still enjoy its output, that doesn't mean its not broken.

SamanthaCarter · August 2020

They can make more money by selling radiants apex for 5k or 10k gems

Eifleber · August 2020

Agreed. Although I don' t like them myself I think how it works takes RNG 10 steps too far.

Obligatory cry pic:

Silaf · September 2020

NinchiTV wrote: »

Me seeing that lich horse I'll probably never get

Exact same problem here. I'm suffering a lot ^^
Let's hope Zos will show some compassion and make them avaible for a lot of gems in the future.

Astrid · September 2020

Gamblers always lose out and complain about the odds being fixed. It’ll never change, and remember the house always wins. Stop lining their pockets for pretty pixels that give no advantage or benefit within the game and go out and buy something nice.

ChaosWotan · September 2020

[snip]

It's just "git rich"

[Edited to remove Inappropriate Content]

Minyassa · September 2020

SamanthaCarter wrote: »

They can make more money by selling radiants apex for 5k or 10k gems

They would definitely make more money off me if that was the case.

About every four seasons there is a Radiant Apex that appeals to me. There's only ever been one I desperately wanted..not desperately enough to spend a lot of cash on gambling, though, because I *know* my luck. The RNG hates me and that is just life. So I just cursed a lot, coveted the thing from afar, and resented the entire crate season and didn't buy those crates because to Gehenna with them for torturing me.

I buy the occasional crown crate set, with gold, when I want costumes or things that cost incidental amounts of gems. 40 gems is very reasonable for a costume. 100 less so but if I reeeeeally want it, well, that's one 15-crate bundle and I can just afford that with gold if I grind crafting writs for a couple weeks. But apexes are almost never a big deal to me, and like I said, there is only rarely a Radiant Apex that appeals to me.

There's been only the one Radiant Apex that I would buy tons and tons of crates to get enough gems for if it cost 5000 gems. But *I would have.* I would have gotten those crates if I had a guaranteed chance of getting it after I'd collected enough gems to do so. And for 5000 gems, I probably would have had to buy, what, around 450ish crates? That's a lot, but I would have done it if I'd had a 100% chance to get the mount I wanted. They would have made $1300-1500 off me for that one mount. Instead they made zero off me, and off the 5 other people I talked to that also liked that mount but not enough to think they'd get it if they bought crates.

I can't be convinced there are more people who spend money they can't afford, and more very wealthy people, playing this game than people who only spend money when there's a guaranteed outcome. Yeah, some people have a gambling addiction, but it's not the majority of the population. Companies don't usually gamble when it comes to income, so it makes little sense that they would be *counting* on addicts. I think this is just a habit of the gaming industry now that isn't really being applied with a lot of forethought, rather than the best economic model.